Theories #1: What Happened to Jennifer Kesse?

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Every little bit more that we could see would have helped, but it still wouldn't have necessarily allowed differentation between some of her known or possible associates that's been discussed. And if it's a stranger, wouldn't have been able to id him based on face profile. A little better, but not necessarily better than where we are.

Truth, I don't understand the part about my "thoughts are that he never went back to Jenn's condo at all after he parked her car." While this is true, the question is where he went when he walked out of HOTG onto the Americana sidewalk. I assume most believe he walked back to Mosaic, bolstered by the dog tracking (I don't know what the tracking path was away from her car that the police saw the dog perform, but of course is known by surveillance he walked around the pool and by the pool gate), and my opinion is he caught a bus there at the covered bus stop on the corner of Americana and Texas, but no matter how he walked out of HOTG it wouldn't give any indication of what he did or where he went on Americana. Does that make more sense?

Also, re:surveillance video area, I don't know details of cameras, whether they were all the same or something different about the "video" of car entering HOTG versus the still images of POI passing pool gate, but there are two cameras involved in that. The "video" of car entering is from a camera on top of poolhouse covering entrance and whatever can be seen of parking the car. The still images are from a camera on end of poolhouse aimed at the pool gate.

My understanding from previous postings we did here in 2007 was that there was a third camera on other end of poolhouse that was aimed in direction of where Jennofer's car was parked but was not operational. I don't remember details on that but we posted along those lines back then, that at least was my understanding back then from some info given here. I ran across some of those postings recently and surprised that I was involved posting about the third camera. Well I guess that was ten years ago.
Re paragraph bolded by me: It was only my own convoluted thinking. Just from reading I had it implanted in my mind that the cameras showed him walking from where he parked Jenn's car back towards Jenn's condo building. I thought Bo just confirmed what the cameras showed and maybe took it a little bit further.

That's why I like to take the time to map because it really makes things a lot clearer for me.

What you have explained has been very helpful, and I appreciate it so much.

I'd like to find the bus stop that appears to be a possibility and see how he could have made his way there from the spot behind the palm tree. I see the corner you refer to--but I'll probably have to draw a line on the map as it has to have rather accurate directions to chart it on it's own. So, some time to get that done and I'll be happy.
 
Sorry for the sudden post, but found this from Chris Henson ie To catch a predator" fame. It about Joyces thought on the POI from a TV reporter Beau Zimmer link below.. (And it was a four day trip.)

"Among them is an ex-boyfriend of Jennifer's who was reportedly in a jealous rage after learning that she had gone to the Caribbean with Rob.

"The night before or sometime before, he had been out drinking and gotten drunk and apparently he was upset that he was not the one that was with Jennifer," said Zimmer. "They talked with him several times, and while police say he is not a suspect in the case, certainly you get the feeling from others that he should be talked to a little bit more."

Jennifer's mom Joyce says there was a married co-worker who had been hitting on Jennifer at the office.

"Jennifer arranged to meet him in the cafeteria at work so that once and for all she could tell him, 'Leave me alone, I am never going to date you. And besides, I don't date married men,'" said Joyce.

That person was questioned.

"We feel it should have been consistent to keep the pressure on that individual," said Joyce."


I need to know the timeline of the Days Her brother and friends occupied her apartment, compared to his night at the blue martini, and which friends phone it was.. his or the other guy.. Unconcluded where are you when I need you..

https://crimewatchdaily.com/2016/03/21/cold-case-jennifer-kesse-disappears-steps-from-orlando-home/
BBM - I wish I knew more about the timeline for Logan, Travis and Matt, too.

So, Logan is Jennifer's brother. He "condo sat" for Jenn and arrived with his two friends--but I don't have a time as to when. Jenn called her father around 6:15 PM on the 23rd and Logan spoke to Jenn directly afterwards, explaining about Travis forgetting his cell phone at her condo. He feels they settled on Jenn putting it in the mail while at work on the 24th.

Travis is the friend who owned the cell phone and forgot it at Jennifer's condo. (Travis called Jennifer sometime during the evening of the 23rd to discuss the cell phone; and he also showed up with Logan on the 24th.)

Matt is the friend who was "stinking drunk" at the Blue Martini bar in the big mall across from Jennifer's condo building on the evening of the 23rd. He and Jenn had dated at some point, but Jenn had been with Rob for almost a year. I would like to know if Matt even lived in Orlando? If not, why didn't he go home with the other boys? And where did he spend the night? After all, bars do close. Eventually they even kick the stinking drunks out.

