UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, Faces 22 Charges - 7 Murder/15 Attempted Murder of Babies #24

[katydid23]

12:48pm

Letby, in a Facebook message to a colleague: 'No repeat today. I've escaped being in 1, back in 3' at 7.12pm.
Mr Johnson says Letby had gone in to room 3 as she knew by that point she was designated babies for that room. Letby says she had gone to see her friend.
Letby denies sabotaging Child N.
Letby agrees it was a "serious event" which happened "within a minute or two" of her entering the room. Mr Johnson says it was "bad luck?" Letby replies: "Yes."

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, June 7 - cross-examination continues

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

Calling it a 'coincidence' and just 'bad luck' would make sense if it was once or twice. But this is Baby N, fourteenth baby we are looking at. Is it still a coincidence when there are 22 unexplained collapses?

 

[Tortoise]

Swipe data shows Letby entered the neonatal unit (via the labour ward) at 7.12am. She says this is "common practice" as the labour ward is where the scrubs and toilets are.

I wonder if there's any significance to this. It seems like it must be a change from her normal routine for them to raise it this time.

I thought she laundered her own uniforms, and there are no staff toilets on the nnu?

 

[DianaWW]

3m ago12:53

'Just bad luck' that infant collapsed minutes after Letby arrived​

Letby is then questioned about why she arrived early to her day shift, swiping in just under 20 minutes before the handover began.
"You sabotaged him on the night shift, in effect by going in early," Nick Johnson, the prosecution barrister says.
"No," says Letby.
The prosecution claims Letby set Child N "up to fail at the end of the previous day shift" and then came in early "to make it look like he came from the night shift with a problem".
Mr Johnson accuses her of "making a beeline" for Child N, in nursery 3.
Letby tells the court she went into the room to speak to her friend, and at this point "handover hadn't been allocated".
But a Facebook message to a colleague timestamped at 7.12am (when she arrived on the unit) disputes this.
It says: 'I've escaped being back in 1, back in 3.'
At 7.15am, the child was "blue" and "wasn't breathing", according to medical notes.
Mr Johnson says this happened "within a minute or two of you arriving in that room".
"Yes," says Letby.
"Just bad luck is it?" says Mr Johnson.
"Yes," says Letby.

https://news.sky.com/story/lucy-let...ws-blog-12868375?postid=6020391#liveblog-body

Lucy Letby trial: Facebook searches of nurse accused of murdering babies read out in court

Lucy Letby, a former neonatal nurse, has been back in court for another day of cross-examination by the prosecution on Friday. She is accused of the murder of seven babies and the attempted murder of 10 others, and denies all the charges.

news.sky.com

 

[DianaWW]

12:59pm

Mr Johnson asks Letby when blood was seen orally on Child N.
Letby replies "the only time definitively" she recalled that was at 3pm. she says that is on her memory "sitting here now".
Mr Johnson says if she had recorded blood observations at the time, would she accept that now? Letby says she would, although it may have been based on what people had informed her at the time.
Mr Johnson says the one who would have informed her would have been the doctor colleague she "loved as a friend".
Letby's nursing note: '...infant transferred to nursery 1 on handover. Mottled, desaturating requiring Neopuff and oxygen.'
Letby says "both" she and Jennifer Jones-Key had gone over to Child N at the time of desaturation.
Mr Johnson says Letby was "hoping to create the impression" on the nursing notes that the problems for Child N happened before the handover.
LL: "No, I disagree."
Letby tells the court she had taken over Child N's care from 7.30am.

1:01pm

Letby's note, written at 1.53pm-2.10pm adds: 'unable to intubate - fresh blood noted in mouth and yielded via suction ++'.
Letby says the 3pm blood observation was the first one she could "definitively remember".
Mr Johnson says this note is a 'good hour' before that observation.
Letby denies Child N was bleeding from when she first got involved that day.

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, June 7 - cross-examination continues

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

 

[Tortoise]

Just catching up on this morning… Baby M-

LL: ‘I am saying I wrote notes on a paper towel, yes," she says. "And at the end of the day it came home with me in my pocket."

