4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #99

[NCWatcher]

What was normal for you in grad school doesn't necessarily make it normal for all grad students all over America. Jmo

Moo, I suppose he may have been planning to go back assuming other events didn't intervene in the interim, ie such as his arrest. Though I'd speculate he would have been pretty paranoid at this point, not to mention the issues he was having with his professor. Really there's not a lot to incentivise going back. Imo he more likely would have withdrawn or suspended his studies.

One thing, I don't believe he would have planned to take his Elantra back there. I guess he would also have to break it to his folks about losing his TA position. If the position was tied to subsidised accommodation at steptoe he would need to find an alternate apt and probably get his folks to help fund that and find a new job. Not saying accommodation was tied to his TA position, IDK. But a legitimate question would arise about being able to afford it imo.

So he knew he'd lost his TA even if folks didn't (ditto for having committed the crime jmo); he could have cleared out apt of most of his meagre student belongings and left the fire stick and tv as a token to his dad. To create a temporary impression of intending to return. Speculation.

No, what was normal behavior for students in my fairly large east coast grad program doesn't mean all grad students are like the ones I knew. But I thought I made it clear I was voicing an opinion-- and opinions are very often based on personal experience. Certainly the post I was responding to contained that poster's opinions about what any grad student should be expected to do during a school break.

Frankly it seems to me that we are tending to view just about anything BK did as pathological no matter how many other people may routinely do the same things (like driving instead of flying home for winter break or failing to leave electronics in an apartment that would be empty for weeks.) And yes, that's an opinion too.
MOO

 

[Megnut]

.

Driving cross country also attracts much less attention than walking around a giant building with security cameras everywhere as well as dealing face to face with TSA agents. He didn’t want the car left behind, out of his site. He also may have still been in possession of the KA-Bar, opting to try & get rid of it somewhere between Pullman & Albrightsville rather than obvious places near where he was known to frequent. Lots of rivers & garbage cans/dumpsters between WA & PA. Likely one within feet of every gas pump or around rest areas at which they stopped.

MOO

And when he was stopped by LE, twice no less, I expect there was some conversation between BK and his dad that sounded something like this:

BK's father to BK: let me do the talking.

Not because he thought BK was guilty of something but a practiced response to 1. keep BK from coming across badly and 2. keep BK from coming across badly.

Yes, one and the same. I speculate that it had been their job for years -- trying to keep BK from coming across badly.

They just had no idea how very very very badly he was coming across all on his own.

JMO

 

[Bahshudc]

Bryan Kohberger’s sister feared he was involved in Idaho murders

Sources told NBC’s Dateline that the accused killer’s family searched his white Hyundai Elantra for possible evidence of the Idaho college murders

www.independent.co.uk

Sorry to circle back — I remember a few days ago somebody was wondering if BK had shown previous behaviour of wearing gloves around the house etc. or if this was due to paranoia. I think there was mention of OCD? IIRC.

I was doing a bit of research and found this old article which states:

“But, during his time at home, his family members noticed that he was behaving somewhat bizarrely.
The source said that Mr Kohberger was constantly wearing latex gloves, including inside their own home.”

Thought this might be interesting as the implication is that he did not normally wear gloves around the house.

MOO and my own interpretation

 

[Balthazar]

snipped by me for brevity and focus:

IMO with little to no doubt, BK was a person of interest by Moscow, PD late November/early December. If WSU id'd the white elantra Nov 29, they must have communicated with Moscow PD shortly thereafter. IMO The white sedan: How police found the man accused of slaying four Idaho students

From the hearing last week, we now know that BK's name was not known to LE until around Dec. 20, 2022. MPD had never heard of him and his name came to them via the FBI. See what AT says at 6-18-59 here:

JMO

 

[jepop]

Why would the neighbor make this up especially knowing that revealing this kind of information could cause him to be called as a witness in this case? JMO.

Well if you really want to get into the nitty gritty of it, the neighbour never said that BK told him that he gave a sample of his DnA to an IGG company who then uploaded an snp profile to their data base. The neighbour just said that BK said he had some sort of DnA test. Hardly worth a court subpoena imo, and for what purpose on earth anyway? If BK submitted a profile ( he didn't according to hearings) he can just tell AT, unless he's been struck dumb and we haven't heard. No need for the neighbour. Jmo.

