Still Missing UK - Bernadette Walker, 17, left parent's car, Peterborough, 21 July 2020 *Arrests* #3

[jackal67]

Nothing surprises me about this man. I believe BW's allegation and that she's been murdered by ScW. That leaves us with a paedophile child rapist and murderer. Couldn't be more evil. MOO

So do you believe SaW had no involvement in it all then ?

 

[jackal67]

This is the one thing that blows my mind the most.

But how could she stop them leaving? If BW made no fuss about going with him she probably wasn't too worried about it. BW could have refused to go with him after all she wasn't a small child . Doubt he could have manhandled her into the car if she refused to leave. She could well have thought that BW was lying as well?
It is more puzzling to me why BW agreed to go in the car with him on either journey

 

[CSIAngus]

So do you believe SaW had no involvement in it all then ?

I don't think she was involved in the murder but clearly she has admitted two counts already of PtCoJ. She clearly lied on several occasions and deliberately pretended to be BW at certain times. The crucial point with her is whether the prosecution can prove that she knew BW was dead and then continued to lie about her running away. I hope she is asked on the stand if she still believes BW has run away.

 

[Tortoise]

But how could she stop them leaving? If BW made no fuss about going with him she probably wasn't too worried about it. BW could have refused to go with him after all she wasn't a small child . Doubt he could have manhandled her into the car if she refused to leave. She could well have thought that BW was lying as well?
It is more puzzling to me why BW agreed to go in the car with him on either journey

I imagine it's quite difficult for a dependent teenager with no money or phone to make a proper attempt at running away, especially in a time where staying at friend's houses was probably banned (can't remember which particular rule was in force at the time), she had no boyfriend and she has been said to be quite introverted. She wrote "If I was brave enough I probably would have already left or killed myself". I don't think she thought she would be killed on that journey, or that her mum wouldn't have believed her, so she was probably shocked at the reactions and didn't have a plan for what to do or where to go. I think she would have been expecting understanding and support, after plucking up the courage to confide in her mum, and support to have Scott removed by police, but with her mum saying she was lying she would probably have to agree to go into care and she might not have been mentally ready for that step. The fact she says she was abused in this way would have been a huge secret for her and a lot of survivors carry guilt and shame with it, not strength and determination to stand up for their rights. She was only 17.

 

[Tanzanite]

I imagine it's quite difficult for a dependent teenager with no money or phone to make a proper attempt at running away, especially in a time where staying at friend's houses was probably banned (can't remember which particular rule was in force at the time), she had no boyfriend and she has been said to be quite introverted. She wrote "If I was brave enough I probably would have already left or killed myself". I don't think she thought she would be killed on that journey, or that her mum wouldn't have believed her, so she was probably shocked at the reactions and didn't have a plan for what to do or where to go. I think she would have been expecting understanding and support, after plucking up the courage to confide in her mum, and support to have Scott removed by police, but with her mum saying she was lying she would probably have to agree to go into care and she might not have been mentally ready for that step. The fact she says she was abused in this way would have been a huge secret for her and a lot of survivors carry guilt and shame with it, not strength and determination to stand up for their rights. She was only 17.

This is such a compassionate post. I wish I could believe that BW HAD run away - I feel so desperately sorry for her and how isolated she must have felt.

 

[Mandalas]

I imagine it's quite difficult for a dependent teenager with no money or phone to make a proper attempt at running away, especially in a time where staying at friend's houses was probably banned (can't remember which particular rule was in force at the time), she had no boyfriend and she has been said to be quite introverted. She wrote "If I was brave enough I probably would have already left or killed myself". I don't think she thought she would be killed on that journey, or that her mum wouldn't have believed her, so she was probably shocked at the reactions and didn't have a plan for what to do or where to go. I think she would have been expecting understanding and support, after plucking up the courage to confide in her mum, and support to have Scott removed by police, but with her mum saying she was lying she would probably have to agree to go into care and she might not have been mentally ready for that step. The fact she says she was abused in this way would have been a huge secret for her and a lot of survivors carry guilt and shame with it, not strength and determination to stand up for their rights. She was only 17.

