TX TX - Julie Moseley, 9, Mary Trlica, 17, Lisa Wilson, 14, Fort Worth, 23 Dec 1974 - #2

[Two for the road]

Ozoner,

I wasn't saying you were right/wrong. I was simply stating that finding their skeletal remains in a car that may have been in TT's posession 40+ years ago is going to prove awfully hard for a DA to make a conviction solely off that. Defense attorneys will be able to insert reasonable doubt all over this case and after so long, absent a confession, the murder charges likely wont stick for lack of physical evidence.

DA needs to prove:
-motive for murdering 3 girls.
-placing murderer at scene
-finding evidence murderer was in car remains were found in
...

If police aren't making a point of listening and/or believing witness accounts, it will be hard to prove he was there.

Without witnesses placing him at benbrook lake, it will be impossible to prove it was actually him and not someone who took his car that put it in the lake.

If they can't place him at the lake, but find his DNA in the car, it was his car.

So my original point that just because they find the remains doesn't mean TT will be proven guilty. It just means the families will have closure. Closure and justice are different things in my book.

Remember the prosecution has the burden of proof beyond a reasonable doubt. There is plenty of reasonable doubt here.

 

[Deleted member 165916]

I thought I read somewhere that Hutchins had a sketchy background. ???

Maybe his *advertiser censored*-and-bull story eye-witness account 20 years after the fact has something to do with that.

 

[Parksestx]

Maybe his *advertiser censored*-and-bull story eye-witness account 20 years after the fact has something to do with that.

This is Bill’s son. Maybe the apple didn’t fall to far from the tree.

Audit: Fired detective mishandled dozens of child abuse cases

 

[folieadeuxnola]

Three missing girls. A family’s hopes. And this week, a long-awaited dive into a lake

Weather permitting, a team of divers and crews are scheduled to retrieve three cars from the bottom of Benbrook Lake on Saturday in hopes of finding clues to the 1974 disappearance of three Fort Worth girls.

The divers from North Texas Marine Recovery & Salvage have raised about $12,000 for equipment to pull the vehicles out of the lake.

They’ve been assisted by Rusty Arnold of Edgecliff Village, the brother of one of the girls who disappeared in December 1974.

 

[Mysteries1974]

I’m hoping that the weather is good for this search. Hoping dofor resolution after 43 years.

 

[Ozoner]

Ozoner,

I wasn't saying you were right/wrong. I was simply stating that finding their skeletal remains in a car that may have been in TT's posession 40+ years ago is going to prove awfully hard for a DA to make a conviction solely off that. Defense attorneys will be able to insert reasonable doubt all over this case and after so long, absent a confession, the murder charges likely wont stick for lack of physical evidence.

DA needs to prove:
-motive for murdering 3 girls.
-placing murderer at scene
-finding evidence murderer was in car remains were found in
...

If police aren't making a point of listening and/or believing witness accounts, it will be hard to prove he was there.

Without witnesses placing him at benbrook lake, it will be impossible to prove it was actually him and not someone who took his car that put it in the lake.

If they can't place him at the lake, but find his DNA in the car, it was his car.

So my original point that just because they find the remains doesn't mean TT will be proven guilty. It just means the families will have closure. Closure and justice are different things in my book.

Remember the prosecution has the burden of proof beyond a reasonable doubt. There is plenty of reasonable doubt here.

You weren't srating that I was right/wrong about what? I haven't argued for a particular theory of the case.

EBM

That is not correct. A Da never has to prove motive.

A DA would not have to place the suspect at the scene of a secondary crime scene (i.e., the lake), either.

If the girls are found in a car that was owned by TT, that would mean that he had a vehicle go missing at the time of the girls' disappearance but failed to report it. That highly suspicious behavior would be evidence of guilt.

That plus the funny business about the letter would be enough to convict him.

 

[dms]

Three missing girls. A family’s hopes. And this week, a long-awaited dive into a lake

"Arnold is going on a 'hunch' that vehicles found submerged in Benbrook Lake may have clues to the 1974 disappearance of his sister and the two other Fort Worth girls."

