TX - 26 dead, 20 injured in church shooting, Sutherland Springs, 5 Nov 2017 #2

[human]

Hundreds of thousands of men have committed extreme domestic violence and murder.

Many have dozens of red flags.

I believe some individuals are born with an "evil bent". I truly do believe this.

How many of the hundreds of thousands would enter a church and kill babies and children? Only those who have always had an "evil bent".

The only exception I have found to this have been religous and cultural genocide attacks on populations of women, babies and children. I'm not saying these are not "evil" acts because they are atrocious and against any form of humanity we feel.

I know, there is no proof to the idea of humans being born with "evil" leanings and there likely never will be proof.

When I say "evil" I mean a darkness and viciousness that we will never understand but it is within certain individuals' conscienceness.

This is my opinion only.

Read about what has been done and still continues to be done to Native Americans, Read about slavery in the US. Read about Papua New Guiana today. Read about the humanitarian crisis in Puerto Rico right now.

Were the men who raped their slaves such as Thomas Jefferson evil?

 

[Stunned]

Read about what has been done and still continues to be done to Native Americans, Read about slavery in the US. Read about Papua New Guiana today. Read about the humanitarian crisis in Puerto Rico right now.

Were the men who raped their slaves such as Thomas Jefferson evil?

Yes they were. Unfortunately, evil is and always has been alive and well all over this poor old world.

 

[DeDee]

Assailant enters church wearing black SWAT gear......you don't suppose there could be any connection to Missy Beavers?............

It crossed my mind, but think the motivations are extremely different. He might have followed that case and was inspired by it.

I've been intentionally avoiding this case. One of my dearest friends in TX holds a position at her Church while her husband maintains security at their Church.

For those who are not aware, I'm embedded in Missy's murder. I traveled to Midlo for the purpose of snapping pictures of the CCoC [Creekside Church of Christ] and SWFA, the firearms shop located across Chris Kyle Memorial Highway from the Church.

Prior to Missy's April 2016 murder at CoCC, there was a previous murder, in the nearby area, that included a Killer dressed in SWAT Gear.

Consider this post as one meant for subscribing to the thread. May Peace, beyond our own understanding, be with One and All.

 

[margarita25]

When the person violated the restraining order (multiple times) he did not go to jail. I called the cops they asked him to leave each time. nothing happened to him. He crossed state limes even and had three restraining orders in three states. Nothing stopped him until I told him I had a gun.
But, yes I highly suggest a victim to start a harassment police file and obtain one anyways, but it won't protect you and the abuser knows this.

(Wow, well I don't know what happened here, because if there is a R.O. which is violated, that person is suppppppposed to go to jail automatically, no questons asked. Sorry to hear this. I feel your pain. Unfortunately I've had to deal with this kind of thing a few times.)

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Prior to Missy's April 2016 murder at CoCC, there was a previous murder, in the nearby area, that included a Killer dressed in SWAT Gear.

Which case was that, DeDee?

 

[x_files]

(Wow, well I don't know what happened here, because if there is a R.O. which is violated, that person is suppppppposed to go to jail automatically, no questons asked. Sorry to hear this. I feel your pain. Unfortunately I've had to deal with this kind of thing a few times.)

yeah, the guy kept talking his way out of arrest and having an elder mother who would bail him out of problems didn't help either.
He stalked and harassed me and my family for over 20 years.

 

[Deleted member 158085]

When the person violated the restraining order (multiple times) he did not go to jail. I called the cops they asked him to leave each time. nothing happened to him. He crossed state limes even and had three restraining orders in three states. Nothing stopped him until I told him I had a gun.
But, yes I highly suggest a victim to start a harassment police file and obtain one anyways, but it won't protect you and the abuser knows this.

It's clear to me that we've been leaving a whole lot out of the national discussion about how to stop mass shootings. What is lacking in at least some of these cases is a system that works for the individual crimes that are precursors to mass violence. The system all too often does not take seriously enough domestic violence, harassment, child abuse, animal abuse, and rape - basically, violence against the often most vulnerable in our population - women, children, and animals. In addition, our system does not give enough support to parents of children with behavioral challenges, especially if it cannot be neatly labeled.

