Romania - Alexandra Macesanu 15 (fnd d'cd) & Luiza Melencu 18, Caracal, kidnapped, April & July 2019

[vladone97]

Image source: Ultimele imagini cu Luiza Melencu și Alexandra Măceșanu în viață. VIDEO răvășitor » Fanatik.ro

Alexandra (right, 15 years old) and Luiza (left, 18 years old) are two Romanian girls who disappeared under very similar circumstances. They were last seen in Caracal, Romania. Luiza disappeared first, around mid-April, and Alexandra disappeared around the end of July. They were kidnapped by the same person, named Gheorghe Dinca, who claims to have killed them, but the investigation is going very slowly and quite a few details are sketchy. For example, a few experts claim that Gheorghe Dinca shouldn't have been able to burn their bodies the way he claims he did. There is suspicion that the Romanian authorities might be trying to cover up the case. The official statement of the authorities is that Alexandra is dead. They haven't declared Luiza dead, but they seem preoccupied with trying to do that rather than trying to find her.

Their kidnapper is believed to be involved with a human trafficking network that has branches outside of Romania. Some of those involved in the investigation consider the possibility that the girls are still alive and were taken outside of Romania by traffickers (there was even a witness that claimed to have seen Alexandra being moved to another location). The most likely countries for them to have been taken to are Italy and England, but other countries are also taken into consideration.

Please, share this information wherever you can and let the world know about them. The story about how they were kidnapped and supposedly killed even made it to the international news but, from what I've seen, the theory about them being alive hasn't reached the international news yet.

 

[Gottlieb]

Well, the latest news are that Alexandra's death is confirmed by DNA analysis of the bones and teeth found at Dinca's property:

Megerősítette a DNS-vizsgálat, hogy az elrabolt román lány maradványait találták meg

And they most likely found Luiza's remains after following the information given by Dinca:

A másik elrabolt román lány maradványait is megtalálhatták

Sorry, have only Hungarian links. The teory that they are still alive was a not so nice try from Romanian police to minimise the mistake they made in this case. They started this rumour before the results of DNA analysis came back.

Alexandra is dead, it is now confirmed, and if the found remains are indeed that of Luiza's, her death will also be confirmed soon.

 

[Gottlieb]

Well, here is a link in English that her remains are identified and confirmed by DNA analysis:

EP president reacts to Romanian teen’s murder: Her voice calling for help in vain horrified all of Europe

 

[Gottlieb]

Another English link about how police found the remains they believe to be Luiza's:

Caracal case: Romanian investigators find first victim’s remains in the woods

And one about how this conspiracy theory does not stand anymore:

Caracal case: Romanian authorities confirm the murder of 15-year old missing girl

I will alert the mods to move the thread to the Located Persons Discussion.

 

[vladone97]

Alexandra's DNA was found on teeth specifically (this was on a news channel in Romania, so I can't link to that), and the people involved in the investigation agree that her teeth could've got there without her dying.
What I can link to, however, is the website of the Romanian Police.
MĂCEŞANU ALEXANDRA-MIHAELA
For the reason stated above, Alexandra is still listed under the "missing children" section by the Romanian Police ("copii disparuti" means "missing children"), as opposed to deceased.
As for Luiza, her DNA was not found on the remains that were initially believed to be hers.
www.romaniatv.net/amp/cazul-caracal-surse-oasele-gasite-in-padure-nu-sunt-ale-luizei-melencu_486030.html
She's also listed as missing, rather than deceased, by the police.
Melencu Mihaela Luiza

 

[HayLouise]

Just came across the 911 call don’t think I can link though

 

[ms_x_to_the_m]

OH my, horrific!!!
RIP Luiza & Alexandra

 

[HayLouise]

1 August 2019:

Alexandra Macesanu: Romanian girl’s 'calls for help released by family'

On Tuesday, Alexandra's uncle, Alexandru Cumpanasu, released what he said was a transcript of her calls .

"Please stay with me on the line, I'm really scared," she said in her final call to the emergency number 112, according to the transcript, which was posted on Facebook.

In response, the officer told her she "can't stay on the line" because she had other calls, assuring her a police car would come "without fail" within minutes, according to the transcript.

Family release abducted girl's calls for help

 

[HayLouise]

More:


What do the call transcripts say?

Alexandra made the three phone calls to 112 on 25 July between 23:03 and 23:12, according to the transcript shared by her uncle, Mr Cumpanasu.

In the first call, Alexandra tells the operator she has been kidnapped by a man and taken somewhere in Caracal. Unable to find out where Alexandra is being held, the call disconnects and the operator requests help from a police officer.

Minutes later, in a second call, Alexandra tries to give the operator more details about her kidnapping.


She tells the operator she is being held captive in a house, but is "locked in a room" and can "only see a gate". Midway through the second call, a police officer takes over from the operator.