- she makes it sound like this paper towel hopped in her pocket and said ‘can I come home with you Lucy?’.. she said the same about the handover notes ‘they came home with me’.

I find it so interesting how she refuses to say the words ‘I took them home’.. it’s almost like she cannot bring herself to admit even the tiniest little mistake that could be considered wrongdoing. I’m wondering whether her intention is, if she isn’t convicted, to return to nursing at some point or in some capacity? Is that why she won’t admit to ‘rule breaking’?

Or is she just completely deluded with narcissism so doesn’t believe she’s done anything wrong? I mean, she obviously took the note home with her, yet she even makes this sound like it’s the paper towel’s fault? Is it possible to manipulate a paper towel? She’s such a mystery….

MOO

It just seems to be a mentality of denying responsibility for her own actions, highlighting the significance of these actions IMO

 

[DianaWW]

Now13:03

Letby wanted to 'create impression' collapse happened before she arrived​

On 15 June 2016, blood was found in Child N's throat - the first time any had allegedly been seen orally in this case.
"Sitting here now I cannot say with any 100% accuracy when I saw something," Letby now tells the court.
The doctor who responded to this initial incident is someone Letby says she "loved as a friend" - she admits this colleague would not have had it in for her. (Letby has previously accused a "band of four" colleagues of conspiring against her.)
"Do you accept what [the doctor] says about this initial desaturation... about it being concerning?" Nick Johnson KC, for the prosecution, asks.
"Yes," says Letby.
Letby did not write up the nursing notes on the collapse at 7.15am of Child N - claiming she took over his care from 7.30am.
"Who discovered him [at 7.15am]?," Mr Johnson asks.
"We were both there," Letby says.
"Who discovered him?" Mr Johnson presses.
"We both heard his monitor, I went over to him," Letby says.
Mr Johnson says Letby was "hoping to create the impression on the paperwork that these were all events that happened before you arrived".
"No, I disagree."

Lucy Letby trial: Facebook searches of nurse accused of murdering babies read out in court

Lucy Letby, a former neonatal nurse, has been back in court for another day of cross-examination by the prosecution on Friday. She is accused of the murder of seven babies and the attempted murder of 10 others, and denies all the charges.

news.sky.com

 

[Legal]

3m ago12:53

'Just bad luck' that infant collapsed minutes after Letby arrived​

Letby is then questioned about why she arrived early to her day shift, swiping in just under 20 minutes before the handover began.
"You sabotaged him on the night shift, in effect by going in early," Nick Johnson, the prosecution barrister says.
"No," says Letby.
The prosecution claims Letby set Child N "up to fail at the end of the previous day shift" and then came in early "to make it look like he came from the night shift with a problem".
Mr Johnson accuses her of "making a beeline" for Child N, in nursery 3.
Letby tells the court she went into the room to speak to her friend, and at this point "handover hadn't been allocated".
But a Facebook message to a colleague timestamped at 7.12am (when she arrived on the unit) disputes this.
It says: 'I've escaped being back in 1, back in 3.'
At 7.15am, the child was "blue" and "wasn't breathing", according to medical notes.
Mr Johnson says this happened "within a minute or two of you arriving in that room".
"Yes," says Letby.
"Just bad luck is it?" says Mr Johnson.
"Yes," says Letby.

Lucy Letby trial live: 'I collect paper' - 'killer' nurse tells court why she kept alleged victim's medical notes under her bed

Lucy Letby trial: Facebook searches of nurse accused of murdering babies read out in court

Lucy Letby, a former neonatal nurse, has been back in court for another day of cross-examination by the prosecution on Friday. She is accused of the murder of seven babies and the attempted murder of 10 others, and denies all the charges.

news.sky.com

This is a lot clearer in the sky reporting. So she has been caught out in a lie - said she went to room 3 to speak to her friend as handover hadn't been allocated, when it had and she knew she was in 3 with the baby. I think the shift starts at 8am, after the 7.30 handover? so she was very early.

