4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #103

[Warwick7]

JMO but I think it was him ... or possibly undercover intelligence trying to provoke or bait / lure the killer.

My only downside on that is was BK known for using FB? He doesn't seem to be the demographic 'wine moms'? I'm not on FB so I don't know if people use it or not any more.

On the 48 Hours Idaho murder, KG's mother said her and her husband got on FB. They could see MM's posts. They could also see all the many many times BK "liked" her posts. Since that is the case, he was known for using FB.

 

[Warwick7]

After-reading the PCA, I want to point out that DM said she thought she heard KG say “there's someone here” but forensics said it also could have been XK, as her phone indicated she was awake.

The PCA doesn't say anything about anyone else being “likely wake.”

In M00 I feel MM was sleeping. KG was initially asleep but woke up when MM was being attacked. When BK went downstairs he runs into XK (probably going to the bathroom or other). I think as I said earlier she ran to her bedroom as soon as she saw BK. She tried and failed to defend herself. EC woke up but it was too late, KB attacked him on the bed. I wonder at that time if XK stood up. He turned around and said that he was only here to help, and she was attacked again. Then there was a thud when she hit the floor at 4:17am.

When the attack happened above her to MM and KG I too feel DM thought someone was playing with Murphy....but, I noticed in the PCA there is a gap between that happening and “there's someone here.” I think the PCA has it at several minutes. It sounds to me like it is described as separate incidents.

What I can't figure out is: XK saying that someone was there. I mean, was it horror or...maybe, she thought whoever arrived was just another average college kid stopping over. There could have been annoyance in her tone, as in it was late and they didn't want a guest, but, I don't know. Even, in the PCA it indicates DM wasn't certain of the exact wording.

Either way, once she saw BK she ran to her bedroom....

 

[LetsSolvIt]

I drifted past the Konig stuff and rest is a hoot!
GH and his bro talk computer is a awesome!!

 

[LinasK]

On the 48 Hours Idaho murder, KG's mother said her and her husband got on FB. They could see MM's posts. They could also see all the many many times BK "liked" her posts. Since that is the case, he was known for using FB.

I KNEW that he'd followed at least one of these girls on social media, despite what's been reported. He stalked them. He didn't just randomly choose this particular house.

 

[Warwick7]

The DD was delivered to the slider in the back yard, not the front door? That doesn't seem like very safe procedure for the DD driver.

In M00 it makes really good sense. In essence everyone has gone to bed, her bedroom was on the middle floor close to the sliding glass door. I'm thinking she told DD to leave it at that door. This way she doesn't have to go all the way downstairs and possible wake up a different room-mate. She could just get it at the sliding glass door and then grab a couple fries, eat in the living room or kitchen, flipping through her phone, without waking up Ethan. Maybe after eating her sandwich she took the rest of her fries to her room. Then, maybe coming out to use the restroom or get a drink she ran into BK.

I also wonder if DD parked behind the house in the back. It would be very easy to drop it off at the sliding door. According to GH's video he has BK parked out back off to the side for about 1.5 minutes. I wonder if he saw the DD. Because after that, according to GH using the documents, it shows BK going wayyyyyyyy around the blocks, then circling back. As if he was waiting for DD to leave....
All M00

 

[Warwick7]

2 years ago, but if you haven't seen this it's good interview.

 

[schooling]

It's possible, but I think if that happened it was within days of the murders. I say this because his last documented trip to the area late at night, was November, 7. So it would have to be between the 8th and the 12th.

MM being the primary target comes from early social media rumors that appear to be untrue. But that doesn't mean she wasn't the primary target. The evidence seems to show her bedroom was the first one he went to, and he may have been able to see her through her bedroom window on surveillance missions (assuming he parked behind the house).

This kind of leads into a theory I have.

I'm totally open to the idea Kohberger went to the house intent on killing multiple victims, but here's a scenario where he has a primary target and this ends the same way.

The evidence appears to show that he made 23 late night trips to the vicinity of the crime scene. If he parked behind the house, he'd have a view of MM's bedroom; It's possible he fixated on her.

On the night of the murders he enters through the second floor sliding door, and makes his way up to MM's bedroom on the third floor. His plan immediately goes awry when he discovers she's not alone in bed. At this point he kills both victims, as he can't leave a survivor.

Minutes prior to this, Xana's DoorDash was delivered. It's possible she was in her bedroom or up and about, and saw or heard BK as he came back down. At this point he has to kill Xana and Ethan, for the same reason he killed KG.

