AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #17

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I thought they could still get the cell phone data without the phone. Does it depend on the service or the actual phone?
They would be able to get records, as well as location data, from the phone company itself.

There are things on that phone however, that they would need the physical device for.
 
Yes that was one of the thing mentioned. Le has to get a warrant for the cell phone company to release that information because it's ruled private information. With the hope Jayme is alive somewhere it might be double hard to get her cell phone records if she has one. She is entitled to her privacy according to the courts. Just thinking she might have to be missing a certain number of days before they can even file. Humm.
I doubt they would have had to wait, as the circumstances here are certainly exigent ones.
 
I think this is the Closs home.

ZLwJZre.png
 
I thought they could still get the cell phone data without the phone. Does it depend on the service or the actual phone?

Yes that was one of the thing mentioned. Le has to get a warrant for the cell phone company to release that information because it's ruled private information. With the hope Jayme is alive somewhere it might be double hard to get her cell phone records if she has one. She is entitled to her privacy according to the courts. Just thinking she might have to be missing a certain number of days before they can even file. Humm.

I think it's a very long process.
 
They used one to bust Jared from Subway. Never heard of it until then.

Do you think they used the dog in the home and outside as well?

Hi human.

I dont think they used this kind of sniffing dog in their home but I do think they would certainly use it if they have searched other homes we are not aware of as of now.

Such as searching any home of a registered sex offender to see if they have hidden kiddie *advertiser censored* inside of their walls.

Jmo
 
Two weird thoughts just popped into my mind.

Being as Jayme is involved with middle school, church, cross country, dance, etc; could she have had to do any fundraisers where she went around town, to her parents' work, neighbors' houses, etc to try to sell? Anyone could have seen her and been "attracted" to her in that case. I'm not saying she went fundraising alone, just that she could've been around a whole lot of people who took notice of her.

Also, maybe law enforcement should look into (if they haven't already) if there were any permits issued for peddler's licenses in Barron for door to door sales. Such as magazine sales, vacuum sales, educational book sales, etc. Someone who could have come to the Closs' door at some point and took note who was home

I don't know what made me think of those things, but they are my fresh ideas!
 
https://gizmodo.com/5795861/how-the-police-get-your-phone-records

In order to convince AT&T, Verizon, or whoever to cough up someone's mobile phone tracks, cops need to present something approved by a judge. Basic account information like name, address, and credit card can be obtained with a subpoena. Anything beyond that, and the judge approved thing comes in two standard forms: a court order or a warrant. To get an order, law enforcement needs to prove that a certain record is relevant and material to an ongoing investigation. Getting a warrant, on the other hand, requires probable cause. The latter needs more proof that the data is worth getting (read: harder for the cops) than the former. Simple, right?

But here's where it gets tricky, says the Santa Clara Law Review: "As one court has appropriately observed, "the recently minted standard of electronic communication via emails, text messages, and other means opens a new frontier in Fourth Amendment [the right against unreasonable searches and seizures] jurisprudence that has been little explored." You see what that is? It's a shoulder shrug-a we have no idea where all this new stuff stands. So on a state level, the courts don't always agree what a judge should approve for a certain piece of information. Real time location tracking of a cell phone by law enforcement, for instance, has courts split. "Some say that the government needs a warrant and probable cause to track this kind of information," explains Catherine Crump, an attorney at the ACLU, "others have held that they need to meet the lower relevant and material standard."

View attachment upload_2018-11-1_16-56-52.gif
On top of that, not all cell phone data is created equal. Text messages newer than 180 days? Probable cause and a warrant. Text messages older than 180 days? Relevant and material for an order. What's the difference, you ask? Well, this new fangled cell phone business doesn't come bundled with an updated set of standards, so the government has been forcing twenty first century technologies into a decades-old framework. The Electronic Communications Privacy Act of 1986-the year of IBM's first laptop computer-is one of these. Long long ago, checking your email meant that you had to download it. Leaving your email with a provider of a "remote computing service," for, say, 180 days, implied that you didn't want it. But that was then. Now, we leave years of email in the cloud. (Thanks, Gmail, for the 7575.950349 megabytes of free storage-and counting—btw.) Text messages-presumably because they're also messages with text—have been lumped in the same category. The government can obtain anything older than six months by proving that it's relevant. "Even if these rules once made sense, they are woefully outdated today," says Crump.