Also, I think someone was wondering about this--for most of the time Jenn and Rob dated, Jen would go to Robb's place for a weekend and Rob would go to Jenn's place for a weekend. I think I heard they did this on a two week schedule; and every weekend Jenn spent at Rob's, she would rise early and drive directly to her workplace in Orlando without stopping at her condo. It appears as though the only difference in her last weekend with Rob was the length--maybe a day or so longer; and they flew to St. Croix and back to Rob's on the Sunday.

Amen, and correct me if im wrong, but she stated in Unconcluded , she was not told the 10:40 time by LE.. they want that info to hold if they catch the perps
BBM - I say respectfully that it is too late for that. It's out there and can't be taken back. If this is all LE has to try to "trip" someone, it is no longer enough and would most likely result in a circus confession like in the JonBenet Ramsey case.

I sometimes ponder if it's Jenn's parents who want to point us away from this because it definitely over rules the morning abduction theory. Only pondering, folks. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong.
 
I'm onboard with this except for the path. And I'm a bit vague on this, but I thought the dog tracked through a field adjacent to HOTG instead of straight to the street. (Down Downing St to Tom Jones and out the back of HOTG?) Again, some of the 'facts' about this case have been refuted so this may be wrong as well.
Thank you for this. I don't agree with the path at this point, either. I'm going to just remove it from the map.

It is in a separate layer, though; so once at the link you can just turn the layer off.

Now that you mention about the field, I do think I have heard that. I see now that nothing at all is solid once the POI left the relatively small vicinity of the surveillance cameras.
 
Amen, and correct me if im wrong, but she stated in Unconcluded , she was not told the 10:40 time by LE.. they want that info to hold if they catch the perps

I can tell you that Kesse's post was carefully worded to repeat a technical explanation given to him and sounds like a carrier analysis to me. It would have to be someone that reliably conveyed information from the cell phone carriers (one or two depending on if both phones handled by same carrier) analysis of phone logs and tower pings (multiple potential towers).

As there are legalities involved here, it is a matter of a comfort level of Kesses accepting a conveyance of a professional analysis of carrier data. I don't need to know how they got it, just that they trust that it's reliable,
 
I'm onboard with this except for the path. And I'm a bit vague on this, but I thought the dog tracked through a field adjacent to HOTG instead of straight to the street. (Down Downing St to Tom Jones and out the back of HOTG?) Again, some of the 'facts' about this case have been refuted so this may be wrong as well.

My vague understanding, and I didn't read much on it, is that the field thing was approaching Mosaic from Conroy, a shortcut to and over a fence instead of going through Mosaic front gate. I don't understand how there can be any ambiguity about leaving HOTG. The surveillance cameras showed him walking past the pool and pool gate. All a person can do is continue walking up a short distance along Texas in the lane to Americana.

The covered bus stop is at corner there of Texas and Americana, where your path has POI turning right there and starting walk back to Mosaic. There is nothing wrong with the path.
 
It is said Jennifer was safety conscious and I believe that to be true.

However being safety conscious and leaving your condo alone after 10 pm doesn't go hand in hand with being safety conscious to me.
Especially when there is a 'bad' area a mere mile down the road. The people from the 'bad' area must surely roam about after dark.

Also, what price having a dead lock fitted to your condo door. I know hindsight is a valuable thing but if you are safety conscious I believe that would have been a sound idea.
Especially with ongoing construction and master keys around the place.
And how easy is it to get a key cut anyway.

If Jennifer was out after 10 pm I would think it was because she was forced out.
 
It is said Jennifer was safety conscious and I believe that to be true.

However being safety conscious and leaving your condo alone after 10 pm doesn't go hand in hand with being safety conscious to me.
Especially when there is a 'bad' area a mere mile down the road. The people from the 'bad' area must surely roam about after dark.

Also, what price having a dead lock fitted to your condo door. I know hindsight is a valuable thing but if you are safety conscious I believe that would have been a sound idea.
Especially with ongoing construction and master keys around the place.
And how easy is it to get a key cut anyway.

If Jennifer was out after 10 pm I would think it was because she was forced out.

Not saying that is completely out of the question with roamers lurking, however based on my experience.. Roamers tend to migrate toward Orange Blossom Trail, the opposite way. Once you pass John Young, it is a different world, less touristy etc. It is truly odd, but I've never seen a homeless person panhandling that close to the expressway etc.
 
