Trial Discussion Thread #33 - 14.05.05 Day 26

[DebinGA]

So Dr Stipp heard both set's of sound's then a man shout for help 3 times
Logic tell's us Carice Stander was awoken after the 2nd set of sounds, she also then heard a man shout for help 3 times.
Oscar's bail affidavit said he shouted for help before breaking the toilet door down.
This show's that no one heard the breaking of the toilet door, it back's up the theory that the door was damaged earlier(first set of sounds), and simply pried open etc after gunshot's.

IIRC OP testified that, still on stumps and holding cocked gun, he returned to the bathroom after feeling around in the bedroom for Reeva, tried and failed to shoulder-butt the wc door open, returned to bedroom, ran out onto balcony and yelled for help 3x, donned legs, and returned to bathroom to break down door to reach Reeva. I don't remember how and when he said he grabbed the cricket bat.

 

[patCee]

The strongest evidence to come out this morning IMO was that both Stander and Carice both stated that OP had told them "I shot Reeva, I thought she was an intruder". Carice also stated that her mother had said Mr Stander had told her the same thing.

So it has strengthened the CH conviction, at least, I would think.

 

[PPKik]

Netcare 911: http://www.netcare911.co.za/live/content.php?Item_ID=4074

Nice find! I missed that on Netcare's site. I have tried to find out if OP's and other calls of that morning were recorded. It seems they were. I wonder now if they were doing this in February of 2013.

 

[DebinGA]

Nice find! I missed that on Netcare's site. I have tried to find out if OP's and other calls of that morning were recorded. It seems they were. I wonder now if they were doing this in February of 2013.

I imagine so. The hospital is a thoroughly modern facility, and the ambulance arrived 6 min. after finally being called and getting an address iirc. I think OP purposely provided no info when he called, but he was aware enough to know it was necessary to be seen later on to have at least made the effort.

 

[Really?]

IIRC OP testified that, still on stumps and holding cocked gun, he returned to the bathroom after feeling around in the bedroom for Reeva, tried and failed to shoulder-butt the wc door open, returned to bedroom, ran out onto balcony and yelled for help 3x, donned legs, and returned to bathroom to break down door to reach Reeva. I don't remember how and when he said he grabbed the cricket bat.

BBM:...true that...but....the dang door opens out....lol...he said he kicked it too to open it I think. wth?

O/T....happy Cinco De Mayo everybody.....tacos tonight :toast:

 

[Ncl1968]

Nel kept pushing Mr Stander about op talking about that night. Did they speak about it afterwards Mr S kept saying no.. I got a feeling Nel knows that they did and was expecting more

 

[44ALLAN]

So, the part about the dogs being nice and very friendly to everyone was an explanation for why the dogs didn't bark at the "intruder", yes?

But there wasn't an intruder !

Every other dog on the estate barked according to Ms Stander though including her own dog.
Maybe Oscars had been eating his 'herbal' whatever it was?

She only heard a man shouting for help though.............not 4 gunshots sounding like concorde taking off...............and it was dark when she got to the house of Oscar despite her father seeing the expression on Oscars face coming down the stairs lol

Dear me..............yeah rite!!

 

[PPKik]

I imagine so. The hospital is a thoroughly modern facility, and the ambulance arrived 6 min. after finally being called and getting an address iirc. I think OP purposely provided no info when he called, but he was aware enough to know it was necessary to be seen later on to have at least made the effort.

I would very much like to know what he said in those 66 seconds. Recordings of 082911 calls must be treated very differently in SA. Here, in the US, that recording surely would have been released.

 

[jay-jay]

Dr Stipp testified that when Stander told him the ambulance hadn't been called, he called the hospital himself. He was told to call another number for the ambulance. He told Stander the number and asked him to phone. This morning Stander made it sound as though it was his own initiative rather than Stipps. Stander phoned and then Stipp (as per his own testimony) spoke to them describing RS injuries.

This morning we heard more information when Carise testified that she too spoke to the ambulance service.

If only we could hear some recordings of these calls to Netcare that OP, Stander and Stipp have stated they made, it might help to clarify/confirm a few things!

 

[Really?]

But there wasn't an intruder !

Every other dog on the estate barked according to Ms Stander though including her own dog.
Maybe Oscars had been eating his 'herbal' whatever it was?

She only heard a man shouting for help though.............not 4 gunshots sounding like concorde taking off...............and it was dark when she got to the house of Oscar despite her father seeing the expression on Oscars face coming down the stairs lol

Dear me..............yeah rite!!

BBM:
CM knows that hence the quotations marks.....it just goes to show what a joke OP's "version" is.

 

[Lyra500]

The strongest evidence to come out this morning IMO was that both Stander and Carice both stated that OP had told them "I shot Reeva, I thought she was an intruder". Carice also stated that her mother had said Mr Stander had told her the same thing.

So it has strengthened the CH conviction, at least, I would think.

Surely it bolsters a murder conviction rather than CH?

Isn't CH causing death by a reckless or negligent act?

