Wrongful death trial begins. Trial coverage and discussion

[Verboten]

I am new to all this. I remember when it happened & knew suicide was preposterous, but just now playing catch up with this thread, Greer interviews, Adam's polygraph, etc. So, I may be responding to older portions of this thread because I'm finding so much I want to speak to. For now, I wanted to add my comments to Tortoise's observations regarding Adam:

Why am I not surprised AS says he took a sleeping pill that night.

He knew he needed to convince them he was sleeping all night, but I don't get it, because he truly thought it was a suicide right?

Only the guilty need to convince. If it was suicide he had no need.

Same as saying in his lie detector test that the door was open when he went to get a knife to cut her down. Thanks for the explanation that wasn't asked for, buddy. It shines a beacon right where we need it, on your guilty knowledge and lies.

I thought the same about the comment Adam "agreed to stay in the guesthouse," as reported in many stories. Was it common for their family members to stay in the guesthouse when there was all that space in the main house? It seemed really important for them to establish he was in separate quarters. If he "agreed to" stay there, that implies it wasn't automatically a given. Who asked him to stay in the guesthouse that he had to agree with? Jonah? To establish his separation? Rebecca? Why? Creepy vibe?

As Tortoise indicates, Adam saying he ran to the kitchen to get a knife, "because the door was open." Is different than him saying he ran to see if he could get into the house. By making that statement, he admits to knowing the door was open ahead of time. How would he know?

I am blown away by his explanation in polygraph video that he ran to get a knife, cut her down, and checked for pulse, then called 911, "if not before." Adam does not know if he cut down a dead body before talking to 911 or during a call to 911? Really?

Also, when did Adam leave town? If he flew in to "support" Jonah, would Jonah not need even MORE support once his girlfriend died in such a horrific manner? Wouldn't that be double the reason for Adam to stick around in Coronado? I haven't seen exact time of his departure, but get the impression he split pretty quickly after all of this.

All the timing around travel and flights is very interesting, but I'll save those broader thoughts for later.

 

[Tortoise]

A week or so ago I watched the press conference where Mr Greer apologised to Dina and her sister. I recall now I think it was the guy next to him saying something like Jonah had been vague about his reason for calling Rebecca that night, and may have alluded to their relationship being over or him thinking Rebecca may have perceived it as such. There seemed to be a bit of disagreement between him and Greer about that and it wasn't really explained.

 

[Tortoise]

Did the guesthouse have its own kitchen with things like coffee making facilities and kitchen knives?

 

[K_Z]

Verboten, you're spot on, IMO. For many years, a lot of us have thought that Adam's odd behaviors, inappropriate demeanor, and bizarre retorts and statements are really off the scale of "normal". With the intense interest of both Dina and Jonah in autism causes, and their involvement in so many autism charities and autism therapeutic services, I've long suspected that Adam is on the spectrum. Dina never appeared to be interested in mental health issues or autism until she met Jonah-- she was a medical equipment rep until then.

And now we hear a really strange tidbit that has never appeared in the past 7 years-- that there was some kind of friendly relationship between Adam and Dina where he sent her his creative writing stories. And yet, Adam appears to have had only sporadic contact with Jonah-- no evidence that they were close. So that just seems an odd connection, IMO. Dina appears to be trying to shield him now with her carefully placed comments, IMO. Such as, she now believes Rebecca was murdered, but Adam didn't do it. And she now no longer believes Rebecca hurt or killed Max. At this late time, that's just off the scale of reasonable or truthful, IMO. It's a huge red flag, IMO.

In the big picture, if Adam is, or isn't, on the autism spectrum makes no difference. He is clearly high functioning if he is autistic, such as those with Asperger's Syndrome. He clearly knows the difference between right and wrong.

But almost nothing about his demeanor and interactions is within the range of normal responses, IMO.

Maybe that's why he may have been asked to stay in the guesthouse. Perhaps he's easier to get along with if there is some separation. Maybe Rebecca was uncomfortable around him. Maybe XZ was still there when it was being discussed that Adam would come after Max's fall, and it was seen as a better situation to have him in the guesthouse, since Jonah would be at the hospital a lot. Just speculation.

 

[K_Z]

A week or so ago I watched the press conference where Mr Greer apologised to Dina and her sister. I recall now I think it was the guy next to him saying something like Jonah had been vague about his reason for calling Rebecca that night, and may have alluded to their relationship being over or him thinking Rebecca may have perceived it as such. There seemed to be a bit of disagreement between him and Greer about that and it wasn't really explained.

Internet trolls in many discussion sites years ago claimed that the voice mail from Jonah was him "dumping" her, and demanding she move out of the mansion immediately.

