4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #97

[schooling]

While prosecutors don’t legally have a responsibility to victims and their families. IMO there are a few ethical guidelines/rule/guidance spelled out in the ABA manual. And whatever it is I remember it not being detailed enough. MOO

Not implying the prosecutors owe anything to the families or victims (BF and DM). Just adding to the convo.

Again MOO going of complete memory.

 

[NCWatcher]

While prosecutors don’t legally have a responsibility to victims and their families. IMO there are a few ethical guidelines/rule/guidance spelled out in the ABA manual. And whatever it is I remember it not being detailed enough. MOO

Not implying the prosecutors owe anything to the families or victims (BF and DM). Just adding to the convo.

Again MOO going of complete memory.

Although I cannot find that information in a quick Google, I don't doubt that's probably all true. But here are some selected standards from the ABA that seem relevant to the question to me. (Italics added)

Standard 3-1.2 Functions and Duties of the Prosecutor
b) The primary duty of the prosecutor is to seek justice within the bounds of the law, not merely to convict. The prosecutor serves the public interest and should act with integrity and balanced judgment to increase public safety both by pursuing appropriate criminal charges of appropriate severity, and by exercising discretion to not pursue criminal charges in appropriate circumstances. The prosecutor should seek to protect the innocent and convict the guilty, consider the interests of victims and witnesses, and respect the constitutional and legal rights of all persons, including suspects and defendants.

Standard 3-1.3 The Client of the Prosecutor
The prosecutor generally serves the public and not any particular government agency, law enforcement officer or unit, witness or victim. When investigating or prosecuting a criminal matter, the prosecutor does not represent law enforcement personnel who have worked on the matter and such law enforcement personnel are not the prosecutor’s clients. The public’s interests and views should be determined by the chief prosecutor and designated assistants in the jurisdiction.

https://www.americanbar.org/groups/criminal_justice/resources/standards/prosecution-function/

 

[Sundog]

dbm

 

[Sundog]

dbm

whoops, wrong thread.

 

[minazoe]

look, BK's DNA is on the snap because he opened that snap to remove the knife. end of story. mOO

 

[PinkParis2052]

Thanks @Nila Aella , I'd forgotten about that quote from AT! So I guess post-crime contamination of the sheath ls definitely still on the table for the Defense. The only option they've never brought up is pre-crime transfer.
It's very interesting to me because IMO this would imply that, in spite of the warrants, there is no actual record of BK purchasing a Kbar knife. If there was, the defense would not be able to argue any form of post-crime contamination at all. They'd be stuck with, yes that was his knife but he gave it to someone/it was stolen, which they've never hinted at.
@schooling I didn't follow Delphi, so can't really compare, but IMO the DNA is absolutely critical for the Prosecution in the Idaho 4 case. If that somehow is either excluded or successfully argued against in court, the case against BK becomes much more tenuous and circumstantial. However I don't see this particular MTS being successful unless there's a major wrongdoing the defense has uncovered which we haven't been privy to.

I can't find a MSM version of the November 2 2023 hearing we were discussing with @PinkParis2052 but at one point when they're discussing giving the Defense a log of the things the judge will see in camera, AT mentions one of the things she wants to check is that "the FBI complied with the requirements of Myfamilytree".
I'm pretty sure she must have misspoke and was referring to FamilyTreeDNA? Could this be the genealogy site BK would have used when he did his own DNA ancestry test?

in reference to the bold text, this is my first time hearing that during that hearing. That's very interesting.

There was one article that I found that was one day before the hearing and there is a few articles after the hearing but not many. Very few people attended this hearing apparently according to I think it was Brian Entin on "X".

There is this article that is based on the article in the Idaho Statesman (which was posted on Nov. 9, 2023) that was posted by East Idaho News.

