Wrongful Death Suit filed Nov. 13, 2013 in California, #5

[elfie]

Hi beach! With all due respect, I realize there are two opinions here - the Defense and the Plantiffs. And there are many people on both sides.

But since there is a trial involved, evidence will be required on the side of the plantiffs. That is a fact. I personally don't think just asking for actual evidence and links to have posters back up their claims is being intolerant. Isn't it also in the rules that things stated as facts must be backed up?

The jurors will certainly want to see evidence in order to convict innocent people of murder. Those of us on the side of LE and the Defendants are constantly being asked to back up our claims - and we can and do.

Not certain, but since this is a wrongful death civil case, no one would be convicted of murder, however responsible they may be. What I find difficult to deal with are twisted facts, hyperbole and nonsense. If the arguments in the civil proceedings are compelling enough, perhaps criminal charges could finally be brought by the State.

 

[LuckyLucy2]

^ Yes, very true, elfie. No one would go to jail and Rebecca's death would still be ruled a suicide, but a guilty verdict would mean that the jury believed the Zahaus made-up, crazy, impossible, implausible story. And that would be a travesty of justice.

Good thing I don't think the Defendants need to worry about that.

 

[SweetT]

I wonder if Jonah, who is a good father (commended for that by a judge), was running background checks on Dina's casual boyfriends and sleepover boyfriends? I hope he was! I hope Jonah hired someone to look up every single parking ticket for all of Dina's friends-- male and female. Anyone she associated with. Because even Dina agrees that is what Jonah should have been doing-- checking out every one of her friends that Max was exposed to.

Remember this? The effort failed miserably, but it shows what Dina thinks about the partners and friends of ex-spouses. I'm sure Dina would agree that she herself should be subject to her own ideas about "parental disclosure", and accountable to both Kimberly James and Jonah Shacknai.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ai-quot-Parental-Disclosure-Act-quot-Proposal

I wonder if Kimberly James was running unconsented background checks on Dina before Dina and Jonah married (oh wait-- didn't Dina use an alias while she was having an affair with Jonah?)?

I wonder if Kimberly James should have prevented her teens from having any contact with Dina, after all of the police calls for domestic violence, to Dina and Jonah's home? As I recall, there were 13 calls to police for domestic violence between Dina and Jonah. The kids from the first marriage weren't even teenagers yet when Dina and Jonah were having all their domestic violence episodes. And Max was actually present in the home when they were going at it. Yikes! Poor kid, to be exposed to that. And Dina was studying to try to become a child psychologist at the time?! Holy God! The hypocrisy!

If I were Kimberly James, I wouldn't want my kids around that kind of violence, and I sure as heck wouldn't allow them to have any unsupervised time alone around Dina. Yikes!

And if I were Jonah, I wouldn't want my son or teens around my ex-wife's casual sleepover boyfriends. Yikes!

People who engage in domestic violence are impulsive and unpredictable. That's much, much worse, IMO, than a history of a single non-violent episode of shoplifting (and family court judges certainly agree with that!). Crime statistics about child abuse by boyfriends of a woman with a child from another man, are pretty sobering.

See how that works?

Remember this? There are lots more links available in the media thread and timeline, outlining all the police calls to the Arizona residence Of Dina and Jonah for domestic violence.

http://www.cbs8.com/story/15103319/reports-allege-history-of-domestic-violence-in-shacknai-home

I guess you will just have to ask Jonah and Kimberly about if and what background checks they did on people. If you wonder so much. Maybe Jonah didn't care who Dina dated or brought around her son. I would think he would but who knows. I also think Kimberly would care but apparently her kids seemed to like Dina. At least from what I can tell. Perhaps Jonah TRUSTED Dina to make good decisions about her son, but perhaps Dina did not trust Jonah's decisions for what ever reasons. Either way I don't blame any of them if they wanted to truly know who their child was being exposed to, or having to be around.

 

[SweetT]

lulu, the thing is though, JS is not a defendant in this WDS, nor is he going on trial. ��

Yep because they know they can't get his money ! He's too smart for them.

 

[SweetT]

Oh, and by the way, like it or not, Rebecca Zahau absolutely did fill the role of Max's Mom while in his father's and Rebecca's care.

No one fills the role of a mom, unless its a step mom and even then not usually that unless maybe mom is dead. Or maybe a grandma who is put in charge or given custody..But certainly not a girlfriend, Like it or not Rebecca was never Max's mother.. The only role she filled was having a relationship with Jonah and being his live in lover..nothing more nothing less.

 

[Imp]

Thanks to K_Z's refresher upthread on All Things Dina, I'm actually thinking Rebecca may have been an oasis of calm in little Max's life as compared to his life with his volatile mother, as well as the volatile relationship between his mother and father.

I've always been troubled by the fact that no one could locate and/or get a response from Dina for hours on the day of Max's accident. If my child wasn't with me, I'd be available by phone every second of the day ~ especially if he was in the care of an ex-husband I despised and a girlfriend I didn't trust.

So very weird that it took so long for the authorities (or whoever it was) to notify Dina of Max's accident.

