Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #184

[Tricia]

Welcome back to the Delphi Murders discussion thread.

On the afternoon of Feb. 13th, 2017, best friends Abigail Williams and Liberty German were dropped off at a bridge in the town of Delphi. On Feb 14th their bodies were discovered around noon about 50 feet from the north bank of Deer Creek which is about 0.5 miles from the bridge.

Richard Allen has been arrested and charged with the murders of Abby and Libby

ISP page dedicated to the investigation (includes audio of suspect)

FOR MORE CLICK HERE FOR THE CARROL COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE FACEBOOK PAGE.

Anyone with information about this case, no matter how insignificant, is encouraged to call the Delphi Homicide Investigation Tip Line at (844) 459-5786.

Information can also be reported by calling the Indiana State Police at(800) 382-7537, or the Carroll County Sheriff's Department at (765) 564-2413.

Information can also be emailed to Abbyandlibbytip@cacoshrf.com

PICTURES OF ABBY AND LIBBY
Link to post with all threads 1 - 98 (Courtesy of margarita25)
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Link to Media Maps & Timelines *No Discussion*
Link to Media Maps & Timelines #2 *No Discussion*
IMAGE Discussion Thread

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Rules Etiquette & Information

Case map by skibaboo updated with grayhuze crime flow video

Grayhuze youtube channel
Murder sheet YouTube

Verified Insiders: None in this case at this time. Verified Professional, Member michael.gartley, is a Verified Expert in Imaging Science.

RULES OF THIS DISCUSSION
DO NOT post photos of random individuals (including persons featured in MSM articles about other area crimes) to compare to the images of unidentified suspect on the bridge.

PLEASE DO NOT POST PICTURES OF SEX OFFENDERS!

Do not sleuth family, PERIOD. This includes previous public records which have nothing to do with this case. They are victims here. Plain and simple.

If you feel you have a tip, by all means, phone it in. Do NOT discuss your tip here. Contact the authorities and give them time to follow your lead.

NOTE - per Tricia and Sillybilly’s 5.28.2021 post here, JBC as a poi is now open for discussion in the Delphi thread.

Added 12/12/21
For general discussion on KAK’s current case please use his thread.
IN, Peru - Kegan Anthony Kline, 27, arrested Aug 29, 2020, 30 Counts associated with CSAM

 

[Tricia]

A consolidation of ADMIN & MOD notes (edited November 24, 2022):

- Members are allowed to discuss Richard Allen's voice as heard on the Gray Hughes podcast. Members may NOT link directly to RA's wife’s social media accounts.

- Speculation about RA’s possible involvement in other cases belongs in the OTHER CASES thread.

- Speculation that is not based on known fact is not allowed.

- Please use initials only for anyone other than victims or perps.

- If you have questions about rules or moderation, please do not ask them on the thread. Just jump off any post to use the Report feature to ask and a Mod or Admin will respond as soon as possible.

- Rumors are not allowed. If you can't link information to Websleuths approved sources, do NOT post it with "I read it somewhere" or "I'll find the link later ...".

- Sleuthing or discussing RSOs just because they are on the registry is not allowed. A thread specific exception may be made by Tricia or an Admin depending on geographical location in relation a crime.

- Photo alterations or side-by-side comparisons of unrelated pictures are not allowed.

 

[Tricia]

Mod Note:
For general JBC II discussions please use his thread. In Abby & Libby’s thread, JBC II should only be discussed in the context of a possible connection to Abby & Libby’s case.
Thanks Everyone!

JBC II Thread:
IN - James Chadwell II, 42, arrested after girl 9, found in his home, Lafayette, 19 Apr 2021 #3

Added 12/12/21
For general discussion on KAK’s current case please use his thread.
IN, Peru - Kegan Anthony Kline, 27, arrested Aug 29, 2020, 30 Counts associated with CSAM

 

[Tricia]

ADMIN NOTE:

Sorry folks, but statement analysis, body language analysis, amateur handwriting analysis is not allowed unless sourced to a credentialed, forensic specialist involved in the case under discussion.

This discussion is dedicated to Abby and Libby. Posts that do not relate directly to their case are off topic and such posts get removed. If you wish to discuss personal matters, please do so with your WS friends through PM or in the basement.

Also, the presumption of innocence is part and parcel of the judicial process. It does not apply to the general public who are entitled to express their opinion. Members are not here to be lectured or chastised by others for expressing their personal opinions. If you have an issue, use the Report feature and let Mods or Admins determine what is or is not okay to post.

Thanks.

Sillybilly
WS Administrator

Click here for The Rules

 

[MadMcGoo]

Continue the discussion here.

 

[Emma Peel]

ugh!
Gee wiz!

I've just been freed up in real life to have a moment to pay a visit to Delphi this busy day.
Good gracious, what a day the Delphi thread has endured!
And now I can't easily press reply to each and everyone's thoughtful posts from the previous thread!

I guess ... y'all might be feeling grateful for your very good luck.