 

[Verboten]

I listened to Under the Gavel, Episode 2, UT's weekly coverage of the trial & it really eats at me to listen to this court "reporter": https://player.fm/series/under-the-gavel/zahau-episode-2-family-and-fingerprints

I understand that SO had blinders on, but can't understand the lay people who, when given a taste of the evidence, show a similar confirmation bias for suicide. The reporter in this podcast drove me crazy. After sitting in the courtroom all week, she should be better equipped for balance.

One thing she said is that: Suicide is assumed because there is no other DNA or prints. She's then asked if items were wiped down & says, basically, that doesn't add up because how would a murderer be able to wipe only his own fingerprints when Rebecca's were still all around. The interviewer then asks, could he have worn gloves, and reporter answers, well yes, but that doesn't make sense because why then wipe down the scene? Wait, did she not JUST SAY she thought the scene wasn't wiped because Rebecca's prints were found? WTH? It's like going around in circles with someone incapable of critical thinking.

She does the same weirdness about the words on the door. She says that the words make sense if written by Rebecca, since she thinks she saved Max, but don't make sense if written by someone else because if they thought she saved Max, they wouldn't want to kill her. Nevermind it makes no sense regardless, or that it makes no sense for Rebecca to be writing in 3rd person.

I have no patience for this one-sided interpretation of the evidence from someone who actually was in court throughout the week. At least, that was my perspective in listening to this--I perceive her as buying the LE interpretation. Not sure I want to listen to another UT podcast if this is the quality of their court reporting...

 

[*Lash*]

With all of this chatter about the lack of info on AS, how online writings of him have completely disappeared over the years, etc., it reminds me of a prominent local architect who got busted for child *advertiser censored* a few years back. The local newspaper published an article detailing how they had been contacted by a PR firm that explained that they were requesting the newspaper to remove articles from their archives which mentioned the sex offender and the architecture firm in the same article. Apparently, having someone be indicted and convicted of possessing and sharing child *advertiser censored* is bad for business. The newspaper published their article to explain why they would not be removing former articles from their archives, as it is against the values and responsibilities of a good journalist. I am assuming that a similar situation occurred here, except the firm hired by the S's was more successful in getting the information removed that they were wanting to be *gone*.

https://www.news-leader.com/story/n...5/19/watchdog-sorry-rewrite-history/27520619/

Thank you for this! Re-writing history... It reminded me of the Forbes article from 2011:

Snip-

Why It's Personal
I also write because Mr. Shacknai's PR firm - Sitrick and Company took the trouble to view my profile on LinkedIn after I posted Cathy Scott's first article on the Zahau death. I didn't like that, particularly because they weren't simply looking for contact information, not having bothered to contact me.

It felt creepy. I don't expect anything like it to ever happen again.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/sheneg...der-in-spreckels-mansion-case/2/#7fe4eb071daa

 

[Verboten]

Did the guesthouse have its own kitchen with things like coffee making facilities and kitchen knives?

Excellent question, Tortoise. We'd have to presume so, this did not seem to be a primitive guest house. Hmmm....

 

[Pi2016]

I was reading the article I linked earlier over again and this stuck out to me:

Like, why did Rebecca scream at her sister Xena at the end of her 911 call, as paramedics stood on the porch, “Don’t open that door!” Was she aware of some danger she hadn’t shared with her? Why did the police ignore a neighbor two doors from the mansion who told them she heard a woman crying for help at 11:30 the night Rebecca died?

https://www.townandcountrymag.com/s...6/shaknai-deaths-mystery-coronado-california/

Anyone know what this is about?

 

[*Lash*]

Respectfully snipped:

I listened to Under the Gavel, Episode 2, UT's weekly coverage of the trial & it really eats at me to listen to this court "reporter": https://player.fm/series/under-the-gavel/zahau-episode-2-family-and-fingerprints

Thank you Verboten!

Here is a YouTube video promo for Under the Gavel - There are clips from the day of the presser with Dina, Nina and Greer. I believe there is new footage where Dina is being interviewed and asked questions about Jonah. I don’t recall this interview. Anyone else?

[video=YouTube;3FtUwX8WFbs]https://youtu.be/3FtUwX8WFbs[/video]

ETA- Nope - It is NOT new footage. It is from an interview in September 2012.

September 19, 2012 interview with Diana Shacknai, mother of Max Shacknai who died from fatal fall down a staircase.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KCXuW6ugwdA

 

[*Lash*]

I was reading the article I linked earlier over again and this stuck out to me:




https://www.townandcountrymag.com/s...6/shaknai-deaths-mystery-coronado-california/

Anyone know what this is about?

