VA - Anjelica "AJ" Hadsell, 18, Norfolk, 3 March 2015 #16

[katydid23]

But that's doubling down on risk. He would need minimize it by making his movements and tracing her as hard as possible. No hits on the cars, wash the red one make it look suspicious and the focus of the timeline, while he used the trailer which is easier to clean or switch, but he couldn't be seen in Franklin with a car that could be traced back to him, thus the shiny rental. He couldn't be seen renting it, so it would have to be somebody he could trust with his life. What incentive would that person have to help? To protect somebody who meant something to them maybe who was also somehow implicated? A person who may have a history of covering up loved one's crimes would maybe try to do the same thing until it is too late? This is why I think more than one Hadsell would be involved. I don't see them rallying like this for a friend of AJ's or her mom. All the setting up the cards with his brother/nephew taking pictures. It would explain the focus of their efforts to a certain extent. AJ's friends seem very young and impressionable. They may have helped make Zach feel unwelcome as group over time, but they wouldn't defend a killer knowingly, it seems to me. Imagine being under the influencing of grifters in a time of crisis?

So then, like you say, someone else needed to rent the car. LE would already know about it if Wes rented one. Especially at the airport. Cameras are everywhere. and rental places require lots of ID. So who could he trust that much? Not many people, imo, would cover up a ghastly murder. I agree it would have to be someone very close to him.

 

[DexterMorgan]

I think there are a few clues. One, he never publicly revealed which gas station. If it was a true story he would have said ' we were at Wawa's...' and hoped people would come forward to say they saw him there with AJ.

But he was very cautious they way he told the story. Never specified the station, NOR exactly where they were or what they were doing---were they sitting in the truck, or standing in the mini mart or pumping gas or standing out in the parking lot or...? He was careful not to hem himself in , just in case someone said ' hey I work at Wawa and the pumps were not working or something that would prove his details untrue.

Also, LE apparently told him they had no video footage to verify his story. And that, if true, makes me believe it NEVER happened. And notice that when Wes says the cops told him there was no video available, he does not scoff and say ' that's crazy, we were right there at waWa for 35 minutes, right at the food stand, and the cashier saw us, I can prove we were there and she left alone in the truck...' HE NEVER SAYS ANYTHING LIKE THAT.

I know I would say that publicly if LE accused me of lying and murder--- I'd try and get the publics help by sharing facts.

If AJ had been to the place that Wes told the cops about, they would have been able to verify that, imo. She was supposedly driving a huge red truck
in broad daylight at lunchtime. There would be cameras and witnesses etc etc. JMO

And that's why I think every person who interviewed him was not that good because they never not once asked him what station he was at. Not once. The reporter should want as much details as quick as possible. So how dare they not ask the simple question of which one.

They could have taken a news crew to that particular station and did a live report of where she was last seen by WH.

But he didn't want that and any journalist who interviewed him never thought of asking him.

They were just happy to be there.

 

[FindHG]

So then, like you say, someone else needed to rent the car. LE would already know about it if Wes rented one. Especially at the airport. Cameras are everywhere. and rental places require lots of ID. So who could he trust that much? Not many people, imo, would cover up a ghastly murder. I agree it would have to be someone very close to him.

And somebody who knows the routine at the airport too, in terms of awareness space. The only family who I can conceive of flying in would be his sister and that would be falling back into the old coping mechanism too. Then you have the ruse and the obit of the split only after LE hones in on Franklin. She lied in her first interview about his background if you believe her in her second, but I don't believe her in either. I think the reason she turned was because she needed to, and it is a fake gesture, another pantomime. She may have helped him with the rental using a false ID. If your niece goes missing you show up to help, right, to search? Why did she stay away while she was so supportive in the media interview? Why would she be the one person in all the group to turn on him and not AJ's mom, who seems red flags proof? Those are her daughter's remains. What does it take for a sister to turn on a brother for killing the daughter of women who still supports him? I would say in this case it is a very big red flag.

 

[Ibiz]

I think there are a few clues. One, he never publicly revealed which gas station. If it was a true story he would have said ' we were at Wawa's...' and hoped people would come forward to say they saw him there with AJ.

But he was very cautious they way he told the story. Never specified the station, NOR exactly where they were or what they were doing---were they sitting in the truck, or standing in the mini mart or pumping gas or standing out in the parking lot or...? He was careful not to hem himself in , just in case someone said ' hey I work at Wawa and the pumps were not working or something that would prove his details untrue.