ETA just seen she said she took over at 7.30

 

[DianaWW]

1m ago13:03

Court has broken for lunch​

It will resume at 2.15pm.

https://news.sky.com/story/lucy-let...ws-blog-12868375?postid=6020437#liveblog-body

Lucy Letby trial: Facebook searches of nurse accused of murdering babies read out in court

Lucy Letby, a former neonatal nurse, has been back in court for another day of cross-examination by the prosecution on Friday. She is accused of the murder of seven babies and the attempted murder of 10 others, and denies all the charges.

news.sky.com

 

[katydid23]

Judith Moritz
@JudithMoritz

Nick Johnson KC: "You saw that as an opportunity to sabotage baby N..." Lucy Letby: "No" NJKC: "And to make it look as though you’d inherited a problem from the night shift" LL: "No"

Nick Johnson KC: "This was a serious event wasn’t it? It happened within a minute or two of you arriving in that room" Lucy Letby: "Yes" NJKC: "Just bad luck was it?" LL: "Yes"

Nick Johnson KC mentions the doctor (name protected by court order) who Lucy Letby exchanged multiple Facebook messages with. He says "He was a friend of yours, who you say you loved as a friend.." Lucy Letby replies "Yes, as time went on. Yes".

Lucy Letby is asked why she didn't write anything in the nursing notes about baby N's first collapse at 0715 when she came onto the unit. She says that she only took over care for him when her shift started at 0730.

 

[marynnu]

This is a lot clearer in the sky reporting. So she has been caught out in a lie - said she went to room 3 to speak to her friend as handover hadn't been allocated, when it had and she knew she was in 3 with the baby. I think the shift starts at 8am, after the 7.30 handover? so she was very early.

ETA just seen she said she took over at 7.30

The shift started at 07.30.

 

[Tortoise]

1:01pm

Letby's note, written at 1.53pm-2.10pm adds: 'unable to intubate - fresh blood noted in mouth and yielded via suction ++'.
Letby says the 3pm blood observation was the first one she could "definitively remember".

I just wanted to point out that this nursing note she wrote at 1.53pm was a retrospective note written for about 9am that morning, because it hasn't been made clear in today's report. This was in electronic evidence earlier during the trial:



Lucy Letby records, in a note written at 1.53pm for care at about 9am: 'Unable to intubate - fresh blood noted in mouth and yielded via suction ++.'

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Thursday, March 2

 

[Tortoise]

Elaine Willcox

@ElaineWITV
·
47m

Prosecution puts it to Letby - "You saw this as an opportunity to sabotage Baby N on the day shift. You had done something to him on the previous shift - to give the impression of a decline, which you could take advantage of. "No", Letby said.

Elaine Willcox

@ElaineWITV
·
36m

Prosecution asked if Letby can explain why Baby N collapsed minutes after her shift started. Letby said it was very busy. There had been a lot of intervention by doctors & nurses. She said she didn't think he collapsed because of a lack of staff or a mistake by a colleague. "No"

Elaine Willcox

@ElaineWITV
·
35m

The prosecution put it to Letby - "You started your (day) shift early and were making a beeline to Baby N, to sabotage him, and make it look like he became unwell on the nightshift. "No" she said.

 

[katydid23]

Judith Moritz
@JudithMoritz

Nick Johnson KC: "You saw that as an opportunity to sabotage baby N..." Lucy Letby: "No" NJKC: "And to make it look as though you’d inherited a problem from the night shift" LL: "No"

Nick Johnson KC: "This was a serious event wasn’t it? It happened within a minute or two of you arriving in that room" Lucy Letby: "Yes" NJKC: "Just bad luck was it?" LL: "Yes"

Nick Johnson KC mentions the doctor (name protected by court order) who Lucy Letby exchanged multiple Facebook messages with. He says "He was a friend of yours, who you say you loved as a friend.." Lucy Letby replies "Yes, as time went on. Yes".

Lucy Letby is asked why she didn't write anything in the nursing notes about baby N's first collapse at 0715 when she came onto the unit. She says that she only took over care for him when her shift started at 0730.

Nick Johnson KC: "This was a serious event wasn’t it? It happened within a minute or two of you arriving in that room" Lucy Letby: "Yes" NJKC: "Just bad luck was it?" LL: "Yes"


So LL arrives 15 minutes early for her shift. And within a couple of minutes, Baby N had his first collapse, which was described as coincidental bad luck for LL.
So when she did her 7:30 observation notes, she was able to record in the notes, that the baby had collapsed BEFORE he was handed over to her.