 

[photographer4]

Someone asked last thread how we know JG isn’t communicating via email anymore. Here’s how: it was said during the proceedings today. Her emails were quoted on filings and now she won’t email.

Delphi double murder trial delayed: Richard Allen’s defense says trial needs to be longer

CARROLL COUNTY, Ind. — Special Judge Fran Gull, appointed by the Indiana Supreme Court to hear the double murder case against accused Delphi killer Richard Allen, has granted a defense team m…

fox59.com

 

[Emma Peel]

oh! pity the mods.
also, bless them.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Wow, what a day! Hopefully whoever needs a break from this firestorm can now take one. Oh, and that includes ALL MODS!!

 

[mrjitty]

Some random takes - all my opinion and musings only

I don't really get how this happens from a project management point of view. It's always been a three week trial. How did the parties not realise they needed longer until 2 weeks before trial? While I understand they need to talk to each other to flesh out what witnesses are needed, Rozzi is not new to this - he must have had some idea if he needed one, two or three weeks. I wonder if he is only recently getting his head around whatever experts he now intends to call?

Similarly the lack of a pre-trial conference until so late in the day seems odd. Shouldn't this all have been hammered out back in March? I have no idea of typical procedure but from simply watching cases, I've never seen anything so last minute dot com

IMO it's no biggie the Judge won't do email anymore. if they are going to put then on the record she might as well require them to file motions and makes orders on the record. Is it normal for the judge to accept emails anyway? Does anyone have insight on typical practice?

It's good that the first evidential/suppression hearings are happening this month. I don't get why they were left so late in the day. Especially the defence need to know what evidence they can lead.

Overall I am not sure how big a deal this all is really is. Based on their own filing about only having had time to review a fraction of discovery, they were not ready I guess. Now they get lots of time.

I really wish Judge Gull would hold more hearings and enter reasoned decisions to get everything on the record.

MOO

 

[snooptroop88]

Have been skimming through all the posts on the now closed thread (whoa, a lot) and I see P supposedly has damning evidence against RA under seal. This is what it's looked like for a long time. And this undoubtedly has to be true, that there are potential undisclosed bombshells because of the seals & gag order. If I wanted any proof that it were the case, it would be in the back-and-forth in the motions to suppress RA's statements. Obviously, we don't know everything he said. I'd love to know what else is at this point undisclosed. Might be wrong, but MOO, that's the reason behind a lot of the D's theatrics. And there's no way this trial could've happened on the projected date, I think that was part of D's show, too.

I can't quote @photographer4's post because thread's closed, but @photographer4 noted that RA's aggression during meetings/interviews at certain points showed he was caught and panicked. Totally agreed on this, when it took all those years for LE to come after him, he figured he was home free. I don't think he was just caught and panicked, he was furious. I've been back and forth on whether multiple parties involved, I started out way back when thinking single actor, moved to "group," have returned to single actor. Still think the dropbox is in some way a factor, but have returned to the original "no collusion" idea because if RA actually did stage that bizarre scene to mislead LE, RA is so wacked out that he'd be unable to find company for his deeds. This killer-- if he did that staging, for that reason-- is just too unique (in a bad, warped way) to find "like minds," which are already hard enough to find when you're talking about having other parties hop on board for something as ghastly as murder. My guess is that the damning evidence against RA does indeed exist, and his goose is probably cooked but good, but only time will tell, and I know we've got months more now of it, till October.

 

[Melted]

I always think there has to be more than one suspect as well, but then I remember it was 7 years ago and people do not keep their mouths closed that long, unless 1 is dead of course. JMO

 

[susane7]

IMO it's no biggie the Judge won't do email anymore. if they are going to put then on the record she might as well require them to file motions and makes orders on the record. Is it normal for the judge to accept emails anyway? Does anyone have insight on typical practice?

The fact that judge and attorneys communicate via email absolutely shocked me, seems so informal. I don't know but I guess it depends of the states in the US because the Prosecutors also were shcoked by that.

 

[arielilane]

@SamJohnsonNews

NEW DETAILS The #Delphi murders trial has been pushed back to October 14, 2024. The defense waived its request for a speedy trial when the judge said she couldn’t extend the May trial. That means #RichardAllen could be in prison for two years before he heads to trial.

12:20 PM · May 7, 2024 from Fort Wayne, IN


One exchange between Defense Attorney Brad Rozzi & Judge Frances Gull after a new trial date was set:
Gull: “If you can’t try this case in a month, there’s something wrong.”
Rozzi: “You don’t know anything about this case.”
MORE NOW at @WTHRcom.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1787880319212831094

 

[arielilane]

The defense wanted 15 days to present its case with no hard end on the May trial date. If Judge Frances Gull would not grant that, defense waived Richard Allen’s right to a speedy trial and asked for a new court date ASAP. Judge set new trial date for October 14.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1787865785639084090

Several contentious exchanges between Judge Gull & defense attorney Bradley Rozzi. Judge: “If you can’t try this case in a month, there’s something wrong.”Rozzi: “You don’t know anything about this case.”

https://twitter.com/x/status/1787871998527324436

During the hearing, defense attorney Andrew Baldwin filed a second request with the court for Judge Gull to be disqualified from the case.


