The Verdict - Do you agree or disagree? #4

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Definition of vague:
1. Of uncertain, indefinite, or unclear character or meaning

If vague evidence meets the legal standard of proof beyond a reasonable doubt, then our legal system is in a lot more trouble than I thought it was.

I think when the jury made their decision, they used the instructions they were given. When the prosecution presented evidence that had unclear meaning (like the level of chloroform in the trunk), uncertain meaning (like GA's testimony), or indefinite meaning (like whether or not the duct tape was ever placed over Caylee's mouth and nose), the jury was left with reasonable doubt, because this evidence was too vague.

Sorry, but I can't agree that vague evidence is proof BARD.

As always, my entire post is my opinion only

The evidence was NOT vague, though. Not vague at all, to a majority of the public. A majority of people who've heard, seen and processed the evidence provided do not find it, as a whole, too "vague" to conclude Caylee died because of criminal neglect or homicide.

Why a minority of folks find the evidence to be "vague" appears, to me, to be because of a lack of direct evidence or a "smoking gun". I have this impression by the reasons provided by pro-verdict folks for their support of the NG verdict.

"Vagueness" is NOT merely a personal opinion. Like I said before, personal opinion has no place in determining guilt in a court of law. In personal life? Sure. But in such an important context as a murder trial, the individuals determining guilt must adhere to higher standards of decision making. Like a scientist with a hypothesis, the juror must follow a well-proscribed pathway, employing logic and reason that may or may not reflect their PERSONAL opinion.

My gut reaction, from day 31, was that Caylee Marie was killed by her mother. It just so happens that the evidence provided by the prosecution underscores my gut reaction. My gut reaction was IRRELEVANT. In fact, I'd feel GLAD to know that Caylee did not die at her mother's hand :( . It would give me a kind of relief to believe she drowned accidentally. That no one mishandled and neglected her, but that she simply died due to an understandable albeit tragic mistake anyone could make.

As the Sunshine Laws uncovered the reams and reams of interviews and examinations by this and that expert, I had to admit there was a LOT of very creepy details that cast Casey Anthony in a bad light. As these creepy details survived Frye hearings and were whittled down to undramatic bone, my gut feeling was justified, but who cares? My gut feeling is MINE. It is not a reflection of a greater reality, necessarily. For me to insist that it is is pure egocentricity. I am not an arbiter of Truth. I am just a human being subject to irrationality and emotionalism, not to mention my basic conviction that it is not HARD to raise a child without KILLING them. In fact, most people DO raise their children without killing them. And in light of exhaustive statistics, people who end up with dead children are abnormally negligent or murderous.

The rest of the picture is filled in with evidence.

For Casey Anthony, we have LIES. Lies, lies, lies. Theft. Lack of conscience. Unremitting tolerance for the pain she caused others. This paints a picture, and not exactly an uncommon picture. It is the picture of a sociopathic personality. A person without empathy or awareness of the pain others suffer because of their actions. A relentless adherance to "what about MEEEE???"

We also have a lack of concern for the welfare of Caylee, which undoubtedly would have shown up SOMEWHERE, but didn't.

Add this to the discarded body in the swamp, with a length of duct tape matching the circumference of a tiny skull still attached to a mat of hair and a mandible stubbornly attached in spite of the frailest connective tissue, now gone due to time and decomposition . . .

Not vague. No vagueness to be found anywhere.
 
It makes perfect sense to me. Rereading the jury instructions makes it even clearer.

Per the judge's instructions, I would have to believe that the prosecution proved beyond a reasonable doubt that Casey killed Caylee to convict her of any of the homicide charges. They didn't. And again per the judge's instructions, I'd have to believe that the prosecution proved beyond a reasonable doubt that Casey intentionally injured Caylee to convict on Aggravated Child Abuse. They didn't. So yes, I'd need essentially the same evidence for any of those charges; they'd have to have proven that she did it, and they failed.

And that's what the jury decided, too.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/59297005/Jury-Instructions-Casey-Anthony

..i wasn't referring to the Aggravated Child Abuse charge--(#3)..