Also, LE apparently told him they had no video footage to verify his story. And that, if true, makes me believe it NEVER happened. And notice that when Wes says the cops told him there was no video available, he does not scoff and say ' that's crazy, we were right there at waWa for 35 minutes, right at the food stand, and the cashier saw us, I can prove we were there and she left alone in the truck...' HE NEVER SAYS ANYTHING LIKE THAT.

I know I would say that publicly if LE accused me of lying and murder--- I'd try and get the publics help by sharing facts.

If AJ had been to the place that Wes told the cops about, they would have been able to verify that, imo. She was supposedly driving a huge red truck
in broad daylight at lunchtime. There would be cameras and witnesses etc etc. JMO

Also, he didn't go into his ramble about how he doesn't like mustered on his sandwich, but his uncle Chet liked mustered, but he's dead now, but he was a great guy, and you know, we liked going fishing together.

I wonder if they'll find out what AJ last ate before she died?

 

[Ibiz]

And somebody who knows the routine at the airport too, in terms of awareness space. The only family who I can conceive of flying in would be his sister and that would be falling back into the old coping mechanism too. Then you have the ruse and the obit of the split only after LE hones in on Franklin. She lied in her first interview about his background if you believe her in her second, but I don't believe her in either. I think the reason she turned was because she needed to, and it is a fake gesture, another pantomime. She may have helped him with the rental under using a false ID. If your niece goes missing you show up to help, right, to search? Why did she stay away while she was so supportive in the media interview? Why would she be the one person in all the group to turn on him and not AJ's mom, who seems red flags proof? Those are her daughter's remains. What does it take for a sister to turn on a brother for killing the daughter of women who still supports him? I would say in this case it is a very big red flag.

I agree, she may have known something about that van, and had to go to the police, and they told her not to speak to the news media about it.

 

[katydid23]

Also, he didn't go into his ramble about how he doesn't like mustered on his sandwich, but his uncle Chet liked mustered, but he's dead now, but he was a great guy, and you know, we liked going fishing together.

I wonder if they'll find out what AJ last ate before she died?

Good question. And I always thought it odd that it was his 'lunch break'---and he never mentioned them grabbing a bite. Why stand and stare at each other for 35 minutes when it's your only chance to eat lunch? Wouldn't he grab something in the mini mart at the very least?

 

[DexterMorgan]

Night all. I am sure we will be on a new thread by the time I wake up west coast time. But good conversation was here tonight and I will view the remainder later on. Sweet dreams.

 

[Ibiz]

Good question. And I always thought it odd that it was his 'lunch break'---and he never mentioned them grabbing a bite. Why stand and stare at each other for 35 minutes when it's your only chance to eat lunch? Wouldn't he grab something in the mini mart at the very least?

That is strange, I thought he said they had lunch. I must have missed that one. I don't think two people would stand and stare at each other for that amount of time. I could see sitting, eating, staring, etc.

 

[Phoebeb]

Quote snipped and bbm:


I find WH's detail about the truck being moved from one side of the driveway to the other very odd. Why would that be significant to him and why would he mention that? How did he even know the truck was moved from one area of the driveway to the other? Was someone watching the house that closely throughout the day to have noticed that and told him (or JH)?

Exactly! He supposedly met her at the gas station and then she was seen at 2 or so- how would he know which side she parked on when she returned and was that only said to make sure it looks like she actually drove the truck that day? Maybe he was the one who moved the truck.

 

[katydid23]

That is strange, I thought he said they had lunch. I must have missed that one. I don't think two people would stand and stare at each other for that amount of time. I could see sitting, eating, staring, etc.

I do not believe that he ever said a word about either of them eating any lunch.

 

[katydid23]

That is strange, I thought he said they had lunch. I must have missed that one. I don't think two people would stand and stare at each other for that amount of time. I could see sitting, eating, staring, etc.

WH: It depends on which way you go with them. I gave her a hundred dollars the week prior and I figured she still had it because she’s very good with money. She just doesn’t spend money loosely... so bottom line is that’s why I gave her the money. I left work at 11:53am and I drove over to the gas station - the police know all of this – the public does not know, so I’m going to release this information so people can stop attacking my family and my character. I met her, I would say, around 12:10, 12:15. [That’s on] record with the police department. We talked, uh, we didn’t really talk about much- we aren’t a talking kind of family.