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[x_files]

It's clear to me that we've been leaving a whole lot out of the national discussion about how to stop mass shootings. What is lacking in at least some of these cases is a system that works for the individual crimes that are precursors to mass violence. The system all too often does not take seriously enough domestic violence, harassment, child abuse, animal abuse, and rape - basically, violence against the often most vulnerable in our population - women, children, and animals. In addition, our system does not give enough support to parents of children with behavioral challenges, especially if it cannot be neatly labeled.

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exactly! If several women filed police reports and nothing was taken seriously he learned he was ABOVE the law. In a way the law in in the favor of the abusers.
I suggest women getting anything everything on video if possible for evidence.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

Pastor: Texas church that was attacked will be demolished

https://www.yahoo.com/news/pence-abbott-attend-vigil-victims-church-shooting-061015454.html

Pastor Frank Pomeroy told leaders of the Southern Baptist Convention earlier this week that it would be too painful to continue using First Baptist Church as a place of worship.

The pastor described the church as "too stark of a reminder" of the massacre, spokesman Sing Oldham said.

No final decisions can be made without consulting congregants, but Pomeroy discussed turning the site into a memorial for the dead and putting up a new building on property the church owns, Oldham said.

 

[kittythehare]

Pastor: Texas church that was attacked will be demolished

https://www.yahoo.com/news/pence-abbott-attend-vigil-victims-church-shooting-061015454.html

Pastor Frank Pomeroy told leaders of the Southern Baptist Convention earlier this week that it would be too painful to continue using First Baptist Church as a place of worship.

The pastor described the church as "too stark of a reminder" of the massacre, spokesman Sing Oldham said.

No final decisions can be made without consulting congregants, but Pomeroy discussed turning the site into a memorial for the dead and putting up a new building on property the church owns, Oldham said.

It is very early to be making those decisions.. better wait a time..

 

[Pamela_Brewer]

Pastor: Texas church that was attacked will be demolished

https://www.yahoo.com/news/pence-abbott-attend-vigil-victims-church-shooting-061015454.html

Pastor Frank Pomeroy told leaders of the Southern Baptist Convention earlier this week that it would be too painful to continue using First Baptist Church as a place of worship.

The pastor described the church as "too stark of a reminder" of the massacre, spokesman Sing Oldham said.

No final decisions can be made without consulting congregants, but Pomeroy discussed turning the site into a memorial for the dead and putting up a new building on property the church owns, Oldham said.

[emoji47] Oh my! My heart breaks for this community!!!!
Moo

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[Deleted member 158085]

Pastor: Texas church that was attacked will be demolished

https://www.yahoo.com/news/pence-abbott-attend-vigil-victims-church-shooting-061015454.html

Pastor Frank Pomeroy told leaders of the Southern Baptist Convention earlier this week that it would be too painful to continue using First Baptist Church as a place of worship.

The pastor described the church as "too stark of a reminder" of the massacre, spokesman Sing Oldham said.

No final decisions can be made without consulting congregants, but Pomeroy discussed turning the site into a memorial for the dead and putting up a new building on property the church owns, Oldham said.

Nearly every member of the congregation will have some kind of PTSD, and I can't imagine them returning to such a painful reminder weekly. I feel terrible for these folks.

And bears10, inbox dealt with.

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[Bernina]

https://www.npr.org/2017/11/09/5630...ocked-cellphone-renews-debate-over-encryption

[h=1]Texas Gunman's Locked Cellphone Renews Debate Over Encryption[/h]

Peter Swire, a professor of law and ethics at the Georgia Institute of Technology, tells Here & Now's Robin Young the FBI lost critical time when it failed to reach out to Apple for help within the first 48 hours of obtaining the Texas gunman's phone, which is reportedly an iPhone.
In a statement, Apple claimed it offered to assist law enforcement on the day of the shooting. Apple says it could have advised the FBI to use the dead shooter's fingerprint to unlock the phone, but after 48 hours that option is no longer available.

