Wrongful death trial begins. Trial coverage and discussion #2

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I wonder if anyone can explain why setting up the mannequin in the courtroom to hang at the height she would have been, dictated by the rope lengths, would have been prejudicial?

In one of the crime shows, the mannequin was described as very life-like, including painted finger and toe nails. We already know the Judge required the mannequin be draped in court, and if not for specific statute - probably ruled against it to avoid inducing a jurors decision on a purely emotional basis,

Evidence exclusion for risk of unfair prejudice, confusion of issues, misleading the jury, or waste of time, all find ample support in most of the States, and California would be no different.
 
Thanks Lezah. I guess I'm not really understanding why it would have a prejudicial impact. It might show he didn't need to get a table but if that's the truth of the matter I don't see why he should not be shown to have been tampering with the evidence or staging the scene. To me it seems prejudicial against the plaintiff not to show it.

I wish I was a lawyer so I could understand! Maybe there is a lawyer on WS who can help...

My rough notes also say ( re the discussions on the record - out of jury presence)

Manequin -

Reference to Foundation / undue prejudice - 402 hearing

And

352 - probative value vs undue prejudice

Masturbation -

Defense / disallow based on 201 and 352
Unfair prejudice of nature of the evidence

Judge overruled considered knife evidence / sex assault / paint on nipples/ buttocks/ sexual undertone so masturbation element relevant. Course of conduct.
 
I overheard courtroom observers chatter last week...in one of the breaks...it was about 2011 being an ‘election year’ for Mr Gore and this being relevant...not sure what relevance that would have...?

SD SHERIFF IS AN ELECTED POSITION

Gore, 69, has been sheriff since 2009, when the Board of Supervisors appointed him to replace retiring Sheriff William Kolender.

Gore beat two challengers - former undersheriff and state assemblyman Jay LaSuer and sheriff’s Lt. Jim Duffy - in the 2010 election primary. He had no opponents in his 2014 re-election.

Last I heard, Gore plans to run again in 2018!

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/public-safety/sd-me-sheriff-gore-20170222-story.html
 
Thanks Lezah. I guess I'm not really understanding why it would have a prejudicial impact. It might show he didn't need to get a table but if that's the truth of the matter I don't see why he should not be shown to have been tampering with the evidence or staging the scene. To me it seems prejudicial against the plaintiff not to show it.

I don't like it, either, especially since Rebecca isn't here to tell us what happened to her. But I remember in the Casey Anthony trial (the only case I've really followed other than this one), visual demonstrations were also a touchy subject, so as Seattle1 noted, there's apparently an issue of emotional impact that judges take into consideration.

In the Anthony trial, a visual was ultimately allowed in that showed an actual picture of Caylee in life, and then, IIRC, a series of overlays that depicted her skull with the duct tape over her little face as they found her. As is the case with the mannequin, the purpose of both visuals is to help demonstrate certain points, but I remember feeling like I'd been punched in the gut when I saw the Caylee thing. I wanted to see Casey hung right that very second.

All that to say, judges have a tough job sometimes trying to keep things fair and balanced!
 
Yeah I guess. Maybe Greer could have been creative and used a gym weight instead of the mannequin to demonstrate the height of the rope.
 
Did JS testify today? Any of our court peeps at trial today?
 
And what about motive...?

I believe your observation re the findings in the guest house are very significant, as is your theory on mentioning the masturbation. It all fits...I think you have shown another piece of the puzzle...

I also feel that we should take another look at motive...and I think we should look at the relationship between AS - and his father.

The emotionless presentation on the stand was only fractured momentarily, and that IMO was when AS spoke of the call he received from his father ( on direct from MrGreer) about Maxie’s accident.

The testimony became much more ‘real’ for me at this point - his description of his fathers heartbreak, devastation.....but he ‘self corrected’ himself half way through, as if realizing it didn’t fit with the ‘he was going to be ok’ narrative. He said words to the effect of “...but, but he said there is hope, there was hope.... he would be ok..”

Hum, that devastation, that honest account of his fathers distress at the beginning of the testimony, it just did it work for me with the caveat of him ‘having hope’.

AS also testified ( in summary and in the main) that he never married because his GF (and those he had previously) were Christian, and it was of great importance to his parents that he married into his faith.

This was expressed IMO with love and consideration of his parents wishes. I believe he has cared very deeply about his parents and he probably lived his life in a way that he wants to please them, however he can. After all, he admitted sacrificing marriage with someone he says he loves, for them...I think he was telling the truth.