Thank you @Tortoise for such an insightful and considerate post.

 

[jackal67]

I don't think she was involved in the murder but clearly she has admitted two counts already of PtCoJ. She clearly lied on several occasions and deliberately pretended to be BW at certain times. The crucial point with her is whether the prosecution can prove that she knew BW was dead and then continued to lie about her running away. I hope she is asked on the stand if she still believes BW has run away.

I do believe she was involved in the murder. Not actually carrying it out but was complicit in it happening. I am sure she will say that she does still believe BW has run away as she has denied the other two charges that suggest she knew BW dead. Also the fact she is involved in the FB campaign to find BW that her son runs. The poster being shared clearly states £5000 reward donated by MUM !

 

[CSIAngus]

But how could she stop them leaving? If BW made no fuss about going with him she probably wasn't too worried about it. BW could have refused to go with him after all she wasn't a small child . Doubt he could have manhandled her into the car if she refused to leave. She could well have thought that BW was lying as well?
It is more puzzling to me why BW agreed to go in the car with him on either journey

He was used to controlling her and she was used to being compliant. I'm not surprised she didn't put up a fuss.

 

[jackal67]

He was used to controlling her and she was used to being compliant. I'm not surprised she didn't put up a fuss.

We do not know this for a fact though do we? I think SaW was the more controlling of the two. He didn't seem to have any control over SaW as she managed to get herself a new boyfriend and visit him when she liked and possibly concieved a child with new boyfriend ! Hardly the behaviour of someone that was scared of or controlled by ScW seems to me SaW did what she liked and sod everyone else!

 

[CSIAngus]

I do believe she was involved in the murder. Not actually carrying it out but was complicit in it happening. I am sure she will say that she does still believe BW has run away as she has denied the other two charges that suggest she knew BW dead. Also the fact she is involved in the FB campaign to find BW that her son runs. The poster being shared clearly states £5000 reward donated by MUM !

I think she may well have know that BW was dead at some point but continued to lie that she wasn't, which is the prosecution case.

 

[jackal67]

I imagine it's quite difficult for a dependent teenager with no money or phone to make a proper attempt at running away, especially in a time where staying at friend's houses was probably banned (can't remember which particular rule was in force at the time), she had no boyfriend and she has been said to be quite introverted. She wrote "If I was brave enough I probably would have already left or killed myself". I don't think she thought she would be killed on that journey, or that her mum wouldn't have believed her, so she was probably shocked at the reactions and didn't have a plan for what to do or where to go. I think she would have been expecting understanding and support, after plucking up the courage to confide in her mum, and support to have Scott removed by police, but with her mum saying she was lying she would probably have to agree to go into care and she might not have been mentally ready for that step. The fact she says she was abused in this way would have been a huge secret for her and a lot of survivors carry guilt and shame with it, not strength and determination to stand up for their rights. She was only 17.

Yes I agree I don't think she was expecting to come to any harm. I don't think she would have been taken into care though. at 17 she would have been too old for that . If BW had gone to the police with her allegations they would have had to take them seriously regardless of whether her Mum believed her or not. IT would have to be investigated and I am sure social services would insist that ScW was removed from the house to safeguard the other siblings. She could of course have asked to be rehoused if she felt uncomfortable staying in the house with her Mum not believing her.

 

[Bogyo13]

According to this article she was aware of what the issue was

"She said she had been contacted on the 17th asking if Bernadette could stay, and had been told there had been a sexual allegation made by Bernadette against Scott Walker."

Bernadette Walker Murder Trial: Teenager told her grandmother ‘she just wanted her mum to believe her’ and ‘she wasn’t lying’ over sexual abuse allegations

Thanks, I missed that!

 

[CSIAngus]

We do not know this for a fact though do we? I think SaW was the more controlling of the two. He didn't seem to have any control over SaW as she managed to get herself a new boyfriend and visit him when she liked and possibly concieved a child with new boyfriend ! Hardly the behaviour of someone that was scared of or controlled by ScW seems to me SaW did what she liked and sod everyone else!