These murders do not go according to plan, as all indications are that Xana fought back. It's noisy, and the dog starts barking. He's spooked, and worried police might be on the way, which is why instead of killing DM (who he likely saw), he walks past her, speeding away minutes later (after stripping off gloves and coveralls).

I theorized that he had brought his 'kit' on previous nights and may have done the same repetitive loops but chickened out. With Thanksgiving break coming, his academic life failing, his timely license plate change, he probably figured what better time but then.

And on your theory, I came to the realization the other day that BK may have come down after hearing DM (reportedly) yelling out her door for everyone to be quiet , and thought it came from Xana.

 

[Ghostwheel]

Rsbm...

What I can't figure out is: XK saying that someone was there. I mean, was it horror or...maybe, she thought whoever arrived was just another average college kid stopping over. There could have been annoyance in her tone, as in it was late and they didn't want a guest, but, I don't know. Even, in the PCA it indicates DM wasn't certain of the exact wording.

Rsbm

My thought process was that Xana was sitting on the couch, with ear buds in the dark with only phone and Good Vibes light masking her cell phone light to anyone looking that way, eating her JITB meal. With the headphones in and listening to something, she might not have noticed noise, but may have felt vibration. I know when I think I've heard something, I pull one headphone out and listen to see if the noise repeats, but I could see someone asking "is someone here?" Or "is someone there?" If they removed the headphone, did not hear an extra noise, but felt that someone was there. No one answers, sees nothing, plugs back in, maybe is even on the way to take the bag to the kitchen, heads back to the bedroom where she is grabbed and mortally wounded, but not yet deceased. Ethan is killed, "I'm going to help you", Xana is done in, off the killer goes.

Or Xana heads maybe to the bathroom. Killer sneaks past to kill Ethan, grabs Xana as she comes back to the room.

Eta: there are so many variations on this, you could not hardly write them all. Bk come in slider while Xana gets meal downstairs. Bk comes in goes upstairs, Xana come to get her DD in the kitchen but headphones on so she doesn't hear or feel vibrations on other side of house. Etc, etc.

All moo, of course

 

[Charlot123]

Older article, might be re-post but it's gives a really good look at AT's strategy and aim.

"Due to his ASD, Mr. Kohberger simply cannot comport himself in a manner that aligns with societal expectations of normalcy. This creates an unconscionable risk that he will be executed because of his disability rather than his culpability,” his attorneys said.

(Ah, the challenge of defending against the sentencing before the verdict is rendered.)

https://www.cnn.com/2025/03/06/us/bryan-kohberger-autism-death-penalty/index.html

As always, balancing pros and cons.

On the one hand it is a shaky ground because most “weird” killers might have these traits. Dahmer, Keys, our school shooters. Even Oswald, MOO.
Not only this, strange interests and behaviors, like…interest in bodies? So it might be in “the murder suits him” area.

On the other hand, such people might indeed be manipulated by a group.

A tendency to make off-color jokes might be misunderstood by others. Or, OCD tendencies that bothered BK’s family when he got back…but could his family share the same traits and hence, lack the capacity to interpret the behavior in the correct way?

So I would have trouble knowing what to do with it. Could BK, a loner, probably frustrated but having no clue how to approach people, take it on the world, especially on women? For sure.

Could he be a “too convenient” scapegoat? Yes, he could.

A very tough case and a tough line of defense. I would try the angle of being non-local as potentially predisposing to “un-preferential treatment”. Why did they dig through heaven and hell to identify his DNA and yet neglected other male DNAs found in the house that, place-wise, could have had more relevance?

 

[Megnut]

The University of Idaho Murders: Makes and Model Homes

Today, we finally caught up with the filings for the murders of Ethan Chapin, Xana Kernodle, Madison Mogen, and Kaylee Goncalves in Moscow, Idaho. We talk...

murdersheetpodcast.com

 

[girlhasnoname]

The DD was delivered to the slider in the back yard, not the front door? That doesn't seem like very safe procedure for the DD driver.

It does and doesn't surprise me. I'd bet DD had delivered to that house many times previously. There was no snow at that point and it would have been more convenient for Xana to pick it up there.

JMO

 

[girlhasnoname]

As always, balancing pros and cons.

On the one hand it is a shaky ground because most “weird” killers might have these traits. Dahmer, Keys, our school shooters. Even Oswald, MOO.
Not only this, strange interests and behaviors, like…interest in bodies? So it might be in “the murder suits him” area.

On the other hand, such people might indeed be manipulated by a group.

A tendency to make off-color jokes might be misunderstood by others. Or, OCD tendencies that bothered BK’s family when he got back…but could his family share the same traits and hence, lack the capacity to interpret the behavior in the correct way?

So I would have trouble knowing what to do with it. Could BK, a loner, probably frustrated but having no clue how to approach people, take it on the world, especially on women? For sure.

Could he be a “too convenient” scapegoat? Yes, he could.

A very tough case and a tough line of defense. I would try the angle of being non-local as potentially predisposing to “un-preferential treatment”. Why did they dig through heaven and hell to identify his DNA and yet neglected other male DNAs found in the house that, place-wise, could have had more relevance?

The DNA on the knife sheath beside the murdered victim trumps all other DNA.

JMO

 

[Nila Aella]

Mr. Gordon may have been the one to respond, and possibly because Timing Advance Records are now under the GLDC, but he specifically was responding to the 22 December 2022 search warrant that Sy Ray is calling out.

I am qualified to authenticate records responsive to the attached Search Warrant dated 12/22/22 because I am familiar with how the records were created, managed, stored, and retrieved.

In his affidavit, Sy Ray omits the part of that sentence, that the CoA is authenticating the records attached to that 22 Dec 2022 search warrant. The CoA says in response to that search warrant, the one Sy Ray is calling out as having produced the missing records, that they did not produce the records for BK's phone and they could not because more than 7 days had elapsed since the time frame specified.

Warrants plural. Dec 23 2022

State
Search warrants for his AT&T records were executed on December 23, 2022. At this point, timing advance records were not available for Bryan Kohberger’s phone to cover the relevant time period - November 13, 2022.

On Dec 23, no TAR for Nov 13th per AJ.
IMO Nov 13 is most important but there are other times in the long warrant are also important.
JMO

State
Despite Defendant’s repeated assertions, the fact of the matter is that AT&T did not provide Timing Advance Records to law enforcement for Bryan Kohberger’s phone. The State is attaching Affidavits from AT&T verifying that the State did not receive timing advance records for Bryan Kohberger’s phone

The two Dec 23rd warrants.
The first warrant was for a short period.
The second warrant was for 6 months.
Mr Gordon mentions both in his affidavit.
SR mentions both.
AJ mentions both and Nov 13th.

There should at least be 7 days of requested TARS for BK just prior to Dec 23rd in the return of the long warrant, IF GLDC did this.
JMO

SR
In 2022 the FBI obtained AT&T Timing Advance records from another source, outside of GLDC.

What is the retention limit for this other FBI source?
The new GLDC retention is 13 months.
JMO

Sy Ray also acknowledges that while Mr. Gordon wrote this CoA, neither he nor the GLDC was involved with the Timing Advance Records. So, while this may be a GLDC file, the CoA is not referencing records obtained under the GLDC--it's referencing the records from that 22 December 2022 search warrant that Sy Ray says contained the missing records. And ATT&T certified they didn't provide BK's records in response to that warrant because more than 7 days had passed since the desired time frame. Sy Ray doesn't say anywhere in his affidavit he knows that 7 day claim to be untrue.

Exactly.
GLDC or other channel?
An affidavit from Mr. Jackson, the person who was actually involved the early ATRs in this case, would be appropriate.
JMO

He just says he knows it was possible to obtain records and the proof is in the records obtained immediately following the murders.
JMO

SR
c.Law Enforcement also requested a tower dump. consisting of AT&T Timing Advance data. This request involved AT&T providing all of the connections between two specific cell sites in Moscow during a two-hour period. The data produced was AT&T Timing Advance data. In all. there were over 3800 AT&T mobile phones identified in the Timing Advance tower dump data

When LE asked for this tower dump including TAD (within 7 day retention period NOV), LE was able to get them, In 2022.
BKs phone was not in this two hour, two tower data dump.


State
These records were not routinely provided in response to legal demand prior to June 2023. After June 2023, AT&T started providing these records pursuant to legal demand
We know the State got records in 2022.
JMO

SR
a. Two of the victims had AT&T phones. Law Enforcement obtained AT&T Timing data on both of their phones.
b. Law Enforcement developed an early investigative lead in this case. That person had an AT&T phone at the time of the crime. Law Enforcement obtained his AT&T Timing Advance data.

Three 2023 Warrants with 2022 TAR requests.
Would like to see the return on these.

