The case for murder

[Serpico]

Dear BOURNE, Thanks for encouraging all of us to keep asking Questions. .."And feel free to ask Q's since we're -- well, most of us except the hateful Dina's clique-- are searching for the truth (and justice) for both Rebecca and Max."
I know firsthand how very strange the "structure" (for lack of a better word) of SDSO has been, and continues to operate. Once a "senior member" has made a decision on a suspect, it IS ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE TO GET ANYONE TO LISTEN TO REASON...or open the investigation to other possibilities/suspects! It is as if they think you are insulting them if you ask them to think about other possible scenarios.:banghead::banghead: You can plead, give them evidence, ask them to listen to reason, tell them what the actions of a prudent person would do etc, etc, etc....and it is just like trying to talk to zombies!! Families have no choice but to hire their own detectives and investigative team, at their own costs! It is like a waking nightmare being played out over, and over again. I refuse to stop asking questions until the families receive a proper, full and complete investigation that examines ALL POSSIBILITIES....not a predetermined scenario of suicide. Once "suicide" was decided, it solved most of the problems for SDSO. Everything, absolutely everything that would point to another scenario was dismissed, diminished or discarded!! Even worse, they attempt to thwart, ridicule, ignore, patronize and embarrass the families for seeking justice. (This is more than deja vu....it is how SDSO continues their dysfunction.) Thankfully, there were/are some kind and caring individuals "outside the cult of SDSO" who know how to circumvent their control. Hmm....such as the Federal courts? As hard as I have been on DS/NR... I still cautioned, "letters" to Big G and his team wasn't going to get her anywhere. It saddens me, because I don't think she has received the full truth, either.

Quite interesting....I began days after RZ was found on an intellectual quest to seek TRUTH-JUSTICE-CLOSURE for the Zahau family. I felt the investigation was like a fork in the road...LEFT turn = Homicide Rd and RIGHT turn = Suicide Lane. Seems when evidence or Red Flags would arise pointing towards Homicide Rd. there was always some form of denial whereas Suicide Lane was being shamefully pushed. JS's hearsay phone call without Dr.Peterson and hospital chart confirmation on the late Tuesday night sudden change of Max's condition is prime example especially after we heard NINA say it was Thursday not Tuesday night when Max's condition turned Grave. Dina always stated in her tv interviews it wasn't until Friday that she realized Max wouldn't make it and leave the hospital.

There are so many more questions unanswered and I hope the Zahau family sees the benefit of releasing more information to the public (audio tapes,etc).
I would like to know:
1- where did the hot wax from the candle found on the courtyard grass drip?
2-if RZ's soles of her feet were "caked" in mud and Adam tracked wet shoeprints in the house leading to the kitchen - why wasn't there any mention of shoeprints/footprints atop the patio table after Adam cut her down?
3- why didn't Adam just reach up and take the GAG out of RZ's mouth when he first saw her instead of 5 minutes later after cutting her down/
4- why did Adam need to take Ambien that night?
5-why wasn't the Red Towing Rope more of an issue with SDSO investigators....speculated it came from the garage but why would that be in the garage? That's an item that would be more likely aboard Jonah's boat.
6-if Gore said in his flawed suicide theory that RZ went to the garage to get the Red Rope why weren't there any RZ footprints mentioned to substantiate his theory?
7-why didn't SDSO detectives follow up with DINA after she canceled her Friday poly?
8- where are all the blood results? what RZ blood was menstrual and what blood location wasn't?
9- how tall is Adam? Send someone to Spreckels now and scream and yell HELP-HELP at night and let the neighbor witness try to identify the sound location.
10- what role did Greg Thompson play in the shifting of the fork road to the RIGHT=Suicide Lane? Did Greg Thompson, the former Forensic Director and Crime Lab boss become involved in the testing decisions or non testing decisions in this case?

