VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #16 *ARREST*

[rizzo0904]

Ugh, this is so frustrating. There were numerous opportunities for this chain of events to have been broken. So many chances for someone to have helped Hannah.

 

[Detective Klimpt]

she was stumbling in the videos. she wasn't holding up the upper portion of her body very well. in no way am i defending this guy. i think he's guilty, but i don't think he needed to drug her. alcohol just sneaks up like that. one minute you are at a 20 year class reunion dancing and holding normal conversations the next minute you are sitting outside with your shoes off blacking out telling your husband you refuse to walk because you can't. that was my last run in with too much to drink and not enough to eat. the black outs happens suddenly.

A big strong guy like JM did not need to drug or exert force in order to take advantage of HG sexually. What reason would he have had to do anything that would result in her death? None, as I see it. Therefore, to my mind this has to be a terrible accident of some sort. In any case, he would be guilty of something, but something less that murder or a crime that carries a life sentence.

Also, (and I apologize if this is offensive to you), I suspect any sexual attack took place outside the vehicle because of how large both of them were. It would be difficult, but not impossible, to have sex in that car. Therefore, I am wondering what evidence they found in the car.

 

[mountainguy777]

some things make sense, and some dont. however....innocent people dont run 1,300 miles away. innocent people WANT to explain thier whereabouts and actions in question. hes guilty of something.

 

[Elley Mae]

she was stumbling in the videos. she wasn't holding up the upper portion of her body very well. in no way am i defending this guy. i think he's guilty, but i don't think he needed to drug her. alcohol just sneaks up like that. one minute you are at a 20 year class reunion dancing and holding normal conversations the next minute you are sitting outside with your shoes off blacking out telling your husband you refuse to walk because you can't. that was my last run in with too much to drink and not enough to eat. the black outs happens suddenly.

That sounds like a fun night out. Like my sister jumping out of the car and playing air guitar to aerosmith's Janies' got a gun, in stopped traffic, then I hollowed out that maybe people she worked with could be watching. She worked at nsa.

Yes people do do crazy chit when under the influence of alcohol/drags. I think he could have told her anything and as drunk as she appeared to be and by others that said she had been drinking, she would probably believed him if he told her he would take her back to where she wanted to go. jmo idk

 

[Kensie]

Who initially provided Hannah with the alcohol? Where did she get it?

In my experience during my party drinking days, I could drink like a fish, be fine one minute and passed out a few minutes later.
Alcohol always kicked my rear end (even after one drink) so I quit drinking it.

 

[justwannahelp]

I agree with you that alcohol sneaks up suddenly. The problem I have is that we see her spending so much time walking from one place to another NOT drinking, I would have thought the alcohol would be having time to wear off a bit. I guess there is a lot of time that we are NOT seeing, during which she is drinking heavily?? Is there any video evidence or witnesses that prove she was drinking heavily of her own free will?

good point. there is a lot of time that lapses from drinks with friends to her wandering around alone without anything to drink. speaking of friends. what are friends saying? what were their last words with her that night. i just feel like we are kind of in the dark here with where to search for her. no cell phone pings. we don't know if his clothes were muddy etc. we don't know if he did or didn't have roommates or what time he came in. we don't know much. i'm sure the police know way more than us, but it doesn't seem like they know where to search. this is bugging me.

 

[JoCoKSEyes]

Just a thought here, but has it been theorized that maybe JLM was black out drunk at the end of the night? Is it possible that he did something horrible but does not remember it? It sure seems like he was drunk earlier in the evening from reports of his behavior. And he's still ordering drinks after 1AM.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[MJPeony]

they stillllll haven't opened the sister's car?!

http://www.khou.com/story/news/loca...t-hannah-graham-caught-in-galveston/16181211/

This is ridiculous imo! How can there be a nationwide search for someone and the TX police haven't even opened the car doors?? Even if it's a jurisdiction thing, there are ways around that. Amazing.

 

[mountainguy777]

i would think if he did something in a state of blackout, the body would be easy to find.

 

[ZsaZsa]

This is ridiculous imo! How can there be a nationwide search for someone and the TX police haven't even opened the car doors?? Even if it's a jurisdiction thing, there are ways around that. Amazing.

It must be a lot of work to apply for a search warrant for it? (Rolls eyes)

 

[rizzo0904]

if he raped her, he had a reason to kill her. to dispose of evidence of rape. he didn't want to be charged with rape, so he killed her.

And people have been killed to cover up much less. My husbands aunt was killed over a bad check. Guy was afraid he would get caught so he beat her to death with a baseball bat.

 

[Phoebeb]

I think you're right, but there's something that's troubling me now.

WG described his clothes as white shirt/black pants. I'm willing to let slide that he didn't remember what kind of pants he had on, and on the video it did look like he had on a white shirt. But now we know that JM had a blue checked shirt on. How would he have gotten that detail so wrong?

WG's description of the person helping Hannah is getting further and further from reality. I understand that people have faulty memories or don't notice things but here's his track record right now:

Black: yes
Male: yes
Bald: no, dreadlocks
Goatee: yes
White shirt: no, rather obvious blue and white checked
Black pants: no, white 3/4 length shorts
Beer belly: possibly, but not exactly how I would have described JM. I would have said stocky or heavyset perhaps.