Alexandra reads an address and the policeman tells her to remain where she is until officers arrive. "Please come fast I'm afraid of him, he beat me," Alexandra says, according to the transcript.

The conversation ends and Alexandra makes a third call. "Please, did you send anyone?" Alexandra asks at the beginning of the call.

"I think he's coming back and I'm afraid."

An officer, once again, assures her that police have been sent, telling her to "relax and calm down a bit", as she sobs on the phone.

Family release abducted girl's calls for help

 

[Gottlieb]

Alexandra's DNA was found on teeth specifically (this was on a news channel in Romania, so I can't link to that), and the people involved in the investigation agree that her teeth could've got there without her dying.
What I can link to, however, is the website of the Romanian Police.
MĂCEŞANU ALEXANDRA-MIHAELA
For the reason stated above, Alexandra is still listed under the "missing children" section by the Romanian Police ("copii disparuti" means "missing children"), as opposed to deceased.
As for Luiza, her DNA was not found on the remains that were initially believed to be hers.
www.romaniatv.net/amp/cazul-caracal-surse-oasele-gasite-in-padure-nu-sunt-ale-luizei-melencu_486030.html
She's also listed as missing, rather than deceased, by the police.
Melencu Mihaela Luiza

Well, Romanian police obviously tries everything to make themselves appear less of the corrupt idiots they actually are.

If the remains are indeeed not of Luiza, then they are from another, to this date unknown, victim of Dinca (he led the police to the remains, they didn't just found them by chance). This is not the good news Romanian police tries to sell it being - it's just one victim more.

I totally get why her family doesn't want to believe that she is dead and I also get why is the police so quick to play along. But her death was confirmed officially by prosecutors of the case. Dinca has also already confessed to both murders (not that that means anything, but still).

Kidnapped Romanian teenage girl is dead - DNA test results

Romanian police is just doing damage control with not denying all those conspiracy theories. They want to get rid of the responsibility and the part they played in her death and want people to concentrate on something else other than how they failed to save somebody's life.

I'd like to have these girls found alive, but, alas, two of them was already found dead, and to find the body of Luiza is just the matter of time.

 

[vladone97]

OH my, horrific!!!
RIP Luiza & Alexandra

Actually, according to Romanian news channels, there is a possibility that the girls might still be alive and that they might have been taken outside of Romania by human traffickers. This is the reason why I created the thread and why I said "please share the information" in the OP. Assuming they are alive, if Romanians want to have any chance to find them, then this information must reach as many people from as many countries as possible.

Well, Romanian police obviously tries everything to make themselves appear less of the corrupt idiots they actually are.

If the remains are indeeed not of Luiza, then they are from another, to this date unknown, victim of Dinca (he led the police to the remains, they didn't just found them by chance). This is not the good news Romanian police tries to sell it being - it's just one victim more.

I totally get why her family doesn't want to believe that she is dead and I also get why is the police so quick to play along. But her death was confirmed officially by prosecutors of the case. Dinca has also already confessed to both murders (not that that means anything, but still).

Kidnapped Romanian teenage girl is dead - DNA test results

Romanian police is just doing damage control with not denying all those conspiracy theories. They want to get rid of the responsibility and the part they played in her death and want people to concentrate on something else other than how they failed to save somebody's life.

I'd like to have these girls found alive, but, alas, two of them was already found dead, and to find the body of Luiza is just the matter of time.

I perfectly understand where you're coming from. I am Romanian and I haven't left the country (yet), so I know very well how incompetent and corrupt Romanian authorities are. I simply want to spread the information because if there's a chance, however slim, that the girls might be alive, then I'm willing to take it. And I'm not the only one.
StiriDiaspora | Alexandra și Luiza, CĂUTATE în Italia. "Dați o mână de ajutor, toată România le caută". SHARE MASIV
"Missing person" posters of the two girls started showing up in Italy.

 

[bykerladi]

How can they be alive if Alexandra's DNA was found in remains?

 

[vladone97]

How can they be alive if Alexandra's DNA was found in remains?

It was stated on the news that Alexandra's DNA was found on teeth, and her teeth could've got there without her dying. Also, her silver jewelry was found pretty much intact among the remains of the supposedly burnt body, which shouldn't have been possible. If her body had been burnt, the jewelry would've melted.

 

[LadyL]

More:


What do the call transcripts say?

Alexandra made the three phone calls to 112 on 25 July between 23:03 and 23:12, according to the transcript shared by her uncle, Mr Cumpanasu.

In the first call, Alexandra tells the operator she has been kidnapped by a man and taken somewhere in Caracal. Unable to find out where Alexandra is being held, the call disconnects and the operator requests help from a police officer.

Minutes later, in a second call, Alexandra tries to give the operator more details about her kidnapping.


She tells the operator she is being held captive in a house, but is "locked in a room" and can "only see a gate". Midway through the second call, a police officer takes over from the operator.