..i was referring to the "lesser" option they had, of 'child abuse'--(#12)..

http://insession.blogs.cnn.com/2011/07/04/jury-instructions-in-the-casey-anthony-trial/
--jury instructions--

CHILD ABUSE
§ 827.03(1), Fla. Stat.

..that---kc anthony---"committed an intentional act that could reasonably be expected to result in physical or mental injury to Caylee Marie Anthony".

..caylee drowned---or was kidnapped---or went missing-----and kc did not call 911?? did not do a damn thing!? ever?? her mom ended up calling 911 after 31 days?? THAT is an intentional act on the part of kc anthony that would definitely be reasonably expected to result in harm to caylee..

..( screw kc's imaginary mental problems ) caylee was to get herself un-kidnapped?? find her own way home?? kc had an obligation TO call 911 when her child went missing/murdered/drowned/kidnapped----and she did not.

..per law.......and these jury instructions...that constitutes child abuse.
 
If any of that were true, then every parent whose child is killed by somebody else would also be 'responsible' and would be charged with his/her death. After all, they were responsible for their child who ended up dead. For example... if a babysitter kills a child, the kid's Mom would be charged just because she's the Mom.

That's not how it works.

How it works is someone kidnaps, kills or your child accidently dies and you don't report it for 31 days....yes that makes the Mom responsible. You are responsible to know where your child is and with whom. You place your child in the hands of someone you know is negligent you are responsible. It is how it works. jmo
 
Just looked at the site you offered. That site is about as useful as HLN for the actual facts about the case - but it is nice to know where you get your facts from. I'll take the intensive hinkymeter timeline instead for accuracy.

I have never heard of the site you prefer. It might be more productive to share it with us all and tell us why you consider it more credible.

Acandyrose came frequently recommended in many threads on WS by long time WS'ers as being a very detailed and very credible source.
 
I have never heard of the site you prefer. It might be more productive to share it with us all and tell us why you consider it more credible.

Acandyrose came frequently recommended in many threads on WS by long time WS'ers as being a very detailed and very credible source.

That's interesting because I've never seen it recommended in the three years I've been reading here. So rather than have me comment on this thread, why not do what I did to your offering and look for yourself. Val, who owns the site, has been a long time contributor to WS and is still a member, so I am amazed you don't recognize it.

It is www.thehinkymeter.com

This site has been quoted over and over again on WS - I doubt anyone here is a stranger to it. In fact, we mentioned it yesterday on the sidebar thread. Peeps refer to it as "the hinky".
 
It is fascinating for me to read this thread and see the various reasons why the not guilty verdict has been defended.

Lawyers, judges and trial experts have called the evidence in this trial - a mountain of evidence - so much so rarely seen in trials - so much it is almost indefensible. Opinions of those very well versed in the law and not involved in this particular trial process. Opinions that have been expressed in articles over and over again, during the trial and since the verdict.

Fascinating to see it dumbed down as "vague". IMO. I give my "feelings" and "opinions" regarding this trial very little value. Whenever I am in a situation that I am not completely confident in my ability to judge, I defer to the experts - if it is something as simple as how to take my 10 speed bike apart and put it back together again, or something as complicated as this trial. It surprises me how the evidence is ignored - this mountain of evidence - and gut feelings are the order of the day. Just fascinating. But it wouldn't have helped me service my bike and put it back together again, and it didn't help the jurors. For that I needed an expert. So did they.
 
How it works is someone kidnaps, kills or your child accidently dies and you don't report it for 31 days....yes that makes the Mom responsible. You are responsible to know where your child is and with whom. You place your child in the hands of someone you know is negligent you are responsible. It is how it works. jmo

ITA. That's what I don't get. Casey LIED FOR 31 DAYS. Why would anyone LIE about their kid being kidnapped? That makes no sense and I've never seen it in any other case. Usually the parents don't know who took their kid, or may have a suspicion, but they can't do anything about it and need and WANT the help of the police to get their child back. Casey was the exact OPPOSITE of every other parent who has EVER had a missing child. Why is Casey lying for 31 days consistently ignored? Who LIES when their child is TAKEN from them? Who LIES when their child dies in an accident?!?!?! No, the only time someone LIES is when they killed their child and don't want to get caught. I can't believe that simple of a concept is so hard to understand. Caylee was NEVER MISSING, she didn't accidently DROWN, she was MURDERED, and her murderer STILL TO THIS DAY keeps LYING about it! And somehow that's okay in society today? If you lie, you get away with murder now?
 