I think that was why she cAme in early that morning---to try and camouflage things with her notes.>> 'Look , I just arrived to handover and the baby is already unwell'

 

[Tortoise]

I wonder if there's any significance to this. It seems like it must be a change from her normal routine for them to raise it this time.

I thought she laundered her own uniforms, and there are no staff toilets on the nnu?

I'm still puzzling about this. Did she think if there was an investigation to see if she was in at the time they wouldn't check the labour ward swipe-ins? I think there has to be a reason for it, if as they are alleging, she was by this stage doing things before she's on duty to look like they happened under a different nurse's watch, and not recording any notes.

 

[Tortoise]

Nick Johnson KC: "This was a serious event wasn’t it? It happened within a minute or two of you arriving in that room" Lucy Letby: "Yes" NJKC: "Just bad luck was it?" LL: "Yes"


So LL arrives 15 minutes early for her shift. And within a couple of minutes, Baby N had his first collapse, which was described as coincidental bad luck for LL.
So when she did her 7:30 observation notes, she was able to record in the notes, that the baby had collapsed BEFORE he was handed over to her.

I think that was why she cAme in early that morning---to try and camouflage things with her notes.>> 'Look , I just arrived to handover and the baby is already unwell'

This was her text that morning, she was up bright and breezy! -

LL to colleague at 5.10am: 'Awake already'

Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Thursday, March 2

 

[Blondiexoxo]

Now12:29

Letby was texting 'non-stop' while feeding a baby​

Questioning continues about how Letby could have been texting her colleague "non-stop" while she was allegedly feeding a baby.
"I couldn't feed a baby while texting so it must have happened at a different time," Letby replies.
"What must have happened?" Mr Johnson asks.
"The feed."
Mr Johnson then says: "Or the alternative is, to use your phrase, you pushed it through."
"No," says Letby.
Child N collapsed at 1am on Friday 3 June. Notes written hours later said his oxygen levels dipped right down to 40%. He is also recorded as "screaming".
"Screaming is very unusual of a child of this age," Mr Johnson says.
"Yes," says Letby.
Mr Johnson then says: "This was your doing."
"No, it was not," says Letby.

Lucy Letby trial: Facebook searches of nurse accused of murdering babies read out in court

Lucy Letby, a former neonatal nurse, has been back in court for another day of cross-examination by the prosecution on Friday. She is accused of the murder of seven babies and the attempted murder of 10 others, and denies all the charges.

news.sky.com

LL is saying that the feed must have happened at a different time than she has recorded in the notes. This IMO is a big hit to her credibility, she is admitting that the times on her notes weren’t accurate, which could suggest that she may well have changed the timings on notes for other babies in this case.

This is a major discrepancy for LL to admit to, but yet she does not actually ‘admit’, she just says ‘the feed must have happened at a different time’ when the inference we can draw from that statement is ‘I wrote down the feed as occurring at a different time’.

How many other events has she wrote down as occurring at a different time to when they actually happened? Is what I would like to know.

The words she uses IMO seem so contrived and carefully thought out. In many of her answers it’s what she doesn’t say that raises questions for me.

Her ‘I collect paper’ answer, isn’t strictly accurate IMO. From the evidence we’ve seen she doesn’t ‘collect paper’ she specifically ‘collects’ handover notes….

MOO

 

[katydid23]

I'm still puzzling about this. Did she think if there was an investigation to see if she was in at the time they wouldn't check the labour ward swipe-ins? I think there has to be a reason for it, if as they are alleging, she was by this stage doing things before she's on duty to look like they happened under a different nurse's watch, and not recording any notes.

"Swipe data shows Letby entered the neonatal unit (via the labour ward) at 7.12am. She says this is "common practice" as the labour ward is where the scrubs and toilets are."

When LL says things like " This is a common practice because..." I have to roll my eyes and go check it out. Those are the kinds of blanket statements that roll out of her mouth on the stand---but then under scrutiny we often find she was just making things up.

