The Phone Calls in the early morning of Dec.18, 2013 (both PayPhone & cells)

[TTF14]

Whether or not he went there is another issue, but if your plan is to meet at PTL for a murder, why are you driving to a pay phone so far from that site and so close to the victim's residence to get her lured to the site?

I think we are missing some pieces here and they may never come to light.

I don't think he drove there. I think he was dropped off there by Tammy in the heat of a fight they got into, possibly about Heather (i.e. maybe she texted lewd photos to her and he was angry she did that). I think at some point after the phone call took place Tammy went back and picked him up and they both went home.

 

[Madeleine74]

Why would Tammy drop him off at a gas station/payphone (aluding to the fight they are claimed to have maybe had)? Wouldn't that mean she expected him to call someone...like maybe Heather, if he knew her phone number by heart, that is? Allegedly Tammy was controlling who he called, had taken his phone, she may have been controlling his cash as well.

There was nearly an hour before Heather tried to call back at the payphone. SM was already back at home by then.

I believe both were in this together. Tammy probably was the conductor of this fatal orchestra, but Sid apparently played his part too. Unless his attorney is claiming Sid was only acting out of fear for his or the kids' lives, he's not an innocent bystander.

 

[jillycat]

Why has the pay phone been referred to in the past as 'close' to her apartment? Do we not in fact even know which pay phone it is? Then never mind the pay phone location.

I'm still left with the fact that there's a lot we don't know about the phone portion/luring of the murder plan.

Because a man who's allegedly chained can't break free and get to a pay phone no matter where it is, nor can he later use his own phone in the presence of his prison warden wife for 4 minutes to chat with the ex-lover.

Nor would he spend 4 minutes to say, "Don't call me...no really don't. And don't. Seriously."

Nor does answering his own cell support an intent to not leave a cell record of contact.

And, whatever he said the first time wasn't enough to motivate Heather to take the bait. Who knows why she was calling a pay phone later, thinking he would answer it, then realizing she needed to call the cell TM controlled and risk TM being right there. So lots of Moorer tale telling and conniving in the span of Heather arriving home and leaving for PTL. Then there are the IE adventures. ?

Whatever explains all this is known only to the Moorer's, who are in it together up to their necks.

I also believe it's possible that 'Plan A' may have failed, so there was a 'Plan B' and PTL was an add on.

Then again, they may have always intended PTL to be the meeting place - where after getting off the phone with Heather, she took off for the landing close to their home and they soon joined her, they kidnapped/murdered Heather this close to their home - then left her car at the crime scene like a billboard confirming that shortly after the meet up, she disappeared from the meeting place. ?

For me, there's just something about the PTL scene that's posed more questions than answers. Currently, the Moorer's have all the answers.

 

[stillwatersc]

Unless I am incorrect on where Heathers apartment was - I don't consider the gas station where he called from 'close' at all. IMHO it's almost as far from that gas station to river oaks as it is from river oaks to PTL.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

We don't know when the IE event occurred at BATB but IMO it was prior to the call to Heather. Isn't the payphone roughly between BATB and the Moorers' home?

 

[AlwaysSearching4....]

Something I keep thinking is: Do we know that the 4 minute phone call was answered - or could it be a very long explanation/goodbye left on the voicemail of his phone?

I think the way things played out could be very pivotal with that information.

I have an iphone and it will let people leave 4 minute (or longer! ugh!) voicemails.

IF a voicemail was left & SM or TM didn't speak with Heather for 4 min, wouldn't LE be able to access all of the voicemails on her phone? I don't know, but I would think that a voicemail box would be accessible, but not a phone conversation.

MOO

 

[Surfside]

We don't know when the IE event occurred at BATB but IMO it was prior to the call to Heather. Isn't the payphone roughly between BATB and the Moorers' home?

Yes. It's on the way to their house, from Broadway, closer to Broadway. That's why I've tossed around the theory of TM and SM getting into a fight, her leaving him at BATB, and him walking to the payphone. Then, TM may have thought better of it, and gone back to pick him up.

 

[NFYIAMY]

And let's remember - we do NOT know WHO was back at the M's home. We know what PHONES were back at the M's home.

The evidence they presented at the bond hearing was just that. THE CELL PHONES were verified to be at the M's home, Heather's PHONE was at her apartment, in her car, PTL....)

After Heather's call to her room mate - we don't have anything concrete that says Heather left her apartment of her own free will - that is assumed. We don't have anything concrete that says SM or TM were both or singularly at home (or which one was or was not at home). All of that is conjecture based on the 'stories' we've thought out/played out here. There's not been, at least to my knowledge, anything released that shows WHY LE says Heather was murdered AT PTL. There are kidnapping charges that we know NADA of the concrete reason why LE charged them with that.....