I believe he has probably lived in the shadow of his brothers success all his life.

He testified he rang RZ immediately after letting the conversation with his father ‘sink in’... he didn’t ring his brother. Why would you ring RZ and not your brother, when he had testified they each ‘always have each other’s back’ and ‘we’re very close, looking out for each other always’

IMO, AS father would be understandably devastated about his young grandchild, and he probably told AS he was seriously injured enough for him to be brain damaged for life, if not going to die. “...I have never never heard...my father has never spoken like that, been so devastated...he was...it was, I never in my life heard him like that.....”

It’s also highly likely he told him the circumstances, and that he was in Rebecca’s care at the time.

I believe his father probably/likely blamed RZ for not watching Max properly, maybe he was upset at JS, maybe he was angry with JS as JS was defending RZ to his dad maybe JS said “she saved him Dad, she did CPR...”

If JS didnt support RZ perhaps he thought he would have to admit to his father he should also share the responsibility of Maxies accident?

Adam Stasi he didn’t ring his brother, he rang RZ. He said RZ told him he had “follow his heart”, he repeated this several times In his testimony.

He said “RZ encouraged me to come, but said I had to follow my heart” some things not fitting for me here...I would ask someone to follow their heart if they were not taking my advice...not if they were...

What came across to me after the testimony was that AS is the son who is not the billionaire. He is the son who never married, and never produced grandchildren for his parents to love. AS is the son who never met a girl who he felt would meet his parents expectations. Maybe this time, he would show his devastated father he would be the son to find out what happened - and hold them responsible.


Maybe the message on the door was related to his father in some way ...and his brother?


( edited to add... just my opinion and speculation....I’ve paraphrazed statements from my recollection)

Wow, honestly I think you are spot on with your new scenario in the guest house. I didn't know about the storage room. Wonder what they stored there... rope? Anyway, I think this is brilliant. Just, wow.
 
But none of that is cut and dried. Not to me. And no one knows if someone else may have been there. Just not the major players weren’t there. There’s no proof no one else was there. I haven’t heard anything outstanding that says AS did it. I wish there was. I hope there’s some big thing coming. Because I believe she was murdered,


There's a great deal that points to Adam. The match of writing for the painting, the knots, conflicts in his testimony, the fact he was the only one on the property, motive, etc. It's all there. More than enough evidence to find him guilty.
 
Dr. Wecht has already testified that the damage to Rebecca's neck was severe enough to indicate she had been hanged. She just wasn't dropped the full 9 feet as if she had jumped. It would not have been difficult for Adam to lower her from the balcony with enough force to damage her neck.

JMO, some things may have happened in the guest house, an altercation or something, but Keith Greer pointed out that spots of Rebecca's menstrual blood were found on the carpeting in the balcony room, enough to indicate she had been lying there nude on the floor for a while. There were also spots of her blood in the hallway going to the room from the master bedroom. Greer has speculated she came out of the shower in a towel into the master bedroom. Something caused her to go to the door, where there was an altercation, her towel was dropped and she was led down the hall to the murder room. The spots of her menstrual blood and the towel show how she was forced through the house and onto the floor of the murder room.

For Adam to do that, then bind her up and haul her out to the guest house seems unnecessary and rather risky. Carrying her nude and bound in ropes out through the courtyard, a neighbor may have seen them. It seems like a lot of work and unnecessary moving of her..

But it's possible he asked her to come to the guest house after arriving home (or she went there to see if he needed anything). He may have come on to her. She may have been insulted, resisted his advances, then returned to the house. He may have felt angry and rejected, so went into the mansion and accosted her after she came out of the shower.

Heads up - Graphic - apologies

Hi Betty, I agree with you on many aspects, including that the initial assault took place in the upstairs room. I believe there was an initial struggle, RZ had just got out of the shower and was surprised. The towel fell when she was first confronted, the blood drops happened here.

I would propose that RZ was restrained in the wicker Chair, and suffocated and rendered unconcious with the plastic bag. (think auto erotic asphyxiation?)

RZ DNA is found inside the bag, but not outside it.

Why inside ( due to breath, skin, saliva?) but not outside? Gloved hands of the perpetrator? And why the bag at all...what was it there for, what was it’s purpose?

The chair was possibly tipped to the right in the struggle. Perhaps her legs were taped to the chair legs ( tape residue only on the front of her legs, the chair legs would prevent the back having residue). In the struggle with the bag on her head and maybe a T-shirt tying her hands behind her back, ( clothing was used as a gag also) and the chair tips to the right....she hits her head on the right side in the struggle, thick pile carpeted flooring would give the same blunt force injuries as found. The diminishing sizes of the four injuries could be a result of her gradually losing conciousness.

