TX TX- Overnight flooding at Camp Mystic, all girls camp. 28 from camp dead, Hunt, Kerr County, July 4, 2025

[Cryptic]

Mystic should be held to higher standard than the RV camps/vacation rentals. They should be held to the same standard as other camps, which afaik, didn't suffer the same losses.

Evidently the death rate was mostly centered on one cabin dangerously close to the river- though they apparently received flood exemptions for others over the years.

No phone policies are common with summer camps. So, that would not have been a Camp Mystic centered policy.

In short, holding them to the same standard as other camps might not change much. For example:

- had other camps also received building exemptions?
- did other camps have no phone policies?
- were the reduced fatalities at other camps due to rigorously practiced evacuation plans- or largely due to luck?

Though I have no idea of whether or not other camps received exemptions, the camps that I am familiar with did not exactly have extensive say, tornado drills.

 

[Morag]

There may not have been cell phones in the cabins…BUT…there was a LOUDSPEAKER SYSTEM which could have been used to alert the children and counselors to move to higher ground. How did the several members of the Eastland family who moved - twice-to higher located buildings know to save themselves? You think they may have had cell phones? RHIP

 

[Serononin]

Evidently the death rate was mostly centered on one cabin dangerously close to the river- though they apparently received flood exemptions for others over the years.

No phone policies are common with summer camps. So, that would not have been a Camp Mystic centered policy.

In short, holding them to the same standard as other camps might not change much. For example:

- had other camps also received building exemptions?
- did other camps have no phone policies?
- were the reduced fatalities at other camps due to rigorously practiced evacuation plans- or largely due to luck?

Though I have no idea of whether or not other camps received exemptions, the camps that I am familiar with did not exactly have extensive say, tornado drills.

Interestingly, according to the New York magazine article linked earlier in the thread, the cabins that suffered the most losses actually weren't those closest to the water. The closest cabins were eventually evacuated, but the ones slightly further away were told to stay where they were. At least one cabin was only evacuated in time because the counsellors in charge of it decided to ignore that instruction and get the kids out themselves.

As for the no phones policy, I completely understand it in the case of the campers (most of whom were too young to have phones anyway IMO), but not the counsellors. Had either of the two counsellors who died been able to receive the flood warnings themselves, instead of relying on the camp leadership (at least one of whom admitted to sleeping through the first alert) to relay information, it's possible things might have been different.

That said, it sounds like the tragedy at Camp Mystic was the result of a cascade of failures, so it's hard to say whether just one or two things being different might have changed the outcome.

I also don't know how differently (or not) the other camps in the area operates. According to this article, at least one of them (the Heart O' the Hills camp, where the camp director was killed) didn't have any campers on site at the time, so that one was certainly down to luck: Texas river hit by flood has 13 summer camps in flood zone

 

[Friday Fan]

I don't think it a money issue at all. Nearly all of the families patronizing the camp are wealthy.

Rather, the lack of AC seems to be part of the charm of a simpler time that encourages campers to stay outdoors during the day and to thus participate in and enjoy out door activities. Others may view the lack of AC as a temporary escape from lives loaded with luxury.

In the end, the strength of the camp appears to have been the timeless activities, not the amenities.

They said the cabins were close to river because they didn't have AC. If they have AC, they can move the cabins uphill. Several camps, including Camp Waldemar, which is 100 years old, has AC.

 

[Morag]

…

That said, it sounds like the tragedy at Camp Mystic was the result of a cascade of failures, so it's hard to say whether just one or two things being different might have changed the outcome…

The family had been operating the camp for half a century. They still failed to evacuate those campers (and counselors). There was only one failure, and that was it.

 

[Cryptic]

They said the cabins were close to river because they didn't have AC. If they have AC, they can move the cabins uphill. Several camps, including Camp Waldemar, which is 100 years old, has AC.

Despite their claims, I doubt AC had anything to do with where the cabins were placed.

Being next to a river- or in this case, a creek bearing the title of "river" (dry state) can drop the temperature a few degrees- and probably increase the humidity a notch or two.

That aside, had the owners or clients expected AC, it would have been installed very quickly no matter where the cabins were located. In the end, I strongly suspect that the cabins were close to the river purely for:

A. Convenience
B. Traditional appeal and mystique

 

[Dotta]

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