The Whites Party Photos and also When exactly did JBR die??

[eileenhawkeye]

It looks like wallpaper behind her...The swirl-like design....What room has the same?

 

[Mama2JML]

Could this picture have actually been taken in the laundry room ?View attachment 58008

No, the photo above is a cropped image of this photo:

 

[UKGuy]

I believe the Rs told police there were dead batteries in the camcorder. Seems out of character for Patsy-she loved to chronicle the special occasions- hard to believe she didn't make sure the video equipment was ready. We have seen a few photos from that morning...Patsy with her death grip on JB's arm with a sweetly smiling JB in her pink pajama top. There is one of JB with her new bike under the tree. There may be a few more in cyberspace.

DeeDee249,
Unless these were specialist batteries, this seems a really poor excuse. Patsy could just phone some store up and have a replacement camcorder delivered ASAP.

There is a clue hiding away in the R's version of events. In the picture of JonBenet with her new bike she appears to be dressed in all white bedclothes. From memory PR said she was looking for the pink pajamas but could not find them so dressed JonBenet in the white longjohns and left her in the white gap top. So how come JonBenet appears to be dressed in white bedclothes, presumably sometime Christmas day? Unless I'm color blind, looks to me as if the longjohns and white gap top are not too dissimilar from how JonBenet was dressed in the new bike under the tree photo?

.

 

[DeeDee249]

Could this picture have actually been taken in the laundry room ?View attachment 58008

It certainly looks like it. It seems to show what looks like a washer and dryer against the wall behind JB. You can also clearly see the gifts wrapped in the signature FAO Schwartz paper. Police claimed to find "partially wrapped (i.e. unwrapped) gifts in the winecellar- yet none was mentioned as having been found in the basement laundry area, which was right outside the winecellar. Also, police asked Patsy whether any photos were taken of JB in the laundry area. There was some confusion as to wether police referred to photos of JB FOUND in the laundry area or photos of JB TAKEN in the laundry area.

 

[elannia]

It certainly looks like it. It seems to show what looks like a washer and dryer against the wall behind JB. You can also clearly see the gifts wrapped in the signature FAO Schwartz paper. Police claimed to find "partially wrapped (i.e. unwrapped) gifts in the winecellar- yet none was mentioned as having been found in the basement laundry area, which was right outside the winecellar. Also, police asked Patsy whether any photos were taken of JB in the laundry area. There was some confusion as to wether police referred to photos of JB FOUND in the laundry area or photos of JB TAKEN in the laundry area.

Its in the Living room(whatever they called it) I can see what looks like a chair(recliner) near JB

 

[DeeDee249]

DeeDee249,
Unless these were specialist batteries, this seems a really poor excuse. Patsy could just phone some store up and have a replacement camcorder delivered ASAP.

There is a clue hiding away in the R's version of events. In the picture of JonBenet with her new bike she appears to be dressed in all white bedclothes. From memory PR said she was looking for the pink pajamas but could not find them so dressed JonBenet in the white longjohns and left her in the white gap top. So how come JonBenet appears to be dressed in white bedclothes, presumably sometime Christmas day? Unless I'm color blind, looks to me as if the longjohns and white gap top are not too dissimilar from how JonBenet was dressed in the new bike under the tree photo?

.

Many stores are closed on Christmas Day. It was in Patsy's nature to have all her ducks in a row. She'd have made sure the camera had batteries. I just think a video either deliberately was NOT taken or deliberately was erased and JR offered the "dead batteries" as an excuse.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

There are three pictures of JonBenet on Christmas morning that have been released. I definitely think there are more, and I bet there was video taken too that was deleted. Maybe there was some disagreement or someone was a bit cranky, and the Ramseys worried it might be used against them? It just makes no sense that they only took 3 pictures.

 

[InstantProof]

Many stores are closed on Christmas Day. It was in Patsy's nature to have all her ducks in a row. She'd have made sure the camera had batteries. I just think a video either deliberately was NOT taken or deliberately was erased and JR offered the "dead batteries" as an excuse.

Didn't video cameras of that time have rechargeable batteries?

 

[midwest mama]

Didn't video cameras of that time have rechargeable batteries?

Yes, and JR said that's why they didn't film....the batteries weren't charged up.

 

[DeDee]

<modsnip>

On January 3, 1997 Lawrence Smith sold photos obtained at a photo processing facility to Brett Sawyer and those photos were later published in the Globe on January 12, 1997. There were also reports of photographs taken out of trash bins of a photography processing facility used by the Ramsey investigators.
http://www.acandyrose.com/crimescene-photos.htm

Larry King Live ~ Aired May 28, 2001 - 21:00 ET [Excerpts selected by me]

SMIT: That's the window. Now, again, that picture that you see is the first photograph taken of that window after the crime scene technicians got back into the house. Now, later on, I believe that it was noted that this window may have been opened even by John Ramsey and Fleet White.