CH: Mhm

WH: We kind of just hung out and stared at each other, you know. I asked her how she was doing, we talked about a little school, um, we are a family of few words with a lot of love. She departed my presence at I would say about 12:40, 12:45pm. I was actually late getting back to my job and I got reamed from my boss. Fact: okay, you know I’m not beyond reproach with my work either but my daughter called me, that’s something she don’t do, I dedicated extra time outside of my lunch break because 12:45pm I’m supposed to be on the clock for lunch.

CH: I understand.
March 18, 2015 at 10:22 AM
Lily said...
WH: I got back around 1:15, 1:20pm – fact. Boss reamed me. Okay? Now, this is something the media public does not know: About, I wanna say, and I can’t really speak a whole lot about this [unintelligible] fact, I know someone saw her after one o’clock departing, our neighbor she waved to. What happened was, it’s a kid, I can’t really speak a name because of the case, but the information is simple. The kid that we all know and love, we always wave to him, she saw him. I mean, they saw each other and then he brought to the police that at 2 o’clock he saw her pass by again. His words are “driving with purpose” and “not herself.” Those are his words, not our words. He went to the police on his own accord and he struggled with it. He came out later than he should have because he didn’t know she was missing to begin, and we didn’t report her until the next day since we didn’t know what to do exactly. Now 2 o’clock is the last physical sighting of her driving the red drunk back towards the house. Now this info is also not in the public - well not truthfully in the public - a minute or minute and a half later he recognized a white small compact car following her. Did not know this. Bottom line is my neighbor reported at 2:03 [unintelligible] 2 o’clock– he smokes, he doesn’t smoke in the house, he smokes on the porch –

 

[katydid23]

Look ^^^ at how little he really shared about their lunch time meeting.

I drove over to 'the' gas station--I met her--we talked a little, not much--we hung out and stared at each other---I asked how she was doing---she departed my presence...

THAT^^^ is the extent of his description of their lunch time meeting.

 

[2Hope4]

All that jibber jabber he does, but then says "we don't talk much"... umm OK! Someone does!!

K I S S

That's my theory. I don't think renting a vehicle and all that jazz went into this. I think it was simple and straightforth. He did come to the house that day, and I do believe he entered the house that day. Whether his intentions were to harm AJ or to steal something from the home at that time, I don't know, but once he saw AJ, the wheels were set into motion and went from there. Especially if there was an argument going on, and it's possible when the girls saw AJ, she was coming inside, or just came home. Whatever went on, it was enough to concern JH that she notified JH's biological father via facebook and asked if he knew anything. Now, he lives in another state, so how would he know anything? He wouldn't. In fact, he hadn't recently spoken to AJ therefore either JH was concerned enough that AJ was mad enough to leave and call or contact her biological father, or for whatever reason JH felt he should know she didn't know where AJ was.

At this point when don't really know who she contacted first, and at what time she started contacting people to see if anyone had seen AJ. I don't find it unusual that a teenager and her parent would have an argument. If my kids came home later than curfew, they knew before they got home that I was going to be awake, and waiting on them and yes, confront them, etc.

But we don't know the dynamics within the home on that level. We see dysfunction, and no doubt some normal teenage rebellion, stretching those wings, tasting the freedom, etc. Some would see it as normal growth in independence and others might see it as the child turning against them, didn't love them the same, rejection, etc.

I hope an arrest comes soon, but I don't believe LE is in a hurry to make that arrest, or press those charges as I said before. I think their perp is sitting in jail, not going anywhere so time is on their side. Gather any and all evidence, get the forensic results, and then nail that perp with every single incident they can!!

BTW, there must not be a funeral planned if a memorial is planned, but the ME isnt' done with the body, then they can't bury her!

 

[2Hope4]

Wasn't 7-11 mentioned in one interview? He said they showed him a video on their cellphone, but the girl was Asian??? Gosh I can't keep his lies straight!

So eliminating everything WH has said, going by just what we do know, Sisters saw AJ that morning on the 2nd. Some texts were exchanged with a sister, and later with JH into the early morning hours, but doubtful it was AJ in those texts. Then AJ's body was found behind that house. I still can't eliminate WH as a perp....

What a hell the perp has caused though. Look how many innocent lives have been affected!! Those kids hanging around that house, they've got a long way to heal. The betrayal to them all including AJ is just unimaginable! The planting of evidence, breaking and entering, etc., heck it's a good thing someone told the truth or they might all be in jail!! And they've lost a precious friend!! Learning who they can trust, and who they can't is going to be a long journey.

At some point, I'm sure hindsight will click, and someone will say, remember when such and such happened? And we thought such and such, but now I'm not sure that's what was real. Tragic all around.

