NV NV - Steven Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - #22

[bessie]

Please continue here.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/7...ing-Utahn.html


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[cocomod]

Thanks Bessie!

I am still here following for Steven. I am saddened that NOTHING has come to light about his disappearance. I do NOT believe it was voluntary.

 

[carbuff]

Thanks, Bessie.

Still thinking of Steven.

 

[Krimi]

I looked at the video of SK parking his car in the cul de sac. A white SUV was following him, whether deliberately or not. As SK walks down the block and turns to the left the SUV appears to be tailing him, take a look on You Tube. Thoughts ? The SUV was supposedly being operated by a real estate agent who claimed she never saw SK or his car (according to what I've read). Likely ?

 

[Sin City]

The white SUV was discussed in depth throughout this thread. There is additional video showing the woman driving the SUV picking up her Mother, and then later dropping her off. The white SUV isn't involved.

 

[Krimi]

<modsnip> His reasons for quitting his job (having to work late) when he was single and no children, moving to an out of the way, depressed town, close to LV and subsequent actions logically point to moving into a new lifestyle. The Henderson episode was probably meeting an older (modsnip). Look for SK in the Gay community, gay mecca's, etc. (modsnip) Case closed.

 

[loogielv]

I must chime in.* I am a native Las Vegasican... Vegican... Vegetarian?

Just trying to lighten the mood... I feel very strangely connected to Steven.* You see, i see his actions prior to disappearing,* and i see myself,* almost at the exact same time period.
I was terribly, hopelessly addicted to oxy.* I nearly lost my family.* I literally have been to every single place his phone pinged on that fateful day,* numerous times.* All to score oxy.

I really believe i can shed light on what happened,* simply because his behavior is not in anyway erratic to me.
Actually,* i don't think he was addicted to pills at all.* I have no doubt in my mind he was on pills though.

So, let me start off by saying,* i know nothing of this case beyond the timeline provided.* The timeline does not in anyway give text messages,* or times he tried to check his vm.* It doesn't say if he used his phone,* or it just grabbed a location as he was passing by. Actually,* i am not even sure if those final locations are specific to his phone,* or just where the cell tower is.

Anyway,* i have extensive experience in door to door sales in Vegas,* and handing out flyers for promotional purposes.

On a side note,* those that don't think flyers,* or door knocking works, you could NOT be more wrong.*
Direct door sales account for nearly 90% of all new customers,* and i don't mean for THs little window washing thing.* I am talking Fortune 500 companies.* Global companies.
Sparklettes,* Century Link,* Cox, Time Warner,* Terminix. If i told you how much i used to make,* you simply would not believe it.

Moving on.* I have two theories,* that i am honestly shocked have NEVER been shared.* What's more,* is i would bet my life one of them is dead on the money what happened to Steven.
Sadly,* they do not end well for him.

Btw,* the Sinaloa Cartel nonsense earlier in these threads is complete and utter nonsense.** I have no doubt the person was ordering drugs from "the company" as we call it,* but they had no knowledge of the stash house,* and no leader showed up,* in a truck,* to deliver drugs to a house.* It simply does not work that way.*
You meet them,* at a crowded place,* YOU GET INTO THEIR CAR,* which is ALWAYS a nice 4 door,* sometimes with the back door handles completely missing so nobody can jump in the back. Then you tell them what you want.
They do not ask on the phone,* and they damn sure are not walking up to an unknown residence where they can get robbed...or..well disappear, like Steven. And forgetting to get money? It's ridiculous.

Steven had NOTHING to do with any Cartel.* Nothing.

Further, the whole "sneaking off to be gay" thing is downright laughable. Maybe 4 years and 9 months ago, but it's 2015. Steven is not maintaining radio silence from his family, including the death of his father, because he likes men.

In fact, this theory should be insulting to gay people everywhere. I won't deny he may have been sorting through some stuff, and he may even have gone to sca to experiment with an older, gay man.

But he is not willingly hiding because of it.


Stevens problems started way back at home.* Not Vegas.

I will make separate posts to distinguish between theories, and to avoid an absolute travesty wall of text.

 

[loogielv]

No idea where all those asterisks came from... Or why this EDIT actually posted as a reply.
Sorry

 

[loogielv]

OK,* so let's get away from drugs for a second.* Let's assume for some reason only God knows, Steven drove 1100 miles for grits and shins, without telling anyone,* and then drove to Vegas,* without telling anyone... Even though it was completely innocent...with ZERO trail.
If we can believe this,* i can sell you some great swamp land,* but also that would mean Steven had no second phone,* as it was totally innocent right? No need to carry a burner if you're everything (and nothing more) your family insists,* even 5 years later.