Just saying! --- I think we sometimes look to the 'what makes sense' of what we do know- to come up with how things played out - when in fact we are dealing with a situation that really makes no sense at all.

 

[CuriousCricket]

Hi, Everyone,
Newbie here, just getting a feel for the case.

A major thing that strikes me is the seemingly amazing coincidence of SM calling HE out of the blue after her date.

Because of that, don't you feel like the two had been communicating in some way? I suspect that SM knew about the date. I even think he might have been watching her place (another sign they had to have been in communication) for the date to end. If the date went inside, or even if SM witnessed any PDA -- holding hands, a kiss -- he could have been consumed with jealousy at the thought of HE with someone else.

A scenario I can see is when the date left, SM left the apt. complex and went to a pay phone to call HE and beg to come over, to see her, he had left TM. (And he sort of had. He'd managed to slip out somewhere along the line. If he had been allowed to go to Heather's maybe he really would have.)

But he was rejected. He had no plan and no where to go except home.

HE plays around with her poetry page, listens to "their song" and loses her resolve. She tries to call SM. She could even have thought if he had left TM (who knows what line SM was spinning in his jealousy) the number he called from was a hotel or something similar.

HE could also have thought that if SM had left TM he had taken his cell phone and she became more and more desperate to reach him and finally called the cell number.

That second call, the answered one, was put on speaker so TM could hear everything and she learned that SM would actually consider leaving her for HE.

The only way her marriage would be safe was with HE out of the way . . . . In these kinds of situations -- infidelity and the breaking up of a marriage -- people actually become someone they've never been before. It is about like temporary insanity.

Since LE is not seeking the death penalty, I wonder if those circumstances play into the decision . . .

 

[magnolia]

And let's remember - we do NOT know WHO was back at the M's home. We know what PHONES were back at the M's home.

The evidence they presented at the bond hearing was just that. THE CELL PHONES were verified to be at the M's home, Heather's PHONE was at her apartment, in her car, PTL....)

After Heather's call to her room mate - we don't have anything concrete that says Heather left her apartment of her own free will - that is assumed. We don't have anything concrete that says SM or TM were both or singularly at home (or which one was or was not at home). All of that is conjecture based on the 'stories' we've thought out/played out here. There's not been, at least to my knowledge, anything released that shows WHY LE says Heather was murdered AT PTL. There are kidnapping charges that we know NADA of the concrete reason why LE charged them with that.....

Just saying! --- I think we sometimes look to the 'what makes sense' of what we do know- to come up with how things played out - when in fact we are dealing with a situation that really makes no sense at all.

BBM - LE seems pretty certain Heather drove herself to PTL. LE has also stated she was lured, not forced, to PTL. I think it is safe to say she left her apartment of her own free will.

Elvis drove herself to boat landing
In a new development, police strongly believe that Elvis drove herself to the Peachtree Boat Landing in Socastee, where her 2001 Dodge Intrepid was discovered abandoned on Dec. 19.

"We're fairly comfortable that she drove there herself," Rhodes said. Police do not think someone drove Elvis from River Oaks Drive to the boat landing.

Investigators also believe Elvis made it to the boat landing, but investigators would not elaborate about why Elvis drove to the boat landing or what may have happened when she arrived.

"Everything indicates that she drove there," said Lt. Chip Squires, the task force leader. "We do not have anything that indicates she did not drive there."

http://www.myhorrynews.com/news/crime/article_ada6ad1c-8f77-11e3-8ca7-001a4bcf6878.html?mode=jqm​

 

[CHERIE.T]

I keep going back to>>> the possibility that TM had SM's cell. SM got mad, drove to the payphone, he called HE and asked HE to meet him at PTL. TM showed up and a fight ensued.

 

[Dixie E]

Hi, Everyone,
Newbie here, just getting a feel for the case.

A major thing that strikes me is the seemingly amazing coincidence of SM calling HE out of the blue after her date.

Because of that, don't you feel like the two had been communicating in some way? I suspect that SM knew about the date. I even think he might have been watching her place (another sign they had to have been in communication) for the date to end. If the date went inside, or even if SM witnessed any PDA -- holding hands, a kiss -- he could have been consumed with jealousy at the thought of HE with someone else.

A scenario I can see is when the date left, SM left the apt. complex and went to a pay phone to call HE and beg to come over, to see her, he had left TM. (And he sort of had. He'd managed to slip out somewhere along the line. If he had been allowed to go to Heather's maybe he really would have.)

But he was rejected. He had no plan and no where to go except home.

HE plays around with her poetry page, listens to "their song" and loses her resolve. She tries to call SM. She could even have thought if he had left TM (who knows what line SM was spinning in his jealousy) the number he called from was a hotel or something similar.

HE could also have thought that if SM had left TM he had taken his cell phone and she became more and more desperate to reach him and finally called the cell number.