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

Bryan Kohberger’s sister feared he was involved in Idaho murders

Sources told NBC’s Dateline that the accused killer’s family searched his white Hyundai Elantra for possible evidence of the Idaho college murders

www.independent.co.uk

Sorry to circle back — I remember a few days ago somebody was wondering if BK had shown previous behaviour of wearing gloves around the house etc. or if this was due to paranoia. I think there was mention of OCD? IIRC.

I was doing a bit of research and found this old article which states:

“But, during his time at home, his family members noticed that he was behaving somewhat bizarrely.
The source said that Mr Kohberger was constantly wearing latex gloves, including inside their own home.”

Thought this might be interesting as the implication is that he did not normally wear gloves around the house.

MOO and my own interpretation

Thank you for sharing that reminder @Bahshudc …. the May 24, 2023 Independent UK online article by Rachel Sharp entitled ‘Bryan Kohberger’s sister searched his car for evidence before police swooped in’.

And there is also IMO an interesting note in that article regarding his sister. And it bears repeating so your timing is great.

From the article: “Bryan Kohberger’s sister feared that her brother was involved in the stabbings of four University of Idaho students before police swooped on their parents’ home and arrested him for murder, according to a bombshell report.”

I wonder if she will be called to testify? And for whom, the prosecution, defense, or both? MOO

 

[mrjitty]

Well if you really want to get into the nitty gritty of it, the neighbour never said that BK told him that he gave a sample of his DnA to an IGG company who then uploaded an snp profile to their data base. The neighbour just said that BK said he had some sort of DnA test. Hardly worth a court subpoena imo, and for what purpose on earth anyway? If BK submitted a profile ( he didn't according to hearings) he can just tell AT, unless he's been struck dumb and we haven't heard. No need for the neighbour. Jmo.

This kind of hearsay evidence would not be allowed versus the primary source.

As you say, BK can just tell AT, who can subpoena the company and get the primary evidence of the same.

Said witness is not able to testify to the truth of the content of the statement.

MOO

 

[jepop]

No, what was normal behavior for students in my fairly large east coast grad program doesn't mean all grad students are like the ones I knew. But I thought I made it clear I was voicing an opinion-- and opinions are very often based on personal experience. Certainly the post I was responding to contained that poster's opinions about what any grad student should be expected to do during a school break.

Frankly it seems to me that we are tending to view just about anything BK did as pathological no matter how many other people may routinely do the same things (like driving instead of flying home for winter break or failing to leave electronics in an apartment that would be empty for weeks.) And yes, that's an opinion too.
MOO

I don't see posts on this topic characterising BK's actions as pathological? I'm simply speculating intentions BK may have had, given certain circumstances, such as having committed murder, lost his TA, no job and issues with professor. Whilst I agree it's pathological to commit murder, I am positing reasonable and rational intentions and decisions for someone in BK's circumstances. Your opinion seems to assume BK had nothing to hide and his actions were more likely just 'normal'. Jmo.

 

[Arkay]

It doesn't strike me as odd BK would 1) go home for the long winter break 2) want a companion for the very long drive to the west coast and then back home to the east coast 3) want to have his car once he got to his parents' home for the extended break

IMO it would be beastly of BK, if he wanted a “companion” for the very long drive, to have his old father have to drive cross-country ALONE to go get him. No companion for dad all the way there.

All MOO

Well the defense has asked what 22 or 23 times now for the DNA discovery and the prosecution just keeps ignoring the request. So AT definitely is interested in seeing how they came to the conclusion it's BK's DNA. The longer they go without showing the more it makes me think they may have manipulated it to match BK's DNA.

That's just my opinion.

Um…not grasping this. Wouldn’t they first need BK’s DNA identified sample in order to “manipulate and match” the snap DNA to Bryan?

And they’d have BK’s DNA in order to nefariously replicate it, how?

Seems to me he’d first have to have left a sample of his DNA somewhere for it to be found and then “matched.”

Oh, wait a minute…he did. On the snap of the housing of the murder weapon.

IMO

 

[NCWatcher]

IMO it would be beastly of BK, if he wanted a “companion” for the very long drive, to have his old father have to drive cross-country ALONE to go get him. No companion for dad all the way there.


Um…not grasping this. Wouldn’t they first need BK’s DNA identified sample in order to “manipulate and match” the snap DNA to Bryan?

And they’d have BK’s DNA in order to nefariously replicate it, how?

Seems to me he’d first have to have left a sample of his DNA somewhere for it to be found and then “matched.”

Oh, wait a minute…he did. On the snap of the housing of the murder weapon.