Perhaps,* because Steven had passed out flyers before,* he happened to be in Vegas... Ran into someone who he happened to talk to,* who offered him a job passing flyers in Vegas.* Steven would not blow off church for this, or he would have already blown it off for TH and been passing them out in his home town.

Since he is in Vegas,* with no cell activity pointing to Vegas,* we have to assume he blew off church because he needed to just get away,* and happened upon someone willing to pay him to pass out flyers. Purely chance with no electronic trail.

This person had to have said to meet them at their house at noon,* and they would go pass out flyers in their vehicle.

This explains the neighborhood,* and the phone activity afterwards.** Assuming we can't prove if the phone was off between the pings,* we can assume it was on.* And since there is not a lot of movement,* we can assume,* Steven only moved areas when the pings moved.

The most telling aspect though, is every single ping is literally smack dab in the middle of huge apartment complexes.*

The perfect place to hand out flyers.

I am painfully familiar with every single place that phone pinged,* and EVERY ONE is an apartment complex.
Now unless this is merely where the tower is,* we can assume the phone was triangulated,* and the coordinates are specific.

This tells me Steven rode from complex to complex,* in someone's car,* working until that evening. I can confirm this is extremely normal for this type of work.* It's EXACTLY how my phone would look.* And when I've worked these apartments,* and i have worked them a lot,* i basically worked the same route.* I would work the 4 complexes on Whitney Ranch,* then it's just a 5 min drive to Arroyo Grande and the most ghetto apartments you ever saw. Then straight up warm springs.*
I have made this trip many times,* and so has this unknown employer.

Since he blew off church,* we can assume he meant to blow off his appointment that night.* So that would mean he was still working until 7ish,* when the phone started up towards the M casino,* which is surrounded by huge desert areas.*
The employer decided he didn't want to pay,* or Steven was too innocent and cute to pass up,* and murdered him.
The voice mail checks, if we had the times,* are perfect indicators of his demise.
If Steven was answering texts and using the phone,* then stopped,* between then and the next vm check is when he was killed,* which will also tell us where,* roughly,* his body is.

My theory is Steven was too busy to answer texts,* was killed,* and the killer had to know if anyone was looking for him. So he checked the vm numerous times,* stayed the night somewhere else, probably a gf,* checked it again in the morning,* threw it out the window on his way back home.*

Or while handing out flyers, Steven knocked on the wrong door,* was killed,* and the employer had no idea,* as he was knocking elsewhere.* He assumed Steven didn't like it, and walked away, and never thought of him again.*
This actually happens a lot.* I have been training people in door sales,* and had them tell me they can't do it,* and they are walking home.* It's not unreasonable the employer would have thought Steven simply bailed and is unaware he is missing... Even though his car is parked on his block.* Maybe the employer never knew which car was Stevens,* never put 2 and 2 together,* and was out passing flyers when LE so diligently canvassed the neighborhood.
This did not happen. I have knocked on doors in Vegas for over 14 years.* I have been inside over a thousand homes.*
I have knocked on doors that ended up being on the news later for keeping little girls locked under the stairs for nearly a decade.* I have knocked while a wife was being beaten by her husband,* and i have knocked while a husband was being beaten by a wife.* I have knocked and had a shotgun pulled on me on two separate occasions. I have knocked on doors mere hours after a crazed ex bf broke in, and murdered the new bf,* their new 6 week old,* with a shotgun, and his own two kids, while the wife was at work.

But i have never been murdered.*

I suppose had i knocked at 2am,* when the killer was there,* i probably would have been.* But i didn't. Literally hundreds of people have tried their hand at door to door for tens of companies in Vegas, for the nearly two decades i have been involved in it,* and i don't know anyone who has been murdered,* or even scared of being hurt while knocking on doors.* It just does not happen... But maybe it did.

Mood lightener: Most disturbing though,* is when i knocked one time,* and someone yelled "come in".*

See,* i know most sales people would just pretend they didn't hear the person and wait for them to open the door.*
Not me.* I hear "come in" and i walk right in and with a big smile say "Bet you weren't expecting me!" which usually results in a laugh,* and a sale.