She is released from the chair, unconscious. The bag is taken off, left where it fell, as is the chair. The assault with the knife, the sexual assault takes place, no injury as no resistance as she is unconcious.

She is picked up and carried in cover of darkness to the guest house, locked in the storage room while the perpetrator goes to get the rope from the garage...

This initial assault upstairs could require just clothing and sports tape.

The fingerprints on the knife blades indicate RZ came round again when she was tied up, and had a chance to try and cut herself free. There was no rope fragments or rope fray in the bedroom, so where is it? I think it was in the guest house that was not checked by the police.

Theory of the order -
Called from downstairs,
Goes onto balcony to respond, leaves footprints on
Cold wet condensation covered balcony floor,
stands on one foot as speaks over balcony,
‘can I come up to speak with you?’
Confronted in the bedroom door way
Argument, Threatened,
Drops towel to defend herself,
Bound with tape and clothing,
Possible painting of message, ( paint tube was found under the plastic bag)
Screams for help,
Threatened again and gaged,
suffocated with bag from behind,
Chair falls to right, causing head injury on the right of the head,
Sexually Assaulted while unconcious,
Moved under cover of darkness to windowless, concrete built storage room while still unconcious,
Then bound with rope, hog tied,
Left for a period of time,
Comes round,
Tries to free herself with knife,
Discovered, Strangled,
Left for a period of time while deceased,
bedroom and bed, upstairs is staged
Perpetrator cuts hog tie - finds rigor Mortis unexpectedly, she will not hang straight,
Decides to lay her on grass and say she was cut down to fit with the narrative.
Waited for daybreak...

I’m so sorry this is so brutal, it’s so sad...it’s just my opinion and hypotheses did how it may have all happened...

I welcome any and all feedback...
 
Did JS testify today? Any of our court peeps at trial today?


Doesn't appear JS testified today.



Shacknai fingerprints not found on evidence, analyst testifies

>>snip

Linda Wright, now in the private business of teaching law enforcement officers how to use fingerprinting systems, was called to the stand by Shacknai’s attorneys.

>>snip
The defense in the lawsuit has maintained during the month-long trial that no evidence links Adam Shacknai, 54, a Memphis tugboat captain, to Zahau’s death.

Wright supported that contention in San Diego Superior Court.

“Did you find Adam Shacknai’s fingerprints on any of the items you analyzed?” defense attorney David Elsberg asked.

“I did not,” Wright

Wright said she dusted the door frame, balcony doors, a metal bed frame, a paint tube and two knives in the guest bedroom. The noose around Zahau’s neck was fastened on one end to the foot of the bed and draped over the balcony railing.

She found Zahau’s prints on all of the objects, she said.

Plaintiff’s attorney C. Keith Greer has said some surfaces appeared to have been wiped down before authorities got to the house.

Wright testified that she saw no evidence anything had been wiped down. But then Greer asked specifically about a section of the balcony door that appeared, in a photo, to have little or no black fingerprint dust stuck to it.

The expert agreed that it could have, in fact, been wiped by someone wanting to remove traces of his or her fingers.

Trial is expected to continue on Thursday with testimony from Jonah Shacknai.

Attorneys have said they expect to conclude the trial next week, with closing arguments the following week before putting the case in jurors’ hands.

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/courts/sd-me-shacknai-fingerprints-20180321-story.html
 
Lezah -
The table has three legs, and has had three legs for some time ( there was testimony to this from a friend I recall) It would be highly unlikely to be stable enough to hold AS and RZ weight during a complicated, weight shifting, unstable center of gravity, cut down operation.[/B
The table was upright at the crimescene, so it stayed upright even when he leapt off, holding a dead weight in an awkward position?
AS testified he placed RZ on the grass without difficulty and got down off the table without difficulty. (It is three feet high with only three legs, and remained upright)


Claudianunes
He doesn't strike me as strong enough to do all of that. To me, it would be more plausible if he said that he cut her down and tried to hold her but couldn't. Doesn't seem possible for him to be o that little table (that, by the way, doesn't look very stable or even strong to hold one adult, let alone, two adults), having enough strenght to cut the rope (as other person here said, seems to be one of those types of ropes that are very hard and not bendable) WHILE holding her, an adult woman, with ONE arm. Wouldn't she come down very quick as he cut the rope? She was, sadly, dead at that point so, imagine how hard is it to hold a death body weight. I know people have said that she was tiny and skinny but, how light could she be and how strong could he be? His version doesn't seem possible to me.