IMO

I agree having the father drive alone wouldn't make sense. But that's not what happened. From what's been reported, the father flew out. And we don't know whether having a companion on the trip back to PA was the father's idea or BK's.
MOO

 

[schooling]

All MOO

Well the defense has asked what 22 or 23 times now for the DNA discovery and the prosecution just keeps ignoring the request. So AT definitely is interested in seeing how they came to the conclusion it's BK's DNA. The longer they go without showing the more it makes me think they may have manipulated it to match BK's DNA.

That's just my opinion.

You're conflating things. There's the "5 quintillion to one DNA" and there's the DNA profile for the familial IGG.

There's no question that the 5 quintillion to one DNA is BKs. It went from the crime scene to a local lab where they pulled the profile and then directly into CODIS. That CODIS sample hit when they arrested BK. The chain of custody is crystal clear. No amount of pondering about of handwringing about the IGG is going to change those facts. JMO.

MOO

 

[schooling]

IMO it would be beastly of BK, if he wanted a “companion” for the very long drive, to have his old father have to drive cross-country ALONE to go get him. No companion for dad all the way there.


Um…not grasping this. Wouldn’t they first need BK’s DNA identified sample in order to “manipulate and match” the snap DNA to Bryan?

And they’d have BK’s DNA in order to nefariously replicate it, how?

Seems to me he’d first have to have left a sample of his DNA somewhere for it to be found and then “matched.”

Oh, wait a minute…he did. On the snap of the housing of the murder weapon.

IMO

This is where the "reasonable" in reasonable doubt comes in, IMO.

Is it more reasonable that BK turned off his cell phone and got caught on video taking his car to a quarduple murder scene and touched the button to pull out the knife and lost the sheath in the struggle?

Or is it more reasonable to think that theirs a secret plot out to frame him. The FBI, state police in three states, Moscow PD , labs, witnesses, prosecutors, 100s of people have ALL have entered into a gigantic conspiracy filled with car videos and cell phone records and DNA and they are all keeping the secret to set this guy from the poconos up?

IMO jurors will stop at the former and not even consider the laughable latter.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

Bryan Kohberger’s sister feared he was involved in Idaho murders

Sources told NBC’s Dateline that the accused killer’s family searched his white Hyundai Elantra for possible evidence of the Idaho college murders

www.independent.co.uk

Sorry to circle back — I remember a few days ago somebody was wondering if BK had shown previous behaviour of wearing gloves around the house etc. or if this was due to paranoia. I think there was mention of OCD? IIRC.

I was doing a bit of research and found this old article which states:

“But, during his time at home, his family members noticed that he was behaving somewhat bizarrely.
The source said that Mr Kohberger was constantly wearing latex gloves, including inside their own home.”

Thought this might be interesting as the implication is that he did not normally wear gloves around the house.

MOO and my own interpretation

An important observation in my book.
This destroys the implication that BK’s odd behavior in PA was caused by OCD or some other disorder that was pervasive and had been persistent throughout his life.
BK’s odd behavior was an attempt to diminish the chances of LE getting a sample of his DNA because BK knew he had probably left some of his behind at the crime scene. Consciousness of guilt.

Opinion

 

[LinasK]

Makes absolutely no sense to me why Dad would fly one way and drive all those grueling miles back instead of BK just hopping a plane. It wasn't because it would have been cheaper after Dad's ticket, hotels, gas, meals, etc. BK was a 28 year old grown man, not a 19 yo college freshman.

I said in the beginning, he was feeling the heat due to leaving the sheath at the scene and then the car ID alert. He wasn't going to return to WSU, especially after his TA position was terminated as well.

A carry on bag and a backpack with his laptop and phone would have held all he needed to get through the Winter Break, he was going to be at home where he would have had access to anything else he needed. He had almost entirely all of his possessions in the car. It's simply not logical. <shrug>

JMO

BBM. You actually answered your own question. It is logical when you realize he had too much stuff to fly back with. My daughter went to college 650 miles from home in another state. Sometimes we fly back and forth, sometimes we drive- depending on cost, amount of stuff, weather...And you have to have good stamina/health to be able to drive hundreds of miles by yourself.

 

[LinasK]

Many students who go home for a month or longer take their vehicles with them. They need transportation at home and many families don't have multiple cars.

This is probably the most normal thing about this whole thing.

MOO

Also so that an abandoned car won't get broken into, and there's the matter of leaving it in snow/rain.

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

Also so that an abandoned car won't get broken into, and there's the matter of leaving it in snow/rain.