My vague understanding, and I didn't read much on it, is that the field thing was approaching Mosaic from Conroy, a shortcut to and over a fence instead of going through Mosaic front gate. I don't understand how there can be any ambiguity about leaving HOTG. The surveillance cameras showed him walking past the pool and pool gate. All a person can do is continue walking up a short distance along Texas in the lane to Americana.

The covered bus stop is at corner there of Texas and Americana, where your path has POI turning right there and starting walk back to Mosaic. There is nothing wrong with the path.

Sorry Ryan, this was intended as response to Truth. I was in a rush and clicked wrong post reply.

It's relevant to your post but was addressing Truth's path. :)
 
Re paragraph bolded by me: It was only my own convoluted thinking. Just from reading I had it implanted in my mind that the cameras showed him walking from where he parked Jenn's car back towards Jenn's condo building. I thought Bo just confirmed what the cameras showed and maybe took it a little bit further.

That's why I like to take the time to map because it really makes things a lot clearer for me.

What you have explained has been very helpful, and I appreciate it so much.

I'd like to find the bus stop that appears to be a possibility and see how he could have made his way there from the spot behind the palm tree. I see the corner you refer to--but I'll probably have to draw a line on the map as it has to have rather accurate directions to chart it on it's own. So, some time to get that done and I'll be happy.

My vague understanding, and I didn't read much on it, is that the field thing was approaching Mosaic from Conroy, a shortcut to and over a fence instead of going through Mosaic front gate. I don't understand how there can be any ambiguity about leaving HOTG. The surveillance cameras showed him walking past the pool and pool gate. All a person can do is continue walking up a short distance along Texas in the lane to Americana.

The covered bus stop is at corner there of Texas and Americana, where your path has POI turning right there and starting walk back to Mosaic. There is nothing wrong with the path.
 
Thank you for this. I don't agree with the path at this point, either. I'm going to just remove it from the map.

It is in a separate layer, though; so once at the link you can just turn the layer off.

Now that you mention about the field, I do think I have heard that. I see now that nothing at all is solid once the POI left the relatively small vicinity of the surveillance cameras.

I have read that the dog tracked back to the Mosaic through a wooded area or field area....The way that I understand it is the POI bypassed the guard shack by taking this route to the fence and entered the Mosaic through this fence ....About the fence, if you have seen pictures of this fence, the fence attaches to a stucco post.....I think that the screw that held the fence to the stucco post was removed as the stucco appears intact not like it was ripped from the post shattering the stucco....
 
It is said Jennifer was safety conscious and I believe that to be true.

However being safety conscious and leaving your condo alone after 10 pm doesn't go hand in hand with being safety conscious to me.
Especially when there is a 'bad' area a mere mile down the road. The people from the 'bad' area must surely roam about after dark.

Also, what price having a dead lock fitted to your condo door. I know hindsight is a valuable thing but if you are safety conscious I believe that would have been a sound idea.
Especially with ongoing construction and master keys around the place.
And how easy is it to get a key cut anyway.

If Jennifer was out after 10 pm I would think it was because she was forced out.

Drew had installed a deadbolt on her door that she had to lock from the inside with a key is the way I understand it....Not sure if she could lock this deadbolt from the outside of her condo or not....
 
It is my understanding that Jennifer's vacation started on a Thursday, May 19, 2006....Not sure if I have ever read what time Logan and his friends arrived there.....
 
It is my understanding that Jennifer's vacation started on a Thursday, May 19, 2006....Not sure if I have ever read what time Logan and his friends arrived there.....

This is a bit of trivia I've hardly seen mentioned. Falls right in with who knew how long she would be gone and when would she be back. I always wondered if it was a coincidence that Jennifer just disappeared her first morning leaving her condo since she came back. IOW, if her trip ended 22 January (Sunday) how did the abductor know she wouldn't be back that night to leave from her condo the morning of the 23rd. Sure co-workers might know she would be back at work on the 23rd, but driving in from Rob's that morning might not be common knowledge.

If this was planned and not a crime of opportunity that is a detail the abductor would need. I often wondered if any of the few occupants of the units might have noticed someone around that area with no particular job or work to do.
 
Sorry Ryan, this was intended as response to Truth. I was in a rush and clicked wrong post reply.

It's relevant to your post but was addressing Truth's path. :)

You're on a roll....I'm not going to stop you! :D
 
This is a bit of trivia I've hardly seen mentioned. Falls right in with who knew how long she would be gone and when would she be back. I always wondered if it was a coincidence that Jennifer just disappeared her first morning leaving her condo since she came back. IOW, if her trip ended 22 January (Sunday) how did the abductor know she wouldn't be back that night to leave from her condo the morning of the 23rd. Sure co-workers might know she would be back at work on the 23rd, but driving in from Rob's that morning might not be common knowledge.