Well this time,* not only were they NOT expecting me, but they were expecting the third man in their gay threesome...which they had already started without him,* on the couch.
I said my classic line as i entered, and as i realized what i was seeing. I froze,* dumb struck.*
WITHOUT MISSING A BEAT,* one of the guys says "NO but you'll do!"
The awkwardness actually drained from the apartment,* and we actually all laughed.* I* apologized, they apologized,* their 3rd man probably showed up later to a very funny story,* and i actually got a sale from it the next day.* That could've ended up worse than getting the shotgun pulled on me.

So, theory 1 is Steven,* by chance meets someone in person who also employs flyer passer outter people,* rides with him,* passes flyers for close to 5 hours,* then is killed.

This could be EASILY investigated had the phone info been released within a reasonable time.** WS people could have rushed to those apartments,* asked if anyone has seen him,* and did anyone get any flyers on their door within the last,* oh,* idk TWO WEEKS?*

Now?* "hi.* Have you seen this guy... 5 years ago?* Have you received any flyers...sigh... Within the last 5 years?"

All is not lost though. My experience in this industry has taught me one thing most of all: We are creatures of habit.* I CONSTANTLY go back to the exact same area.* The same exact complexes.* And if i am preoccupied or my mind is elsewhere,* like i couldn't wait to kill someone,* i end up at my goto spot.

So based on the location of SCA, it is more likely than not,* this killer goes to these apartments A LOT.* Like once a month,* no less than once a quarter.*

So,* if LE cared, they could do some of that "investigating" i have heard so much about,* and go ask residents for any flyers they have received within the last year.* People keep those.* They could also ask the office for a list of anyone who lived there 5 years ago and ask them specifically about Steven.* There will not be more than 5 families still living there,* but it's something.

Then,* cross check multiple apartments,* and cross check all the businesses on the flyers retrieved for anyone associated who lives in.. Wait for it.. SCA.
Maybe a week worth of investigating for a POI who not only knows why Steven was in Vegas,* but is also the last to see him alive? Pretty friggen important,* i would think.

 

[fridaybaker]

I'm responding to this fromKrimi in the last thread: I just saw the Disappeared rerun. Why did Koecher leave a job (fired ?) and go to a depressed small town where he had no ties ( or did he ?). Those programs don't reveal a lot of important details, so one has to speculate. Was he leading a double life through the internet ? Did he schedule a liaison of some sort with an someone in Henderson ? If that were the case such individual might have instructed Kocher to park the car away from the house in question. I think something went tragically wrong at that meeting, based on what I have available.
Thoughts ?

I've always wondered about this -1) SK leaving a large job market for a smaller one because he needed to find work, 2) complaining about having to work evenings because he didn't have time to spend with friends and family, then moving away from friends and family. Also, the mystery: The guy is very "devout" -never misses church, yet does that very thing and no one questions him about it. -Doesn't ask why he's in Vegas, despite his known struggle to pay bills, etc. Wouldn't someone at least say "Great -did you have an interview?" "Whatcha doin'?" Nothing? It's a puzzle, and me just can't help but thinking some peeps know more than they say.

 

[Fairy1]

What apartments?

None of the flyers were found anywhere but in Steven's car and why would a business located in St. George be advertising in Vegas/Henderson?

And why would Steven, without the knowledge of his boss/business owner, have been in the Las Vegas area on a Sunday, when he was supposed to be elsewhere, to distribute flyers? He came very close to Vegas the day before, when he had nowhere else to be.

 

[Fairy1]

Although I've been here since the beginning, I'm going through all the threads since day 1 to refresh my memory. There has been a tremendous and invaluable amount of input, research and comments on this case - much of which I, myself, have forgotten. I realize there are a lot of threads on Steven's case and it's a lot to read through, but we've been so fortunate to have the insights of Steven's friends and family members here and that's not usually the case. Off to read!

 

[Blunomore]

Interesting theory on reddit. Unable to post, but here is the intro:

i can't believe i did not see this sooner. The second car, a white Toyota sequoia? IS HIS CONNECT. THIS IS WHO HE WAS MEETING!

THIS IS WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR STEVENS DISAPPEARANCE.

Absolutely, without a doubt he contacts this person via phone, at least twice, says he's at the spot, waits 7 min for him to show up, they talk and the connect says hey, walk up the street and i will pick you up around the way. Bring the pills. Then Steven gets out and walks and the vehicle that just got to the same spot, leaves too? Cmon police. This is despicable work.