As you already mentioned, it has been established that Neo-natal staff washed their own scrubs, so why would she need to go in that entrance?

 

[Blondiexoxo]

I'm still puzzling about this. Did she think if there was an investigation to see if she was in at the time they wouldn't check the labour ward swipe-ins? I think there has to be a reason for it, if as they are alleging, she was by this stage doing things before she's on duty to look like they happened under a different nurse's watch, and not recording any notes.

IMO this is something that I thought myself when reading that she entered through labour ward. Of course she has an answer for it that it’s where uniforms etc are kept, but if that were a common way for her to enter why haven’t we heard of her swiping in this way before?

It’s a huge ‘coincidence’ IMO that she just so happened to swipe in through a different entry, much earlier than her shift was due to start, minutes before another baby collapses.

Additionally she is claiming that handover hadn’t been allocated at the time of baby N’s collapse, yet her message to a colleague says the complete opposite and placed her in room 3 with child N 3 minutes before the collapse.

3m ago12:53

'Just bad luck' that infant collapsed minutes after Letby arrived​

Letby is then questioned about why she arrived early to her day shift, swiping in just under 20 minutes before the handover began.
"You sabotaged him on the night shift, in effect by going in early," Nick Johnson, the prosecution barrister says.
"No," says Letby.
The prosecution claims Letby set Child N "up to fail at the end of the previous day shift" and then came in early "to make it look like he came from the night shift with a problem".
Mr Johnson accuses her of "making a beeline" for Child N, in nursery 3.
Letby tells the court she went into the room to speak to her friend, and at this point "handover hadn't been allocated".
But a Facebook message to a colleague timestamped at 7.12am (when she arrived on the unit) disputes this.
It says: 'I've escaped being back in 1, back in 3.'
At 7.15am, the child was "blue" and "wasn't breathing", according to medical notes.
Mr Johnson says this happened "within a minute or two of you arriving in that room".
"Yes," says Letby.
"Just bad luck is it?" says Mr Johnson.
"Yes," says Letby.

Lucy Letby trial live: 'I collect paper' - 'killer' nurse tells court why she kept alleged victim's medical notes under her bed

Lucy Letby trial: Facebook searches of nurse accused of murdering babies read out in court

Lucy Letby, a former neonatal nurse, has been back in court for another day of cross-examination by the prosecution on Friday. She is accused of the murder of seven babies and the attempted murder of 10 others, and denies all the charges.

news.sky.com

IMO this is yet another blow to any credibility she may have remaining…
MOO

 

[notsure]

Yes more likely left it on the desk which allows LL to pick it up ..that seems more of a conscious collecting of it

Or she retrieved it from a bin.

 

[Tortoise]

Good flavour coming through today, on what might seem to be inconsequential matters in the context of the allegations, but showing an unwillingness to be candid. IMO



She says she "probably" put it in her pocket, and put it under her bed.

Letby replies: "Because I collect paper".

Other sheets such as handover sheets were not thought about.

--

She denies "waiting an hour and a quarter" to write up those nursing notes or "hanging around" to get the note Dr Ukoh had when writing up the note.

(then why did she wait to write her nursing notes?)

--

Letby is asked by Mr Johnson if she knows what the implication of 'go commando' means.

LL: "I don't know what was meant, I can't say right now."

NJ: "Do you think this was an army reference, being from Hereford?"

LL: "I don't know."

--

8.04pm [Ah ok I'll have to Google it later lol don't know much about it [haemophilia]], 8.06pm, 8.11pm [Complex condition, yeah 50;50 chance antenatally].

NJ: "That is where you got the answer from, Dr Google?"

LL: "No, '50:50' is something staff would know"

--

One of the designated babies received a 50ml NGT feed at 8.30pm as they were asleep. Letby says that feed can take '10-15 minutes or so'. She says she can't put a 'definitive number' on it.

Mr Johnson says other estimates for this kinds of feed have been 20 minutes.

Letby: "I really can't say."

--

Letby is asked about the 'Jennifer and I were talking at the doorway'. Letby says she meant only she was at the doorway, and Jennifer Jones-Key was in the nursery room.

LIVE: Lucy Letby trial, June 7 - cross-examination continues