And I do NOT believe ANYONE will find an 'adoption' for AJ either. I think a certain someone didn't want her kids all having different last names, so had AJs name changed to her own last name!! A stab in the back to Zach!!! I can't see a judge EVER allowing someone with that much of a criminal background to adopt. But, the truth is going to come out. Trial time, all the truth will be revealed!!

 

[Mountain_Kat]

They say that the kind of evidence that forensic teams can gather from a crime scene is often more helpful in making a case against a known suspect than in suggesting suspects. How helpful might we expect forensic evidence from the South Ferry Rd. crime site to be in identifying the perpetrator(s) in the AJ case? I'm having a hard time seeing WH (if he was involved) in the role of Dexter, expertly avoiding leaving any evidence behind.

Jumping way ahead to weigh in on this, but imo, that depends on alot of different factors. Dump sites and crime scenes are two VERY different things. If this is the actual crime scene (which I seriously doubt it is), then the forensic evidence is probably ideal for identifying the perpetrator. If LE have an actual crime scene somewhere else, and have collected evidence from there to match to the dumpsite/remains evidence, before it was destroyed or contaminated, then conditions are probably good for identification. If we only have a dumpsite, and not an actual crime scene...the chances of identification of a perp are significantly lower. And, naturally, all of this depends on the condition of the remains.

But don't forget, there is often more to a case than just forensics. And we have no idea what evidence LE have collected or from where. So, this is a really hard question to answer, with what little we actually know about the investigation.

JMO

 

[Mountain_Kat]

We know there was a gas station because WH tells us there was a gas station.

We know there was no gas station because WH tells us there was no gas station.

I don't see any confusion here. [/sarcasm]

But we do have clues and indicators as to which might actually be the truth. According to WH, LE told him they didn't see him on the gas station video. I see no reason to assume that WH is lying about this. Why would he? So IF LE did tell him they couldn't see him on the gas station video, then we know that he named a particular gas station. And while it's true that LE sometimes lie in order to gauge a POI's reaction, I don't think this was the case with respect to their comments about the gas station, simply because, they would have no reason to say that they didn't see him if they did. So...from all of this, it's pretty clear, to me at least, that WH made up the gas station story, and LE knows that he made the story up.

JMO, MOO, etc etc

 

[2Hope4]

He word salad his way around where he was staying as well. Of course LE knew where he was staying, so not wanting to tell 'the public' as he puts it, is weird. Perhaps he's afraid someone will remember seeing him leaving or coming back to the motel/hotel and thus he didn't want the public calling in tips! Who knows with this career criminal what his thinking is. I do believe the world is better off with him where he is!

 

[2Hope4]

Oh wait a minute, that just gave me an idea. If AJ was in the back of that truck, or even in the passenger side of the truck, then he wanted tips called in about the white car instead! He was trying to imply the truck didn't leave for long, because AJ met him, and a neighbor saw her after that meeting, so therefore he didn't do anything. In his word salad mind. However, that neighbor wasn't sure on the day! So, again, call in tips on that white car, but not on the truck!

And we don't know if the vehicle seen going to the house was an innocent person going there, or a perp! Or the perp returning to the scene for whatever reason! The truck could have done everything during the night, and since the truck was suppose to be a hotel/motel he was staying at, who would know it wasn't there??? JH wouldn't know! The neighbors around AJs house wouldn't know! There's lots of down time not accounted for. Lots of time during the dark hours that anything could have happened. Even if AJ was with him at any time alive during the day hours, he still would have had plenty of time on his hands. Telling will be if there is video or card swipe times from the motel/hotel showing him leaving, coming, etc and what vehicle he was using! And there's got to be cameras else where that captured him either in the work van or his truck!

But that dark vehicle, while it seems strange, could be someone that pulled off to pee, smoke a joint, or was scoping it out to break into later. Could be unrelated to AJ all together! We really don't have enough information at this point to know.

 

[bettiepageturner]

Ugh, I hadn't read the good pastor's petition description until today.

Must step away from keyboard now.

 

[bettiepageturner]

He word salad his way around where he was staying as well. Of course LE knew where he was staying, so not wanting to tell 'the public' as he puts it, is weird. Perhaps he's afraid someone will remember seeing him leaving or coming back to the motel/hotel and thus he didn't want the public calling in tips! Who knows with this career criminal what his thinking is. I do believe the world is better off with him where he is!

I also think he knew marital estrangement would make people wonder about his character. Unfortunately his continual repetition of "my daughter" is still affecting certain media sources, and the average commenter can't be bothered to read more than a paragraph about the case.