ITA. That's what I don't get. Casey LIED FOR 31 DAYS. Why would anyone LIE about their kid being kidnapped? That makes no sense and I've never seen it in any other case. Usually the parents don't know who took their kid, or may have a suspicion, but they can't do anything about it and need and WANT the help of the police to get their child back. Casey was the exact OPPOSITE of every other parent who has EVER had a missing child. Why is Casey lying for 31 days consistently ignored? Who LIES when their child is TAKEN from them? Who LIES when their child dies in an accident?!?!?! No, the only time someone LIES is when they killed their child and don't want to get caught. I can't believe that simple of a concept is so hard to understand. Caylee was NEVER MISSING, she didn't accidently DROWN, she was MURDERED, and her murderer STILL TO THIS DAY keeps LYING about it! And somehow that's okay in society today? If you lie, you get away with murder now?

LambChop made an excellent post in another thread - who believes a liar? Who?
 
Something the jury did not consider apparently was when JB said GA brought Caylee to KC and placed her in KC's arms and KC cried and cried and cried. And then.....did nothing. Didn't bother to inquire what happened to Caylee next...nothing. Kind of cold hearted, pretty much what you would expect from someone who killed their child. jmo
 
i have tried to follow the jonbenet ramsey case on candyrose and spend lots of time being confused in trying to follow it. i compare to the jeffrey macdonald site which is rather straight forward and credible documents. candyrose tends to have more tabloid and magazine articles. maybe the difference is a conviction in the macdonald murders and an open cold case with ramsey.
 
And your point is? You use acandyrose - which I don't use. I use the hinkymeter - and? On 1000 posts? That's barely a mention...

Yep, 1000 is nothing, unless you are on here 24/7 you could easily miss it and I just found out about it recently. Did not know it existed before then. It is a very good timeline but I did notice some of the information may be a little "misquoted" from documents. Nothing major and I can't think of what it was right this minute but this person did do an excellent job of setting up the timeline.

The most accurate information still remains the documents released from discovery. jmo
 
Yep, 1000 is nothing, unless you are on here 24/7 you could easily miss it and I just found out about it recently. Did not know it existed before then. It is a very good timeline but I did notice some of the information may be a little "misquoted" from documents. Nothing major and I can't think of what it was right this minute but this person did do an excellent job of setting up the timeline.

The most accurate information still remains the documents released from discovery. jmo

This is precisely why I prefer WS information or the hinky. And the reason for my HLN comment - there is no room for tabloid style information in a murder trial IMO. Aside from the fact it's a bit late for a timeline. Maybe four months too late.
 
How it works is someone kidnaps, kills or your child accidently dies and you don't report it for 31 days....yes that makes the Mom responsible. You are responsible to know where your child is and with whom. You place your child in the hands of someone you know is negligent you are responsible. It is how it works. jmo

Exactly, if a child goes missing and parents or guardians don't report it immediately, they should go down. If a child dies by accident and three years (or another substantial periods of time) have passed since the child is alleged to have died by accident, if no accident was ever reported, if medical assistance was never summoned to help recover the child, and it's only the parent or other guardian's word that there was an accident and not something more sinister, if there's no body, or not enough body left to tell, the legal burden of proof should pass away from the prosecution to the defense to convince the court it was an accident and not something else and if the defense can't, life in prison without possibility of parole should be the favored option. There is simply no way that children should be allowed to disappear from their parents, either never to be seen again, or later to turn up dead in trash bags without THAT alone being a life without parole crime.
 
But the law does not work like that. I actually agree with what your saying, but legally that's not the way it works. You have to prove the mother did it, you can't inference it because 'she's responsible'.