State of Idaho v. Bryan C. Kohberger

JMO

Hard to believe that the State/FBI did not obtain the ATRs of the person they arrested and charged.
Did the State already had BKs ATR reports from some other source?
Maybe it was a "group" decision?
JMO

Did the State or FBI request BKs ATR records in Pullman?
Near Blaine?
In Moscow on any tower?
At any time before or after his arrest?
After June 2023 when records were available to LE?
By any source?
JMO

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/CR01-24-31665/2025/032625+Defendants+Notice+of+Filing+Affidavit+iso+Obj+to+the+States+MIL+RE+ATT+Timing+Advance+Records.pdf

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/CR01-24-31665/2025/032425-States+Reply+to+Defendants+Objection+to+the+States+MIL+RE+ATT+Timing+Advance+Records.pdf

All JMO

 

[Megnut]

By the time LE had BK's NAME, they were unable to get the ATR for November because AT&T hadn't retained it.

LE knew the names of the individuals for whom they pulled ATRs from AT&T.

If LE had somehow pulled BK's ATR in November, AT would be wondering where they got his name.

AT has been trying to create a conspiracy where there is none. AT&T did not, at the time, retain ATRs beyond 7 days.

So ironic really. AT is arguing that the State has withheld evidence they didn't have.

When BK's cellphone is going to sink him anyway.

JMO

 

[Warwick7]

As always, balancing pros and cons.

On the one hand it is a shaky ground because most “weird” killers might have these traits. Dahmer, Keys, our school shooters. Even Oswald, MOO.
Not only this, strange interests and behaviors, like…interest in bodies? So it might be in “the murder suits him” area.

On the other hand, such people might indeed be manipulated by a group.

A tendency to make off-color jokes might be misunderstood by others. Or, OCD tendencies that bothered BK’s family when he got back…but could his family share the same traits and hence, lack the capacity to interpret the behavior in the correct way?

So I would have trouble knowing what to do with it. Could BK, a loner, probably frustrated but having no clue how to approach people, take it on the world, especially on women? For sure.

Could he be a “too convenient” scapegoat? Yes, he could.

A very tough case and a tough line of defense. I would try the angle of being non-local as potentially predisposing to “un-preferential treatment”. Why did they dig through heaven and hell to identify his DNA and yet neglected other male DNAs found in the house that, place-wise, could have had more relevance?

BBM
Is that question rhetorical or are you really asking, I can't tell.

 

[Tutter]

Agree, I once had a sheriff deputy show up at my front front door guided by GPS for a 911 hang up call from my across the road neighbor. Her young grandson who was playing with her phone dialed it. Deputy told me the # and I had it in my phone so I told him where it came from.

I once had a people knock on my door saying they traced their lost iPhone to my house. They were at a mall and the girl somehow lost her phone so they used the find my iPhone. It was a grandma and 2 teenagers, so I wasn’t scared of them, and we had never left the house that day. My dh was out of town. It was weird and I eventually involved the police because they started harassing me. The police didn’t really seem to believe me either because they said the gps was so accurate. Clearly not! This was 2016. I tested the find my phone with my husband’s when he got home and sure enough it said he was across the street from the shopping center he was actually in.

It was quite the experience.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

As always, balancing pros and cons.

On the one hand it is a shaky ground because most “weird” killers might have these traits. Dahmer, Keys, our school shooters. Even Oswald, MOO.
Not only this, strange interests and behaviors, like…interest in bodies? So it might be in “the murder suits him” area.

On the other hand, such people might indeed be manipulated by a group.

A tendency to make off-color jokes might be misunderstood by others. Or, OCD tendencies that bothered BK’s family when he got back…but could his family share the same traits and hence, lack the capacity to interpret the behavior in the correct way?

So I would have trouble knowing what to do with it. Could BK, a loner, probably frustrated but having no clue how to approach people, take it on the world, especially on women? For sure.

Could he be a “too convenient” scapegoat? Yes, he could.

A very tough case and a tough line of defense. I would try the angle of being non-local as potentially predisposing to “un-preferential treatment”. Why did they dig through heaven and hell to identify his DNA and yet neglected other male DNAs found in the house that, place-wise, could have had more relevance?

BBM #1
A scapegoat?
I think not. Not with a detailed timeline of his car and his DNA on a knife sheath under a victim.
So either LE scoured the area looking for an odd-affected, “weird” guy, to pin this on and planted evidence to frame him, or LE is thanking their lucky stars that the DNA that was accidentally transferred to the knife sheath was from an odd-affected, “weird guy, so they could just stop their investigation right then and just pin it on BK since finding the real person who massacred four people isn’t all that important. No.

