GUILTY PLEA DEAL ACCEPTED - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #113

[LAborn]

Yes, the Moscow Police investigation docs that discuss Murphy are chilling.

I wonder if LE found any Reese’s Peanut Butter Cup wrappers in the wooded area behind or beside the house at 1122 King Road. Oh wait, the candies aren’t vegan.

Anyway, Part 2: Inception of The Idaho 4 was so creepy and showed that the murderer’s psychopathy started young.

As far as the crime scene goes, I have a feeling there was much more blood than we realize, including on the walls.

I’m still not sure what to make of the footprints in the back. During Bill Thompson’s recitation, he just said the murderer parked in back, entered the house via the slider, committed four murders, left the house via the slider, then sped away. Why would he dip back to the right of the back patio? Perhaps the killer wanted to make LE think he left via foot towards the homes to the west? Or maybe Hunter Johnson retrieved the kitchen knife via the slider instead of making his way across a potentially bloody living room?

One more thing--about the Door Dash driver's interview (doc #104, that I discussed in a previous post). The probergers, as expected, have latched on to her interview, spinning tales to match their favorite conspiracy theory.

Now that police have released so many documents, they must stay on top of the rumors and give more interviews, like the recent CNN interview with the Idaho State Police Lt. Darren Gilbertson and Moscow Police Chief Anthony Dahlinger. Thank goodness the murderer is in prison permanently. Unfortunately, the surviving victims and the victim families are still at risk. Even Karen Read's champion, Turtleboy, is being attacked when he says the Idaho murderer is guilty.

IMO

What is this from (bolded)? I'd like to read/watch it. Thanks.

 

[xjd11]

OMG. He took the food? Unbelievable.

with all his food/vegan rules, i'm surprised he would do that. maybe he just grabbed that bag to put the bloody knife in?

 

[sunshineray]

I think the psychology of BK is complicated, and our instinct wants to say he is a monster, has no human qualities and we are human and not like him. The binary is how we separate the Others from Us, and it isn’t reality

So it all depends on the context- we are not robots- we are infinitely more complex
He can care only for himself, sometimes
And also care for his parents, sometimes
It is clear he did not expect to get caught, so he had convinced himself that his parents would not be impacted by his choices, because he was so damn smart.
It doesn’t seem he had a close relationship with his sisters- why? Age difference? Favoritism?

Has he ever had a close friend, who accepted him as he is, and he accepted them?
Has he ever had a mutually caring relationship with a woman other than his mother?

He is a mixed bag- obsessive about some things yet other parts are stunted, absent.
Socially awkward- feels like a social failure, seeks acceptance from subculture- serial killers, incels
Full of shame and self loathing- feels like a failure in love- seeking acceptance into a group of heroes he identifies with
Self medicating- addict, lacking control, hiding from reality- heroin is a depressant
Avoidance- unable or unwilling to develop skills needed for healthy coping, not reflective
Obsessive- seeking control- rotates through obsessions like addictions
Anger- blame, unfair world, victim mindset

I am no behavioral expert, but I saw these things in his reaction to the victim impact statements- and we have so little footage of him to go on.
- fear
- shame
- fury
- boredom
- entertainment, dupers delight
- surprise, shock

He exhibited an intense inhuman level of self-control through all of these intense emotions. Wow
That is a skill- what causes a person to develop that skill? It feels unusual, almost as if he saw the truth in the statements and he was shocked at the accuracy and could not deny it.
Almost as if he has respect for the process, the game of cat and mouse between perp and LE, and he has accepted that he lost.

He pled guilty to everything- he has accepted that he lost.
He could have prolonged the agony of the victim’s families and extend his time on the stage, and lead on his proberger minions- he didn’t.
I think he does not have the attention span or maturity or resilience to have heard all of his mistakes be pointed out in court.
I think he fears insignificance and germs as much as death.
So does he accept failure- what will that do to him if he does?

What if he isn’t done? He is only 30, how could he be resigned to prison for the rest of his life and accept that his one single contribution to the genre of serial killers is viewed as a flop?
Is he is done? I don’t think he is done. So, what is next? What will be his next obsession?