Like everyone else...many more questions than answers but hopefully the Zahau family will release the evidence that Gore sent the family over a year ago. I, for one, want a trial not a quick settlement because in a trial questions are asked and answered under oath.

 

[IQuestion]

SERPICO I hope this link takes you to the picture taken of the balcony right at the beginning of the "investigation." The Suspicious Death of Rebecca Zahau, Murder or Suicide? It is attached to the post by CYNIC Notice that the double hung window on the left of the photo IS OPEN! and the curtains are drawn.
I think the person(s) who attacked RZ in the narrow hallway, surprising her and causing her towel to drop in the hallway, did not know the window was open. So despite the thick walls, shape of the courtyard, isolation or what ever excuse people want to make....A SCREAM WOULD HAVE BEEN HEARD THROUGH THE OPEN WINDOW. or try this link to the photo of the balcony and window on left. http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2011/09/18/what-really-happened-in-the-coronado-mansion.html

 

[STS-135]

SERPICO I hope this link takes you to the picture taken of the balcony right at the beginning of the "investigation." The Suspicious Death of Rebecca Zahau, Murder or Suicide? It is attached to the post by CYNIC Notice that the double hung window on the left of the photo IS OPEN! and the curtains are drawn.
I think the person(s) who attacked RZ in the narrow hallway, surprising her and causing her towel to drop in the hallway, did not know the window was open. So despite the thick walls, shape of the courtyard, isolation or what ever excuse people want to make....A SCREAM WOULD HAVE BEEN HEARD THROUGH THE OPEN WINDOW. or try this link to the photo of the balcony and window on left. http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2011/09/18/what-really-happened-in-the-coronado-mansion.html

Where did you find a reference to the towel dropped in the hallway? I don't remember reading that anywhere, but it certainly fits into my view of things.

I'm not doubting you, I just need to validate all the stated facts for myself.

 

[IQuestion]

Where did you find a reference to the towel dropped in the hallway? I don't remember reading that anywhere, but it certainly fits into my view of things.

I'm not doubting you, I just need to validate all the stated facts for myself.[/QUOTE

STS-35 Please aware, although I am very good with recalling what I have seen and read.... BUT I AM ALSO THE LEAST COMPUTER TECHNICAL PERSON on this posting forum:blushing: But I'll try to post a link, ok? I found a chart listed as NORTHEAST BEDROOM @ SDSHERIFF.NET It is a diagram of the room and entrance area. It has several items catalogued and names ie. item #26 Knife-13", item#27 Knife-9", item#28 plastic bag etc. ITEM #34 TOWEL...AND IT IS JUST OUTSIDE THE BALCONY ROOM IN THE HALL. http://www.google.com/imgres?q=REBE...168&start=0&ndsp=24&ved=1t:429,r:15,s:0,i:126
...so sorry for the long link but I don't know how to attach a picture of the actual diagram, but I am sure one of our fellow sleuthers will help us out:seeya:

 

[Serpico]

Where did you find a reference to the towel dropped in the hallway? I don't remember reading that anywhere, but it certainly fits into my view of things.

I'm not doubting you, I just need to validate all the stated facts for myself.

Ann Rule's book -Fatal Friends Deadly Neighbors = page 219. "Detective Tsuida noted a white and green towel in the hallway just outside that bedroom,along with what looked like dried blood."

Former Attorney Anne Bremner gave Ann Rule access to the files Sheriff Gore finally sent given the additional information we've read in this book. The time has come for the Zahau family to release the info to the PUBLIC.....why hold on to this and be so paranoid when you allowed Ann Rule to access and publish?
This same information will be requested by the people you sued so I don't understand why sister Mary has kept quiet the last 12 months or so and not released the entire polygraph audio between Adam/Paul Redden and other audio interviews with Jonah,Dina,Nina,eyewitnesses,etc. Also, the blood test results ....Ann Rule mentioned in her book a lot of evidence was never tested.....what evidence wasn't tested and why hasn't the family and lawyers demanded additional testing 12 months ago?