Actually, there are times in the law, where the burden does shift. I'm saying this should always be one of them. No mother, father or guardian should be able to be missing a child or have one accidentally die without having to account for that child. Parents have been convicted when their child was missing and they didn't report it. There's a dad here doing 50 years because his kid went missing and he couldn't provide either the child or reasonable explanation as to what happened... and they never found the body. That's the way it should be. You don't report your kid missing, or explain truthfully the circumstances of child's disappearance or demise, the presumption should be foul play. Otherwise, it's open season on children...to be killed or sold or whatever cuz hey, in the words of Bart Simpson, 'Nobody saw me do anything. Nobody can prove a thing.' The thing should be that a kid was missing and/ or dead and the parent didn't report it. That pretty much rules out something besides foul play. Juries do go there, as they should. This jury should have gone there too with the mountain of evidence they had. Unfortunately, they fell for the defense bushwah.
 
Then the law needs to be changed. That makes no logical sense. She lied and continues to lie and somehow that's okay. That is just not right and yes, I am very angry about it. And I have seen other cases where people have been convicted because they lied and it was proven they lied. So apparently it's not every case where lying gets an acquittal, just this one for some ungodly reason that makes no logical sense. And there was a lot more than just a freaking inference here. I get tired of seeing that. Just because people ignore glaring evidence doesn't mean it never existed.

There was a mountain of evidence in this case. The behavior of the defendant alone should have been enough, has been in similar cases. The prosecution didn't go after one or more of the Ramseys under circumstances not so far from those in this case because they were afraid they might get a jury like this one, later on for other reasons. But cases like this are prosecuted and won- Scott Peterson for example, Aaron Thompson. I think the Caylee case was either lost in jury selection or, more likely, during sequestration when the jury coalesced into a group led by one individual or a clique. MO, of course. What the jury said with this verdict was, hey your baby gets dead, you know its dead, never report the baby missing, don't co-operate to find baby, don't bury baby, baby ends up in a swamp with duct tape, with proof it was in the trunk of your car, scattered, devoured but bugs and animals having been triple trash-bagged all you have to do to avoid responsibility is to allege kidnapping by an imaginary nanny and deny it was an accident for 3 years. Actually YOU never even have to say yourself it was an accident, you certainly don't have to prove there was an accident. If your lawyer says accident, daddy and penis when there is finally a trial, the jury will assume it was an accident. Well, after all, nobody saw you do it, so nobody can prove a thing. You're so tiny and cute. That mean old man with the p-thing is probably responsible anyway. Yippeeeee, you get a pass!! Baby's dead, but you're not. Party on!
 
The evidence was NOT vague, though. Not vague at all, to a majority of the public. A majority of people who've heard, seen and processed the evidence provided do not find it, as a whole, too "vague" to conclude Caylee died because of criminal neglect or homicide.

Why a minority of folks find the evidence to be "vague" appears, to me, to be because of a lack of direct evidence or a "smoking gun". I have this impression by the reasons provided by pro-verdict folks for their support of the NG verdict.

"Vagueness" is NOT merely a personal opinion. Like I said before, personal opinion has no place in determining guilt in a court of law. In personal life? Sure. But in such an important context as a murder trial, the individuals determining guilt must adhere to higher standards of decision making. Like a scientist with a hypothesis, the juror must follow a well-proscribed pathway, employing logic and reason that may or may not reflect their PERSONAL opinion.

My gut reaction, from day 31, was that Caylee Marie was killed by her mother. It just so happens that the evidence provided by the prosecution underscores my gut reaction. My gut reaction was IRRELEVANT. In fact, I'd feel GLAD to know that Caylee did not die at her mother's hand :( . It would give me a kind of relief to believe she drowned accidentally. That no one mishandled and neglected her, but that she simply died due to an understandable albeit tragic mistake anyone could make.

As the Sunshine Laws uncovered the reams and reams of interviews and examinations by this and that expert, I had to admit there was a LOT of very creepy details that cast Casey Anthony in a bad light. As these creepy details survived Frye hearings and were whittled down to undramatic bone, my gut feeling was justified, but who cares? My gut feeling is MINE. It is not a reflection of a greater reality, necessarily. For me to insist that it is is pure egocentricity. I am not an arbiter of Truth. I am just a human being subject to irrationality and emotionalism, not to mention my basic conviction that it is not HARD to raise a child without KILLING them. In fact, most people DO raise their children without killing them. And in light of exhaustive statistics, people who end up with dead children are abnormally negligent or murderous.

The rest of the picture is filled in with evidence.

For Casey Anthony, we have LIES. Lies, lies, lies. Theft. Lack of conscience. Unremitting tolerance for the pain she caused others. This paints a picture, and not exactly an uncommon picture. It is the picture of a sociopathic personality. A person without empathy or awareness of the pain others suffer because of their actions. A relentless adherance to "what about MEEEE???"

We also have a lack of concern for the welfare of Caylee, which undoubtedly would have shown up SOMEWHERE, but didn't.

Add this to the discarded body in the swamp, with a length of duct tape matching the circumference of a tiny skull still attached to a mat of hair and a mandible stubbornly attached in spite of the frailest connective tissue, now gone due to time and decomposition . . .

Not vague. No vagueness to be found anywhere.

How to make chloroform was searched on the A's computer. That is clear. There was a high level of chloroform in the trunk. What evidence was given:

That KC bought chloroform
That KC bought the ingredients to make chloroform
That KC had the skills to make chloroform from scratch
That KC used chloroform on Caylee ever, in any way
That KC stole the chloroform
That KC has ever even touched a bottle of chloroform
When did KC use the chloroform
Where did KC use the chloroform
Why did KC use the chloroform
What caused the high level of chloroform in the trunk
What could have caused the high level
That KC used chloroform on Caylee while she was in the trunk
In the end, JA could only hope KC used the chloroform on Caylee so Caylee didn't suffer. The prosecution should present evidence as to how the chloroform was used, they should present hope as evidence. The chloroform evidence was vague.

The substance like adipocere. If the state had pursued the further testing necessary to prove this substance was adipocere, and it was proven to be adipocere, they would have had direct evidence that a dead body had been in the trunk. They did not do so, WHY, as this left this piece of evidence questionable or vague. Had they did the additional testing, and it had been human adipocere, JA would have pounded this home. This would have solidified all the trunk evidence, so again you have to ask WHY didn't they take one more step. Did they know it was not adipocere, and that is why they didn't? Who knows.

The duct tape. The duct tape was in the vicinity of the skull, near the mouth and nasal cavity, and attached to a hair matt by sediment and debris. The state did not call RK as a witness. RK gave multiple statements interviews and depos, and his story changed every time. Area A was compromised by RK's manipulation of the skull, the amount of manipulation depends on which of his stories is true. RK's stories change, and this makes them untrustworthy which is why the state did not call the hero who found Caylee's remains to the stand. His testimony hurts the states case, because it causes reasonable doubt as to the actual location of the duct tape. According to the inferences (guesses) made by JA and Dr. G. the duct tape was placed over Caylee's mouth and nose. According to the superimposed photoshop movie, the duct tape could have been placed over Caylee's mouth and nose. Inferences about placement of the duct tape that were made without regard to contradictory statements by the man who found the remains, testimony of Dr. Spitz who testified that the skull was laying on its side while decomposing, and potential manipulation caused from animal activity and or Tropical Storm Faye, imo equals reasonable doubt. Also, did the state prove

KC ever had duct tape in her hands to use
KC used the duct tape on Caylee
When KC used the duct tape
Where KC used the duct tape
How KC used the duct tape
The duct tape was used for suffocation (not to stop leakage)
Why KC used the duct tape (suffocation, to silence her, to stop leakage)
Who the mystery DNA belonged to
Too many questions about the duct tape remained unanswered, which to me puts this evidence in the gray area, which is vague.
The barely visible stain in the trunk, that had no DNA, and no blood found in it. There was no blackness to the stain. Vague imo. Even if Caylee's body had been in the trunk
Who placed the body in the trunk
Why did they place the body in the trunk
Why did they leave the body in the trunk for 2.8 days
When did they place the body in the trunk
When did they take the body out of the trunk
why did they take the body out of the trunk
who took the body out of the trunk
The prosecution did not answer these questions, they left it up to the jury to speculate on these answers, and the jury is not allowed to speculate.