If this was planned and not a crime of opportunity that is a detail the abductor would need. I often wondered if any of the few occupants of the units might have noticed someone around that area with no particular job or work to do.

If her disappearance was planned it points to someone who was angered by her trip and who would know her return date I believe....
 
My vague understanding, and I didn't read much on it, is that the field thing was approaching Mosaic from Conroy, a shortcut to and over a fence instead of going through Mosaic front gate. I don't understand how there can be any ambiguity about leaving HOTG. The surveillance cameras showed him walking past the pool and pool gate. All a person can do is continue walking up a short distance along Texas in the lane to Americana.

The covered bus stop is at corner there of Texas and Americana, where your path has POI turning right there and starting walk back to Mosaic. There is nothing wrong with the path.
On the screen shot below I added red arrows to represent the path of the POI. I put him walking along Downing St and crossing kitty corner to the bus stop that I circled in red, too.

I know you say Texas, not Downing, but I can't understand how he could get to Texas without backtracking to Huntington Green Court; unless you mean he crossed on the green space between Downing and Texas, right after he finished hiding behind the palm tree at marker #4?

I'm so sorry for being confused like this--I'm not from the area; not even close. I promise I won't keep this up.

10if52v.jpg
 
On the screen shot below I added red arrows to represent the path of the POI. I put him walking along Downing St and crossing kitty corner to the bus stop that I circled in red, too.

I know you say Texas, not Downing, but I can't understand how he could get to Texas without backtracking to Huntington Green Court; unless you mean he crossed on the green space between Downing and Texas, right after he finished hiding behind the palm tree at marker #4?

I'm so sorry for being confused like this--I'm not from the area; not even close. I promise I won't keep this up.

10if52v.jpg

First of all, we're making a lot of progress with your maps, so much appreciated for that.

You have the arrows correct from the pool to the corner of Americana. That is just the POI continuing to walk past the gate and on down the lane to Americana where he would then do something about going somewhere. I call it a parking lane, I see the map says it is Downing St. It is a little lane in the apartment complex.

I said he would walk down the lane that runs alongside Texas, and Downing runs alongside Texas. Your thoughts were that the POI would exit out to Texas and walk along Texas. Looking at your map you can see there's no sidewalk along Texas there on the other side of Downing. There's no reason a person would want to get over in the grass and walk alongside Texas up to Americana. They would just continue walking down the Downing lane they've been walking on as the went around the pool and passed the gate into the pool where the pictures were taken. They would walk right where your red arrows are.

Since I am the only one who thinks that those covered bus stops at Texas and Americana is where he likely went, let's forget about that for the moment. He would only cut across the grass at the corner if he wanted to go left on down Americana, stop at one of the bus stops, or in the case of living nearby down Texas, cross Americana and continue down Texas to his residence.

Let's say it's none of those, and that he walked back to Mosaic. Then your last red arrow across the grass at the corner would go away. He would round the turn at the end of Downing and walk a short distance on the same lane but now named Tom Jones. he would walk to the Picadilly Circus lane and then out the entrance and onto the sidewalk on Americana. He would then walk as your path showed, down Americana, cross that expressway, continue on now called Conroy, and cut across a lot to the Mosaic fence as soon as he near Mosaic.

Your original path was close enough. It showed coming down Texas and turn down Americana to Mosaic and that is plenty close enough. The lane runs right alongside Texas within HOTG, and then in front runs along Americana inside HOTG as Tom Jones.

Lastly, and this is highly technical :), I said catty corner and you correctly said kitty corner, I think, but I don't remember, that was back in the day last I heard someone use it. In any event the interesting thing is that your arrow is just across the street corner, not kitty / catty corner. Kitty corner would be diagonal across Americana. Except a person can't do that, they would cross Texas at the red arrow but then continue and cross Americana, and they would have crossed kitty corner. Except I see you circled what looks like a bus stop and it looks like one on both sides, so he would he gone to whichever bus stop for direction he was headed, which the bus stop you circled would be for headed back to Mosaic.

And thus you have stumbled upon the answer. He would have taken a bus back toward Mosaic, not walked, as I have never believed from the beginning. However, I thought the bus would more likely be headed on out Americana toward Orange Tree Blossom, but no, he is headed back toward Mosaic, either the complex itself, or where he parked his car when he walked in there to stalk Jennifer or whatever he was intent on doing when he abducted her.