FBI’s DNA records set to be turned over for judge’s review in U of I murder case - East Idaho News

Judge John Judge of Idaho’s 2nd Judicial District set a deadline of Dec. 1 for prosecutors in the case to retrieve and submit DNA records from the FBI.

www.eastidahonews.com

AT wanted the court to keep a list (which is called a privilege list or log) of everything that court received from the prosecution when they collected everything from the FBI and from the Private Lab (AT called the Private Lab - Othram and BT would only refer to them as the Private Lab).

What I thought was interesting was that BT said that Defense team was looking for items in IGG that don't exist and the experts for the Prosecution have told them that. AT said that they were only looking for things that their 2 Genealogists have mentioned to them and things that were listed in the DOJ interim guidelines 2019 document which AT included a copy of it in her third Motion to Compel document filed in court. In the DOJ interim Guidelines 2019, there are certain things that should be saved by the prosecution when someone is charged and there is going to be a trial. There is a public defender on YouTube when the prosecution filed a request for a protective order and the defense filed their objection to it, when she went over both of those documents, she said that the prosecution is going to have to turn over the IGG information to the defense and that was in June 2023 before the Aug 2023 hearings took place and before JJJ granted the defense's request for the IGG information at the end of Oct. 2023.

All IMO.

 

[Balthazar]

look, BK's DNA is on the snap because he opened that snap to remove the knife. end of story. mOO

I think a lot depends on where the DNA was found. If it was found on top of the button of the snap, then it probably wouldn't be there because he opened it. I mean, do you put your finger on the button of a snap to open it? We don't know yet, for certain, exactly where the DNA was found. Some people here claimed it was inside the grooves of the snap, but there is no proof of that at this point. Howard Blum wrote it was "on the Button snap" in his book.

 

[TallCoolOne]

I think a lot depends on where the DNA was found. If it was found on top of the button of the snap, then it probably wouldn't be there because he opened it. I mean, do you put your finger on the button of a snap to open it? We don't know yet, for certain, exactly where the DNA was found. Some people here claimed it was inside the grooves of the snap, but there is no proof of that at this point. Howard Blum wrote it was "on the Button snap" in his book.

Unless he had previously opened it to inspect the knife and then closed it. Just because someone wiped an Item to remove their prints/DNA doesn't necessarily mean they got everything.

 

[sds71]

.

 

[Gemmie]

I think a lot depends on where the DNA was found. If it was found on top of the button of the snap, then it probably wouldn't be there because he opened it. I mean, do you put your finger on the button of a snap to open it? We don't know yet, for certain, exactly where the DNA was found. Some people here claimed it was inside the grooves of the snap, but there is no proof of that at this point. Howard Blum wrote it was "on the Button snap" in his book.

I could have sworn the DNA was found in the snap groove (which would indicate to me that someone tried to clean the snap itself for it not to be on it, but rather in the groove). Am I misremembering? I've seen lots of conversation in the BK threads when doing a search of this forum for the word groove.

As for what Howard Blum "knows"... NM. I'm not going to go there. lol

 

[StarryStarryNight]

I think a lot depends on where the DNA was found. If it was found on top of the button of the snap, then it probably wouldn't be there because he opened it. I mean, do you put your finger on the button of a snap to open it? We don't know yet, for certain, exactly where the DNA was found. Some people here claimed it was inside the grooves of the snap, but there is no proof of that at this point. Howard Blum wrote it was "on the Button snap" in his book.

Well it shouldn’t be there at all. Not if BK is innocent.
Shouldn’t be on the top of the snap, the grooves of the snap, or anywhere on that snap, the sheath or really anything or anywhere in that house.
So, it does matter where it was found. It was found in the victims’ house. A place it should not be.

 

[whiterhino]

I could have sworn the DNA was found in the snap groove (which would indicate to me that someone tried to clean the snap itself for it not to be on it, but rather in the groove). Am I misremembering? I've seen lots of conversation in the BK threads when doing a search of this forum for the word groove.

As for what Howard Blum "knows"... NM. I'm not going to go there. lol

You're not misremembering! The words I distinctly recall were "single source DNA" and "use point of knife sheath" (use point being the snap & single source meaning only one contributor of the dna).