That second call, the answered one, was put on speaker so TM could hear everything and she learned that SM would actually consider leaving her for HE.

The only way her marriage would be safe was with HE out of the way . . . . In these kinds of situations -- infidelity and the breaking up of a marriage -- people actually become someone they've never been before. It is about like temporary insanity.

Since LE is not seeking the death penalty, I wonder if those circumstances play into the decision . . .

This is the same thing that I have been thinking all along and I strongly believe that this is what really happened.

 

[Motherof5]

Hi, Everyone,
Newbie here, just getting a feel for the case.

A major thing that strikes me is the seemingly amazing coincidence of SM calling HE out of the blue after her date.

Because of that, don't you feel like the two had been communicating in some way? I suspect that SM knew about the date. I even think he might have been watching her place (another sign they had to have been in communication) for the date to end. If the date went inside, or even if SM witnessed any PDA -- holding hands, a kiss -- he could have been consumed with jealousy at the thought of HE with someone else.

A scenario I can see is when the date left, SM left the apt. complex and went to a pay phone to call HE and beg to come over, to see her, he had left TM. (And he sort of had. He'd managed to slip out somewhere along the line. If he had been allowed to go to Heather's maybe he really would have.)

But he was rejected. He had no plan and no where to go except home.

HE plays around with her poetry page, listens to "their song" and loses her resolve. She tries to call SM. She could even have thought if he had left TM (who knows what line SM was spinning in his jealousy) the number he called from was a hotel or something similar.

HE could also have thought that if SM had left TM he had taken his cell phone and she became more and more desperate to reach him and finally called the cell number.

That second call, the answered one, was put on speaker so TM could hear everything and she learned that SM would actually consider leaving her for HE.

The only way her marriage would be safe was with HE out of the way . . . . In these kinds of situations -- infidelity and the breaking up of a marriage -- people actually become someone they've never been before. It is about like temporary insanity.

Since LE is not seeking the death penalty, I wonder if those circumstances play into the decision . . .

I like your theory but wonder.....if Heather thought that SM called from a hotel,ect...why would she then think that he would have his cell phone with him but didn't call her from it? That part always drives me crazy. :banghead:

 

[jillycat]

I personally don't believe that SM was both chained up, and able to get out of the house and to a pay phone to call Heather.

I also don't believe that SM both cared for and wanted to be with Heather, then killed her.

If there's any truth to the story that TM was chaining SM, then she allowed him freedom that morning for some reason. Heather was contacted and is now dead. Sounds like the reason to me.

If there's no truth to the story that TM was chaining SM, then that's just one more lie the Moorer's have told in their series of them.

I don't see any room for SM's innocence in any scenario.

 

[Rochestergirl]

I like your theory but wonder.....if Heather thought that SM called from a hotel,ect...why would she then think that he would have his cell phone with him but didn't call her from it? That part always drives me crazy. :banghead:

This is what makes me think HE called back the cell but the calls from HEs cell to SMs cell was made by SM and TM answered.

 

[Motherof5]

This is what makes me think HE called back the cell but the calls from HEs cell to SMs cell was made by SM and TM answered.

I've wondered the same but then why call Heather from a pay phone first? Was the pay phone used because SM really was trying to call Heather without TM knowing or because SM and TM were trying to lure Heather out without SM's cell being on her records and showing that he contacted her first? :banghead: Either way...Heather didn't leave for the landing after that call. What would have happened if she hadn't called him back?:tantrum:

 

[TedMac]

I personally don't believe that SM was both chained up, and able to get out of the house and to a pay phone to call Heather.

I also don't believe that SM both cared for and wanted to be with Heather, then killed her.

If there's any truth to the story that TM was chaining SM, then she allowed him freedom that morning for some reason. Heather was contacted and is now dead. Sounds like the reason to me.

If there's no truth to the story that TM was chaining SM, then that's just one more lie the Moorer's have told in their series of them.

I don't see any room for SM's innocence in any scenario.

Agree 100%.

I can't help but believe that SM was doing nothing more than using Heather for his own pleasure. If he really cared for her, she wouldn't be dead.

SM is involved in this up to his eyeballs. Heather was lured out of her apartment by SM. She was either killed or incapacitated at PTL by TM & SM and disposed of afterwards by both of them. The luring, kidnapping, killing and disposal of Heather was planned in advance. Make no mistake, this entire sorrid affair was planned and carried out by two cold-blooded killers. Both-including SM are nothing less than that.

They thought they had the perfect plan, but there three things they didn't count on-(1) Heather talking with her room mate and disclosing that SM was contacting her that night, (2) getting caught on video going to and leaving the PTL and (3) a search warrant being executed on their vehicles and property which IMHO revealed more evidence of Heather's demise.

 

[4evernbluejeans]

Agree 100%.

