4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #101

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  • #101
I don't get why this trial is taking so long. unless its just the defence and delaying actions. you know what the strongest evidence there is that it wasn't his car? his cell phone pings are damning as well.
Pretty standard actually. Then throw in the death penalty, trials two, three years out is the norm IME.

I like Hippler. He's not going to budge, will hold both parties to the timeline so it doesn't head into four or more.

JMO
 
  • #102
I don't get why this trial is taking so long. unless its just the defence and delaying actions. you know what the strongest evidence there is that it wasn't his car? his cell phone pings are damning as well.
DP qualifying cases always tend to take longer. Both sides and the court itself are very aware of the gravity of a case where the verdict can mean death for the defendant.

MOO
 
  • #103
Makes allot of sense actually. is it then safe to presume the DP is on the cards?
 
  • #104
I don't get why this trial is taking so long. unless its just the defence and delaying actions. you know what the strongest evidence there is that it wasn't his car? his cell phone pings are damning as well.
IMO it isn't taking longer than would be usual for a high-profile, multiple murder, death penalty case. For example, the James Holmes case in CO-- Holmes was arrested minutes after the theater shootings but it was nearly 3 years later almost to the day before there was a conviction. And even if it was taking longer than is usual, better a delay now than having to have a second trial later because of errors made in haste.
MOO
 
  • #105
Makes allot of sense actually. is it then safe to presume the DP is on the cards?
It is.

The defense is fighting it. First fighting the death penalty itself, now they seem to be switching tracks and trying to argue that the defendant should be exempt, claiming he is autistic.

I, an autistic person, am extremely dubious.

MOO
 
  • #106
It is.

The defense is fighting it. First fighting the death penalty itself, now they seem to be switching tracks and trying to argue that the defendant should be exempt, claiming he is autistic.

I, an autistic person, am extremely dubious.

MOO
I'm not clued up on such matters but can we tell if the defence is going for damage limitation more than a thorough and believable defence? or both. I would guess both as thats their job but I would presume a smart one would simply "bite the bullet".
 
  • #107
I'm not clued up on such matters but can we tell if the defence is going for damage limitation more than a thorough and believable defence? or both. I would guess both as thats their job but I would presume a smart one would simply "bite the bullet".
Not sure what you mean by "bite the bullet." AT is a skilled DP-qualified lawyer. Are you suggesting she should give up defending BK? I'm confused. Of course, a defense attorney would prefer the client get off but if that's not possible, lessening punishment is thought important, especially in a DP case.
MOO
 
  • #108
I'm not clued up on such matters but can we tell if the defence is going for damage limitation more than a thorough and believable defence? or both. I would guess both as thats their job but I would presume a smart one would simply "bite the bullet".
Up to this point, much of the Defense's energy (bluster) has been toward suppression. The evidence is damning beyond all damning so the best defense would have knocked out evidence.

But that failed. Spectacularly.

IF she puts on an actual defense at trial, it'll be through paid experts IMO to cloudy up genetic genealogy, muddle up DNA ratios/statistics. For certain she'll try to raise the question of reliability/credibility with the State's witnesses.

Her work is cut out for her.

I predict she'll age ten years and lose as many pounds.

While, in the end, a fine prison somewhere with gain about 180# (or whatever he weighs).

And while he serves out LWOP or the DP, the most he can hope for -- if there's anyone still willing to -- prison visits behind plexiglass every day and maybe twice on Sunday.

JMO
 
  • #109
Not sure what you mean by "bite the bullet." AT is a skilled DP-qualified lawyer. Are you suggesting she should give up defending BK? I'm confused. Of course, a defense attorney would prefer the client get off but if that's not possible, lessening punishment is thought important, especially in a DP case.
MOO
yeh bite the bullet means to face something unpleasant and deal with it, in this context im thinking she probably knows its a lost cause so would plow more effort into avoiding the DP. nothing about not defending him. im also wondering if its possible to see her angle, which mightgive an insight to her approach.
 
  • #110
yeh bite the bullet means to face something unpleasant and deal with it, in this context im thinking she probably knows its a lost cause so would plow more effort into avoiding the DP. nothing about not defending him. im also wondering if its possible to see her angle, which mightgive an insight to her approach.
Well, even with the gag order and the sealed documents both sides are "talking to" the potential jury pool with pre-trial matters. So I wouldn't expect to see a skilled defense attorney obviously give up on winning the guilt phase of the trial. That's just my opinion, of course.
 
  • #111
Up to this point, much of the Defense's energy (bluster) has been toward suppression. The evidence is damning beyond all damning so the best defense would have knocked out evidence.

But that failed. Spectacularly.

IF she puts on an actual defense at trial, it'll be through paid experts IMO to cloudy up genetic genealogy, muddle up DNA ratios/statistics. For certain she'll try to raise the question of reliability/credibility with the State's witnesses.

Her work is cut out for her.

I predict she'll age ten years and lose as many pounds.

While, in the end, a fine prison somewhere with gain about 180# (or whatever he weighs).

And while he serves out LWOP or the DP, the most he can hope for -- if there's anyone still willing to -- prison visits behind plexiglass every day and maybe twice on Sunday.

JMO
sounds like fr her health she should quit. its not biting a bullet its chowing a cannonball. Any info on what his family position is? the way one of the article reads they were thought to have suspicions.
 