The door person from Tempo (Abby?) who remembers JM from that night would know if he was in a blue checkered shirt or a solid white/grey shirt when he walked away with Hannah with his arm around her- he was there twice that night according to insidec'ville article.

 

[atthelake]

I've quickly scanned threads and someone mentioned the article that has been promised for dayyyyyyyyyyyys was released. Does anyone have it handy to repost? TIA

ETA: Found Coy's blog at http://insidecville.com/blog/ljs-timeline/

Hannah was last seen by an eye witness walking with LJ Matthew in the early morning hours of Saturday, September 13. She appeared heavily intoxicated, the witness told me, slouched against him, not quite able to walk on her own. They were seen together outside Tempo, the same restaurant where just about an hour before, another woman had told him to get his hands off of her. I ask that young woman what one thing she remembered most about that night. She thinks for a moment and says with a steady stare, “That he creeped me the f##k out.”

Unprovoked, he suddenly grabbed a man in the Blue Light Grill and wrenched him into a wrestling hold so forcefully that he pulled the man’s hamstring, leaving this man limping for days. In the first few seconds of meeting two women for the first time, he yanked them up off the ground and threw them over his shoulders and laughed, making them uncomfortable and embarrassed. He continued to follow both these women, at the Blue Light and later at the Tempo restaurant, putting his arm around them, his face uncomfortably close to theirs, touching their backs, their hair, their faces, their legs— until one of them cursed at him to stop. After one of the women slipped off the boots she was wearing, LJ unexpectedly pulled off her socks, saying he wanted to see her toes. A friend of LJ’s for over nine years described him as a “prowler,” clarifying his use of the word by adding, “which is not to say he was looking for a victim, but looking for a girl who’s already compromised a little bit, maybe improve his chances.”

At 12:05am, Johnson captures another image on his phone (at left) which shows LJ standing with Molly. At that very moment, Hannah Graham is at a party with friends across town near the University.

Molly says she quickly grew tired of the uncomfortable advances from LJ. “I just didn’t like how he was grabbing my friend and I.” Hoping to leave him behind, Molly and her group of friends left Blue Light for Tempo. “But he followed us,” she says, despite the fact that no one in their group had invited him to come along. “But after we got to Tempo, he walked in the door right behind us.”

nevermind... :seeya:

 

[justwannahelp]

A big strong guy like JM did not need to drug or exert force in order to take advantage of HG sexually. What reason would he have had to do anything that would result in her death? None, as I see it. Therefore, to my mind this has to be a terrible accident of some sort. In any case, he would be guilty of something, but something less that murder or a crime that carries a life sentence.

Also, (and I apologize if this is offensive to you), I suspect any sexual attack took place outside the vehicle because of how large both of them were. It would be difficult, but not impossible, to have sex in that car. Therefore, I am wondering what evidence they found in the car.

if he raped her, he had a reason to kill her. to dispose of evidence of rape. he didn't want to be charged with rape, so he killed her. the reason why most rapist kill their victims is to keep them quiet. others kill because they like the way killing makes them feel powerful

 

[south fishy]

After watching the video of LJM signing the docs in Texas court and reading the "LJ's Timeline" article, both linked above, I am seeing a BOGUS defense strategy form..... "Not culpable by reason of mental defect due to multiple football head injuries". This guy seems to have some serious frontal lobe issues.

 

[skibaboo]

I've quickly scanned threads and someone mentioned the article that has been promised for dayyyyyyyyyyyys was released. Does anyone have it handy to repost? TIA

Here you go ATL http://insidecville.com/blog/ljs-timeline/

 

[Athena12]

With HG being falling-down drunk, JM might have taken her back to his apartment. If she woke up later and freaked out, JM may have done something to her at that time. She didn't get reported missing for almost 40 hours, and a lot could have happened in that time period. JMO

 

[MrPalomar]

I think the charge fits as examples for it are given, but I think the "abduction" part is confusing, as she was not truly abducted. IF all JM had done was taken Hannah back to her apartment, where she wanted to go, or handed her over to UVA campus security or the police, it would not have been an issue She willingly went with him, first of all

Even if someone goes with someone else willingly, if the person then is held against their will, i.e. depriving them of their liberty, that still can qualify as abduction. Not a lawyer, but that is my understanding.

 

[ElementaryDearWatson]

But he was already on "the mall"- and followed the group from Blue Light to Tempo? Car would have been out of the way, and it's odd to think he would go back to the car to change shirts imo

He could have "followed" them to Tempo by taking his car. He knew they were going there, even though they did not invite them to come along. Also, I do think LE went back for the checkered shirt and the maroon T-Shirt once they saw the photos and had a clear picture of what he was wearing that night as they could not tell for sure in the video's.

 

[justwannahelp]

This is ridiculous imo! How can there be a nationwide search for someone and the TX police haven't even opened the car doors?? Even if it's a jurisdiction thing, there are ways around that. Amazing.

if i were her mother i would have flown to galveston and beat the doors down where they are holding that car. no. i don't think hanah is inside, but there has to be clues of some sort.

seems like orange car though would actually provide more clues as to where she could be, UNLESS he moved her body or went back to it to better hide it. seems like his shoes or socks would be muddy. unless he went the dumpster route. did they check hospital dumpsters?