I can't help but believe that SM was doing nothing more than using Heather for his own pleasure. If he really cared for her, she wouldn't be dead.

SM is involved in this up to his eyeballs. Heather was lured out of her apartment by SM. She was either killed or incapacitated at PTL by TM & SM and disposed of afterwards by both of them. The luring, kidnapping, killing and disposal of Heather was planned in advance. Make no mistake, this entire sorrid affair was planned and carried out by two cold-blooded killers. Both-including SM are nothing less than that.

They thought they had the perfect plan, but there three things they didn't count on-(1) Heather talking with her room mate and disclosing that SM was contacting her that night, (2) getting caught on video going to and leaving the PTL and (3) a search warrant being executed on their vehicles and property which IMHO revealed more evidence of Heather's demise.

ME three! If he cared, and his wife came up with this murder idea- He could have turned her in and stopped this whole thing. I think it is hard to imagine this, because obviously HE cared and TRUSTED SM enough to leave her home after 1am and meet him at that boat landing. But she was unfortunately dead wrong. It is a bitter pill to swallow, but SM could have stopped this at far too many junctures.

 

[RoxanneRoxannaDana]

ME three! If he cared, and his wife came up with this murder idea- He could have turned her in and stopped this whole thing. I think it is hard to imagine this, because obviously HE cared and TRUSTED SM enough to leave her home after 1am and meet him at that boat landing. But she was unfortunately dead wrong. It is a bitter pill to swallow, but SM could have stopped this at far too many junctures.

ITA. SM could have and should have stopped what happened to HE. The dynamic between SM and TM is that she was the dominant personality. He married her when he was so young. Look at the photos she posted on the Disboards of their honeymoon. SM was only 20 and not a mature 20. She was as much a mother to him as she was his lover.

IMO TM ranted and raved at him constantly after she discovered the affair. I think at some point she decided that the only way she could forgive him is if he killed HE. Like a recalcitrant child wanting to please his elder, he went along with it. I don't think either of them gave much thought to what it would do to their family if they got caught.

Also, I would guess that LE has video of HE driving to PTL. IMO video surveillance tape plus the fact that her car was found there is why LE believes she went there of her own free will.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Does anyone else think it is possible that the official story so far is not what really happened?

We all know about how the pictures used of Heather were of her at a younger age, no mention of the tattoos, and there was a push for national coverage. The whole case was framed like Heather, a teenager, was abducted from thin air by a predator. Using the pictures they used of Heather was probably one of the smartest things (in terms of attracting interest and attention) that they did. It is obvious that someone knows how these cases work.

I feel like the official story is…off. The story seems to be that when the affair got discovered, Heather went away. Tammy continued to harass her. Heather, who was very witty on Twitter, never once replied. No argument. However, she never thought to block her number either. Heather completely stopped talking to Sidney, although we are told she was in love. Then, Heather gets a call in the earning morning hours. It is Sidney, and he is leaving his wife for her. Heather is crying and upset, but goes to PTL to meet him.

Despite Heather making it clear on Twitter that she sought out a physical relationship with Sidney, the official story seems to push the idea that she was madly in love with him. If Heather was in love with Sidney, if she was ready to move in with him, it makes the affair slightly more acceptable, than if she simply decided she wanted a hook-up.

But what if Heather went to PTL to hook up with Sidney? What if she didn’t go there because she was in love? I can definitely see that being kept quiet. This is a case where the most popular pictures shown of the victim are professional photos, that are years old. Appearances are extremely important here. This is also a case that happened in a conservative area, which could play a part in why the story is what it is.

The whole story seems to be created with the task of making Heather as sympathetic and innocent as possible. Right down to Heather crying before she went to PTL. Her Twitter is just so different from the official story, that I am shocked it is still up. I wonder if the PR game is still being played.

 

[4evernbluejeans]

Eileenhawkeye, I agree that they are using pictures of Heather that are older and before she got her tattoos. I think it is safe to say that her parents did not like them. She in fact stated that on one of her social media posts "my parents hate my tattoos, I'm an *advertiser censored*****e." I do not have the link, sorry. Heather IMO was a very protected child, and was strongly rebelling against that as a young adult. While I will agree her social media especially her tumblr are in a contrast to what "nice" girls may post, I do not agree that it shows that she was only looking for a "hook up". If you look closely at the quotes HE copied and the songs or poems-after the breakup with SM, you see a girl who is trying to stop thinking about someone-let go of feelings. I think the "No big deal, I'm not hurt" response is a millennial generational response sometimes. I do not know if the press is somehow being manipulated, but if it were my daughter- I would do whatever to keep the eyes of the public on this case. However the local outcry, which has been substantial has come from a community that knows Heather and her family, knows who Heather is-and just wants her back. Of course MOO!