My 2 cents

IMO

While I respect your opinions, when people do monstrous things, they earn the title "monster". Trying to figure out why they did it, those mitigating factors, is all well and good for posterity but it doesn't ever redeem, rename them or their actions. They're still evil because they chose to be. Thank God he can never harm anyone again. AJMO

 

[Dotta]

Shorthand for Loser.

Lawless?
Loathsome?

 

[PunishThenForgive]

He is an academic and a good student. And he has OCD. I agree it's truly astonishing he left no trace, but considering the make up of who he was it checks. (Although O.J. left hardly any evidence too, and he's far from a mastermind).

Could anyone tell me why it's believed he was an incel? I know some women found him creepy and awkward, but has he indicted it himself with writing or conversations with friends? I thought the connection to Elliot Rodgers was conjecture by others.

Frankly, I'm leaning more and more toward his murders being another form of research and experimentation (as school and drugs were). Because he's able to disassociate, he likely was in and out of thinking about the impacts of his actions on others.

I guess it depends on how one defines the word incel. Does one have to be a devout follower of Elliot Rodger? Anyway, the murderer is a misogynist, apparently never had a girlfriend and murdered a romantically successful guy in his sleep.

Regardless of whether or not he is an incel, the killer is a textbook psychopath, and it is psychopathy that leads an incel to commit heinous acts. IMO

 

[femto]

Maddie and Kaylee's faces were attacked leaving them unrecognizable, that despite the fact both were also stabbed in the lungs and liver. Kaylee also had a fatal stab behind her clavicle as well as asphyxiation and bludgeoning injuries and was bleeding heavily from her midsection. That sounds like the overkill was rage induced and with the intent of completely destroying them, erasing their idenities. MO

Then the monster was heard saying, (most likely to Xana) (paraphrazing), "It's ok, I'm going to help you". A person who murders, describing carnage as helping...it was personal. I do believe that one of them may have been the impetus for him being there that night, but once there and committed, he was all in...just like Bundy (someone I think he idolized) in that sorority. MO

I think DM is only alive because she was so still with fright and he didn't see her. That and visual snow in the darkness probably saved her. MO

Kohberger Investigation Documents | Moscow, ID

Related to State of Idaho v. Bryan Kohberger, Latah County Case CR29-22-2805, Ada County Case CR01-24-31665, and MPD Case No. 22-M09903. Includes Non-Exempt MPD Investigatory Records that have been redacted pursuant to the Idaho Public Records Act and authorized for release to the general public.

www.ci.moscow.id.us

Maddie's face wasn't said to be unrecognizable, just that it had a cut across her face and some cuts on her foreams. I believe both were done due to her close proximity to Kaylee and in the process of Bryan fighting Kaylee, he swung the knife around which probably left these marks on Maddie. I don't think Bryan had the time or was all there mentally for these to be calculated. We can easily infer that once he stabbed Maddie, Kaylee woke up and he panicked and brutalized her in order to silence her as fast as possible. From then on he was in a such a hurry to leave, that he lost his sheath and ran into Xana and tried to paficy her with the 'i'm going to help you'. As far as his tone goes, I mean you're putting too much credibility into it. Dylan wasn't exactly in her right state of mind at the time. Sleepy, intoxicated and in huge amount of stress.

I think Dylan is alive because she didn't try to get in Kohberger's way. Kaylee was killed because because she woke up and instictively tried to fight back, Xana was in his path to leave and Ethan was the biggest threat and presumably waking up from the commotion. Dylan didn't really impede his escape. It's possible he did not hear her, but I find it highly unlikely given Dylan herself thought he looked at her and the new information that she actually screamed for Kaylee.

He has to have killed before. How would you know that you had the capacity to do this, especially on this level? I cannot imagine this is the first time he has tested himself.

I think it's simple. He went there to kill Maddie or Kaylee (most likely Maddie given the evidence) and all the rest was basically extreme self-preservation and carelessness for human life. Let's not forget that he still had time to back out when he saw Maddie and Kaylee in the same bed together and he still chose to go along with his plan (unless something happened, like being caught, that forced him to go along with it).

 

[LAborn]

I guess it depends on how one defines the word incel. Does one have to be a devout follower of Elliot Rodgers? Anyway, the murderer is a misogynist, apparently never had a girlfriend and murdered a romantically successful guy in his sleep.

