Shannan Gilbert Found, death declared an accident. What do you think?

[Peter Brendt]

I keep going back to the SK's comments to Melissa Barthelemy's sister -

"I'm going to watch her body rot"

with this hyoid bone gone...it seems he is indeed watching them rot IMO

That's now a far way to Okam's razor, isn't it?

Peter

 

[Peter Brendt]

lisk strangles sg, lisk hides sg's remains somewhere they won't be found, too much heat is on lisk so he thinks it will be better if she is found and her death is chalked up to an accident (guilty people overthink things), lisk removes evidence of homicide and places remains where they will be found, liks creates reason to re-search a previously searched area.

you should now know lisk is local, has anatomical knowledge as well as the previously announced knowledge of police investigations.....

Yeah, and because of all that heat, the next thing is, he kills Amber Lynn Costello and places her body in his usual graveyard again. That makes sense ... or maybe not?

Peter

 

[Theforeigner]

The latest NY Post article is stating that it was definitely Gilbert's hyoid bone/s that were missing as per Mari's attorney.

How weird is that???

Here is another (mysterious) case with mysteriously missing hyoid bone (among other things), also Dr Baden was the one who seem to have tried helped the family to get closer to the truth. Horrible case by the way.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...red-helping-secret-probe-fake-rape-claim.html

Quote:
"Also suspicious to the Antonacci family was the Navy’s handling of their son’s death.
Antonacci’s family said a Navy representative came to their Long Island home saying the 22-year-old had died in a car wreck.
Later, the Navy reportedly told them he had suffered a massive aneurysm.
The family also claimed to ABC News that the Navy failed to mention that Kyle’s nose and been broken, as well as other signs he had been beaten.
‘He looked like he was tortured,’ his mother said.
Unconvinced by the initial autopsy, Kyle's family had his body exhumed and hired famed forensic pathologist Dr Michael Baden to examine him.
Dr Baden found that the hyoid bone - the only bone located in the throat which critical in investigations like these - was gone.In addition, photographs and x-rays of Kyle’s body had also disappeared.
With those key pieces of evidence missing, a conclusive cause of death is nearly impossible to determine."

 

[dcgrumpy]

Yeah, and because of all that heat, the next thing is, he kills Amber Lynn Costello and places her body in his usual graveyard again. That makes sense ... or maybe not?

Peter

Plus the fact that there was no heat on a LISK at the time. No one knew there was a SK until 7 months after she disappeared.

ETA
Oh wait, TS is saying he thinks she was moved there after the other bodies were found. But like was mentioned earlier how do you move a skeleton and keep it intact.

 

[Redbird]

There was potential heat on CPH, JB, and MP, was there not? But LE did not seem to want to waste much time on an investigation of what happened to SG, so the heat went away. At least that's the way I understand it.

 

[To Kill a Mockingbird]

Well, Mari's attorney is going to have to talk the talk and walk the walk and talk to Dr. Baden. Dr. Baden has been on the news shows....last December..... discussing Shannan's possible..... autopsy results..... he was weighing things out - on the tv shows.

One can only hope that the Gilbert family has immediately reached out to Dr. Baden.

TKM

 

[Peter Brendt]

Here is another (mysterious) case with mysteriously missing hyoid bone (among other things), also Dr Baden was the one who seem to have tried helped the family to get closer to the truth. Horrible case by the way.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...red-helping-secret-probe-fake-rape-claim.html

Quote:
"Also suspicious to the Antonacci family was the Navy’s handling of their son’s death.
Antonacci’s family said a Navy representative came to their Long Island home saying the 22-year-old had died in a car wreck.
Later, the Navy reportedly told them he had suffered a massive aneurysm.
The family also claimed to ABC News that the Navy failed to mention that Kyle’s nose and been broken, as well as other signs he had been beaten.
‘He looked like he was tortured,’ his mother said.
Unconvinced by the initial autopsy, Kyle's family had his body exhumed and hired famed forensic pathologist Dr Michael Baden to examine him.
Dr Baden found that the hyoid bone - the only bone located in the throat which critical in investigations like these - was gone.In addition, photographs and x-rays of Kyle’s body had also disappeared.
With those key pieces of evidence missing, a conclusive cause of death is nearly impossible to determine."

And in that case, he had at least a body, not only bones. Lets aside the differences in a missing thyroid bone in a skeleton and a whole body, in the end, it's how Dr. Baden said. "With those key pieces of evidence missing, a conclusive cause of death is nearly impossible to determine."

Peter

 

[Peter Brendt]

There was potential heat on CPH, JB, and MP, was there not? But LE did not seem to want to waste much time on an investigation of what happened to SG, so the heat went away. At least that's the way I understand it.

There was a little heat in the week if May 1st. But it was very quickly obvious, LE didn't care too much or didn't take it serious at all. No big searches then, that came all only after the GB4 were found. So there was no reason and even if you can construct something to blame CPH or JB as killer, you still have not one piece of a connection to the GB4.

Peter

 

[Peter Brendt]

Well, Mari's attorney is going to have to talk the talk and walk the walk and talk to Dr. Baden. Dr. Baden has been on the news shows....last December..... discussing Shannan's possible..... autopsy results..... he was weighing things out - on the tv shows.

One can only hope that the Gilbert family has immediately reached out to Dr. Baden.

TKM

I so hope that and I so hope, he can determine the COD for once and all. As long, as there is the thyroid missing (what was the other one? C2? C3?) there is always room for speculation and we have to deal with it over and over again. I admit, I would so enjoy to have someone like Dr. Baden get this cleared up, so we can go forward. I run out of open predictions and I am tired of regurgitating the old ones.

