Trial Discussion Thread #50 - 14.08.8, Day 40 ~final arguments continue~

[minor4th]

3:16 call by Mr N reporting man crying out loud

Timeline according to Roux:

Stipp saying he was on phone at 3:17 when he heard the second set of sounds

Johnson - phoned security at 3:16 for 58 seconds, then ran to balcony and heard the sounds.

Conclusion - second sounds were at 3:17; first sounds were before 3:15

Johnson's notes - woke up about 3:12 and heard screaming

Mrs N - heard "bang", last sound from the gunshots - Mr N. makes a call at 3:16 when screaming started

Conclusion - first sounds were between 3:11- 3:13; 5-6 minutes between the 2 sets of sounds

"help, help, help" - 3:14-3:15 (refers to , Johnson, Burger, Stipp, Carice, and OP testimony)

3:19 call to Netcare

 

[zwiebel]

R: There was one complicating factor. That was Dr Stipp (laughs) We'll show you about Dr Stipp.

 

[minor4th]

Around 3:12 were first shots

Around 3:13-3:14 was "help, help, help"

3:17 second sounds (cricket bat)

 

[zwiebel]

R: I'll show you many things about Dr Stipp that cannot be. And Mrs Stipp.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Roux will show that there are many, many things with reference to Dr and Mrs Stipp that cannot be.

 

[zwiebel]

Roux looking through files, apologising.

 

[minor4th]

I don't think it has been taken as 'common cause' by the PT, has it .. Nel said yesterday .. bat first, gun shots second.

No, Nel did not say that yesterday. Nel completely failed to say anything about what the first shots were.

 

[Val1]

Exactly what Nel did yesterday - attack the defense rather than prove their own case.

OP's own testimony pretty much proved it for them, add the body, the location, the weapon and a few ear witnesses and that's about it. All of the witnesses on the scene came after the murder and only heard OP's excuse and got a front row view of his distress(imo at realizing what he'd done and not so much as to RS being dead because that probably wouldn't even have registered yet at that point).

 

[jay-jay]

R: There was one complicating factor. That was Dr Stipp (laughs) We'll show you about Dr Stipp.

Nasty, the way Roux laughed while saying that. Disgusting, in fact.

 

[patCee]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7aDl4HzE6fY

Sorry should have said this is a good live feed of the DT today.

 

[jay-jay]

OMG, the way he is dissing the Stipps! They should sue him!

 

[zwiebel]

R: We give you the reported times;

Cell phone data, security card stamps, objective facts.

2.20 security activated guard track next to OP hse. Peter Baba was right by house, that's why it's important. If there was a loud argument. But he said everything was normal. It's fatal for the state. Cannot be.

 

[katydid23]

he's getting ready to throw the Stipps under the bus. I don't think the judge will appreciate that. They are a very educated, well respected professional black couple, who 'made it' out of apartheid, and Roux is dissing them in court. And Stipp ran out of his safe home to confront danger because he thought a child was being harmed. And Roux is making fun of them now.

 

[jay-jay]

No, Nel did not say that yesterday. Nel completely failed to say anything about what the first shots were.

Well, what I meant was that Nel said the second lot of sounds heard were gunshots. Therefore what Roux says about it being 'common cause' the first sounds were gunshots, is not actually the case.

 

[minor4th]

Well, what I meant was that Nel said the second lot of sounds heard were gunshots. Therefore what Roux says about it being 'common cause' the first sounds were gunshots, is not actually the case.

But it is common cause. All of the expert witnesses said the gunshots were before the cricket bat hitting the door.

 

[DILLIGAF]

Roux just also conceded that OP is guilty of one of the charges - negligently handling/discharging firearm

If he's conceding that OP is guilty of this charge, why didn't OP change his plea to guilty?

 

[zwiebel]

R: He passed four mins later. still nothing.

R: Mrs Stipp told us Mr S called security at 3.15 and said he saw a man walking in front of OP's bedroom window....if the accused was on his stumps, it's not possible. On state's evidence, accused was in bathroom at 3.15, on his legs.....the first sounds could only have been the shots, and second the bat.

 

[jay-jay]

he's getting ready to throw the Stipps under the bus. I don't think the judge will appreciate that. They are a very educated, well respected professional black couple, who 'made it' out of apartheid, and Roux is dissing them in court. And Stipp ran out of his safe home to confront danger because he thought a child was being harmed. And Roux is making fun of them now.

Oh, are they black? I didn't know that .. gosh, that puts a different spin on things then, and they way they've been treated/spoken about by both OP and now by Roux ..

 

[zwiebel]

R: Listing all the calls and time that were made, too fast.

 

[Susza]

Good morning to all of you from sunny southern Germany!