The prosecution did not prove
When Caylee died, where Caylee died, how Caylee died, why Caylee died, who killed Caylee, that Caylee did not die by accident, that Caylee did not drown by accident, that Caylee died by chloroform overdose, or chemical overdose, or suffocation by duct tape or any other means. That KC was the last one to see Caylee alive. The state left a mountain of questions for the jury to answer, and in order to answer these questions the jury would have to speculate or guess, because the state could not prove them. The jury is not supposed to speculate or guess. How could the jury possibly convict on the first 3 charges with so much speculation necessary to come to the conclusion of guilty.

As always, my entire post is my opinion only
 
the key word is THEORY

The State did not present theories - the Defense did and Baez has been quoted as recently as several weeks ago saying what he presented at trial was possible theory.
The state presented facts in a logical order. Facts defined by irrefutable evidence and testimonies.

The Defense - well - something similar to FCA's imaginary friends.
 
Are you referring to the Lawyers, Judges, and Trial Experts that are Talking Heads and get their paycheck from affilliated media?

I have no interest whatsoever in Talking Heads, HLN, tabloid news sites or anything that even slightly reminds me a gossip site, or gets paid for their opinion. I leave that to the Defense. Those I refer to have been quoted here over and over again since the trial. I'm not about to repeat them again.
 
How to make chloroform was searched on the A's computer. That is clear. There was a high level of chloroform in the trunk. What evidence was given:

That KC bought chloroform
That KC bought the ingredients to make chloroform
That KC had the skills to make chloroform from scratch
That KC used chloroform on Caylee ever, in any way
That KC stole the chloroform
That KC has ever even touched a bottle of chloroform
When did KC use the chloroform
Where did KC use the chloroform
Why did KC use the chloroform
What caused the high level of chloroform in the trunk
What could have caused the high level
That KC used chloroform on Caylee while she was in the trunk
In the end, JA could only hope KC used the chloroform on Caylee so Caylee didn't suffer. The prosecution should present evidence as to how the chloroform was used, they should present hope as evidence. The chloroform evidence was vague.

The substance like adipocere. If the state had pursued the further testing necessary to prove this substance was adipocere, and it was proven to be adipocere, they would have had direct evidence that a dead body had been in the trunk. They did not do so, WHY, as this left this piece of evidence questionable or vague. Had they did the additional testing, and it had been human adipocere, JA would have pounded this home. This would have solidified all the trunk evidence, so again you have to ask WHY didn't they take one more step. Did they know it was not adipocere, and that is why they didn't? Who knows.

The duct tape. The duct tape was in the vicinity of the skull, near the mouth and nasal cavity, and attached to a hair matt by sediment and debris. The state did not call RK as a witness. RK gave multiple statements interviews and depos, and his story changed every time. Area A was compromised by RK's manipulation of the skull, the amount of manipulation depends on which of his stories is true. RK's stories change, and this makes them untrustworthy which is why the state did not call the hero who found Caylee's remains to the stand. His testimony hurts the states case, because it causes reasonable doubt as to the actual location of the duct tape. According to the inferences (guesses) made by JA and Dr. G. the duct tape was placed over Caylee's mouth and nose. According to the superimposed photoshop movie, the duct tape could have been placed over Caylee's mouth and nose. Inferences about placement of the duct tape that were made without regard to contradictory statements by the man who found the remains, testimony of Dr. Spitz who testified that the skull was laying on its side while decomposing, and potential manipulation caused from animal activity and or Tropical Storm Faye, imo equals reasonable doubt. Also, did the state prove