BBM #2
Please explain where, place-wise, in that house, would it be more relevant to find DNA, than on the knife sheath?

 

[Boxer]

As always, balancing pros and cons.

On the one hand it is a shaky ground because most “weird” killers might have these traits. Dahmer, Keys, our school shooters. Even Oswald, MOO.
Not only this, strange interests and behaviors, like…interest in bodies? So it might be in “the murder suits him” area.

On the other hand, such people might indeed be manipulated by a group.

A tendency to make off-color jokes might be misunderstood by others. Or, OCD tendencies that bothered BK’s family when he got back…but could his family share the same traits and hence, lack the capacity to interpret the behavior in the correct way?

So I would have trouble knowing what to do with it. Could BK, a loner, probably frustrated but having no clue how to approach people, take it on the world, especially on women? For sure.

Could he be a “too convenient” scapegoat? Yes, he could.

A very tough case and a tough line of defense. I would try the angle of being non-local as potentially predisposing to “un-preferential treatment”. Why did they dig through heaven and hell to identify his DNA and yet neglected other male DNAs found in the house that, place-wise, could have had more relevance?

Because the DNA was on the weapon sheath. That is why it is and was priority.

 

[Boxer]

I once had a people knock on my door saying they traced their lost iPhone to my house. They were at a mall and the girl somehow lost her phone so they used the find my iPhone. It was a grandma and 2 teenagers, so I wasn’t scared of them, and we had never left the house that day. My dh was out of town. It was weird and I eventually involved the police because they started harassing me. The police didn’t really seem to believe me either because they said the gps was so accurate. Clearly not! This was 2016. I tested the find my phone with my husband’s when he got home and sure enough it said he was across the street from the shopping center he was actually in.

It was quite the experience.

FMiP is not totally precise even now. Still useful to get close.
Some girls came by same thing lost a phone the night before in an Uber. They saw the Uber car found the driver's house, but the gos was a little off. 40 ft or so.

 

[MassGuy]

As always, balancing pros and cons.

On the one hand it is a shaky ground because most “weird” killers might have these traits. Dahmer, Keys, our school shooters. Even Oswald, MOO.
Not only this, strange interests and behaviors, like…interest in bodies? So it might be in “the murder suits him” area.

On the other hand, such people might indeed be manipulated by a group.

A tendency to make off-color jokes might be misunderstood by others. Or, OCD tendencies that bothered BK’s family when he got back…but could his family share the same traits and hence, lack the capacity to interpret the behavior in the correct way?

So I would have trouble knowing what to do with it. Could BK, a loner, probably frustrated but having no clue how to approach people, take it on the world, especially on women? For sure.

Could he be a “too convenient” scapegoat? Yes, he could.

A very tough case and a tough line of defense. I would try the angle of being non-local as potentially predisposing to “un-preferential treatment”. Why did they dig through heaven and hell to identify his DNA and yet neglected other male DNAs found in the house that, place-wise, could have had more relevance?

Focusing on this:

Could he be a “too convenient” scapegoat? Yes, he could.

A very tough case and a tough line of defense. I would try the angle of being non-local as potentially predisposing to “un-preferential treatment”. Why did they dig through heaven and hell to identify his DNA and yet neglected other male DNAs found in the house that, place-wise, could have had more relevance?

You have a sheath found at the scene of a stabbing, and no foreign blood found in the immediate crime scenes (bedrooms). That sheath absolutely becomes your best piece of evidence, and the most probable DNA link to the killer. The FBI had no way of knowing who that DNA belonged to before they completed the family tree. Upon receiving that name, law enforcement discovered that absolutely everything fit, from the white Hyundai, to the movements of that car, to the phone being powered down, etc.

If they believed for a second that other DNA was relevant, they would have chased it as hard as they chased the sheath DNA. We still don't know the extent of their investigation into that DNA; all we have is defense claims. What we do know, is that the defense recently reveled in a filing that they now know exactly what was done with that DNA.

You have a blood spot on a railing in an area of the house the killer did not go. It has no corresponding blood, like it should if the killer cut himself. You have a glove outside that has the same issue, and if it had a cut in it the defense absolutely would have mentioned this in their Frank's efforts.

I'm sure the prosecution has ensured this angle will be closed to the defense; we see that all the time come trial.