what are your thoughts now? *re-re-poll*

[greenpalm]

I was thinking decomposing semen, not fresh semen. Semen is a bodily fluid comprised of (among other things) living cells, as is a live human body.

I was thinking decomposing semen, not fresh semen. Semen is a bodily fluid comprised of (among other things) living cells, as is a live human body.

We have HRD dog experts answering questions in the [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152258"]HRD thread[/ame]. I believe they will tell you that a [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152258"]HRD (human remains Detection)[/ame] dog will not hit on decomposing semen, menstrual blood, other blood, etc. But to really get to the heart of their expert answers, you should go check out the thread, and ask the semen question there. They have been wonderful about sharing their insight.

 

[Abby Normal]

We have HRD dog experts answering questions in the HRD thread. I believe they will tell you that a HRD (human remains Detection) dog will not hit on decomposing semen, menstrual blood, other blood, etc. But to really get to the heart of their expert answers, you should go check out the thread, and ask the semen question there. They have been wonderful about sharing their insight.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7273912&postcount=151"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Human Remains (*cadaver) Detection (HRD) dog questions and answers **NO DISCUSSION**[/ame]

HRD thread:

An HRD dog WILL alert on human blood.

The entire conversation about it starts off right at the top of page 7.

ETA- and my research has shown me that, yes, they do in fact hit on decomposing human semen. fwiw. I would still ask Oriah or Sarx though... you never know with the pesky internets.

ETA- well trained dogs will not hit on menstrual blood because it is compositionally different. They have been trained to rule it out.

 

[Abby Normal]

oops, sorry- had already linked to the HRD thread :crazy:

 

[w1df10wr]

I had seen some members ask for another poll. Have your thoughts changed? If so, why?

**remember no name calling and bashing or embellishing names of case players**

Even with the most recent news of another neighbor being there with DB & SB before 9pm, MW and the phone details - my opinion is still the same, no clue.

 

[Hopeful2]

well, at least we have J. Tacopina JD involved when there is a sweet innocent baby 12 month old girl missing.... isn't he the one who got Joran VDS off so he could go on to murder a Chilean woman? MOO
(there are no "smiles" to addend this comment)

 

[sherbetjello]

*back ont he fence*

[ame]http://video.foxnews.com/v/1270739314001/exclusive-cell-phone-records-released-of-irwin-family/?playlist_id=87937[/ame]

 

[Steely Dan]

*back ont he fence*

http://video.foxnews.com/v/12707393...s-released-of-irwin-family/?playlist_id=87937

The video isn't showing up? The link above will work though.

 

[Steely Dan]

*back ont he fence*

http://video.foxnews.com/v/12707393...s-released-of-irwin-family/?playlist_id=87937

:waitasec: I'm gonna have to back off the family now too.

 

[Curious Me]

RE: "Exclusive: Cell Phone Records Released of Irwin Family"

It's definitely interesting if neither of the parents tried to call MW.

I will be stunned if both parents had nothing to do with Lisa missing. I will wonder forever why the parents have acted so very odd, JMO, in every interview I've seen of them. BS wants to keep concentrating on Jersey and his connections. What does LE say? I am sure LE knows a heck of a lot more than BS.

 

[Jacie Estes]

I am still in the same place that I was in the beginning; I do not believe that the parents hurt their baby girl, intentionally or otherwise.

The press conference today added more for me to believe that. This motley crue....excuse me, Insane Clown Posse and the cast of characters that include mw and jersey are more and more suspect in my mind.

 

[JohnBull]

I am still in the same place that I was in the beginning; I do not believe that the parents hurt their baby girl, intentionally or otherwise.

The press conference today added more for me to believe that. This motley crue....excuse me, Insane Clown Posse and the cast of characters that include mw and jersey are more and more suspect in my mind.

I'm with you, at least as things now stand. For heaven's sake, you've got two independent sightings of a man carrying a baby, three miles apart, with a possible sighting directly in between; attempted calls from a stolen cell phone that couldn't initiate calls, and those calls going to someone in a house full of creepy people, one of whom is connected to a known burglar and arsonist who just happens to ply his trade in the area where the child was living!

 

[Leila]

----------------
As for the dogs, they are cadaver dogs which means they only hit on cadaver odor. They are not into tracing live people. 9/11 convinced me. Also Caylee trial.LE. did confirm in one of the early statements.:seeya:

Yes, there's a huge difference between cadaver dogs and dogs trained to track and find live humans. Cadaver dogs are trained specifically to find the scent of deceased humans only. They don't hit on the scent of deceased animals, only humans.

Dogs that are trained to track and find live humans are used only for that purpose. I have a friend who has a dog trained to find live people, and she was sent to NYC in the aftermath of Sept. 11, 2001. The dogs were used to find live survivors in the ruins of the world trade center. Sadly, there were very few hits. Our friend said the dogs being used to find people were getting frustrated not making any finds, and rescuers took turns covering themselves with debris and allowing the dogs to make a hit and be praised.

