PLEA DEAL REACHED - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #109

[bugenjoyer]

I definitely understand why victims' families would be angry about the LWOP deal, but i think ultimately the most important thing is that justice is done... he will be in prison forever and he will never hurt or kill anyone ever again, and family, friends, and witnesses won't be subjected to the trauma of a trial and multiple appeals over the course of who knows how many years.

 

[Boodles]

Judge can accept or reject the plea deal.
It's at his discretion.
And yes, if plea gets rejected, BK can withdraw his guilty plea and go to trial.

I don't think Judge H. will reject it, though.
I do think he'll add his own requirements to the deal, and then we'll see if BK still wants to plead out or withdraw from the plea agreement.

Tomorrow will be interesting.

Will Wednesday's hearing be televised or streamed? I sure hope so!

 

[AngTxGal]

Does anybody know what Sheriff's Return (Criminal) in the documents list means? Could this be evidence, for example like the knife? Is this the sign of cooperation, or did he provide evidence? A little baffling. JMOO

I think “Sheriff’s Return” this is the record of legal documents being delivered/ served.

No, not a document related to physical evidence

IMO

 

[AngTxGal]

"Kaylee's father Steve Goncalves said Monday
he fears Kohberger will spend the rest of the agreed-on life sentence
capitalizing on his notoriety by writing a book,
or communicating with the outside world about what he did.

'We have a killer who wants a show,
and they just gave him one',
he said.

Goncalves' family attorney Shanon Gray told NBC News
that they realized the prospect of Kohberger actually being executed within the family's lifetime was slim
if he had been sentenced to death.

But Gray said
the Goncalves' had been comforted
by the far harsher routine Kohberger would have faced on death row.

'You're basically on lockdown for 23 hours',
she explained,
with inmates given one hour outdoor to exercise each day."

https://twitter.com/x/status/1940037815586214031

The families can file a civil suit that prevents Kohberger from ever profiting from the murders. “Son of Sam” laws at the state level. So while a book deal would be a concern- that can be prevented.
It may also be added by the judge as a condition of the plea agreement? Maybe

What Goncalves hasn’t considered is the reality of DP appeals could last decades, and the DP would not even be certain.
Goncalves is not thinking what BK may have been doing for months and months- writing a manuscript. I doubt BK has been doing nothing.

BK is likely making friends, has a fleet of wing-nut sadistic lonely women pen pals pledging their love. He is probably getting plenty of attention in his twisted little world.

Goncalves is processing, no doubt, as we all are. Based on what the press is reporting- the idea of a plea deal was sprung on the families as a trial date was approaching. But, I can’t imagine that the idea of a plea deal would not have come up as a possibility.

IMO

 

[willyengland]

They are BK's own words, bolding my own:

Kohberger wrote in May 2011 that he has "depression, no interest in activity, constant thoughts of suicide, crazy thoughts, delusions of grandeur, anxiety, poor self image, poor social skills, NO EMOTION." The post concluded: "When I get home, I am mean to my family. This started when VS did. I felt no emotion and along with the depersonalization, I can say and do whatever I want with little remorse."

Has it been confirmed that this was indeed Kohberger?

 

[Joe Friday]

Now that the initial shock has worn off, I'm glad he's taking a plea.
He's not copping to lesser charges.
The only thing off the table is the death penalty.
He will never see the light of day outside prison.
No appeals.
No innocence projects.
The families don't have add to their suffering with trial, appeals, etc.
BF and DM won't have to testify.
Taxpayer money saved.

Once again I'm wishing SG would stop talking to the media. I understand his frustration. I would be fine handing him a baseball bat and letting him alone in a room with BK, but this is good. Some guilty people don't even get convicted.
moo

edited to add a line

BBM

Regarding Taxpayer money saved.

It would be interesting to know if the cost of an inmate going through the death penalty phase of incarceration and execution out weights the cost of housing an inmate in prison for the rest of their natural life.

Which in this case, that may be a very long time. Perhaps 50+ years, compared to 20 years on death row.

 

[PunishThenForgive]

Has it been confirmed that this was indeed Kohberger?

The NYT thinks it’s true. Sorry, the article may be behind a paywall.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/13/us/idaho-murders-bryan-kohberger.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare

 

[Magic8Ball]

I hope in time the families that are not happy with this deal will see it for the positive thing it is.