  • #112
sounds like fr her health she should quit. its not biting a bullet its chowing a cannonball. Any info on what his family position is? the way one of the article reads they were thought to have suspicions.
I doubt AT will decide to quit her job. She is a public defender and one of the few death penalty qualified ones in that area. I expect she can handle the case without endangering her health unduly. This isn't her first rodeo.
MOO
 
  • #113
yeh bite the bullet means to face something unpleasant and deal with it, in this context im thinking she probably knows its a lost cause so would plow more effort into avoiding the DP. nothing about not defending him. im also wondering if its possible to see her angle, which mightgive an insight to her approach.
IMO her approach is predictable.

Start with the public cries of his innocence. Volley for change of venue.
File robust motions, in length and quantity.
Pour through discovery in search of anything challengeable.
Create a public narrative. That LE and the State are secretive, underhanded, untrustworthy.
Massage the judge with impassioned motions and oration.
File Frank's motions in the hopes of getting ANY evidence thrown out.
At trial, challenge the witness and the evidence, try to create a tiny air bubble of doubt.
Question State's expert witness, asking the right questions to the wrong investigators.
Try to win jurors over on genealogy privacy, unscientific statistics, etc.

Save mitigation for sentencing. Poor Bryan, victim of an unconstitutional DP. Poor Bryan, awkward and misunderstood. No criminal history, as if this quadruple MASSACRE was an accidental one-off. Four-off.

I think the State will counter on each element of the DP, multiple victims, heinous crime, etc, but it's really the one place AT night be able to show her teeth. One sympathetic juror might spare him the DP.

It really won't matter, either way. It'll be locked up in appeals how ever it comes to be. Regardless, DP or no DP, BK is already dead inside.

JMO
 
  • #114
AT might waste her time trying to convince a juror that a particular view of the Elantra is particularly unidentifiable and try to tongue tie the wrong expert into admitting some debate over model years, but methinks that one the jury hears about octillions to one, they aren't going to roll on AT's car/shell game.

JMO
 
  • #115
IMO her approach is predictable.

Start with the public cries of his innocence. Volley for change of venue.
File robust motions, in length and quantity.
Pour through discovery in search of anything challengeable.
Create a public narrative. That LE and the State are secretive, underhanded, untrustworthy.
Massage the judge with impassioned motions and oration.
File Frank's motions in the hopes of getting ANY evidence thrown out.
At trial, challenge the witness and the evidence, try to create a tiny air bubble of doubt.
Question State's expert witness, asking the right questions to the wrong investigators.
Try to win jurors over on genealogy privacy, unscientific statistics, etc.

Save mitigation for sentencing. Poor Bryan, victim of an unconstitutional DP. Poor Bryan, awkward and misunderstood. No criminal history, as if this quadruple MASSACRE was an accidental one-off. Four-off.

I think the State will counter on each element of the DP, multiple victims, heinous crime, etc, but it's really the one place AT night be able to show her teeth. One sympathetic juror might spare him the DP.

It really won't matter, either way. It'll be locked up in appeals how ever it comes to be. Regardless, DP or no DP, BK is already dead inside.

JMO
sounds more desperate to me, lol.
 
  • #116
yeh bite the bullet means to face something unpleasant and deal with it, in this context im thinking she probably knows its a lost cause so would plow more effort into avoiding the DP. nothing about not defending him. im also wondering if its possible to see her angle, which mightgive an insight to her approach.
AT is a very skilled attorney, and she has been, and will continue to fight for her client, at every challenge, before and during trial. She will provide a vigorous defense, likely challenging every piece of evidence presented at trial. However, she can only work with what she is given to work with, and she doesn't have a lot to work with. She is not a miracle worker. If she keeps BK from getting the dp, which may be possible, that is as close to a win as BK is likely going to see in this case. JMO
 
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  • #117
AT is a very skilled attorney, and she has been, and will continue to fight for her client, at every challenge, before and during trial. She will provide a vigorous defense, likely challenging every piece of evidence presented at trial. However, she can only work with what she is given to work with, and she doesn't have a lot to work with. She is not a miracle worker. If she keeps BK from getting the dp, which may be possible, that is as close to a win as BK is likely going to see in this case. JMO

Agreed.

Her real problem is that her client did a quadruple murder and left part of the murder weapon behind with his DNA on it.

I am old school so the expectation on a Silk in that situation for example, is simply that they force the prosecution to prove their case, and ensure procedure is adhered to. There never would be an expectation to get a guilty person off. That is not actually the job, though increasingly in these cases I fear that defence attorneys see anything as fair game it if can lead to a 'win'.

Hopefully things settle down a bit now and we can march on to trial without so much conspiracy swirling around.

MOO
 
  • #118
They wouldn't have had any classes or anything like that together, because they went to completely different universities.

MOO

Yikes! I plumb forgot!

I’m still vacillating between theories of how he chose this group, or one individual, or an easy pickings house.
 
  • #119
Yikes! I plumb forgot!

I’m still vacillating between theories of how he chose this group, or one individual, or an easy pickings house.
I've been 'house' since the beginning, and have yet to read anything to shift me from that. Of course, there's a vast amount of information that will come out at trial that may change the face of this crime and the events of it completely. We're working theories from so little.

MOO
 
  • #120
If he does speak, he probably compliments her by saying she has "good birthing hips," like he told his Tinder date. It's one hell of a pickup line, so there's no reason to abandon it.
I really really miss the laugh emoji.
 
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