Hearings will be held in Carroll County May 21-23 on several outstanding motions from the defense & state on evidence that will or will not be allowed at trial.


Judge Gull said she would no longer be communicating with the defense by emails because her emails wind up in defense motions, which she considered inappropriate.


UPDATED: Richard Allen’s jury trial for the #DelphiMurders pushed back to October over defense concerns about limited time allotted to present its case.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1787880162501050534

 

[arielilane]

I always think there has to be more than one suspect as well, but then I remember it was 7 years ago and people do not keep their mouths closed that long, unless 1 is dead of course. JMO

Respectfully, disagree, some people will keep quiet for years, unfortunately. Only moo, though.
Defense benefits with all the delays. People forget.

Agree with your. opinion about if one is dead.

 

[twall]

05/08/2024	Motion Filed Motion for Admissibility.pdf Filed By: State of Indiana File Stamp: 05/06/2024
05/08/2024	Praecipe for Transcript Filed Praecipe for Transcript Filed By: Allen, Richard M. File Stamp: 05/07/2024
05/08/2024	Order Issued Defendant appears in person and with counsel, Attorneys Bradley Rozzi, Andrew Baldwin, and Jennifer Auger. State appears by Prosecuting Attorney Nicholas McLeland and Deputy Prosecuting Attorneys James Luttrell and Stacey Diener. Hearing held on defendant's Motion to Pre-Trial Hearing filed April 30, 2024. Defense counsel report to the Court that the scheduled trial dates of May 13 - 31, 2024, are inadequate for trial. Defendant waives his speedy trial and moves for a continuance. State objects as they are ready for trial but leaves it to the Court's discretion. Defense motion granted. Jury trial ordered continued and reset to October 14 - November 15, 2024, at 9:00 a.m. in the Carroll Circuit Court. Defendant's Motion to Compel and Request for Sanctions, Defendant's two (2) pending Motions to Suppress, State's Motion in Limine, and State's Motion for Ruling on Admissibility all set for hearing May 21 - 23, 2024, at 9:00 a.m. in the Carroll Circuit Court. Defendant's third and fourth Request for Franks Hearing will be ruled upon and not set for hearing unless necessary. Judicial Officer: Gull, Frances -SJ Noticed: McLeland, Nicholas Charles Noticed: Baldwin, Andrew Joseph Noticed: Rozzi, Bradley Anthony Noticed: Luttrull, James David JR Noticed: Diener, Stacey Lynn Noticed: Auger, Jennifer Jones Order Signed: 05/07/2024

 

[FrostedGlass]

Deleted = already posted

 

[AugustWest]

Indiana Jury Rule 4:

Rule 4 - Notice of Selection for Jury Pool and Summons for Jury Service, Ind. Ju. R. 4 | Casetext Search + Citator

Read Rule 4 - Notice of Selection for Jury Pool and Summons for Jury Service, Ind. Ju. R. 4, see flags on bad law, and search Casetext’s comprehensive legal database

casetext.com

Case law on Jury Rule 4:

Clark v. State

Clark v. State - 659 N.E.2d 548

law.justia.com

 

[TTF14]

Some random takes - all my opinion and musings only

I don't really get how this happens from a project management point of view. It's always been a three week trial. How did the parties not realise they needed longer until 2 weeks before trial? While I understand they need to talk to each other to flesh out what witnesses are needed, Rozzi is not new to this - he must have had some idea if he needed one, two or three weeks. I wonder if he is only recently getting his head around whatever experts he now intends to call?

Similarly the lack of a pre-trial conference until so late in the day seems odd. Shouldn't this all have been hammered out back in March? I have no idea of typical procedure but from simply watching cases, I've never seen anything so last minute dot com

IMO it's no biggie the Judge won't do email anymore. if they are going to put then on the record she might as well require them to file motions and makes orders on the record. Is it normal for the judge to accept emails anyway? Does anyone have insight on typical practice?

It's good that the first evidential/suppression hearings are happening this month. I don't get why they were left so late in the day. Especially the defence need to know what evidence they can lead.

Overall I am not sure how big a deal this all is really is. Based on their own filing about only having had time to review a fraction of discovery, they were not ready I guess. Now they get lots of time.

I really wish Judge Gull would hold more hearings and enter reasoned decisions to get everything on the record.

MOO

Nick is inexperienced, so he gets a pass in not realizing this sooner, but yeah, the defense attorneys definitely should have. Naysayers will say "because they knew all along they would not be going to trial in May." However, they did request to keep the trial on schedule and just extend the time and the judge said no. Other things had probably already been scheduled so she couldn't is my guess.

IMO MOO