 

[SweetT]

Thanks to K_Z's refresher upthread on All Things Dina, I'm actually thinking Rebecca may have been an oasis of calm in little Max's life as compared to his life with his volatile mother, as well as the volatile relationship between his mother and father.

I've always been troubled by the fact that no one could locate and/or get a response from Dina for hours on the day of Max's accident. If my child wasn't with me, I'd be available by phone every second of the day ~ especially if he was in the care of an ex-husband I despised and a girlfriend I didn't trust.

So very weird that it took so long for the authorities (or whoever it was) to notify Dina of Max's accident.

I don't think you can call ending up DEAD an oasis of calm for Max. I think someone had a temper and had gotten tired of the teenagers , who had just left and was on her last nerve. Too bad she didn't have a horn to honk instead.

 

[Frigga]

That is just patently false. Of course a step mother fills the role of a mother when said child is in her home or her care- and no not only if the mother is dead. Come on now. You may not like it- the mother and ex wife might not like it but that's how things go in blended families after divorce.

No- the new woman will never be THE MOTHER, but if a child is in her care and the father is out of the house then she is mothering the child- not babysitting.

Rebecca was living with Jonah as his partner- in this modern era- as do many couples who have both been previously married- Jonah twice- I doubt he was gung-ho about jumping into marriage number 3 and that fact probably had nothing to do with his relationship with Rebecca and more to do with the number of children and financial settlements from his previous forays into the institution.

When children that are not my own are in my care I absolutely mother them- in a way. I do for them like I would do for my own children and make decisions on that basis. I tell friends when my children are in their care that they may absolutely make decisions for my kids based on whatever decision they would make for their own child or a child in their family. There is a reason that we use the phrase it takes a village to raise a child.

I find it absolutely bizarre that Dina was not able to be reached for so long on the day Max had his accident. My kids are 16, 14 and 12 and if they are not at home or with me I have my phone right next to me at all times and always answer- unless or until they are all safely home. If I am sick and sleeping I have my phone right with me on the bed- I have been sick with the worst flu imaginable and been conked out and woke up to my phone because my kids were not all with me. In light of Dina's allegations it makes even less sense to me.

I am rooting for justice- not a side.

 

[K_Z]

Frigga-- that is a beautiful, wonderful post-- and thank you for that. Many compassionate, mature, responsible adults are attentively and lovingly raising kids not their "biological own".

I'm raising kids from birth, adoption, and "not mine, but essentially mine" due to social circumstances. A dedicated, compassionate parent, or parent figure, makes sure the teeth are brushed, the clothes are clean, the meals are healthy, the kids are to school on time, the homework is supervised and completed, the physical and emotional needs are met, the dreams are encouraged, the future is planned for, and the kids are ALL safe and healthy.

Rebecca was a parent figure for Max when he was with Jonah and Rebecca for Jonah's parenting time. It is tremendously sad and disappointing that Dina could not find it in herself to be even a little bit thankful for the attentive and dedicated parenting that Rebecca provided so selflessly. Jonah had the means to hire a nanny if he wanted one for Max-- he never did. He and Rebecca parented Max during Jonah's custody time.

Dina has said she didn't take Jonah to family court to "prevent" Rebecca from being around Max because she (Dina) could not afford it. That's baloney, IMO. Dina, IMO, didn't go to family court to try to prevent Rebecca from being around Max because no family court judge would ever rule in her favor.

Rebecca had no drug or alcohol convictions, no violent or abusive or drug related arrests or convictions, no accusations or convictions for child abuse or neglect, no violent felonies or misdemeanors, nothing at all that any family court judge would be able to use to justify preventing her from being around Max, or any other child. That's why Dina didn't, IMO, go to family court to try to "prevent" Rebecca from being around Max. Not about money at all-- Dina had no legal basis to ask for Rebecca to be barred from being around Max. And that infuriated Dina, IMO.

 

[LuckyLucy2]

Being a man's live-in girlfriend and babysitter for his child for barely 6 months hardly compares to being an actual Mom...getting pregnant...holding that child inside you for nine months...giving birth....loving them for 6 years. IMO.

 

[*Lash*]

I don't think you can call ending up DEAD an oasis of calm for Max. I think someone had a temper and had gotten tired of the teenagers , who had just left and was on her last nerve. Too bad she didn't have a horn to honk instead.

BBM - SMH ...Yeah, it just makes so much sense honking a horn would have helped if Rebecca was really suicidal! Maybe it would have changed her mind and saved her life? Too bad Rebecca didn't have a horn to honk when she was being murdered by the alleged defendants. The screams were obviously not enough.

 

[LuckyLucy2]

^ Are you referring to the screams that no one called 911 about, and that Law Enforcement determined came from the beach?

 

[Betty P]

^The neighbors did call about the screams. It's reported that evidence will be part of the trial. The beach was closed at that hour. No one was there.

Why keep repeating information that is easily proven wrong?

 

[Betty P]

LuckyLucy, your link to the WSJ article about Jonah isn't working. Can you fix it?

 

[screecher]

Yep because they know they can't get his money ! He's too smart for them.

lol. JS has an alibi. The others do not.

Dina Romano lied, said she was at Rady. Nina said she was there, and AS was there.