Regardless of whether or not he is an incel, the killer is a textbook psychopath, and it is psychopathy that leads an incel to commit heinous acts. IMO

Thanks, I'm looking for sources of information that have lead people to label him an incel, not conjecture.

 

[PunishThenForgive]

What is this from (bolded)? I'd like to read/watch it. Thanks.

Sorry, the book is the recent one by James Patterson & Vicky Ward. The full title is The Idaho Four: An American Tragedy.

The book has six parts. "Part Two: Inception" focuses on the Idaho murderer himself and discusses his background, possible motivations, and actions right before and after the murders.

 

[soap mama]

So something I don't understand about the crime scene.

My understanding is BK went to the 3rd floor first and killed Maddie and Kaylee. Then he encountered Xana who put up one hell of a struggle before she was killed. So how was Ethan killed in bed asleep? Would not the fierce struggle with Xana have woke him up?

Or did he kill Ethan first quietly in his sleep and then go to the 3rd floor? Then how does he avoid running into Xana after killing Ethan?

Any insight?

I believe Ethan was killed after Xana, that he was passed out from drinking, which is different from a normal sleep. Apparently there was no screaming or yelling per Dylan and Bethany.

 

[AngTxGal]

He is an academic and a good student. And he has OCD. I agree it's truly astonishing he left no trace, but considering the make up of who he was it checks. (Although O.J. left hardly any evidence too, and he's far from a mastermind).

Could anyone tell me why it's believed he was an incel? I know some women found him creepy and awkward, but has he indicted it himself with writing or conversations with friends? I thought the connection to Elliot Rodgers was conjecture by others.

Frankly, I'm leaning more and more toward his murders being another form of research and experimentation (as school and drugs were). Because he's able to disassociate, he likely was in and out of thinking about the impacts of his actions on others.

I think both are true- ‘research’ into the perfect crime and outlet for incel injustices.

BK was trying to carry out the perfect murder, and thought he was smart enough to do it.
He had to choose a person to murder, and he chose young attractive women he did not know

He has no sexual assault history, like Bundy
He has no female relationship history- as far as I’ve seen
He is not a victim of parental abuse or neglect, not abandoned
He seems to have been somewhat rejected by women, did not like his female students
He had trouble with his female boss- he lost his TA position

He chose stabbing as a way to kill- that is in a person’s personal space and bodily fluids.
Some would say a knife is a substitute for a penis (can we say that here?)

How does a germaphobe, without experience in the personal space of women get past all the contact with a body, and all the blood?
Not just one victim, but another, then another, then another

His drive is an intense anger/fear of inadequacy, to hate, if you live then I lose- that to me is consistent with an Incel

Does he have to have contact with a community, have written a manifesto, have evidence of following a leader, No. Maybe years ago he was a follower- not now. Twice degreed, 28 not 18.

IMO

 

[Spiderplant]

The dog found unharmed inside the home where four University of Idaho students were butchered in their beds did not tamper with the crime scene and was not discovered in the same room as any of the victims, it has been revealed.

Moscow Police said in an update on Monday that Murphy, the pet dog that victim Kaylee Goncalves shared with her former long-term boyfriend, was found in a room where the crimes had not been committed.
there was no indication the animal had entered the crime scene,”
source:

Idaho police offer new details about Kaylee Goncalves’ dog at the crime scene

Investigators previously revealed that the dog was found inside the home when officers arrived on the scene of the murders on 13 November

www.the-independent.com

On Murphy- I am sure I read here in an article or a video link that a detective held/placed Murphy in a room purposefully to not disturb the crime scenes.
Similarly that neighbours heard/saw him outside. I think he was treated as evidence, kept ina. Room until he would be taken to the shelter and picked up-

I just need to find the link previously posted- since victim statements. I’ll come back with this.

 

[soap mama]

Thanks for posting this! I am in and out of the Idaho threads as almost impossible to keep up with it all.

BK heard someone calling out about noise while he was in the house. He likely knew at least another person or more were there if he new if wasn't Xana that yelled out. Not sure on that, maybe he thought Xana was the one who yelled out.

Perhaps he was ready to leave the house because of exhaustion. Did he spark something up to lure others out of their rooms? Or did he prep himself and spark up a stun gun or other weapon in case another persona came out of the room to surprise him?