 

[Serpico]

SERPICO I hope this link takes you to the picture taken of the balcony right at the beginning of the "investigation." The Suspicious Death of Rebecca Zahau, Murder or Suicide? It is attached to the post by CYNIC Notice that the double hung window on the left of the photo IS OPEN! and the curtains are drawn.
I think the person(s) who attacked RZ in the narrow hallway, surprising her and causing her towel to drop in the hallway, did not know the window was open. So despite the thick walls, shape of the courtyard, isolation or what ever excuse people want to make....A SCREAM WOULD HAVE BEEN HEARD THROUGH THE OPEN WINDOW. or try this link to the photo of the balcony and window on left. http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2011/09/18/what-really-happened-in-the-coronado-mansion.html

I'm missing something besides not being able to access link.Are you saying at 11:40pm there was a window open near her main bedroom.....okay so now we have another possible site of her Screams and HELP-HELP. I just have tried to attach the Screams with RZ's temporary escape outside somewhere because she had to get a fair amount of DIRT on her soles of feet at some point.

Thanks for the "heads up"....will look for that picture with windows open.

 

[*Lash*]

Green and white stripped towel - item #34 listed on search warrant 41227



Search warrant 41227 -
http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/kfmb/misc/warrant_41227.pdf

 

[*Lash*]

I'm missing something besides not being able to access link.Are you saying at 11:40pm there was a window open near her main bedroom.....okay so now we have another possible site of her Screams and HELP-HELP. I just have tried to attach the Screams with RZ's temporary escape outside somewhere because she had to get a fair amount of DIRT on her soles of feet at some point.

Thanks for the "heads up"....will look for that picture with windows open.

Looking at the picture, the open window is on the left.



[ame="http://www.forumsforjustice.org/forums/showthread.php?t=10186"]The Suspicious Death of Rebecca Zahau, Murder or Suicide? - Forums For Justice[/ame]

 

[Serpico]

Looking at the picture, the open window is on the left.

View attachment 35999

The Suspicious Death of Rebecca Zahau, Murder or Suicide? - Forums For Justice

Ah so.....excellent. Hmmm......

 

[time]

Green and white stripped towel - item #34 listed on search warrant 41227

View attachment 35998

Search warrant 41227 -
http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/kfmb/misc/warrant_41227.pdf

See, shouldn't a black latex glove be in that diagram and pictures?

 

[*Lash*]

See, shouldn't a black latex glove be in that diagram and pictures?

In my opinion, it appears quite a few items are missing. Where was the tissue with a red stain found and the paper towel with red stains? What was the red stain?

Then we have items not taken into evidence, the dog bone and the dryer sheet. Two items that could have played a role in her murder. Dog bone could have caused the head injuries and the dryer sheet could have been used to wipe off fingerprints. Leaving these two items out of the evidence collected makes absolutely no sense to me.

 

[time]

Thanks Lash.

Also, we are not seeing true crime scene photos? Or not all of them that are relevant?

 

[IQuestion]

Looking at the picture, the open window is on the left.

View attachment 35999

The Suspicious Death of Rebecca Zahau, Murder or Suicide? - Forums For Justice

**LASH*** I REST MY CASE!! (aka FLASH!) There you go again with those great computer skills and attach THE EXACT PHOTO of the balcony with the OPEN double hung window. (but the killer didn't see the open window because it was covered by the curtains) An open window less than 4 ft from the balcony is PRIMA FACIE EVIDENCE that a screaming woman can "in fact" be heard by the neighbors.

 

[STS-135]

I agree with you here. My best guess is there was premeditation to harm Becky or at the very least interrogate her. And sadly, there does seem to be some level of enjoyment at humiliating her, and reducing her to "garbage". Someone who enjoys degradation I imagine.