Peter

 

[john1]

"A fracture of the hyoid bone is said to happen in between 17 to 70 percent of the death cases that result from manual strangulation."

http://www.primehealthchannel.com/hyoid-bone.html

 

[truthspider]

So there was no reason and even if you can construct something to blame CPH or JB as killer, you still have not one piece of a connection to the GB4.

If the hyoid bone is indeed missing and the rest of the skeleton is intact, good luck convincing any rational person that SG was not killed by the killer of the G4.

Before you say that a dune fox could have absconded with the hyoid, remember there are 206 bones in the body. It is pretty unlikely that the bone chosen by the fox just happens to be the one bone that links SG to the G4. Assuming the clever fox isn't the lisk and didn't intentionally remove that bone specifically. ah hah! (this is where you chase your tail and start sleuthing foxes)

 

[Peter Brendt]

"A fracture of the hyoid bone is said to happen in between 17 to 70 percent of the death cases that result from manual strangulation."

http://www.primehealthchannel.com/hyoid-bone.html

And a higher chance in certain methods of ligature strangulation. But then, the thyroid bone as a relative small bone and only connected by relative thin cartilage and muscles to the rest of the skeleton, which means, it is also highly likely to fall out of it's position during decomposition and one of the first bones, small animals would be able to get out at all, even the details depend on the position of the decomposing body on the ground.

Peter

 

[Peter Brendt]

If the hyoid bone is indeed missing and the rest of the skeleton is intact, good luck convincing any rational person that SG was not killed by the killer of the G4.

Before you say that a dune fox could have absconded with the hyoid, remember there are 206 bones in the body. It is pretty unlikely that the bone chosen by the fox just happens to be the one bone that links SG to the G4. Assuming the clever fox isn't the lisk and didn't intentionally remove that bone specifically. ah hah! (this is where you chase your tail and start sleuthing foxes)

You forgot to mention, that about 200 of those bones are connected to each other by relative strong ligature. Only three bones are connected mostly by muscles and relative thing cartilage: The staple bones in the ear and the thyroid bone, which makes them the first bones that can be removed without tools at all. Only since the staples are in the ears, they fall most likely into the skull during decomposition while the thyroid just lays around and is accessible. Technically over a long time in the decomposition, this makes it the only bone accessible for small animals and birds.

And even if she was strangled? Strangulation alone doesn't prove a connection to the GB4. Any other whacko strangulates his victims as well. So all you have, is your wish of a connection, but still no evidence, while the different details contradict such a connection.

Peter

 

[Redbird]

It is the hyoid bone that is missing, not the thyroid bone. They are not the same thing. I know nothing about anatomy but I can look at a picture and see that these are two separate bones.

 

[dcgrumpy]

It is the hyoid bone that is missing, not the thyroid bone. They are not the same thing. I know nothing about anatomy but I can look at a picture and see that these are two separate bones.

Do you happen to have a link where it says which bones are missing? All I could find was the lawyer saying 2 bones were missing from her neck.

 

[Redbird]

The latest NY Post article is stating that it was definitely Gilbert's hyoid bone/s that were missing as per Mari's attorney.

How weird is that???

As commented on by Mrs. PC. I have always found her to be very meticulous in her research and trust her information to be correct.

 

[MrsPC]

Do you happen to have a link where it says which bones are missing? All I could find was the lawyer saying 2 bones were missing from her neck.

Her lawyer, John Ray, said that when the skeletal remains of Gilbert, 24, were found in December in Oak Beach — a year and seven months after her May 2010 disappearance — the only two bones missing were the hyoid bones of the neck. They are crucial in determining whether a victim was strangled to death, he said.

Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/...ostitute_busRG467weRU18lXrShECM#ixzz1tpMxmEbp

 

[Peter Brendt]

It is the hyoid bone that is missing, not the thyroid bone. They are not the same thing. I know nothing about anatomy but I can look at a picture and see that these are two separate bones.

There is no thyroid bone, only a hyoid bone. I messed that one up pretty consequently, did i? I hereby apologize for being multilingual and messing up between those vocabularies sometines.

Peter

 

[dc20015]

Since everyone is already discussing the missing bones, I wanted to throw out there that I also found the second half of this press statement of high interest:

Family wants answers after Shannan Gilbert's autopsy's ruled

Mr. Ray talks about the 911 call here and for the first time, I'm hearing someone say who Shannan named as her attackers. Before, IIRC, we only had the "she named her attacker and it was someone she knew". He says she said her driver and john were part of an attempt to kill her. This to me directly refers to Pak and Brewer. Not that they necessarily were the killer(s), but that they were at least participants in the crime. This obviously has been speculated on, but this is the first time I've heard it said straight up that these people in particular were named by Shannan in the tape as targeting her. Also he uses the phrase "we now know". To me, this means that the lawyer and/or family has now either heard the tape, been given a transcript or been given an in-depth description of the tape that they never had before.

 

[Clem Snide]

Since everyone is already discussing the missing bones, I wanted to throw out there that I also found the second half of this press statement of high interest:

Family wants answers after Shannan Gilbert's autopsy's ruled - YouTube

Mr. Ray talks about the 911 call here and for the first time, I'm hearing someone say who Shannan named as her attackers. Before, IIRC, we only had the "she named her attacker and it was someone she knew". He says she said her driver and john were part of an attempt to kill her. This to me directly refers to Pak and Brewer. Not that they necessarily were the killer(s), but that they were at least participants in the crime. This obviously has been speculated on, but this is the first time I've heard it said straight up that these people in particular were named by Shannan in the tape as targeting her. Also he uses the phrase "we now know". To me, this means that the lawyer and/or family has now either heard the tape, been given a transcript or been given an in-depth description of the tape that they never had before.

For my money, I don't believe a word this clown is saying. He doesn't seem particularly bright and dresses like some kind of geriatric pimp, which is totally inappropriate considering that his clients are the family of a sex worker.