A hunch! Okay then.

 

[Mysteries1974]

I really hope the weather is good on Saturday! I want this case to be solved!

 

[Parksestx]

"Arnold is going on a 'hunch' that vehicles found submerged in Benbrook Lake may have clues to the 1974 disappearance of his sister and the two other Fort Worth girls."

A hunch! Okay then.

Is that sarcasm or what? It’s a far better theory than the FWPD has ever come up with and a damn sight more action than they’ve ever taken.

 

[TGwebs]

A podcast called True Crime Garage just did a two part story on the Fort Worth Trio. There are some errors that will be immediately noticeable to anyone who has spent time researching the case, but I don't fault them for that. This is hard case to get right. You have to wade through so much misinformation. I spent months researching my own article and still had to go back and make some corrections, so I'm not knocking them for that for a moment.

What I like about the podcast is how thoughtful it is. I feel like they are earnestly trying to respect the girls and have an intellectual discussion about the possibilities, particularly when it came to possible suspects.

Incidentally, they come to the same conclusions as I have, which is that Lloyd Lee Welch or someone like him is a far better suspect than TT. That being said, I know most people on this forum believe the TT theory and I respect the hard word that went into it. I also know everyone is looking forward to the dive and I respect that. The dive is important to the family members and therefore it's important it takes place. They deserve to turn over that stone. And I'd love to be wrong because they deserve some sort of resolution to this.

Here's the podcast if anyone is interested: True Crime Garage

 

[TGwebs]

Deleting duplicate post

 

[TGwebs]

"Arnold is going on a 'hunch' that vehicles found submerged in Benbrook Lake may have clues to the 1974 disappearance of his sister and the two other Fort Worth girls."

A hunch! Okay then.

That's why LE isn't performing the operation and they raised money for it on their own.

 

[Faith0263]

Wow..that's right. Carla's body was found in a culvert near Benbrook Lake. It would be weird though that the murderer would dump the car in the lake and leave the body behind to be found. However it may have been someone who wanted her found for one reason or another. What a great thing that would be if both cases could be solved by bringing up these cars out of the lake. I know you have been looking into the Carla Walker case for a long time as well as these girls and I am pretty sure you don't think so, but now I gotta ask....Are you saying that you believe that these two cases could be related? Just asking because I don't remember you specifically mentioning it. But she was kidnapped from a bowling alley and that is where TT said he was the night the trio disappeared. Was Carla kidnapped from the same bowling alley that TT frequented?

 

[Faith0263]

There was a description of the killer's car, a vague, one but it was backed in and running. I'll have to go back and find it but if I remember correctly it was described as a tan or beige car.

Not only her bf described it but there was a witness that matched his description as well.

 

[Faith0263]

Since you bring it up...I'll work on it and post it tomorrow.

Rodney ( Carla's bf) gave a description and they had a witness. Both accounts matched. It was light tan or yellow color, backed in, running, with its running lights or parking lights only on.

 

[Faith0263]

Rodney ( Carla's bf) gave a description and they had a witness. Both accounts matched. It was light tan or yellow color, backed in, running, with its running lights or parking lights only on.

This is a car they think is very similar

 

[Faith0263]

Deleted duplicate post

 

[Faith0263]

"Arnold is going on a 'hunch' that vehicles found submerged in Benbrook Lake may have clues to the 1974 disappearance of his sister and the two other Fort Worth girls."

A hunch! Okay then.

 

[Faith0263]

Yes so why didn't he ok the dive way back when his niece practically begged him to bring the cars up then. Why didn't he do benefits and bring his band back together b4 now???

The families deserved much more way back when. But if R said no then that's what they got. Nothing. Infuriating!!

 

[Ozoner]

That's why LE isn't performing the operation and they raised money for it on their own.

It boggles my mind that raising any car from the bottom of a lake wouldn't be standard procedure. Someone is probably in at least one of those cars. I won't be surprised if there are skeletons in all three cars.