KC ever had duct tape in her hands to use
KC used the duct tape on Caylee
When KC used the duct tape
Where KC used the duct tape
How KC used the duct tape
The duct tape was used for suffocation (not to stop leakage)
Why KC used the duct tape (suffocation, to silence her, to stop leakage)
Who the mystery DNA belonged to
Too many questions about the duct tape remained unanswered, which to me puts this evidence in the gray area, which is vague.
The barely visible stain in the trunk, that had no DNA, and no blood found in it. There was no blackness to the stain. Vague imo. Even if Caylee's body had been in the trunk
Who placed the body in the trunk
Why did they place the body in the trunk
Why did they leave the body in the trunk for 2.8 days
When did they place the body in the trunk
When did they take the body out of the trunk
why did they take the body out of the trunk
who took the body out of the trunk
The prosecution did not answer these questions, they left it up to the jury to speculate on these answers, and the jury is not allowed to speculate.

The prosecution did not prove
When Caylee died, where Caylee died, how Caylee died, why Caylee died, who killed Caylee, that Caylee did not die by accident, that Caylee did not drown by accident, that Caylee died by chloroform overdose, or chemical overdose, or suffocation by duct tape or any other means. That KC was the last one to see Caylee alive. The state left a mountain of questions for the jury to answer, and in order to answer these questions the jury would have to speculate or guess, because the state could not prove them. The jury is not supposed to speculate or guess. How could the jury possibly convict on the first 3 charges with so much speculation necessary to come to the conclusion of guilty.

As always, my entire post is my opinion only
:hand:Wrong, this is not CSI. The prosecution is NOT required to prove manner of death, nor do you need an eyewitness to the crime or videotape. Circumstantial Evidence is far more powerful than Direct Evidence. Life is not that neat and tidy. Many 1st degree murder convictions have been won without knowing it (e.g. Scott Peterson), and some without the bodies (e.g. Hans Reiser). It is up to the jury to use common sense and connect the dots that the prosecutor gives them. There was noone else with the means, motive, and opportunity to kill Caylee. Casey was her responsible guardian- NOT George- if Caylee had drowned, for which there was zero evidence- and Casey was the last person seen with her. On top of that, you have a mother who lies for the 31 days before Caylee is reported missing, and not by her (she never would have reported her missing because she got her freedom and was living it up). Zero worried reaction for a supposed missing/drowned child, only partying, sex, shopping, stealing, renting videos, and getting tattoos, all while her child was gone!!!!!
F.Y.I., Casey used that duct tape for her ABC flag dress party. I believe Casey put the body in the trunk when she backed up her car in the garage as seen by the next door neighbor and asked to borrow his shovel. I think she made the Chloroform from common ingredients and did it at the abandoned house near the woods off Suburban...:twocents:
What mystery DNA????:waitasec:
Also, I talked to a criminologist. He told me that water is destructive, so Caylee being under water for several months would destroy fingerprint evidence on the duct tape...
 
There was a mountain of evidence in this case. The behavior of the defendant alone should have been enough, has been in similar cases. The prosecution didn't go after one or more of the Ramseys under circumstances not so far from those in this case because they were afraid they might get a jury like this one, later on for other reasons. But cases like this are prosecuted and won- Scott Peterson for example, Aaron Thompson. I think the Caylee case was either lost in jury selection or, more likely, during sequestration when the jury coalesced into a group led by one individual or a clique. MO, of course. What the jury said with this verdict was, hey your baby gets dead, you know its dead, never report the baby missing, don't co-operate to find baby, don't bury baby, baby ends up in a swamp with duct tape, with proof it was in the trunk of your car, scattered, devoured but bugs and animals having been triple trash-bagged all you have to do to avoid responsibility is to allege kidnapping by an imaginary nanny and deny it was an accident for 3 years. Actually YOU never even have to say yourself it was an accident, you certainly don't have to prove there was an accident. If your lawyer says accident, daddy and penis when there is finally a trial, the jury will assume it was an accident. Well, after all, nobody saw you do it, so nobody can prove a thing. You're so tiny and cute. That mean old man with the p-thing is probably responsible anyway. Yippeeeee, you get a pass!! Baby's dead, but you're not. Party on!

Yes, in fact wasn't that a quote of FCA's when the miachondrial DNA came back? Since it could either be FCA's death band hair or Caylee's death band hair - FCA said - well I'm here.
 
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