TX - Police respond to reports of shooter at Santa Fe High School, 18 May 2018

[x_files]

Bigger question, if bullying was the motive, why deal with it by killing people
I understand what your saying though.

You'd think logically he'd want to take out those he felt that wronged him? I guess we'll never know unless he starts talking.

 

[Cryptic]

Are shotguns used for this ?

Yes.

Trap shooting involves shotguns with clay discs "pigeons" standing in for birds. The shotguns can be pump, or the more traditional "over and under" or "double barrel" breach loading shotguns. A relative of mine shot trap for years. From what I saw, many participants liked the traditional, slower firing shotguns.

As a side note, trap shooting, though it involves guns, is very tame with no emphasis what so ever on human like targets or say, pimped out AR-15s and high capacity pistols. Even the shot used in competition is very unlikely to seriously harm a person- though I would not want to get hit by some.

 

[Davia18]

You'd think logically he'd want to take out those he felt that wronged him? I guess we'll never know unless he starts talking.

Sadly I don't think there is much logic with these people whom kill
At least not normal sensible logic.

 

[PrairieWind]

Another day, another school shooting. I have no words that will add anything productive to the discussion.

Instead I will share a couple of articles.

This is a good article from a few years back in the New Yorker about how school shootings spread .. goes into quite a bit of depth. I recommend it for anyone trying to get their head around why these incidents keep happening.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/10/19/thresholds-of-violence

This is another in-depth article which gets into the issue of people in the community paying attention to warning signs.

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/10/mass-shootings-threat-assessment-shooter-fbi-columbine/

The New Yorker article is very good. Sad. But to me, it really just leaves me with more questions. And I guess thats the point in a way; there just aren't any answers.

 

[dianaelaine59]

Because I mentioned him before:
John Barnes was the police officer critically injuried on the scene. He was shot with the shotgun and wounded in both arms (I would imagine chest too, IMO).

“For 23 years, John Barnes worked for the Houston Police Department, patrolling the streets of city’s southwest side, and later hunting rapists and pedophiles.

But his most dangerous day came four months into his new job as a school police officer in Santa Fe, when gunman opened fire in the town’s high school, killing ten and critically injuring Barnes.”

https://m.chron.com/news/houston-te...26475.php?ipid=mobbreaking#item-85307-tbla-55

I wonder if he was wearing a vest?


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[jjenny]

I wonder if he was wearing a vest?


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Whether he was or wasn't, it wouldn't have helped, since he was shot in the elbow.

 

[Doghairrules]

Confirmed at press conference by sheriff.

2 firearms--

A shotgun (not mentioned by sheriff if it was sawed off, which is illegal, and the comment was it WAS owned legally by the father of the shooter)

And a .38 revolver (holds 5, 6, or 8 rounds depending on the model-- 5 or 6 is most common). Revolvers are NOT quick to re-load, even using a rapid re-loader device, which takes a lot of practice. This is a "low capacity" weapon, with no external magazine.

There was NO semi-automatic weapon used at this mass shooting.

I was actually talking about the officer who was shot, either in the arm or in the chest, not the weapons [emoji38]

 

[Betty P]

The New Yorker article is very good. Sad. But to me, it really just leaves me with more questions. And I guess thats the point in a way; there just aren't any answers.

Yes, it is very good. Maybe we need to find a way to de-glamourize the image of mass/school shooters to young people. Find ways to not make other kids identify with them as a group.

Between Columbine and Aaron Ybarra, the riot changed: it became more and more self-referential, more ritualized, more and more about identification with the school-shooting tradition. Eric Harris wanted to start a revolution. Aguilar and Ybarra wanted to join one. Harris saw himself as a hero. Aguilar and Ybarra were hero-worshippers.

And make deadly weapons, ammunition and bomb making materials near impossible for people to access. Also really get serious about cracking down on bullying in school. All these things together.

 

[HoneyWest]

This article has some information about what was on his FB and Instagram accounts before they were taken down:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-courts/shooting-suspect-dimitrios-pagourtzis-posted-born-kill-t-shirt-n875571

 

[Tbone144]

I wonder if he was wearing a vest?