It is starting to make sense.
 
Does anyone believe this abduction will ever be solved?

It is a tough one; no body, no crime scene, no physical evidence and no witnesses.
One would think there must be a witness to something somewhere but if there is they aren't talking.

I often think LE has seen lots of stuff we'd like to see and they have talked to many people we would like to talk to but they haven't made any headway. Yet.

I guess that's why it's eleven years and counting. Sad and frustrating.
 
First of all, we're making a lot of progress with your maps, so much appreciated for that.

You have the arrows correct from the pool to the corner of Americana. That is just the POI continuing to walk past the gate and on down the lane to Americana where he would then do something about going somewhere. I call it a parking lane, I see the map says it is Downing St. It is a little lane in the apartment complex.

I said he would walk down the lane that runs alongside Texas, and Downing runs alongside Texas. Your thoughts were that the POI would exit out to Texas and walk along Texas. Looking at your map you can see there's no sidewalk along Texas there on the other side of Downing. There's no reason a person would want to get over in the grass and walk alongside Texas up to Americana. They would just continue walking down the Downing lane they've been walking on as the went around the pool and passed the gate into the pool where the pictures were taken. They would walk right where your red arrows are.

Since I am the only one who thinks that those covered bus stops at Texas and Americana is where he likely went, let's forget about that for the moment. He would only cut across the grass at the corner if he wanted to go left on down Americana, stop at one of the bus stops, or in the case of living nearby down Texas, cross Americana and continue down Texas to his residence.

Let's say it's none of those, and that he walked back to Mosaic. Then your last red arrow across the grass at the corner would go away. He would round the turn at the end of Downing and walk a short distance on the same lane but now named Tom Jones. he would walk to the Picadilly Circus lane and then out the entrance and onto the sidewalk on Americana. He would then walk as your path showed, down Americana, cross that expressway, continue on now called Conroy, and cut across a lot to the Mosaic fence as soon as he near Mosaic.

Your original path was close enough. It showed coming down Texas and turn down Americana to Mosaic and that is plenty close enough. The lane runs right alongside Texas within HOTG, and then in front runs along Americana inside HOTG as Tom Jones.

Lastly, and this is highly technical :), I said catty corner and you correctly said kitty corner, I think, but I don't remember, that was back in the day last I heard someone use it. In any event the interesting thing is that your arrow is just across the street corner, not kitty / catty corner. Kitty corner would be diagonal across Americana. Except a person can't do that, they would cross Texas at the red arrow but then continue and cross Americana, and they would have crossed kitty corner. Except I see you circled what looks like a bus stop and it looks like one on both sides, so he would he gone to whichever bus stop for direction he was headed, which the bus stop you circled would be for headed back to Mosaic.

And thus you have stumbled upon the answer. He would have taken a bus back toward Mosaic, not walked, as I have never believed from the beginning. However, I thought the bus would more likely be headed on out Americana toward Orange Tree Blossom, but no, he is headed back toward Mosaic, either the complex itself, or where he parked his car when he walked in there to stalk Jennifer or whatever he was intent on doing when he abducted her.

It is starting to make sense.
Thank you for your comments above and previous; and also for your time. I really mean that. I hope you don't for a second contemplate that I meant anything by the catty corner/kitty corner thing. Oh my gosh, never. I just grabbed the first word that popped into my head as I tried to call up from memory what you had said in a previous comment.

You are most certainly correct in mentioning that I circled the first bus stop I found that I could point arrows to, but your thoughts that he may have taken a bus back to Jenn's condo building seems well within the possibilities. I have read, and others here on the thread have mentioned, that LE did gather and review hours and hours of video from any and every place possible. They found nothing apparently, not a trace. A short and quick bus trip could be the answer.
 
Does anyone believe this abduction will ever be solved?

It is a tough one; no body, no crime scene, no physical evidence and no witnesses.
One would think there must be a witness to something somewhere but if there is they aren't talking.

I often think LE has seen lots of stuff we'd like to see and they have talked to many people we would like to talk to but they haven't made any headway. Yet.

I guess that's why it's eleven years and counting. Sad and frustrating.
BBM - that is the problem. Not even enough to offer positive speculation on when a young woman like Jennifer Kesse could have been over come by this evil .

I know that they do solve old cases of 15, 20, 25 years. So, yes, I do have hope it will be solved. And if the podcast and threads like this can get the public showing interest--that will send LE a strong message that Jennifer has not been forgotten.
 
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