The sequoia driver knew of the cameras so asked him to walk up the way so he could avoid all witnesses.

I stand by my prediction that Steven talked to this person at least twice. Whoever is on his phone, is either the driver, or is the person putting him in touch with the driver. Either way the phone calls are connected.

The mysterious item Steven is holding? Looks suspiciously like a pharmacy bag... _---------

 

[carbuff]

The SUV has been researched repeatedly, and cleared. Repeatedly.

How dumb do you think the police are?

 

[SassyBenton]

Ever heard of the McStay case? Police can be VERY dumb. Here&#8217;s what I think is weird:

The realtor shows up right after Steven and drives in the same direction he is seen walking. Okay, no huge red flag there, maybe purely coincidence. However, I did some research on this woman and funnily enough though, where does one of Steven&#8217;s cell pings come from before he showed up in the Sun City Anthem neighborhood? The cell tower a block from the realtor&#8217;s house. Is it just a very strange coincidence that this woman and Steven are on the exact same street at the same time and several hours before that his phone pinged a block from her house?

So let me ask this: how well did LE really look into the realtor? Did they check and see where she was before arriving in that neighborhood? What about after she left that neighborhood, where did she go? Did they check her cell phone records?

Also, I noticed she and her husband started a mortgage business a month before Steven disappeared. Was he possibly walking around passing out flyers/advertising for their new business? Just throwin it out there&#8230;

 

[SassyBenton]

Im puzzled as to why the Help find Steven Koecher fb group was made secret?

I'm answering this from the last thread. That particular facebook page is run by people very close to the Koecher family. They get extremely offended by suggestions that Steven may have been gay, they also get very upset if you bring up the topic of Steven being murdered, which is strange to me since at this point it is clearly an option. I was once a part of the group but upon stating I thought Steven was murdered I was kicked out of the group and received several hateful messages from its members. They don&#8217;t believe he ran off yet they don&#8217;t believe he was murdered, I&#8217;m not sure what exactly they think happened to Steven. Alien abduction maybe?

 

[EdinburghLass]

Im puzzled as to why the Help find Steven Koecher fb group was made secret?

I'm answering this from the last thread. That particular facebook page is run by people very close to the Koecher family. They get extremely offended by suggestions that Steven may have been gay, they also get very upset if you bring up the topic of Steven being murdered, which is strange to me since at this point it is clearly an option. I was once a part of the group but upon stating I thought Steven was murdered I was kicked out of the group and received several hateful messages from its members. They don&#8217;t believe he ran off yet they don&#8217;t believe he was murdered, I&#8217;m not sure what exactly they think happened to Steven. Alien abduction maybe?

But they created another page and are publicising that one? Such a waste of everyone's time. The main admin on that group is on a power trip. The Steven Koecher discussion page is more useful.

 

[Invalesco]

Finally my first post! I've been lurking for quite some time, then joined but refused to post till I had read ALL the threads! The length of my post has got shorter over time as you fab people have read my mind and posted my musings, my questions etc till I'm left with just a hello lol.

I originally found WS after seeing another case on Disappeared and coming to do some sleuthing on him (Lee Cutler I will get to your thread!) but started reading about Steven and that was me hooked. First I'd like to say thanks and well done to all who have contributed here especially those first posters Laytonian, Fairy, etc you really got stuck in at that crucial time and did some amazing work.

I don't actually have one specific idea of what happened to Steven, and so, one post you may think I'm advocating a certain idea then a few posts down I'll be picking holes in it... I'm no super sleuther my only ability is to play devils advocate! Some of your scenarios are more plausible to me than others but I won't go through all of them just some general musings and things that's stuck with me throughout the threads. *Disclaimer* Yes I've read timelines and all the threads but please forgive me if I've forgotten a detail from thread 2 or what was mentioned on the 736th post... there's a lot of info!

Suicide - Not my personal favourite scenario. Just the location doesn't 'fit' as far as stress and general life pressures I don't believe he was under such strain that he couldn't cope. He didn't use the money from family but he knew he had the support and was generally close to his family. His younger brother Dallin they were close and would talk regular.