Shooting someone four times because you think they are an intruder is surely a deliberate act and therefore murder.

 

[shane13]

If only we could hear some recordings of these calls to Netcare that OP, Stander and Stipp have stated they made, it might help to clarify/confirm a few things!

Oscar is alleged to have told Netcare:
"Netcare, everything is fine. But would you send an ambulance here anyway."

 

[aoibhinn]

Good evening, fellow sleuthers and thank you for the transcriptions. Barging in once again .... I wasn't able to watch today (never-ending exams ) but I've read through the whole thread. Perhaps I need to watch but it appears to me that there was something very telling in CS's testimony today.

CS: Lying in bed...I knew there must be terrible trouble - I could hear a man shouting, so was thinking, where's the lady?...

I went to my mom, said I could hear shouts. She said yes, OP phoned your dad, he shot Reeva.

Listen to the video again later because she said she heard a man calling help, even clarified she had wondered if the man was calling out what could have happened to the woman.

Another poster mentioned that this appeared to bolster OP's version of events.

However, it seems to me that CS, in delivering her recall of events, actually heard a woman screaming before the man called for help. While she was still in bed. Why else would she wonder about a woman at that point in time?

Or am I not interpreting that incorrectly?

 

[shane13]

<Respectfully snipped and bolded by me>

Pardon if this has been asked and answered, I'm late catching up this morning.

Is it common in SA, when it's 'rather hot', to not run one's air conditioner? Or, is it common to run the a/c and then let all the cool air fly out your sliding door? Or are these estates so shoddily built that no one's a/c works and everyone's sliders were open that night?

Interesting that she had 'issues' regarding the need to fiddle with her sliding doors at just the same time OP happened to run (on his stumps?) to his to yell help help help! Very ... fortuitous. Ahem.

BBM
Good thinking.
Part of how this one runs deep.

 

[Lyra500]

Good evening, fellow sleuthers and thank you for the transcriptions. Barging in once again .... I wasn't able to watch today (never-ending exams ) but I've read through the whole thread. Perhaps I need to watch but it appears to me that there was something very telling in CS's testimony today.





Another poster mentioned that this appeared to bolster OP's version of events.

However, it seems to me that CS, in delivering her recall of events, actually heard a woman screaming before the man called for help. While she was still in bed. Why else would she wonder about a woman at that point in time?

Or am I not interpreting that incorrectly?

It was me that used the word bolster - i said she had made up an embellishment to reinforce OP's story, but at that point (according to her) she could not possibly know that a woman was involved because she claims to have heard nothing but a man shouting help three times. So what woman was she referring to?

As you say though, another explanation is that she knew very well there was a woman involved and she heard far more than she is admitting to. That leaves a really bad taste in the mouth.

 

[Really?]

Good evening, fellow sleuthers and thank you for the transcriptions. Barging in once again .... I wasn't able to watch today (never-ending exams ) but I've read through the whole thread. Perhaps I need to watch but it appears to me that there was something very telling in CS's testimony today.





Another poster mentioned that this appeared to bolster OP's version of events.

However, it seems to me that CS, in delivering her recall of events, actually heard a woman screaming before the man called for help. While she was still in bed. Why else would she wonder about a woman at that point in time?

Or am I not interpreting that incorrectly?

Nope...you got it right....strange thing to say after never mentioning hearing a woman before.

 

[swissmonster]

Seriously, could Carice have heard anyone screaming ( at OP's house) from that far away?

Well said! 200m!

 

[Giles]

Good evening, fellow sleuthers and thank you for the transcriptions. Barging in once again .... I wasn't able to watch today (never-ending exams ) but I've read through the whole thread. Perhaps I need to watch but it appears to me that there was something very telling in CS's testimony today.





Another poster mentioned that this appeared to bolster OP's version of events.

However, it seems to me that CS, in delivering her recall of events, actually heard a woman screaming before the man called for help. While she was still in bed. Why else would she wonder about a woman at that point in time?

Or am I not interpreting that incorrectly?

I don't think there is anything to this. She spoke at a hundred miles an hour and was eager to express each and every thought she'd had, every step of the way.

Her testimony seemed simple and reliable (as did her father's).

Good luck with your exams!

 

[whiterum]

But there wasn't an intruder !

Every other dog on the estate barked according to Ms Stander though including her own dog.
Maybe Oscars had been eating his 'herbal' whatever it was?

She only heard a man shouting for help though.............not 4 gunshots sounding like concorde taking off...............and it was dark when she got to the house of Oscar despite her father seeing the expression on Oscars face coming down the stairs lol

Dear me..............yeah rite!!

Makes you wonder why in all this supposed darkness that they didn't put all the lights on. There was a young woman critically wounded, so it would be essential to see clearly what the hell they were all doing.

 

[Really?]

Makes you wonder why in all this supposed darkness that they didn't put all the lights on. There was a young woman critically wounded, so it would be essential to see clearly what the hell they were all doing.

In Oscar-World things must be Oscar-Dark <--new accredited classes thanks to shane13......lol



Hi OP....:jail: