Wrongful death trial begins. Trial coverage and discussion

[vlpate]

Yes, there is evidence to back it up. It was tested by a professional lab. DNA and menstrual blood were found on all four sides of the knife handle.

Greet talks about it in his interview with Tricia. He claims when he brought up the evidence to SDSO, they became difficult to work with, no longer cooperated. He said that SDSO had tested the knife and knew something was on the handle.

More news articles

https://crimewatchdaily.com/2018/01...eath-ruled-suicide-by-sheriffs-investigators/

https://www.10news.com/news/evidenc...-zahau-disproves-suicide-family-attorney-says

Her menstrual blood was found in a few places, that is not proof of rape. To me it is ludicrous to even suggest a grown man would "rape" a woman with the little handle of a steak knife - for what purpose? It was evidently not a violent rape that would match the violence of hogtieing, suffocating, and throwing a dead woman over a balcony with a rope tied to her neck. At some point Ocam's razor has to be considered.

And respectfully, I like to actually see evidence when it comes to what attorney's present to media. Greer also said, on Tricia's show, that he was not aware of a test that could differentiate between regular blood and menstrual blood.

 

[vlpate]

Might I suggest you spend some time reviewing all the new interviews and news stories that have come out. There's been quite a bit of new evidence revealed since RZ's family defense team reviewed the evidence.

It would be a shame to form an opinion only based on the limited, cherry-picked information provided by SDSO so many years ago Do yourself a favor and catch up!

https://www.spreaker.com/user/triciag/websleuths-radio2-11-18-full-show-greer-

I have been researching this case and the new theories/evidence for a while now, but thanks for the suggestion.

I am curious why I am being referred to old LE links here if they are not reliable. It's either reliable or it's not, JMO.

 

[Mica]

Her menstrual blood was found in a few places, that is not proof of rape. To me it is ludicrous to even suggest a grown man would "rape" a woman with the little handle of a steak knife - for what purpose? It was evidently not a violent rape that would match the violence of hogtieing, suffocating, and throwing a dead woman over a balcony with a rope tied to her neck. At some point Ocam's razor has to be considered.

And respectfully, I like to actually see evidence when it comes to what attorney's present to media. Greer also said, on Tricia's show, that he was not aware of a test that could differentiate between regular blood and menstrual blood.

Looks like there is a test to differentiate between regular blood and menstral blood.

PMB Test — Menstrual Blood Test

https://www.seratec.com/pmb-test



Forensic differentiation between peripheral and menstrual blood in cases of alleged sexual assault-validating an immunochromatographic multiplex assay for simultaneous detection of human hemoglobin and D-dimer.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29058082

 

[Betty P]

Her menstrual blood was found in a few places, that is not proof of rape. To me it is ludicrous to even suggest a grown man would "rape" a woman with the little handle of a steak knife - for what purpose? It was evidently not a violent rape that would match the violence of hogtieing, suffocating, and throwing a dead woman over a balcony with a rope tied to her neck. At some point Ocam's razor has to be considered.

And respectfully, I like to actually see evidence when it comes to what attorney's present to media. Greer also said, on Tricia's show, that he was not aware of a test that could differentiate between regular blood and menstrual blood.

KZ explained the difference between testing for menstrual blood vs regular blood that enabled the lab to determine it was menstrual blood

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/s...The-case-for-murder-2&p=13784960#post13784960

Can you think of any other reason why RZ's menstrual blood would be on the handle of the steak knife? Are you saying she put it there herself? It was on all four sides of the knife handle, remember? Or are you saying when Adam inserted the knife, that it was some form of consensual sex with RZ? Really?

Why Adam did it is anybody's guess.

 

[Betty P]

I have been researching this case and the new theories/evidence for a while now, but thanks for the suggestion.

I am curious why I am being referred to old LE links here if they are not reliable. It's either reliable or it's not, JMO.

All the links you've been provided are fairly recent and reliable. Greer announced the new evidence on the knife blade last November, so most of the links are since that time. If you have some that refute the evidence of RZ's blood on the knife handle, please share.

 

[BBL]

Were phone records collected for the house phone/guest house phone?

 

[Betty P]

Were phone records collected for the house phone/guest house phone?

On Tricia's interview with him last night, he said there were phone records available for everyone involved and they matched what everyone said they were doing. No more details than that. Hopefully we can follow up and find out more about those records.

That would be a great question for the next interview: Will all the phone records gathered as evidence in this case be available to the public after the trial?

 

[vlpate]

How is RZ's blood and DNA on the knife handle "no evidence"?