My guess is that the people staying at the G Street house that night know much more about the circumstances that Tuesday day and evening leading up to and after Dina (or Nina) were seen late at night suspiciously stalking the Spreckles grounds. I hope these people realize that by keeping quiet they too are comitting a crime that could land them in prison. We know Nina has lied to the police Day 1 by insinuating to law enforcement that her son was incapable of being alone for her to go to the crime lab to give DNA samples. This not only was an outright lie, there is a incredible level of arrogance to it. Her son is an adult, has a job, drives and goes to college: Really? He suddenly can't be alone? I think she didn't want him to be alone with police in case they asked him some questions.

Yes! I too believe that it was no more than an attempt to interrogate RZ that quickly escalated out of control. However, what I found outrageous, and even painful at a deeply personal level when I first read it, was not that NR talked her way out of going downtown and then just canceled her poly; but rather that LE actually went along with her literally only hours into what they claimed was still a homicide investigation at that point in time. Please tell me when to stop laughing... :floorlaugh:

Live long and prosper!

p.s. I realize this is a very old post but I'm trying to do my best to catch up.

 

[bourne]

Yes! I too believe that it was no more than an attempt to interrogate RZ that quickly escalated out of control. However, what I found outrageous, and even painful at a deeply personal level when I first read it, was not that NR talked her way out of going downtown and then just canceled her poly; but rather that LE actually went along with her literally only hours into what they claimed was still a homicide investigation at that point in time. Please tell me when to stop laughing... :floorlaugh:

Live long and prosper!

p.s. I realize this is a very old post but I'm trying to do my best to catch up.

I disagree. I strongly believe it was premeditated by a spiteful ex-wife full of hate towards her ex Jonah's new gf who was not only young, but gorgeous and Asian. So yes, there was definitely a racist component to it from the ex-wife.

Given Dina's violent history, and because Dina knows the exact layout of the house, where the balcony and bed was, and also where knives(s) would be kept, etc., I have a strong sense that Dina fantasized about murdering/hanging Rebecca (and even Jonah) at some point, quite possibly while Dina was heavily intoxicated from drinking like a whale. It would not be unreasonable to believe that Dina had these sick fantasies in mind of binding a nude Rebecca and throwing her over the balcony before Max even had his accident, which Dina then freely used as a pretext to get her revenge on the young Asian woman who replaced her as the "statuesque goddess" in Jonah's life.

I believe Dina brought the "murder tools" (e.g., ropes) or collected these murder tools earlier in the day while Rebecca was out of the Spreckels mansion in her "big black bag" as eyewitnesses stated having seen Dina carrying and acting bizarrely and walking back and forth from the Spreckels front door to the back courtyard area. Dina was consummately prepared to use the murder tools to torture, assault and murder Rebecca that night. No doubt in my mind this was NOT an off-the-cuff, abrupt, "moment of passion" kill. Nope. Don't buy it. That woman Dina hated Rebecca from the get-go and Max's accident gave her the excuse to unleash her hateful fury at Rebecca. This was a premeditated murder. If investigators check the date of purchase of "The Housemaid" video, that'd give an inkling as to how long this sicko Dina had started plotting her revenge on Rebecca.

 

[STS-135]

I disagree. I strongly believe it was premeditated by a spiteful ex-wife full of hate towards her ex Jonah's new gf who was not only young, but gorgeous and Asian. So yes, there was definitely a racist component to it from the ex-wife.

Given Dina's violent history, and because Dina knows the exact layout of the house, where the balcony and bed was, and also where knives(s) would be kept, etc., I have a strong sense that Dina fantasized about murdering/hanging Rebecca (and even Jonah) at some point, quite possibly while Dina was heavily intoxicated from drinking like a whale. It would not be unreasonable to believe that Dina had these sick fantasies in mind of binding a nude Rebecca and throwing her over the balcony before Max even had his accident, which Dina then freely used as a pretext to get her revenge on the young Asian woman who replaced her as the "statuesque goddess" in Jonah's life.