IIRC it was the grooves on the metal snap closure of the knife sheath.

@StarryStarryNight Yes. BK isn't claiming the knife sheath as his property yet it was positive for BKs DNA. It also wouldn't really matter what evidence LE found containing traces of BKs DNA, BK himself cannot explain any item/object/DNA presence in the house.

Having said that, if LE had found something less incriminating/suggestive such as a pen or a lighter I have to wonder if that would've changed anyone's story. JMO.

 

[Boxer]

Well it shouldn’t be there at all. Not if BK is innocent.
Shouldn’t be on the top of the snap, the grooves of the snap, or anywhere on that snap, the sheath or really anything or anywhere in that house.
So, it does matter where it was found. It was found in the victims’ house. A place it should not be.

Exactly. At the crime scene.
AT is bending, twisting, heaving, crying, huffing etc. "Out damn DNA out."

 

[Reporter-C.Lin]

Exactly. At the crime scene.
AT is bending, twisting, heaving, crying, huffing etc. "Out damn DNA out."

Regarding the defense's tactics:
I've lived in Idaho and worked with law enforcement there during and after this murder (I just recently moved away). I can tell you the defense lawyer's so-called research done by people who don't live in Idaho on why the trial needs to be moved to Ada County because how Latah County jury pool cannot be fair while Ada County has less knowledge about this case is complete BS.
Some of these TV personalities from cable news channels agreeing with this change of venues, but I would advise not to listen to them. They also frequently bash Moscow PD and Latah County's prosecution and whine about not being able to milk more out of this case. In my opinion, they are the ignorant ones. Just know they are more like ambulance chasers. B*** E*** from a smaller cable news channel goes around the country and shows up on cases, as if he really knows everything from the start. He was in Idaho for another trial and I even saw him in person. I later moved away and then I saw him again in another case in Philadelphia. I work in the trade and I want to say, take what the cable news talk show programs tell you with a grain of salt, especially someone who flies around and shows up for all kinds of trials.

But I guess if the defense doesn't try all the tricks known to lawyers, and Kohberger gets convicted, then that opens up the possibility of claiming inadequate defense argument and appeal

 

[whiterhino]

Exactly. At the crime scene.
AT is bending, twisting, heaving, crying, huffing etc. "Out damn DNA out."

Indeed! RBBM as an aside, I do miss @10ofRods input lately...

 

[pittsburghgirl]

Well it shouldn’t be there at all. Not if BK is innocent.
Shouldn’t be on the top of the snap, the grooves of the snap, or anywhere on that snap, the sheath or really anything or anywhere in that house.
So, it does matter where it was found. It was found in the victims’ house. A place it should not be.

People forget that in dreaming up problematic scenarios. He brought an object in the house that was found under the body of one of the victims. How do we know it was his? His DNA is on it. That puts him at the crime scene.

 

[NottaYutz]

Whoa. Interesting development.

Bryan Kohberger investigated over nearby home invasion year before alleged slayings of 4 University of Idaho students

Officials are now saying Bryan Kohberger, the suspect charged in the quadruple homicide of four Moscow, Idaho students, was investigated in connection with a home invasion that took place before th…

nypost.com

 

[iamshadow21]

Whoa. Interesting development.

Bryan Kohberger investigated over nearby home invasion year before alleged slayings of 4 University of Idaho students

Officials are now saying Bryan Kohberger, the suspect charged in the quadruple homicide of four Moscow, Idaho students, was investigated in connection with a home invasion that took place before th…

nypost.com

Whole lot of nothing, IMO, he was the other side of the country when this happened, and does not match the physical description.

 

[xjd11]

Whole lot of nothing, IMO, he was the other side of the country when this happened, and does not match the physical description.

wonder if the defense "leaked" this to throw doubt about a different perp in the area

 

[Tarik]

Have they established a motive for the murders yet?