Alexandra reads an address and the policeman tells her to remain where she is until officers arrive. "Please come fast I'm afraid of him, he beat me," Alexandra says, according to the transcript.

The conversation ends and Alexandra makes a third call. "Please, did you send anyone?" Alexandra asks at the beginning of the call.

"I think he's coming back and I'm afraid."

An officer, once again, assures her that police have been sent, telling her to "relax and calm down a bit", as she sobs on the phone.

Family release abducted girl's calls for help

that poor girl
terrible

 

[Gottlieb]

It was stated on the news that Alexandra's DNA was found on teeth, and her teeth could've got there without her dying. Also, her silver jewelry was found pretty much intact among the remains of the supposedly burnt body, which shouldn't have been possible. If her body had been burnt, the jewelry would've melted.

They also found burned human bones, not only teeth. There was somebody burned there, and the only DNA found was that of Alexandra. Sorry, there is not much leeway for the theory that she's still alive.

He may have wanted to keep the jewelry and only threw it in the fire later, when he realized that he will be caught. So maybe it wasn't in the fire long enough to melt. Or if he used wood and paper (what village people commonly use) to set the fire, it wasn't hot enough to melt the silver. To find out why the silver did not melt would be the job of the forensics and police. I, a complete layperson in all things fire have already come up with two plausible theories. The silver being not melted is in no way an evidence that she is alive. Her DNA on the burnt bones and teeth on the other hand is an evidence that she is dead.

Dinca also presented the police with the remains of a 15-17 year old girl, whom he obviously killed (let's dismiss the possibility, that he just happened to know, out of pure intuition, where to dig in the woods to find human corpses, because he is a miracle man, who just knows things by default).

The human trafficking theory originates in the rumours about the reason why the police waited so long before entering the house (unfortunately, we are not able to discuss these rumours).

I honestly wish you were right and they were alive. Unfortunately evidence doesn't tell us so. But spreading the information can't do any harm, you are right at that.

 

[indicolite22]

If the remains aren't those of Luiza, are there any other 15-17 year old girls missing from the area? Have they tried to determine for how long have the remains been there?

 

[vladone97]

If the remains aren't those of Luiza, are there any other 15-17 year old girls missing from the area? Have they tried to determine for how long have the remains been there?

They are suspecting that there's a third victim. They're still looking into that.

 

[vladone97]

Updates on the case:
www.dcnews.ro/ancheta-caracal-tatal-luizei-a-primit-o-scrisoare-in-aceasta-seara-a-sunat-la-112-imediat_681438.html
Yesterday, Luiza's family received a letter saying "Stop looking for the girls. They're dead". It was not specified whether anyone had signed the letter, so it seems to be anonymous.
www.fanatik.ro/contul-de-whatsapp-al-luizei-melencu-activ-pentru-scurt-timp-iarasi-e-ceva-ciudat-19050934/amp
And last night, Luiza's Whatsapp account was accessed and deactivated. It's pretty strange that this is happening now, considering that Luiza has been missing since April.
And it's also weird that these two things happened in such a short time frame.

 

[Gottlieb]

Don't take it personally, I really don't mean this as an offense, but I just don't get this case.

On one side there is DNA analysis and the police prosecutor telling the family that Alexandra is dead - all this reported in worldwide msm. Honestly, could it be more official than this:
Caracal case/DIICOT: Lab tests show genetic profile of a single person - Alexandra Macesanu

On the other side is the uncle, telling that he doesn't believe in the DNA result because it is "light and weak" or something of that effect, and some football sites with sensation-seeking articles about social media accounts.

Not everything on the internet is msm or even credible.

I advise you to look up the Douglas Garland case, he kidnapped and murdered his neighbours and their 5 year old grandson, and then burnt their bodies in a metal barrel (just like Dinca) so completely that it took months combing through the ashes to find like one broken piece of tooth and some metal bits of clothing. Fortunately Canadian police and legal system is somewhat more professional than in Romania, otherwise there would still be crazy ideas circulating out there about little Nathan and his grandparents living their best lives somewhere, because, you know, no bodies? No DNA? We did not see them dead so they must be living? We found only a barrel of ashes and some broken tooth, that's not enough evidence for them being dead? Let's search for them in Mexico!

Because you can totally be still alive if your tooth is found in a barrel of burnt human ashes, yeah, sure.

Sorry for being sarcastic and again, it's not directed personally at you, vladone. I just really don't get this whole thread.

Alexandra is dead and her remains are found. Some other victim is dead and her remains are found. According to Dinca's confession, Luiza is dead too, although her remains haven't been found yet. This whole "trafficked to Italy" thing is a red herring, imo, that serves the police all too well. Why people are so keen to believe it, is a mystery for me.

 

[Gottlieb]

On the other hand, police is searching his yard with a scanner:
Anchetă în casa lui Gheorghe Dincă. Scannerul adus a oferit deja primele indicii

(Another mention of him confessing to both murders).