 

[LuckyLucy2]

^The neighbors did call about the screams. It's reported that evidence will be part of the trial. The beach was closed at that hour. No one was there.

Why keep repeating information that is easily proven wrong?

No, they did not call that night, when they heard the "scream". They told the police the next day, after Rebecca's body was found. So they obviously did not think that someone's life was in danger and they themselves thought it could have been the teens.

BBM
Why didn’t you follow-up with the neighbors when they heard screams?

A detailed statement was taken from the neighbor who heard a scream. The scream heard was about two and one-half hours before Rebecca’s voice mail was accessed on her phone, and the witness believed it could have been attributed to several teens which were in the area at the time. The witness could not tell exactly where the scream came from, but gestured to an area more toward the beach rather than the mansion. This interview was conducted the first day of the investigation.

http://sdsheriff.net/coronado/faq.html

From Ann Rule's Fatal Friends, Deadly Neighbors:

page 208 During the forty-eight hours between Max being carried out and the second arrival of
emergency vehicles, however, none of these possible witnesses had seen or heard anything
worrisome.

page 209 Next door to the first estate, the residents were an older couple who lived on Ocean
Boulevard year-round. They said that the Spreckels Mansion was very quiet and dark when
they got home about 8 p.m. on Tuesday.

page 210 The husband said that they had been away from home all day on Tuesday. "We left
about ten A.M. and got home at eight thirrty pm, he said. "We didn't hear anything unusual
during the night. The husband rose as usual at 5 am, and his wife said she heard a bog barking
next door around seven.

page 211 About the lady who says she heard the "screams" she told investigators, that the
womans screams had come from the witness's own front yard or possibly over in Jonah
Shacknai's yard. And then there were no sounds at all. In the end, the woman hadn't told
anyone about the scream. Not her husband. Not the police.

 

[LuckyLucy2]

lol. JS has an alibi. The others do not.

Dina Romano lied, said she was at Rady. Nina said she was there, and AS was there.

Not true.

BBM
Rebecca Zahau's naked body was found hanging from the balcony of her multi-
millionaire boyfriend, Jonah Shacknai's Coronado mansion on July 13. Just two
days earlier, Jonah's son Max, was found at the base of the stairs, unconscious.
Max later died from his injuries. Jonah's brother Adam, found Rebecca's body
hanging from the balcony and cut her down. Adam was the only person home
when Rebecca died.

"We concluded beyond a shadow of the doubt, that neither Jonah or Dina (Max's
mother, and Jonah's ex-wife) were at the house that night. Jonah and Dina were
at the hospital at Max's bedside, or at the Ronald McDonald house, across the
street from the hospital," Lt. Nesbit told RadarOnline.com.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...ego- police-willing-reopen-case-ruled-suicide

 

[LuckyLucy2]

LuckyLucy, your link to the WSJ article about Jonah isn't working. Can you fix it?

Here it is, and also where it appeared here at WebSleuths:

http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702304203304576446184124867402

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?146059-Rebecca-Nalepa-suicide-or-murder-5/page68

 

[Imp]

Ah yes, SDSO's Lt. Larry Nesbit.

I fixed his quote for him @ http://radaronline.com/exclusives/2...ego-police-willing-reopen-case-ruled-suicide/

“We concluded beyond a shadow of the doubt from cell phone triangulation, that neither Jonah or Dina's phone were at the house that night. Jonah and Dina's phone were at the hospital at Max’s bedside, or at the Ronald McDonald house, across the street from the hospital, or somewhere within the range of our cell phone triangulation efforts,” Lt. Nesbit told RadarOnline.com.



Oh, and regarding cell phone triangulation ...

Turns Out Cell Phone Location Data is Not Even Close to Accurate, But Everyone Falls for It

We've frequently talked about law enforcement and the intelligence community accessing and making use of cell site location data, which looks to figure out where people are based on what cell towers they're connected to.

However, as anyone with even a basic geometry education recognizes, which cell tower you're connected to does not give you a particularly exact location. It can be useful in putting someone in a specific (wide) area -- or, much more useful in detailing where someone is traveling over long distances as they repeatedly switch towers in a particular direction. But a single reading does not give you particularly exact location details.

https://www.techdirt.com/articles/2...ven-close-to-accurate-everyone-falls-it.shtml

 

[Imp]

Was doing a bit of Googling and I just unearthed an article we've all probably seen from November 2011, headlined Mixed DNA "all over" Zahau death scene; some evidence not tested. It's from CBS8.com @ http://www.cbs8.com/story/16068012/...some-evidence-not-tested?clienttype=printable

This little tidbit is worth repeating:

Attorney Bremner said Jonah Shacknai is seen on hospital surveillance video on the night of Zahau's death, but Dina Shacknai is not.

Sheriff Gore confirmed as much during his news conference.

"We don't have her (Dina Shacknai) on surveillance tape," Gore confirmed. "Her position was determined thorough GPS triangulation on her cell phone, which put her in the vicinity of Rady Children's Hospital."

The "vicinity of Rady Children's Hospital" is another of Gore's countless imprecise statements and hedges. A real piece of work, that one.