Yes @LinasK …. and in this case, it seems that BK may have had additional incentive to leave the area and with and in that white Hyundai Elantra vehicle. And I can’t recall exact timing, but there was also the matter of information relating to a biological profile having been found on the knife sheath’s snap. Wonder what he and his father talked about during the drive……. and in between the stops by police. MOO

 

[INfisherman]

.

And when he was stopped by LE, twice no less, I expect there was some conversation between BK and his dad that sounded something like this:

BK's father to BK: let me do the talking.

Not because he thought BK was guilty of something but a practiced response to 1. keep BK from coming across badly and 2. keep BK from coming across badly.

Yes, one and the same. I speculate that it had been their job for years -- trying to keep BK from coming across badly.

They just had no idea how very very very badly he was coming across all on his own.

JMO

Very likely. I imagine BK had no issues with that because the last thing he wanted was someone potentially going through his baggage or belongings, which is quite a common occurrence on the busier highway shoulders around here like I-70 & I-65 (major drug mule routes), should he run into a testy officer or one thinking he smelled an odd odor coming from the vehicle, etc., etc..

Had it not worked out like it did, with dad doing the talking, we can probably imagine he likely would have been just dying to ask what was the legal distance allowed, likely followed by asking how close he was actually following. I would also speculate he would inform the officer he was from PA & then proceed to explain how things are done there. Just like he did in when pulled over in WA for pulling out into an intersection too soon.

Maybe dad knew BK had been confrontational, stand-offish or asking too many questions during traffic stops in the past which increased the likelihood of a citation or more.

JMO

 

[INfisherman]

Wonder what he and his father talked about during the drive……. and in between the stops by police. MOO

RSBM

How much heat to expect…due to the weather, I’m sure.

MOO

 

[Balthazar]

Well if you really want to get into the nitty gritty of it, the neighbour never said that BK told him that he gave a sample of his DnA to an IGG company who then uploaded an snp profile to their data base. The neighbour just said that BK said he had some sort of DnA test. Hardly worth a court subpoena imo, and for what purpose on earth anyway? If BK submitted a profile ( he didn't according to hearings) he can just tell AT, unless he's been struck dumb and we haven't heard. No need for the neighbour. Jmo.

The conversation between BK and the neighbor was about ancestry, not a medical problem, paternity, immigration or any of the other reasons BK might have taken a DNA test. If BK did a DNA test and discussed it during a conversation on ancestry in which he told the neighbor he is of German ancestry, the DNA test must have been about ancestry. If it had been a medical DNA test, then the conversation would have been about whatever disease or medical family history he was being tested for.

AT evaded answering whether or not BK had submitted a profile when Judge Hippler asked her if she was saying that the FBI got into BK's DNA profile on the non-LE side of a DNA database at the last hearing. I think she is saving that information for the Franks hearing.

"Kohberger, who was a student in the university’s criminology department, asked whether the neighbor could identify his ancestral background, which the man guessed was Italy, the student told the paper.

But Kohberger responded that he was actually of German descent.

“He talked about his ancestors. He had some sort of DNA test. I don’t know how he got to that point. … It was just interesting to him,” the neighbor told the Statesman."
...
"Meanwhile, the neighbor also revealed that Moscow detectives contacted him after they found his cellphone number in Kohberger’s phone. "

Idaho suspect Bryan Kohberger sent DNA for genetic testing to explore ancestry: neighbor

Bryan Kohberger told a fellow grad student that he explored his ancestry by submitting DNA for genetic testing – which could shed light on how investigators used forensic genealogy to zero in on th…

nypost.com

 

[MassGuy]

Very likely. I imagine BK had no issues with that because the last thing he wanted was someone potentially going through his baggage or belongings, which is quite a common occurrence on the busier highway shoulders around here like I-70 & I-65 (major drug mule routes), should he run into a testy officer or one thinking he smelled an odd odor coming from the vehicle, etc., etc..

Had it not worked out like it did, with dad doing the talking, we can probably imagine he likely would have been just dying to ask what was the legal distance allowed, likely followed by asking how close he was actually following. I would also speculate he would inform the officer he was from PA & then proceed to explain how things are done there. Just like he did in when pulled over in WA for pulling out into an intersection too soon.

Maybe dad knew BK had been confrontational, stand-offish or asking too many questions during traffic stops in the past which increased the likelihood of a citation or more.

JMO

I don't know what the hell it is, but these killers tend to have horrible driving records. I guess it goes to impulsivity and disregard for authority.