Hi Pi2016 :wave: I personally do not put too much stock in articles written by friends of the key players in this case. The author is Sean Elder.

 

[Mica]

Did the guesthouse have its own kitchen with things like coffee making facilities and kitchen knives?

Great question. Yes, the guesthouse has a kitchen.

https://www.planomatic.com/mls14441

 

[Pi2016]

Hi Pi2016 :wave: I personally do not put too much stock in articles written by friends of the key players in this case. The author is Sean Elder.

Do you think this is Sean Elder or Dina's opinion, or did the 911 call pick up Rebecca saying "Don't open that door"? I think the jurors already heard Xena's 911 call, so curious if Rebecca is heard on there saying what (Dina via the article) claimed?

I can't shake the feeling that we don't know everything about Max's accident that day. I do not believe Rebecca killed him or had anything to do with it, but it just seems like something is missing.

 

[*Lash*]

Do you think this is Sean Elder or Dina's opinion, or did the 911 call pick up Rebecca saying "Don't open that door"? I think the jurors already heard Xena's 911 call, so curious if Rebecca is heard on there saying what (Dina via the article) claimed?

I can't shake the feeling that we don't know everything about Max's accident that day. I do not believe Rebecca killed him or had anything to do with it, but it just seems like something is missing.

I really cannot answer who’s opinion it might be...I agree with the curiosity. Maybe Sean could reveal his source?

 

[Pi2016]

I really cannot answer who’s opinion it might be...I agree with the curiosity. Maybe Sean could reveal his source?

Do you know if Xena's 911 call is available anywhere?

 

[*Lash*]

I have not seen a transcript of XZ. I do not believe it has been released. This was published earlier this week by the Tribune.

Snip-

A second taped deposition was shown to jurors, of Zahau’s sister, XZ, who was 13 when Max suffered his fall. She said she stepped out of a shower at the Coronado mansion and heard Zahau screaming for her.

She ran downstairs and saw Zahau kneeling on the floor, with Max lying with his head in her lap, unconscious. A crystal chandelier that had been hanging above, in the foyer, was broken on the floor. The boy’s scooter lay nearby and their pet dog, Ocean, was running around.

Zahau yelled for XZ to call 911. XZ spent a few moments looking for Zahau’s cellphone and got a 911 operator in Coronado. Jurors listened to a tape of the 911 call, in which XZ inadvertently confuses the dispatcher into thinking her sister had fallen and their mother was doing CPR.

Medics and police soon arrived and Max was taken to the hospital, unconscious. He died six days later. The death was ruled an accident.

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/courts/sd-me-zahau-day6-story.html

Do you know if Xena's 911 call is available anywhere?

Sorry, not that I am aware - just some new detailed info from court.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Did the guesthouse have its own kitchen with things like coffee making facilities and kitchen knives?

Something that would be of interest to me, would be what lights were on in the house and in the guest house when the police arrived. Perhaps that is why he said he had to go upstairs is because some of the lights were on?

Eta.. or correcting myself, he never did say he was going upstairs. Did she do all this in the dark? With no bedroom lights on with all of the tying of knots etc.?

 

[Pi2016]

KZ, and anyone else interested, I ended up finding the article that mentions the doctor who initially thought Max had been suffocated.

Newly obtained search warrants reveal that a doctor at first thought that Max Shacknai, son of Jonah Shacknai may have been suffocated.
A county sheriff’s investigation later confirmed that Max died after falling down the stairs in the infamous Spreckles mansion where Rebecca Zahau was found dead days later.
However, Dr. Brad Peterson, a doctor at Rady’s Children’s hospital was quoted in a search warrant saying that Max might have suffocated before the fall. The visible injuries were not consistent with the cardiac arrest and brain swelling experienced by the boy, Peterson said.

https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Shacknai-Boy-May-Have-Suffocated-Doctor-130367943.html

 

[Betty P]

Something that would be of interest to me, would be what lights were on in the house and in the guest house when the police arrived. Perhaps that is why he said he had to go upstairs is because some of the lights were on?

Eta.. or correcting myself, he never did say he was going upstairs. Did she do all this in the dark? With no bedroom lights on with all of the tying of knots etc.?

That's another question I've had too. Over the years we've discussed this and I don't recall the answer. It would be great to have clarification on this from LE. If the lights were off in the murder room, it would be one more reason to believe it was murder.

I don't need more evidence to convince me it was murder. From the moment I saw the configuration of RZ's fingerprints on the butcher knife and heard of her blood on the knife handle, it was game over. But some people may need more to convince them.

 

[Betty P]

Do you know if Xena's 911 call is available anywhere?

I'm pretty sure there's a transcript here somewhere. Check the sticky threads at the top, there should be a link to those documents.