I would challenge anyone to pick up a bag of anything that weighs approx. 105 lbs & stand on a table with a missing table leg or one that is broken, and jump off the table with that weight. Or if you are brave enough have your husband hold you and attempt to jump off an approx. three foot table to the ground.

Imagine it is dead weight and that rigor mortis which starts 20-30 minutes after death has been setting in. Cell phone records confirm someone listened to Zahau’s voicemail for two minutes at 12:50am on July 13, about two hours before her estimated time of death. Rigor would have been setting in for approx. 3-4 hrs.

When someone is dead it means that the body becomes harder to move as the limbs are stuck in place. These factors make a person seem heavier & it is more difficult when trying to lift or carry them.

Are any pictures of the table available for viewing.
 
Regarding the DNA, has it ever been stated what dna methodology/technique was used to analyze the evidence? Maybe somebody here knows.

I was reading this article which states older dna methodology had a higher ratio of producing “non shedders.” However, modern techniques have specialized techniques designed to maximize DNA results. I find it interesting it has been concluded Adam is a “non shedder” since there wasn’t a trace of his dna found. If an outdated technique was used, the accuracy is questionable. Of course if Adam wore gloves or wiped the crime scene this wouldn’t be relevant.

The article also discusses factors that increase the amount of DNA found. Type of contact including pressure and friction increase the amount of dna used. Adam saying he tried to loosen the rope would create enough pressure and friction to leave dna behind, IMO.

Pay attention to these areas of the article...

Is DNA always left on an object via touch?
What factors tend to increase the amount of DNA available for transfer?


http://ryanforensicdna.com/touchdna/
 
Lezah -
The table has three legs, and has had three legs for some time ( there was testimony to this from a friend I recall) It would be highly unlikely to be stable enough to hold AS and RZ weight during a complicated, weight shifting, unstable center of gravity, cut down operation.[/B
The table was upright at the crimescene, so it stayed upright even when he leapt off, holding a dead weight in an awkward position?
AS testified he placed RZ on the grass without difficulty and got down off the table without difficulty. (It is three feet high with only three legs, and remained upright)


Claudianunes
He doesn't strike me as strong enough to do all of that. To me, it would be more plausible if he said that he cut her down and tried to hold her but couldn't. Doesn't seem possible for him to be o that little table (that, by the way, doesn't look very stable or even strong to hold one adult, let alone, two adults), having enough strenght to cut the rope (as other person here said, seems to be one of those types of ropes that are very hard and not bendable) WHILE holding her, an adult woman, with ONE arm. Wouldn't she come down very quick as he cut the rope? She was, sadly, dead at that point so, imagine how hard is it to hold a death body weight. I know people have said that she was tiny and skinny but, how light could she be and how strong could he be? His version doesn't seem possible to me.



I would challenge anyone to pick up a bag of anything that weighs approx. 105 lbs & stand on a table with a missing table leg or one that is broken, and jump off the table with that weight. Or if you are brave enough have your husband hold you and attempt to jump off an approx. three foot table to the ground.

Imagine it is dead weight and that rigor mortis which starts 20-30 minutes after death has been setting in. Cell phone records confirm someone listened to Zahau’s voicemail for two minutes at 12:50am on July 13, about two hours before her estimated time of death. Rigor would have been setting in for approx. 3-4 hrs.

When someone is dead it means that the body becomes harder to move as the limbs are stuck in place. These factors make a person seem heavier & it is more difficult when trying to lift or carry them.

Are any pictures of the table available for viewing.


BBM, Table at bottom of photo
 

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Onset of rigor mortis sets in at about 3-4 hours after death, not 20-30 min. Even in a hot environment, rigor won't set in that fast.

* Rigor in limbs is actually fairly easy to break in the early stages. I have worked with many families who cradled/ held their loved ones for several hours after death, and the rigor is easily manipulated at that stage. Rigor in the jaw is usually more reliable in the early hours, because no one usually opens and closes the jaw to break rigor.

However, a body does begin to cool as soon as death occurs, and even at 20-30 min, it's possible to detect cooling of exposed skin at ordinary room temps. Which is why the 13 hour delay of the ME's office tech arriving is inexcusable. The tech could have/ should have established TOD with core temps as well as rigor and livor. Core temps at 13 hours aren't really reliable, and she was laying in the sun exposed for much of that time.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rigor_mortis
 
BBM, Table at bottom of photo

It looks like a cheap patio table to me. Adam would weight approx. 160-170 (just a guesstimate) and RZ weighted 105 lbs. I do not know what the weight factor would be for such a table - it seems questionable to me.
 