 

[Dewey2Me1MoThyme]

Looking at the cast of characters in this case, I see more and more possibilities that SODDI than I do that it could have only been DB or JI.
What puzzles me is why everyone takes anything a neighbour, friend, or stranger says as gospel while everything DB or their attornies say as spin, lies etc. If it were a neighbour that committed this crime do you expect them to come forward and admit it?
Jersey had full rein of the neighbourhood. The new kids on the block, Shane and Dane we know nothing about but yet seem to have some connection at least. Then we have a disgruntled estranged husband of SB who blames DB for the break-up of his marriage according to some.
Though some may want to excuse all these people they are willing to suppose DB hunted down a stray cat to wipe the floors with in hopes of masking the smell of death. I guess that must be reasonable to some but sounds a bit far fetched to me.

 

[highflyer]

Thoughts? Have never followed a case this closely before. This is so bizarre that it's dizzying and makes me feel quite dimwitted.

 

[Dewey2Me1MoThyme]

Thoughts? Have never followed a case this closely before. This is so bizarre that it's dizzying and makes me feel quite dimwitted.

:floorlaugh:

 

[Kavya01]

To me, horrible though it may sound I do still believe fully it was an accident on the Mother's watch, or, non-watch as it may have been.

3-fold reasoning that, a lot of times the simplest explanation IS indeed the true one, statistically speaking children are far less prone to being harmed by "another dude" than a relative/friend, and the fact the parents are not camping LE's doorstep.

Even with some leeway about everyone being different, if one of my little boys "went missing/was kidnapped" etc, I would probably soon be in jail for police harassment or something. I would be camped out at the police station demanding to be seeing detectives constantly, beg to be let in on meetings, help with paperwork so they could work faster/spend less time on that and more on searching, And demand to see a case officer every ten minutes because I still had forgot to mention to add to their rapport the colour of my toothpaste spit that morning.

I'd be their number one squeaky wheel nuisance that LE and FBI would run away and hide from because I'd DEMAND to talk to them seventeen times daily.


The entrenching movements of the parents make one such as myself VERY, VERY wary.

 

[tink92]

I am still in the same place that I was in the beginning; I do not believe that the parents hurt their baby girl, intentionally or otherwise.

The press conference today added more for me to believe that. This motley crue....excuse me, Insane Clown Posse and the cast of characters that include mw and jersey are more and more suspect in my mind.

As usual i totally agree Jacie!....This has been my thoughts for a while now.

I really hope some posters will start laying off the family a bit now...and opening their minds to other possibilities than mom did it!

I had to have a break from here yesterday because one poster was just upsetting me with her venom towards DB...Iam all for having a theory but please don't keep spouting nasty comments about Deb..who very well is most likely a terrible victim in all this.

I need to grow a thicker skin..but the lack of compassion here stuns me sometimes....(only in a small minority)

Anyway thanks Jacie for your excellent post!

 

[Angelonline]

......the fact the parents are not camping LE's doorstep.

Even with some leeway about everyone being different, if one of my little boys "went missing/was kidnapped" etc, I would probably soon be in jail for police harassment or something. I would be camped out at the police station demanding to be seeing detectives constantly, beg to be let in on meetings, help with paperwork so they could work faster/spend less time on that and more on searching, And demand to see a case officer every ten minutes because I still had forgot to mention to add to their rapport the colour of my toothpaste spit that morning.

I'd be their number one squeaky wheel nuisance that LE and FBI would run away and hide from because I'd DEMAND to talk to them seventeen times daily.


The entrenching movements of the parents make one such as myself VERY, VERY wary.

I so agree with this. I have 4 girls ages 3 to 23 and I would also be LE's biggest nightmare if one of them came up missing. I would also probably be pretty scary looking because I seriously doubt I would be able to comb my hair or make sure I was dressed properly. I would be living on the doorsteps of the police station and in front of any available microphone not explaining my actions or what I did or didn't do, but instead pleading for help and begging the abductor to please bring back my child.

 

[Dewey2Me1MoThyme]

As usual i totally agree Jacie!....This has been my thoughts for a while now.

I really hope some posters will start laying off the family a bit now...and opening their minds to other possibilities than mom did it!

I had to have a break from here yesterday because one poster was just upsetting me with her venom towards DB...Iam all for having a theory but please don't keep spouting nasty comments about Deb..who very well is most likely a terrible victim in all this.

I need to grow a thicker skin..but the lack of compassion here stuns me sometimes....(only in a small minority)

Anyway thanks Jacie for your excellent post!

If you use DB's timeline when it fits one's theory, discard anything she says when it does not fit one's theories, pick and choose the facts you like and discard the rest, and if one has to, add your own spin to what is left over, there is only one logical conclusion. The DDI (Deb Did It) theory.
However if you weigh all the evidence pro and con evenly, then one would have to admit it could have been a host of people we've heard of, and possibly some we haven't. But that would be unpopular. :banghead:

 

[Whisperer]

I see there are some that believe in the stranger theory and are expressing that we are wrong about the parents. For the record, everyone of us hope we are wrong.

Can anyone think of a case where a baby was stolen and the stranger was caught? If so, maybe we can review the details of the case and get a profile of the kind of perp that takes babies.

I know of one case. He was a sexual predator and stole a three month old. She was left in a field. I know all I need to know about this type and I have excluded that type in this case but if people here want to consider that, go ahead! I've paid the price for reading and talking to the #$#$ B@#@. I will never get over it...because it ripped my heart out.

So, for those who think intruder, it is time to profile the @#$#$....