Doesn't make sense to me really either to use something like that if he had a knife, but maybe he was feeling weak in the arm or tired. Thinking out loud, still unsure what it was... JMO MOO

ETA: I'm starting to veer towards a stun granade/flash bang type thing after looking up stuff online

Didn't Dylan say she yelled out and up for them to be quiet?
And then he ran into Xana getting her DD.

 

[sunshineray]

Maddie's face wasn't said to be unrecognizable, just that it had a cut across her face and some cuts on her foreams. I believe both were done due to her close proximity to Kaylee and in the process of Bryan fighting Kaylee, he swung the knife around which probably left these marks on Maddie. I don't think Bryan had the time or was all there mentally for these to be calculated. We can easily infer that once he stabbed Maddie, Kaylee woke up and he panicked and brutalized her in order to silence her as fast as possible. From then on he was in a such a hurry to leave, that he lost his sheath and ran into Xana and tried to paficy her with the 'i'm going to help you'. As far as his tone goes, I mean you're putting too much credibility into it. Dylan wasn't exactly in her right state of mind at the time. Sleepy, intoxicated and in huge amount of stress.

I think Dylan is alive because she didn't try to get in Kohberger's way. Kaylee was killed because because she woke up and instictively tried to fight back, Xana was in his path to leave and Ethan was the biggest threat and presumably waking up from the commotion. Dylan didn't really impede his escape. It's possible he did not hear her, but I find it highly unlikely given Dylan herself thought he looked at her and the new information that she actually screamed for Kaylee.


I think it's simple. He went there to kill Maddie or Kaylee (most likely Maddie given the evidence) and all the rest was basically extreme self-preservation and carelessness for human life. Let's not forget that he still had time to back out when he saw Maddie and Kaylee in the same bed together and he still chose to go along with his plan (unless something happened, like being caught, that forced him to go along with it).

It said in that article that responder said both girls were unrecognizable. I don't think we can fathom the destruction he did yet, without more info. It's just chilling to think about.

I believe he chased Xana to her bedroom. He could have fled after being spotted. He wanted to make sure she didn't call 911. AJMO

 

[pittsburghgirl]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1948149163348082736

What do these 2 letters on his orange prison uniform mean?

View attachment 604077

He looks very thin, especially his arms IMO.

Note that in this photo, the sister's dress looks like a kind of rust color, not a vivid red.

 

[PunishThenForgive]

On Murphy- I am sure I read here in an article or a video link that a detective held/placed Murphy in a room purposefully to not disturb the crime scenes.
Similarly that neighbours heard/saw him outside. I think he was treated as evidence, kept ina. Room until he would be taken to the shelter and picked up-

I just need to find the link previously posted- since victim statements. I’ll come back with this.

In Supp 125 of the Moscow Police Department Investigation Documents, S. Gunderson states:



Earlier in this document, Gunderson states:

When I arrived on the third floor to assess the scene, I noticed a medium sized curly haired tan dog on the bed inside the western third floor bedroom (later identified as Kaylee Goncalves' room). The dog appeared timid/scared and didn't react to our presence. Due to the chaos surrounding the scene, my initial concern was preserving the scene. As part of that process, I asked one of the officers to shut the door, so the dog did not attempt to jump on the bed with any of the victims.

 

[Megnut]

If the DDD hadn't had trouble finding 1122 King, the felon might not have looped the 4th time. If he hadn't been circling to see what that vehicle was doing, the lack of front plate works not have been captured.

Conversely, if she had been a mere few minutes later, she might have met the same fate as the victims.

That is a lot to process.

JMO

 

[cottonweaver]

Yes, the Moscow Police investigation docs that discuss Murphy are chilling.

I wonder if LE found any Reese’s Peanut Butter Cup wrappers in the wooded area behind or beside the house at 1122 King Road. Oh wait, the candies aren’t vegan.

Anyway, Part 2: Inception of The Idaho 4 was so creepy and showed that the murderer’s psychopathy started young.

As far as the crime scene goes, I have a feeling there was much more blood than we realize, including on the walls.