Going back to what the family believed about Max's prognosis and condition at the time of Rebcca's death, and Adam's comments about the conversation with his father where the elder Mr. Shacknai was devastated, I have a thought connection to recent testimony.

Go back and listen to Dr. Brad Peterson's testimony of a few days ago. He said, of prognosis and comments to Max's parents-- "I don't know exactly what I said to them, but I would have been extremely guarded. Very guarded."

"Guarded" in medical speak is not presenting an optimistic picture, not giving false hope. That BP used the term "guarded" in his testimony is significant, IMO. "Guarded", IMO, is very grave, "expectant". In my opinion, that does not indicate that he was watching and waiting to see if Max would improve-- he was expecting him to continue to worsen and decline.

I do think Leezah's speculation upthread about Adam possibly wanting to avenge Max's death for the sake of the elder Grandpa Shacknai's grief is fascinating. Very interesting. Especially given the family dynamics, religious traditions, etc. Much to ponder.

** Here is an article that discussed the term "guarded" in condition and prognosis.

The Rationing of Health Care for Those Whose Prognosis is guarded

A good example of guarded prognosis occurs when a patient is terminally ill but the doctor realizes that telling this patient about the impending situation will aggravate matters and even cause depression.

Therefore, having defined the topic concepts separately, it is important to combine them and come up with a clear meaning of the statement “rationing of healthcare for those whose prognosis is guarded." This is an ethical issue of concern to both the nursing and healthcare professionals. It is of concern because a decision has to be made no matte what, and in a timely manner. Therefore, to ration healthcare for those whose prognosis is guarded implies that a medical practitioner has already evaluated the patient, and made a prediction concerning the patient’s disease progress, but out of consideration for the patient’s expected outcome on realizing the bone of contention, the medical practitioner decides to ration treatment.

https://www.lawteacher.net/free-law...se-prognosis-is-guarded-law-medical-essay.php
 
It looks like a cheap patio table to me. Adam would weight approx. 160-170 (just a guesstimate) and RZ weighted 105 lbs. I do not know what the weight factor would be for such a table - it seems questionable to me.


Agree. I doubt very much that table can hold over 200 pounds of weight.
 
Onset of rigor mortis sets in at about 3-4 hours after death, not 20-30 min. Even in a hot environment, rigor won't set in that fast.

* Rigor in limbs is actually fairly easy to break in the early stages. I have worked with many families who cradled/ held their loved ones for several hours after death, and the rigor is easily manipulated at that stage. Rigor in the jaw is usually more reliable in the early hours, because no one usually opens and closes the jaw to break rigor.

However, a body does begin to cool as soon as death occurs, and even at 20-30 min, it's possible to detect cooling of exposed skin at ordinary room temps. Which is why the 13 hour delay of the ME's office tech arriving is inexcusable. The tech could have/ should have established TOD with core temps as well as rigor and livor. Core temps at 13 hours aren't really reliable, and she was laying in the sun exposed for much of that time.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rigor_mortis

Thanks for the clarity. Sheesh I misunderstood what I read.....again.
 
In one of Greer’s recent Websleuth interviews, he said the Asian *advertiser censored* had been viewed on Monday evening on one of Rebecca’s computers, but he said something like, “she may have exaggerated, and it really wasn’t important.” What? What does that mean? How could it not be important?

If I were on the Jury, from what I have seen to date, I would have to vote Not Guilty. They have not proved Adam had anything to do with her death, and there is no reason he would all of a sudden at his age, have to rape his brother’s girlfriend. It sounded like he and Jonah were close despite their age difference. Their is no indication in his past. No violence it seems, whatsoever. Why would he sexually assault or rape Rebecca? It just makes no sense to me.

I have leaned towards it being suicide since learning about the physical evidence, and am even more confident that is correct from seeing the testimony so far. Unless something major - which includes physical evidence which shows Adam was in the balcony room - I image I won’t change my mind.

Just my opinion.

We don't necessarily know if there aren't things like this (sexual assault or harassment) in his background. If his brother can "take care of" things in his life (like the weird thing he said about some sort of driving offense), he can take care of anything like that.

Men do rape women without having much of a "motive" besides sadist sexual gratification.

-----
Separate thought but from the moment i heard about this murder, I've always felt that "asian bondage" is something JS was into.
 
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