I believe Dina brought the "murder tools" (e.g., ropes) or collected these murder tools earlier in the day while Rebecca was out of the Spreckels mansion in her "big black bag" as eyewitnesses stated having seen Dina carrying and acting bizarrely and walking back and forth from the Spreckels front door to the back courtyard area. Dina was consummately prepared to use the murder tools to torture, assault and murder Rebecca that night. No doubt in my mind this was NOT an off-the-cuff, abrupt, "moment of passion" kill. Nope. Don't buy it. That woman Dina hated Rebecca from the get-go and Max's accident gave her the excuse to unleash her hateful fury at Rebecca. This was a premeditated murder. If investigators check the date of purchase of "The Housemaid" video, that'd give an inkling as to how long this sicko Dina had started plotting her revenge on Rebecca.

I beg to differ. Although she is obviously no rocket scientist, Dina seems way too smart and cunning to have made so many easily avoidable mistakes had she conspired and/or planned to murder Rebecca. IMHO she sneaked into the house impulsively when RZ failed to come to the front door. It would seemingly also explain a lot of things if Rebecca didn't answer the door because she was in the shower at the time.

JS, on the other hand, could've probably been a rocket scientist if he had wanted to be one; and, if he too had conspired to kill Rebecca, he would have certainly still retained enough of his wits during the though time he was going through to have done it without attracting so much attention.

Also, if Jonah in fact assisted with the cover up after the fact, then the only sufficiently strong motivation to assist that I can think of would've been to avoid attracting even more attention to Maxie's case. In other words, he would've (also) had to know a lot more about how Max died.

No way, no how, that Jonah would've risked throwing it all away only to keep his brother and/or Nina out of jail. They are expendable. If he in fact assisted after the case, it would only make sense if he did it only to protect himself in Maxie's case, or his children as some believe.

As tempting as it is to believe that JS's substantial influence and money played a significant role during either or even both investigations; I lean heavily to no more than outright incompetence and even negligence on the part of LE. (Your cue. Wink! Wink!)

 

[Serpico]

Who was Responsible For RZ's Death?

I'll go on the record saying Adam in a Ambien drug induced sexual assault.....he probably still can't remember all the details after he supposedly woke up.

 

[bourne]

I beg to differ. Although she is obviously no rocket scientist, Dina seems way too smart and cunning to have made so many easily avoidable mistakes had she conspired and/or planned to murder Rebecca. IMHO she sneaked into the house impulsively when RZ failed to come to the front door. It would seemingly also explain a lot of things if Rebecca didn't answer the door because she was in the shower at the time.

JS, on the other hand, could've probably been a rocket scientist if he had wanted to be one; and, if he too had conspired to kill Rebecca, he would have certainly still retained enough of his wits during the though time he was going through to have done it without attracting so much attention.

Also, if Jonah in fact assisted with the cover up after the fact, then the only sufficiently strong motivation to assist that I can think of would've been to avoid attracting even more attention to Maxie's case. In other words, he would've (also) had to know a lot more about how Max died.

No way, no how, that Jonah would've risked throwing it all away only to keep his brother and/or Nina out of jail. They are expendable. If he in fact assisted after the case, it would only make sense if he did it only to protect himself in Maxie's case, or his children as some believe.

As tempting as it is to believe that JS's substantial influence and money played a significant role during either or even both investigations; I lean heavily to no more than outright incompetence and even negligence on the part of LE. (Your cue. Wink! Wink!)

Wow, you honestly think there were TONS of mistakes made by the murderer(s) in this case? If so, and you honestly think this was indeed a murder, then why did LE and ME rule it a "suicide"? If this "murder" masquerading as a "suicide' is not the work of someone obviously smart and cunning, and manipulatively deceptive, then you are underestimating Dina.

For two whole years, the Zahaus have tried unsuccessfully to get Rebecca's case reopened and have the suicide ruling changed to "foul play" or "homicide". If the murder of Rebecca is not the work of someone obviously smart enough to get away with murder, I don't know what is!