Sudden mental breakdown - I don't believe... I live in the UK but have 'walked' around Vegas on Google maps so often I think I could be a guide for the place! It looks a busy place, busy enough that if someone was walking around having some kind of episode it would be noticed (unless the consensus is he went into a property and had a breakdown)

Voluntary Missing - I seem to lean more towards this for the fact that it answers a few questions and it's uncomplicated. I saw the posts regarding the Greyhound bus. No ID needed, a quiet exit etc, could have stashed some cash instead of paying rent and he wouldn't use his Mums money out of guilt of what he was planning.
Also when asked about the basketball game he said he didn't think he'd be back, or couldn't make it? On the Disappeared episode his Mum said they spoke every week and she had spoken to him just a couple of days before.... safe to say he had a good few days before anyone thought 'Where's Steven?'
I know this is apparently a 'ridiculous' idea to some as its impossible to just disappear but.... as I said I'm no super sleuther but like many on here I can apply my life experiences to a case so it could seem more plausible (to me anyway).... it is possible to disappear and in some instances its NOT that difficult. I did this twice and so will not discount this theory.
Why would he disappear? That I'm still musing on.... gay is certainly possible, wanting to leave LDS, yes could see that too. But there are still questions that could pick apart the theory. Why didn't he come home IF he knew about his Dad, why not at least make some contact to say stop looking for me, I don't know what was so bad in his life that he felt he had to leave it all.

Landlord - Fishy! I only know what has been said on here as I don't know his name to look into it but what I've seen is enough to put me on alert. I know his partner\wife was on here seeming worried and caring etc but we had a case here in UK (can't post links off my tablet and not sure if I'm allowed to name people) two young girls aged 10 went missing and Mr H did public interviews, appeals etc, seemed ever so caring and worried.... he'd killed them the day they'd gone missing. It was all a cover.
Now what if... Steven was trying to catch up on his rent by doing some 'jobs' for the LL maybe delivered something, got the cash for the delivery and ran. It would explain the phone calls and the wife on here and multiple forums wanting to find him...I noticed she stopped all talk on the other forum around the time (from what I can gather) of her DH arrest.
Problems with this theory.... why run with the cash? Why not do the jobs and catch up with the rent. Unless he wanted the clean break and opportunity knocked right on time... hmmm another 'I don't know'
BTW there is a reserved apology for these people IF it ever comes to light what really happened to Steven and they weren't involved.

I think I'm in the minority but I don't buy the interview/job opportunity\being lured and being murdered theory. The only idea I find in its favour is he was job hunting. Against the theory... it was a Sunday, he should have been at church and I don't feel it (not sure if this is a valid reason lol)

I'm going to stop typing soon because I've rambled enough but just a couple of other things I've picked up on...

The parking spot - as mentioned I have walked those streets on Google map and for the area he was in that was the only parking spot where he wouldn't be outside someone's house. The other cul de sacs all had the circular turning area but there were houses on the circle also... if that makes sense. So he may of been walking back to any of those streets not necessarily EL.... if he was going to a house

His phone pinged off that last tower for two days before it dies WHY was the area not searched. Either the phone was dumped there or its with Steven....

GW - he's either very unlucky or he knows something. One thing that stood out for me is in the reports it states he was a good friend of Stevens and rang him that morning.... but somewhere on this thread (trying to find it!) I'm sure I read that he stated somewhere he wasn't really that much a friend? Trying to distance himself?
Also I think it was Fairy that mentioned a few times the conversation didn't go right in her opinion and I agree...I know they're guys but seriously
'hey I'm in Vegas can you get to the meeting'
"no sorry I'm in Vegas'
"ok I'll go'..... no no no that just doesn't sound right. (I paraphrased a little but everyone knows the conversation)
I'm don't know if GW was criminally involved I'd guess not, but I'm not comfortable with his story.

Ok so much for being short lol. I'm sure there is so much more I've forgot to say but I think I got the important stuff

 

[gray_v]

I've followed this case over the years, and I think it's fantastic to how much degree you've all discussed it. I'm not sure what to think myself. I do believe that whatever happened, happened in that housing estate. I don't know what to think on the homosexual angle. I have experience of the Mormon church as my ex-boyfriend resigned from the church when he came out and I understand that pressure when those two things collide.

 

[Blunomore]

But they created another page and are publicising that one? Such a waste of everyone's time. The main admin on that group is on a power trip. The Steven Koecher discussion page is more useful.

Even on the discussion page you mention, there is a family member "monitoring" it and if you say the wrong thing (in their opinions), the admin comes down on you.