I agree. I don't think ScW controlled SaW in any way, shape or form. He did however control BW sufficiently to sexually abuse her for 7 years before she said anything.

 

[jackal67]

I think she may well have know that BW was dead at some point but continued to lie that she wasn't, which is the prosecution case.

But why did she continue to lie? Why not just throw ScW under the bus if she had nothing to do with the murder.? Makes no sense to me.

 

[Alyce]

I believe that the motive could have been this simple. : BWs allegations completely mess up SaWs lifestyle and freedom. If BW reported it to the police ,social services would have been involved . ScW would have been made to move out whil the allegations were investigated As someone else said I think it suited SaW to have ScW living at home for many reasons. Built in babysitter enabling visits to new boyfriend, friends outings etc. " sharing the load of childcare ,domestic duties etc. Hard to cope with 10 kids as a single parent. She may have told the older siblings and the boyfriend that she wanted him out but she obviously didn't. ScW of course would not want to leave. Where would he go he would lose all the income and was probably hoping that the new Relationship would fizzle out at some point, hence his willingness to accept new baby as his. HE seems to be besotted by SaW. SaW may also have been hedging her bets for the same reason. Cake and eat it springs to mind. I actually believe SaW was the mastermind here and ScW a besotted puppet ,albeit an evil one

I agree with you re the motive - not wanting to lose the children who provided the cash to fund her lifestyle, plus having Scott as a useful * parent*.
To be accurate, there were only 6 younger children who needed any kind of supervision and 3 older teens who were no doubt used as child minders.

 

[mrazda71]

I agree. I don't think ScW controlled SaW in any way, shape or form. He did however control BW sufficiently to sexually abuse her for 7 years before she said anything.

It's not unusual for abusers to be people who feel that they lack control amongst their peers ... they feel inferior and so enact control over people who they perceived to be smaller, weaker... I just haven't seen any evidence of Sarah being controlled BY Scott

 

[Alyce]

I am not really familiar with trial format. Are all these current witnesses Prosecution witnesses? Also do we actually know if ScW and SaW will actually take the stand and give evidence or can they choose not to?

Yes this is still the Prosecution case. We will be told when they finish their submissions. Also we will be told when the Defence begins their case.
As to whether Sarah and Scott will give evidence - their individual counsel will have discussed it with them and offered advice but ultimately it is their choice. When claiming to be innocent it is usually more sensible to give testimony to back up your claim, but at the same time, if counsel think their client is going to be an unreliable witness, they may advise against it.
If I had to guess I would say they will both give testimony. She is a complete narcissist who will be bursting to tell her side of the story and relate her grievances and put the blame on everyone except herself.
I don't see him in the same light but I still think he will testify. In theory, Juries are not meant to infer anything if a defendant chooses not to, but in practice I am sure most of them do take a dim view of it.

 

[jackal67]

Yes this is still the Prosecution case. We will be told when they finish their submissions. Also we will be told when the Defence begins their case.
As to whether Sarah and Scott will give evidence - their individual counsel will have discussed it with them and offered advice but ultimately it is their choice. When claiming to be innocent it is usually more sensible to give testimony to back up your claim, but at the same time, if counsel think their client is going to be an unreliable witness, they may advise against it.
If I had to guess I would say they will both give testimony. She is a complete narcissist who will be bursting to tell her side of the story and relate her grievances and put the blame on everyone except herself.
I don't see him in the same light but I still think he will testify. In theory, Juries are not meant to infer anything if a defendant chooses not to, but in practice I am sure most of them do take a dim view of it.

Thanks for that.

 

[Sooty]

Bernadette Walker Murder Trial: Friend tells court about strange text messages | ITV News

 

[jackal67]

Just noticed a photo on BWs facebook page. The Family excluding ScW and older boys. with Nick Knowles the house renovator bloke.! Can't remember the name of the TV show ? Looks like they have been part of that show !!