She had blood on two of her fingers, so it could have transferred from her hand. She had blood apparently dripping and some on her toes, she could have stepped on or over the knife at some point. So the small amount of blood on the handle is not evidence of rape, IMO. DeMeo said, incorrectly, there was no blood on RZ's hand. (See autopsy report)

"DeMeo testified that a steak knife found in the second-floor guest bedroom — where one of the rope Zahau was found hanging from was tied — had Rebecca’s blood on the handle. But there was no blood on her hands..."

 

[Imp]

Betty P: I think you shared the link to this thread yesterday or the day before, but since nothing is happening in the case until Monday, I'm posting it again for those who might be interested:

Evidence not tested
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?183224-Evidence-not-tested

 

[AlwaysShocked]

I thought Mr. Greer said that testing to the knife handle determined RZ blood on all 4 sides but testing to determine if this was menstrual blood was NOT performed. He went on to say that since RZ had no bleeding wounds anywhere on her body it had to be menstrual blood.

 

[vlpate]

All the links you've been provided are fairly recent and reliable. Greer announced the new evidence on the knife blade last November, so most of the links are since that time. If you have some that refute the evidence of RZ's blood on the knife handle, please share.

Actually the search warrants are from 2011.

I haven't refuted that there may have been blood on the knife, my doubt is that it was used to rape RZ.

 

[vlpate]

I found this from NIH interesting :

Thus, in suicidal hanging cases certain precautions and preventative measures were observed. For example, tying the hands together was regarded as a means to make self-release impossible; closure of the oral orifice as a means to prevent the victim from calling out for help, and placing soft material against the ligature loop was thought to be an attempt to lessen the feeling of pain.

 

[AZlawyer]

Apologies for veering a bit off topic, but I notice AZlawyer is here. I have a question for her (or anyone else who may be able to help): are juries impressed, not impressed, or neutral in re: the number of attorneys a defendant has? I googled numerous questions on this subject, and was unable to find any information; my main concern/interest is whether Adam's 9 lawyers could have any effect on the jury.
Thanks so much for any replies!

I agree with the previous answer from another attorney, which was basically "it depends" haha. But also, the jury may not realize how many attorneys he has. I assume they aren't all sitting at the counsel table, and the jury may assume some of them are assistants.

 

[Imp]

Actually the search warrants are from 2011.

I haven't refuted that there may have been blood on the knife, my doubt is that it was used to rape RZ.

I find it much more likely she was assaulted with the knife handle than that she showered and dripped "menstrual blood" in the shower, got out of the shower, remained undressed, knowingly dripped "menstrual blood" everywhere she walked as well as on the items she supposedly used to assist her in her supposed naked suicide.

 

[Kakidoll]

I'm sorry, but i also find it VERY strange that any woman would walk around a bedroom dripping menstrual blood. Yes, we all have had 'those' accidents but again, for her to do all they say she did PURPOSELY? Nope, don't see it. Only if forced to go from shower by someone else. Just seems 'off' to me, just another think to make me go 'hmmmm'.

 

[Betty P]

I find it much more likely she was assaulted with the knife handle than that she showered and dripped "menstrual blood" in the shower, got out of the shower, remained undressed, knowingly dripped "menstrual blood" everywhere she walked as well as on the items she supposedly used to assist her in her supposed naked suicide.

It would be pretty much impossible to transfer menstrual blood that way considering the evidence was on all 4 sides of the knife handle.

 

[vlpate]

KZ explained the difference between testing for menstrual blood vs regular blood that enabled the lab to determine it was menstrual blood

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/s...The-case-for-murder-2&p=13784960#post13784960

Can you think of any other reason why RZ's menstrual blood would be on the handle of the steak knife? Are you saying she put it there herself? It was on all four sides of the knife handle, remember? Or are you saying when Adam inserted the knife, that it was some form of consensual sex with RZ? Really?

Why Adam did it is anybody's guess.

I don't doubt they can test for it, but Greer was not aware of any such test and his expert DeMeo did not mention testing the blood...it appeared she simply did the math, no cuts = menstrual blood.

This is an actual article on the differential tests from the International Journal of Medicine. I'd be curious if just anyone can order this test or only LE.

I do agree the blood should have been tested at jump street.

 

[Betty P]

I thought Mr. Greer said that testing to the knife handle determined RZ blood on all 4 sides but testing to determine if this was menstrual blood was NOT performed. He went on to say that since RZ had no bleeding wounds anywhere on her body it had to be menstrual blood.

No, I don't recall that. He said it was menstrual blood.

 

[nanwv]

If the knife handle was bloody on all sides, AS was holding the knife blade during the inserting process? With gloves on? No cuts on his hands? Jeez, this case.......

 

[vlpate]

No, I don't recall that. He said it was menstrual blood.

It might be helpful to go back and listen to the show. Tricia asked Greer if such a test existed and he said he was not aware of one.