SewingDeb said:
Would you expect that when a husband becomes mentally ill and is having thoughts of hurting his children that the wife simply go off to work and leave him with a house full of children? You wouldn't think she should take some responsibility if he kills them?
First of all I make a distinction between adults and children. Children are dependent on a adults and parents are responsible for telling children what decisions to make and eventually teaching them how to make them and finally watching them make their own.
Andrea was not the child of her husband. She was a grown woman who was given the ability to make choices. Her life is one of choices. Pointing the finger at someone else because you didn't get the help you needed is no excuse. She knew what she had done was wrong and immediately called the police. Apparently she knew who to call when she needed arrested and charged.
But let's look at what Rusty Yates did and what he had to say. Here is a quote from not only Rusty Yates but Dr. Saeed who Rusty and Andrea went to after a seemingly psycyhotic attempt:
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,218445,00.html
"Rusty told jurors that he and Andrea went to the Devereux-Texas Treatment Network, where Mohammed Saeed became Andrea's psychiatrist. Rusty testified that he never knew that Andrea had visions and voices; he said he never knew she had considered killing the children. Neither did Dr. Saeed"
And a second quote:
"After only slight improvement, Andrea was released from Devereux. A month later, she had another episode. Rusty took her back to Devereux. Again, she was released. Dr. Saeed reluctantly prescribed Haldol, the same drug that worked in a drug cocktail for her in 1999. But after a few weeks, he took her off the drug, citing his concerns about side effects. (For more on Saeed's response, see
our previous examination of the Yates trial.) Though Andrea's condition seemed to be worsening two days before the drownings, when her husband drove her to Saeed's office, Rusty testified, the doctor refused to try Haldol longer or return her to the hospital. Rusty was frustrated, he told the jury, and he didn't know what else to do."
Rusty Yates was not and is not a mental health professional but took her to a mental health professional Rusty Yates is not a psychic nor is the mental health professional. If anyone could have predicted or should have intervened based on training and experience related to mental health issues and a mother being around her children it would have been the doctor. But Rusty clearly testified he knew of no ideations of her murdering her children.
Now Andrea herself was her high school class valedictorian and graduated with a Nursing degree from the University of Texas Health Science Center. She was no dummy by a long shot. A very intelligent person by all standards.
Andrea didn't met her husband until she was 25, long into adulthood and far removed from teenaged innocence and naivity (unless you are interested in prescribing for Andrea a lifelong pass or irresponsibility and naivity simply because it suits your desired view of her which doesn't work in the adult world).
As an adult she dated Rusty for 3 years. At close to age 30 they got married. Okay so we have a woman, grown adult, with a nursing degree and able to take care of herself, cope with life, and make adult decisions. So she decides with her husband Rusty to have a baby, Noah.
Well after a couple of more babies of which no one can find any records of her being forced against her will they still lived in a 350 sq. ft. trailer. It appears then she sank into depression.
During this time ANDREA and her husband BOTH chose to continue corresponding with:
Michael Woroniecki
He was and is an extremist. Mind you, this is Andrea who is, with her husband, both making the choice to correspond with this man who preached that women had some inherit evil and should be constantly submissive to their husbands. Now many many homes exist where a man attempts to introduce this type of NONSENSE and women of the same or lesser stature of Andrea put their foot down and make it clear that she isn't going to tolerate this nonsense and if he wants to believe it he can but she isn't having any part of it. But Andrea made the choice to continue to expose herself to this. She chose. There is no record of her husband forcing her or threatening her.
Remember, Andrea isn't some sister-brother offspring reared without an education or sophistication. She has a degree from a major university and was her High School valedictorian.
In 1999 here is an account of the first significant depressive episode:
http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/women/andrea_yates/6.html
"In 1999, Andrea called Rusty at work and told him she needed help. When he arrived home, he found her shaking and chewing her fingers, so he took her and the children to his parents' home, where she said she felt better. But then she tried to kill herself with a drug overdose from her father's medication, and with Andrea's mother's help, Rusty finally got her into treatment. Later she said she had just wanted to "sleep forever." She was diagnosed with a major depressive disorder."
Like in the end, here at the beginning Rusty helped with getting treatment.
Following this her husband AGAIN helped her:
http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/women/andrea_yates/6.html
"The ailing mother was discharged and another psychiatrist switched her to Zyprexa, an antipsychotic drug for bipolar disorders and schizophrenia. Andrea flushed the pills down the toilet. Then she got worse.
She told her psychiatrist that she was hearing voices and seeing visions again about getting a knife. She began to scratch at herself, leaving sores on her legs. Then Rusty found her in the bathroom one day pressing a knife to her throat. He took it away and got her hospitalized. "
They were recommended NOT to have a fifth child because of the postpartum depression that might happen. They BOTH decided to have one. In fact, Rusty's mother came to help as well.
Well, RUSTY continued to try and finds ways to get Andrea treatment and of course followed up with all the medications prescribed by doctors.
BUT to directly answer your question, as you can see Rusty testified as did Dr. Saeed that he never knew of her stating she had ideations or thoughts of hurting her children. Not only Rusty but the doctor to which her brought her did not either. Rusty cannot be a mind reader nor a psychic and the records demonstrates that he acted many many times on her behalf to get her mental health treatment. She, ANDREA YATES, often refused to take medication. Often she would trade stories and change stories with therapists.
Personally I don't doubt that Andrea Yates needs mental counselling and treatment. But I do make her accountable for her numerous decisions throughout life as a grown adult to ignore bad information, to foster and nuture a lifestyle that deliberately made her others dependent and ultimately conditioned to blame outside sources for her deliberate murders of her children.