SMIT: The position of that suitcase when it was first observed there, by Fleet White, was that it was directly against the wall, directly underneath that open window.

SMIT: ...Also, upstairs, in the master bedroom, there is no indication there where anything was disturbed, or where there had been any violence. In Burke's room, it's the same way. [SMIT does not mention that FW made Burke's bed that morning.]

SMIT: And brought her down to the deepest, farthest, dirtiest corner of that basement, and did fashion a garrote there that was used to strangle her. And that he did also stunt-gun her, very possibly, at that location. And then he also brutally hit her on the head with a blunt object.

SMIT: I see a brutal first-degree murder. I see a very violent death of JonBenet. I see someone fashioning a garrote and putting it around her neck. I see someone tightening that garrote to control her. I see someone taking that handle and pulling it very violently tight and killing her.

SMIT: Perhaps, the kidnapper is also a sadistic pedophile, perhaps that was his intent all along. I don't know what was in the mind of the killer. All I know is that the killer fantasied making this garrote in his mind. He fantasized putting this around JonBenet's neck.

He had to put a handle on this garrote. He had to put a noose on this garrote. He had to put it around JonBenet's neck, probably while she was still bound and had duct tape on her mouth, this is a fantasy in the mind of the killer. Why he did this, inside the house, I don't know.

Perhaps he don't have a place to take JonBenet. Perhaps he couldn't get her out of the house. I believe that the suitcase has another function in that window. I think perhaps he tried to stick her in that suitcase. I believe that there is...

KING: Really they are going...

SMIT: Fibers on the outside of JonBenet's clothing which may have come from the material inside that suitcase. That is what the lab report says.

SMIT: ....The Ramseys should have been interviewed right away. That was a mistake. One of the biggest mistakes that was made. They should have been brought down to the police station right away. It was not their decision not to do that...

KING: ....He [Police Chief Beckner] says, "The department believes it would be improper it to debate the merits of the Ramsey case evidence in the public arena."

The statement also says that Lou Smit has not been involved in the official investigation of JonBenet's killing for the past two and a half years. And adds -- quoting here, "The case and development of evidence has changed significantly over that period of time."

According to the Boulder police, they formerly interviewed more than 600 people in this case. Investigated about 140 potential suspects. Logged about 1400 items of evidence. And built a file approximately 40,000 pages long.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0105/28/lkl.00.html

FW touched the basement window and possibly the window sill, moved the Samsonite suitcase, looked inside the wine cellar hellhole, touched Burke's bedding, drove Burke to his home and was with John when he "discovered" JonBenét.

moo omo omho and all that jazz

 

[midwest mama]

DeDee. in all fairness here and with respect to your posting, the reference you showed cited Lawrence Smith selling photos to a Globe representative. This person was not Lou Smit, the detective. Lawrence Smith was an employee of the photo lab, and IIRC, he pilfered the photos away during their processing and sold them.

I can't believe for a moment that Lou Smit would have sold crime scene photos, even though I don't agree with his theory. He earned a remarkable reputation over the years for his abilities.

 

[DeDee]

Well, blow me down! When I am wrong; I'll say I'm wrong!

midwest mama, I admit to speed reading and along with that comes errors. Thank you for the respectful correction.

However brilliant Lou Smit's career may have been, I have difficulty getting over his ability to commit fraud in order to get a job in Law Enforcement. After LS left the unsolved murder of JonBenét, he hooked up with the producers of Haunting Evidence on trutv. LS guides the two psychics to the R home and also to the White's home as he describes the circumstantial evidence to them. The end result of the psychics' televised involvement was an implication that a security guard from Access Graphics may have committed the heinous crime.

From Wikipedia ~ "Smit boasted that he "never lost a homicide case" in a career in which he worked on more than 200 murder cases in which a suspect had been arrested and tried for their crime."

This detective who was called out of retirement to assist on the JBR murder investigation, sought psychics to help him to solve the case. Really? One of the psychics claimed to have recorded JonBenét's voice outside of her home on 15th Street. What a farce! JMO

Lou Smit lied to get into LE. Furthermore, he sought psychics to further promote his "intruder" theory. Those are not attributes of a "remarkable reputation". JMO

Having tried various businesses and failing, Smit prayed for a solution and saw as an answer from God a call he received from a cousin who served on the Colorado Springs Department suggesting that he apply to serve.[2] Smit fell just short of the department's minimum height of five feet and nine inches, but was able to join the force in 1966 after he had his cousin hit him over the skull with a nightstick, allowing him to meet the height minimum when he was remeasured the following day with the bump on his head.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lou_Smit

http://www.trutv.com/shows/haunting_evidence/index.html?pid=Am__y4p9FG_wGRcfjJJFIOAaM4rmGFCa

Haunting Evidence threads:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?89163-Haunting-Evidence-JonBenet-Ramsey

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...unting-Evidence-on-JBR-tonight-Saturday/page2

MMHOO

 

[chlban]

Well, blow me down! When I am wrong; I'll say I'm wrong!

midwest mama, I admit to speed reading and along with that comes errors. Thank you for the respectful correction.