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That would make sense why they are reporting injuries to his arms but also heard he was shot in the chest. The vest could have stopped the center of mass injuries. I’d like to think this role is talent seriously enough to equip them with vests. Even with the vest his heart stopped twice. I’m thankful they were able to bring him back.

 

[Bernina]

Most poignant words I've heard............

"Thoughts and prayers won't fix this."

 

[MaryG12]

One thing that occurred to me as I read his in the news (have we really become that desensitized to violence in America?) is that maybe some of these shooters will do it knowing the real blame will lay elsewhere.

The NRA always seems to be the main target. Or mental illness even if mental illness has nothing to do with it, and the shooter made a conscious choice to shoot up a school.

 

[KaaBoom]

2018 School shootings
US: 20
Mexico: 3
Russia: 1

School shooting - Wikipedia

 

[gitana1]

The more you bash the NRA, the stronger they get. :thumb:

No. The more money they get the more powerful they become. Truth doesn't make them powerful. Financial contributions from people obsessed with guns doesn't.

 

[EuTuCroquet?]

I have to wonder why the ATF is responding so quickly to this school shooting? IIRC, the ATF hasn't responded to other school shootings this rapidly, if at all. Is it solely because of the improvised explosives?

I'm glad they're there, but it seems strange-- out of school shooting patterns-- for them to show up so quickly.

This is from 8:28 this morning-- less than an hour after the shootings. Anyone else find that odd?

https://twitter.com/ATFHQ/status/99...hooting-today-2018-05-18-live-stream-updates/

Maybe this has been answered already. Sorry if it has and I’m repeating.

The ATF responded so quickly because explosive devices were likely involved.

It’s not odd at all. It’s SOP in a situation like this.

 

[EuTuCroquet?]

So it is illegal to sell a handgun to someone under 18. Yet he posts a picture of a handgun on social media. Without getting into specifics of TX law, to me that is a warning sign which should have been reported to LE for them to follow up on. We will see if that happened.

Maybe we should close the loophole in federal law that exempts gun owners from legal culpability when their guns are not properly stored, then stolen and used in crimes.

 

[EuTuCroquet?]

Oh lord all mighty, to think that the biggest thing we had to worry about in the 70's was getting busted for pot...

We never, ever, ever had to deal with something like this. It wasn't even on the radar. It wasn't even a thought. Or a possibility. Or even something anyone could fathom. I can't even imagine being a student, teacher, or parent right now.

My heart wonders when will it end? How many kids? Why?

Someone please answer to us. Don't give me good guy bad guy scenario like some Clint Eastwood movie. It's a movie!

What every terrorist knows is the element of surprise. And that is something no one can ever plan for.

Will congress ever do the right thing? Not without a turnover, because while there are more guns than citizens, there is still the mindset. Imagine how powerful it would be if our government took safety measures while still protecting the second amendment?

Imagine how powerful our government would be if it substituted the wall for kids, North Korea for kids, Iran for kids, Israel for kids, China for kids, EU for kids.

Imagine a UN for kids?

I am skeptical, because I am old, been there done that... Show me something new. You say you are the great negotiater, it is your moniker, your monkey.

Well then, prove it.

I was just today thinking about what’s often called America’s Golden Era of Domestic Terrorism: The 1970s.

Though, obviously, kids weren’t the main target. Today is something more sinister.

It isn’t bad parenting. It isn’t “THEM.” This problem is about US. It’s up to us to fix it.

https://www-m.cnn.com/2015/07/28/opinions/bergen-1970s-terrorism/index.html

 

[MaryG12]

And yet, these shootings always happen at public schools, very rarely private schools.

I wonder why.

 

[joedotnet]

Maybe we should close the loophole in federal law that exempts gun owners from legal culpability when their guns are not properly stored, stolen and used in crimes.

I’ll support that.


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[EuTuCroquet?]

And yet, these shootings always happen at public schools, very rarely private schools.

I wonder why.

Higher attendance? Hundreds of thousands of more students?

I dunno. Just guessing!

Because, I mean, these happen in affluent public schools, too. Good schools, usually.