The families are going to get something they would NEVER have gotten absent a guilty plea:

They'll get BK admitting to them and to the world that he is in fact that one who savagely murdered these four individuals.

He would never have done so if a jury had convicted him and sentenced him to death.

He would have granted interviews to Dateline et al. saying he was framed.
His final words in front of the firing squad would have been, "I did not do these crimes. You're executing an innocent man."

This way, they get to hear the confession.
We all get to hear the confession.

 

[Tragg]

Bud Welch’s daughter died in a terrorist bombing (Oklahoma City). Initially, like SG, he wanted her murderers killed. But then he realized the death penalty is nothing more than vengeance, and it was an act of vengeance that killed his daughter. “Vengeance is a strong and natural emotion,” he said, “but it has no place in our justice system.”

The death penalty serves no useful purpose for society that is not effectively served by life imprisonment. The argument that the death penalty is necessary to deter homicide has been debunked by numerous researchers using a variety of methods. It has been shown to increase violence by providing state-approved examples that killing is an appropriate response to offenses.

Moreover, the justice system’s human flaws assure that innocents will be killed in our name, and a system that kills innocent people is simply unacceptable.

I have no sympathy for killers: I do not minimize the viciousness of their crimes or the suffering of victims’ families. But no crime wholly removes the humanity of the person who committed it, and no human is beyond the possibility of redemption. People of faith and principle on both sides of the political divide have recognized this moral truth.

Justice requires retribution, but that is not the same as revenge.

All MOO.

 

[stormymama]

Does anybody know what Sheriff's Return (Criminal) in the documents list means? Could this be evidence, for example like the knife? Is this the sign of cooperation, or did he provide evidence? A little baffling. JMOO

A sheriff's return is when the sheriff serves someone and then they send the party serving that person a "return" piece of paper back stating if the person what served or not.

 

[kaen]

I can't begin to fathom the mindset of the families. As they will grapple with the most senseless crime that tore these young people away from them.

And, I fully understand that it is the State vs rather than the family vs. It seems wrong that families were not consulted. All that said, this monster was going to be alive for a long time before any death penalty would ever be enforced. I appreciate the idea that once he pleads he will not need to be heard from again-- no insinuations, no doubts for most of us (except some silly followers) about his guilt, like the man who killed his wife and young ( I know his name, just won't use it.)

I hope these families can get behind this plea without too much more pain. There is no detail that is going to give them peace. But, if they want allocution I hope they get it.

 

[ilovewings]

How could anyone deserve the death penalty more.

So, like Watts, they'll stick him in a relatively cushy place so well protected to save their own collective a$$es from possible violence against their new protected one. See Watts with his private cell for 2+ years. Now reportedly serving as religious "counselor" for terminally ill inmates, and preparing for his new marriage albeit without conjugal visits. So far.

What a gobsmack. What a sick joke letting him off so be can spend the rest of his life as the enigma. While real people, who have not taken the lives of others have to live under bridges because no one is gifting them free housing, 3 squares a day, free utilities, free dental, medical for the rest of their lives at raxpayer expense.

Frankly, I can't think of much worse than losing my freedom- one day in jail would be one too many. Don't poo poo the loss of his freedom----I don't imagine that is something he takes lightly. He obviously fears death more, but the loss of freedom for the rest of one's life is a huge deal. He isn't the type of criminal that wouldn't mind prison: some criminals actually do better in prison than out, but not BK- He never intended to get caught. He thought he was the smartest guy in the room.

 

[stmarysmead]

I have no sympathy AT ALL for BK. I would have preferred a trial and death penalty.

But, how can the judge reject this plea deal now… since any trial would be tainted by his public acknowledgement in this plea deal that he indeed is the killer?

 

[Teche]

Can Judge Hippler refuse to accept the plea deal?

I hope that Bryan has to give all details of the horrific murders. This may help LE to learn from this and can help LE in future investigations.

 

[Dexter12]

The Prosecution offered a deal, that is how Kohberger was able to accept, to many the offer alone seems like an injustice.

Now we all know that a deal implies he gets something in exchange.
Kohberger gets the death penalty removed as an option
Kohberger changes his pleas to guilty, life sentences, no possibility of parole, no appeals

Does his tell them where the knife is?
Does he have to explain what he did and why?
Does he have to hear victim impact statements?
Is he able to write a book and become famous? Or can they sue for all proceeds of any adventure go to the families?