I’m still not sure what to make of the footprints in the back. During Bill Thompson’s recitation, he just said the murderer parked in back, entered the house via the slider, committed four murders, left the house via the slider, then sped away. Why would he dip back to the right of the back patio? Perhaps the killer wanted to make LE think he left via foot towards the homes to the west? Or maybe Hunter Johnson retrieved the kitchen knife via the slider instead of making his way across a potentially bloody living room?

One more thing--about the Door Dash driver's interview (doc #104, that I discussed in a previous post). The probergers, as expected, have latched on to her interview, spinning tales to match their favorite conspiracy theory.

Now that police have released so many documents, they must stay on top of the rumors and give more interviews, like the recent CNN interview with the Idaho State Police Lt. Darren Gilbertson and Moscow Police Chief Anthony Dahlinger. Thank goodness the murderer is in prison permanently. Unfortunately, the surviving victims and the victim families are still at risk. Even Karen Read's champion, Turtleboy, is being attacked when he says the Idaho murderer is guilty.

IMO

yes am not sure if those snow footprints were ever established as ' probably' his - I haven't managed to get through all the documents to see if they matched his shoe size etc

You mean this -

Sorry - best image I can do, from courtTV. ( Ignore backpack ref, Chief Fry later decided it was old, had been there some time)

Here's some images from WS-er cujenna's old photo collection ( Linked on page 1 of every WS thread) This might be the stump?



Yes maybe he wanted to throw LE off track? (Could that be why the door was found wide open? Or did that witness get that wrong, twice? What does Hunter say about the front door when he arrived?)

Anyway, the dumbest thing Wannabe Loser hadn't realized the nearby lamp was a camera.That's not skilful reconnaissence is it? So he still ends up being captured driving away at speed. A white car in the dark too. Dumb wannabe as Alivea G said.

extent of the snow that morning? photo dated 14 Nov. ( I can't recall when the kids' cars were removed) From cujenna's resource

 

[Spiderplant]

Thank you for linking.
Disregard my comment as mine was based on reporting not supps.

In Supp 125 of the Moscow Police Department Investigation Documents, S. Gunderson states:

View attachment 604110

 

[Dexter12]

OMG. He took the food? Unbelievable.

Where does the article say he took the food?

 

[sunshineray]

I think both are true- ‘research’ into the perfect crime and outlet for incel injustices.

BK was trying to carry out the perfect murder, and thought he was smart enough to do it.
He had to choose a person to murder, and he chose young attractive women he did not know

He has no sexual assault history, like Bundy
He has no female relationship history- as far as I’ve seen
He is not a victim of parental abuse or neglect, not abandoned
He seems to have been somewhat rejected by women, did not like his female students
He had trouble with his female boss- he lost his TA position

He chose stabbing as a way to kill- that is in a person’s personal space and bodily fluids.
Some would say a knife is a substitute for a penis (can we say that here?)

How does a germaphobe, without experience in the personal space of women get past all the contact with a body, and all the blood?
Not just one victim, but another, then another, then another

His drive is an intense anger/fear of inadequacy, to hate, if you live then I lose- that to me is consistent with an Incel

Does he have to have contact with a community, have written a manifesto, have evidence of following a leader, No. Maybe years ago he was a follower- not now. Twice degreed, 28 not 18.

IMO

It is interesting though...especially the last bit about his mother's op-ed.

[COLOR=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.95)]Bryan Kohberger allegedly searched online for Ted Bundy as well as depicting nonconsensual sex in the weeks before and after four University of Idaho students were stabbed to death at an off-campus home, according to a report from NBC News, which cites police documents.[/COLOR]
[COLOR=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.95)]The network reports that Kohberger allegedly searched for with the keywords "forced," "passed out," "drugged," and "sleeping."
(...)
The Bundy search could have been related to Kohberger's role as a teacher's assistant in an introductory-level criminology class, a job he held both before and after the murders.
It could also have been a way for him to find the op-ed his mother wrote about the serial killer in 1999, which later went viral after her son's arrest."

Bryan Kohberger Searched Online for Ted Bundy and Nonconsensual Pornography in Weeks Surrounding Idaho Murders: Report

These new details from police were reported by NBC News, along with video and images of a car similar to Kohberger's seen driving in the neighborhood that night.

people.com

[/COLOR]