 

[rsd1200]

It would appear that any group, individual, or agency that needed to distance themselves or put up boundaries/rules against him were going to suffer.

The pastor and the officers in the Airforce were concerned & rightfully so.

The killers anger would’ve raged out on anyone that objected to his intolerable or deviant behavior.

I hope his parents & family talk to investigators in detail to gain a better understanding. What did they see and what did they do? What systems failed and what worked? We need to learn more & find better solutions.

BBM
I'd like to see that too, but, and I don't know his parents, however, right now, I'd guess that they are scrutinizing every corner of their life with him since the day they brought him home, as just a tiny bundle, from the hospital. I don't know when, or if, I'd be able to sit down with someone to spill out all of those years. If I did, it would be with a trained professional, who truly wanted to study his case, for the benefit of mental health in our society.

 

[rsd1200]

One way they are worth it - if they've violated the person can go to jail. Sometimes they work.

Maybe, but they don't stop bullets, and it usually just angers the individual more. I can see it in a case like the Rhoden case where the lady slapped the young Rhoden son, and there was a restraining order/or no contact order on that case. Violent spouse abusers rarely seem to care about restraining orders.

 

[ATasteOfHoney]

BBM
I'd like to see that too, but, and I don't know his parents, however, right now, I'd guess that they are scrutinizing every corner of their life with him since the day they brought him home, as just a tiny bundle, from the hospital. I don't know when, or if, I'd be able to sit down with someone to spill out all of those years. If I did, it would be with a trained professional, who truly wanted to study his case, for the benefit of mental health in our society.

Since we are just learning of DPK’s deviance & charges brought against him numerous times, it’s easy to assume that his parents are just learning about it too. They are not. I’m in no way blaming his parents but I’d like to know what worked for a while, who interceded, did hiring attorneys & posting bail calm him down, is there a history of this behavior in the generations before him, what triggered him, what meds worked, what type of therapy worked, what help did they reach out to for therapy?
There is learning here without blaming..".
But I can assure you they knew.....& they were probably very scared.

We need to collect data & formulate a better system

 

[bluesneakers]

Maybe, but they don't stop bullets, and it usually just angers the individual more. I can see it in a case like the Rhoden case where the lady slapped the young Rhoden son, and there was a restraining order/or no contact order on that case. Violent spouse abusers rarely seem to care about restraining orders.

Anyone who has grounds to get a restraining order should get one.

 

[rsd1200]

If he was my son, friend etc...I would have reported him for murdering animals. Why didn't anyone report this?!!!

Because she had no proof.

Though Edwards can’t say whether Kelley was telling the truth, the odd behavior was enough for her to stop communicating with him.

If they'd went out to visit him, I think he'd been smart enough to get rid of the bodies of the animals. He could have been saying these things for shock value too. She also may have feared for her own safety. Go to LE, and he gets a charge, who will he direct his anger at? Her.

 

[Deleted member 158085]

Because she had no proof.



If they'd went out to visit him, I think he'd been smart enough to get rid of the bodies of the animals. He could have been saying these things for shock value too. She also may have feared for her own safety. Go to LE, and he gets a charge, who will he direct his anger at? Her.

We investigated plenty of animal abuse without proof in order to find the proof. It's important to report it even if you have no proof yet. It gives the people in the animal welfare community a chance, at least, to investigate. I have sat in my car in the dark for hours, waiting for abusers to come out and do their thing.

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[Bernina]

We investigated plenty of animal abuse without proof in order to find the proof. It's important to report it even if you have no proof yet. It gives the people in the animal welfare community a chance, at least, to investigate. I have sat in my car in the dark for hours, waiting for abusers to come out and do their thing.

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By law, Animal Control HAS to respond to an abuse report. If someone had called, they would have pulled his background, hopefully found the Colorado conviction for animal abuse, and he would have been on their radar. They more than likely would have made random spot checks.