So does this case wrap it up for victims? I’m not sure all of the families could be appeased as their needs for justice would be different.
For some victim families this may be enough
For other victim families this isn’t enough- they may want the death penalty
For other victims- some were witnesses, they were in that house, they would have to testify in court. No trial may allow them to more easily move forward?
For still others- they may want to face him in court and testify against him.

It would be tough to decide what to do here as the families likely could not agree. Would it be ok to pursue the death penalty for some victim families when others are against it. I don’t think so. And some have been quiet and stayed private while others have been outspoken.

It is all a bit confusing, many of us were hoping for a trial, but the victims and families often do not come first- they are often lost in the drama.

IMO

The defense approached the prosecution with the plea deal.

 

[Teche]

It's just that the appeals process in DP cases can take decades. The Lawyer You Know episode tonight said that Idaho is a notoriously slow execution state. Florida's average is 9 years. The national average is nearly 20. And if for some reason the death penalty comes off the table through laws or lawsuits (e.g., the problems with the chemicals used in lethal injection states or the problems with the electric chair), you could end up with a Charles Manson scenario. He was convicted in 1971 and given the death penalty; in 1972, the death penalty in California was overturned and he was sentence to life with the possibility of parole. He was eligible to apply for parole after 7 years; in all, he want up for parole 12 times.

During that time he would be on death row waiting and waiting.

 

[SteveP]

After sleeping on the news that a plea deal has been reached in this case, I have gotten over my initial disgust, and now can see the bigger picture. As much as I, and very many others here feel that this case would have been a slam dunk, realistically, I know that there is no such thing. We know the names of those who are the proof of that, but I will not acknowledge them here.

With this plea deal, BK is going away, for life. No chance of one rogue juror deciding that reasonable doubt means no doubt. No chance of a juror lying their way through voir dire, only to thwart every attempt to find him guilty in deliberations. No chance of a potential juror saying they could hear and decide a death penalty case, only to realize when it came down to time to make that decision, they could not. I firmly believe that this killer deserves to pay for his crimes with his life, but I I accept this plea arrangement. I do think Judge Hippler can, and hopefully will, require full allocution from BK, explaining the how and why. I also think he should be required to divulge the location that he dumped or buried his knife and kill kit. I am still pissed that it took until this point to iron out an agreement, which was initiated by the defense a few days ago, probably right after her last two Hail Mary's (alternate suspect theory, and motion to continue) were shot down, but I guess, truthfully, the odds of him being put to death were very slim. He would just sit in prison for years and years, while one appeal after another got filed on his behalf. With this agreement, there will be no appeals. He will die in prison, whether a day after getting there, or 50 years from now, long after people have forgotten his name. As much as I think he deserves a bullet, I can live with that. I hope that the families of the victims will be able to.

Tomorrow's 11amMDT hearing should be very interesting! JMO

 

[Arkay]

The families can file a civil suit that prevents Kohberger from ever profiting from the murders. “Son of Sam” laws at the state level. So while a book deal would be a concern- that can be prevented.
It may also be added by the judge as a condition of the plea agreement? Maybe

I had to research this because here in NY, where the “Son of Sam” law originated, it was eventually struck down as unconstitutional although there are other provisions for victims’ families.

Wikipedia tells me that Idaho does have Son of Sam intact and I’m grateful for that. Also from A.I.:

AI Overview

Idaho, like many other states, has a "Son of Sam law" aimed at preventing criminals from profiting from their crimes, specifically through the sale of stories about their crimes. However, these laws have faced legal challenges due to the First Amendment, particularly the right to freedom of speech.

Me again:

In some states there are civil remedies, such as in California when O.J. wrote his self-serving book and the Goldmans were able to attach the profits.

I certainly hope BK just fades away into obscurity though.

 

[ilovewings]

The defense approached the prosecution with the plea deal.

that is what I think happened----

 

[Warwick7]

The Dateline episode came across robust (which at the time I wish they had never put it out), then the DD driver video, which was extremely fatal to BK, then there's AT getting shot down ugly after she sought to point the finger at 4 innocent people.

These 3 happened in a short period of time. As someone said earlier the case was sinking fast, and the pressure ramped up big time.

I M00 I've got a gut feeling BK's family members may have urged him to take a plea deal.