I agree that Dina's no rocket scientist. But neither are the tens of thousands of murderers who've gotten away with murder. Just look at the mobs. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to commit murder. It only takes someone with a cunning mind, someone with no conscience to commit murder. To get away with it, all they need is someone ignorant enough like SDLE to "buy" their con. In this case, it is most evident that the "suicide narrative" was perpetrating upon the gullible LE right from the start. Adam started the ball rolling. And there was also a picture of a Dina entering the Spreckels mansion the day Rebecca's body was found, Wed morning, and we all know about her cry-me-a-river, poor me, my "one and only son" Max was killed by this Asian babysitter of my ex...She also got that suicide call rolling early in the game.Who wouldn't feel sorry for a mother who just lost her one and only 6-year-old child?

Don't tell me there was no sympathy for this Dina mother right from the start -- that the according to Dina, "golddigger of a gf of her ex killed her child and killed herself out of guilt" BS. If you believe that this is not a good con, I'll sell you the Brooklyn Bridge and throw in Buckingham Palace and the royal servants for a US quarter.

Get real.

 

[time]

Who was Responsible For RZ's Death?

I'll go on the record saying Adam in a Ambien drug induced sexual assault.....he probably still can't remember all the details after he supposedly woke up.

Dina in a rage fueled assault on a woman she already despised (possibly with alcohol or drugs involved). It makes sense because of the parallels between the two deaths and lots of other stuff. We already know Dina had a propensity toward violent disputes. She lost her heir to the fortune also.

 

[STS-135]

Who was Responsible For RZ's Death?

I'll go on the record saying Adam in a Ambien drug induced sexual assault.....he probably still can't remember all the details after he supposedly woke up.

This is weird, really, really, really weird... Anne Rule's book arrived yesterday. I just returned to my office from a long break during which I read the first five chapters. I just couldn't put it down - until it was time to leave! Anyhow, I actually had to put the book down for a while as soon as I read that section on p. 188. It hit me like a brick, because it reminded me of something that happened to my wife of 30 years while she was taking Ambien several years ago...

One night she suddenly opened her eyes and got up. Moments earlier she was fast asleep. I can tell when she's fast asleep because of that peaceful, very faint snore she still denies doing! Anyway, she got up and headed straight for the kitchen and spent a few minutes there. Neither one knows what she did while she was there, if anything. Then she returned to bed. And, as she climbed into bed, started arguing loudly with me without any readily apparent reason. Not that we never argueed in bed before, but we were just fine earlier that evening. So her incoherent and rambling attacks, while sounding vaguely familiar insofar as to the changing nature of the various issues she might've been referring to, made absolutely no sense within the context of that evening.

I kept trying to interrupt her, to ask her what was going on, but to no avail. Finally, I just assumed that it must the TV still being ON that late at night, or perhaps just too loud, and I turned it OFF. She turned to one side and fell asleep again, literally. Just like that. Awake and visibly angry one moment. Fast asleep the next.

The next morning I was still upset and brought it up. But she couldn't remember any of it. None. I didn't believe her at first, but it was such a silly incident anyway that I just dropped it. She, on the other hand, was (she later admitted) bothered enough by it to remember to ask our PCP several weeks later if Ambien could affect memory somehow. Our Doctor switched her to another med without much of an explanation.

Much later we heard something about Ambien, it might've been regarding the Ambien defense case. I don't really remember how we first heard about it. But we have no doubt that whatever happened that night was Ambien-induced. OMG, you may have just cracked the case wide-open. Something definitely worthwhile exploring further.

On the other hand, as the born-skeptic that I am, how do we know that he was not just trying to build an Ambien defense too if he was charged with her murder? When did the Ambien case take place, before or after Rebecca's? And who could've given him that way out if perhaps not the same person who was already busy getting him an attorney? What I mean is, would most people say that they had taken Ambien the night before, or a sleeping pill?