Let's break it down: Typically, outgoing and incoming telephone numbers, email and texts over 180 days old, and historical location records can be obtained with a court order. Precise real time cell tracking, email or text messages sent within the last six months, and the physical search and seizure of a phone some courts have held require a warrant and probable cause.

Which brings us around to the detailed location history that the iPhone keeps of its user. Because that data is stored on the phone and on the computers that the phone is synched to, cops would have to physically search your phone and computer. That type of thing requires probable cause, which is tough. Law enforcement would be better off just getting a court order for historical location records. The records kept by your cell service provider seem to raise much bigger issues about privacy.

But for now, keeping our digital footprint safe just means avoiding phone calls we might later regret.
 
I remember reading about a 'house across the street' so I'd like to see where more houses are located.

If you put in their address on google maps you can see what is there. I do not believe there is a house across the street.

Go left of Barron to find the address on the map
 
I doubt they would have had to wait, as the circumstances here are certainly exigent ones.

I know that’s the case in the UK but would it still need warrants in the USA because of your Amendment rights ? I ask because there was a huge issue reported when LE wanted to access cellular data from the phones recovered in the SAN Bernardino crime scene ..., or am I getting it wrong?
 
Two weird thoughts just popped into my mind.

Being as Jayme is involved with middle school, church, cross country, dance, etc; could she have had to do any fundraisers where she went around town, to her parents' work, neighbors' houses, etc to try to sell? Anyone could have seen her and been "attracted" to her in that case. I'm not saying she went fundraising alone, just that she could've been around a whole lot of people who took notice of her.

Also, maybe law enforcement should look into (if they haven't already) if there were any permits issued for peddler's licenses in Barron for door to door sales. Such as magazine sales, vacuum sales, educational book sales, etc. Someone who could have come to the Closs' door at some point and took note who was home

I don't know what made me think of those things, but they are my fresh ideas!

Yes great thinking

There was the case of the young girl abducted when she went selling cookies in her neighbourhood and it was a local resident who was responsible if I recall correctly . Although I cannot recall where or when it happened or the victims name.
 
I know that’s the case in the UK but would it still need warrants in the USA because of your Amendment rights ? I ask because there was a huge issue reported when LE wanted to access cellular data from the phones recovered in the SAN Bernardino crime scene ..., or am I getting it wrong?
They would need a warrant, but that wouldn’t be difficult.

The San Bernardino issue was Apple itself. They refused to unlock the device, claiming that they didn’t have that capability.

Phone records are much easier to obtain.
 
Two weird thoughts just popped into my mind.

Being as Jayme is involved with middle school, church, cross country, dance, etc; could she have had to do any fundraisers where she went around town, to her parents' work, neighbors' houses, etc to try to sell? Anyone could have seen her and been "attracted" to her in that case. I'm not saying she went fundraising alone, just that she could've been around a whole lot of people who took notice of her.

Also, maybe law enforcement should look into (if they haven't already) if there were any permits issued for peddler's licenses in Barron for door to door sales. Such as magazine sales, vacuum sales, educational book sales, etc. Someone who could have come to the Closs' door at some point and took note who was home

I don't know what made me think of those things, but they are my fresh ideas!

I hate those fundraisers. One year my kid’s school asked parents to send money instead of doing fundraisers. I cannot remember if it was successful or not.

In the summer in MN, there were magazine and children’s books sale people. I hated that.

Good thoughts.
 
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