However brilliant Lou Smit's career may have been, I have difficulty getting over his ability to commit fraud in order to get a job in Law Enforcement. After LS left the unsolved murder of JonBenét, he hooked up with the producers of Haunting Evidence on trutv. LS guides the two psychics to the R home and also to the White's home as he describes the circumstantial evidence to them. The end result of the psychics' televised involvement was an implication that a security guard from Access Graphics may have committed the heinous crime.

From Wikipedia ~ "Smit boasted that he "never lost a homicide case" in a career in which he worked on more than 200 murder cases in which a suspect had been arrested and tried for their crime."

This detective who was called out of retirement to assist on the JBR murder investigation, sought psychics to help him to solve the case. Really? One of the psychics claimed to have recorded JonBenét's voice outside of her home on 15th Street. What a farce! JMO

Lou Smit lied to get into LE. Furthermore, he sought psychics to further promote his "intruder" theory. Those are not attributes of a "remarkable reputation". JMO



http://www.trutv.com/shows/haunting_evidence/index.html?pid=Am__y4p9FG_wGRcfjJJFIOAaM4rmGFCa

Haunting Evidence threads:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?89163-Haunting-Evidence-JonBenet-Ramsey

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...unting-Evidence-on-JBR-tonight-Saturday/page2

MMHOO

BBM. I agree. Even John Douglas didn't stoop to selling psychic crap. At least not that I know of.

 

[midwest mama]

OK, touche on Smit's foibles. Irrespective of his shortcomings before and after his career, and maybe even some during his career of which we may never know, the man did have, IMO, a remarkable reputation for crime-solving. He knew how to sleuth in his active career and ascertain a resolve.

I do feel he goofed, big time, on the way he responded to the JB case, and do not agree with his theory. Maybe staying in retirement would have served him better than to have left this last case as the ending to his legacy. Just MHO.

 

[WhoKnowsWhat]

Nom de plume,
IMO, JAR is possible given your assumptions. Then you have to ask why does JR, PR and BR cover for him?

The absence of Christmas images and that of those taken at the White's party is no coincidence.

They represent cogent forensic evidence so have been sealed.


.

If JR convinced PR that BR injured JBR, then PR would help to cover for BR. I don't think BR knew too much of what happened and told LE that JBR was awake when they got home Christmas evening.

 

[andreww]

Not every party has pictures taken at it. Especially when the party is a "friends" affair. Family affairs I would expect to see cameras at, but at a friends party, maybe, maybe not.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[tweezybird]

Is there a complete list of who was at the White's party?

 

[DeeDee249]

Not every party has pictures taken at it. Especially when the party is a "friends" affair. Family affairs I would expect to see cameras at, but at a friends party, maybe, maybe not.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

True, but we KNOW police had copies of photos taken at the White's party. As for a complete list of attendees, I am sure police had that as well.

 

[dodie20]

There are three pictures of JonBenet on Christmas morning that have been released. I definitely think there are more, and I bet there was video taken too that was deleted. Maybe there was some disagreement or someone was a bit cranky, and the Ramseys worried it might be used against them? It just makes no sense that they only took 3 pictures.

right, either they only turned over a few pictures or only 3 pictures were released to the public. I've never been much of a picture taker, but even I, after going to the trouble of getting out the camera etc., wouldn't stop at 3 on Christmas morning. hmmm, wonder if they did take more but only turned over 3 or if only 3 out of however many were released to the public....after all these years, I can't think of a good reason to not release the others, if there are more. It's not like they're worried about tipping off the killer. Not after all these years. moo

 

[icedtea4me]

right, either they only turned over a few pictures or only 3 pictures were released to the public. I've never been much of a picture taker, but even I, after going to the trouble of getting out the camera etc., wouldn't stop at 3 on Christmas morning. hmmm, wonder if they did take more but only turned over 3 or if only 3 out of however many were released to the public....after all these years, I can't think of a good reason to not release the others, if there are more. It's not like they're worried about tipping off the killer. Not after all these years. moo

Since JonBenet is the victim, the only Christmas pictures released, imho, are going to be of her.