MN - Jacob Wetterling, 11, St. Joseph, 22 Oct 1989 - #7

[KeepHopeAlive]

I believe Daniel Rassier also abducted Joshua Guimond.

That's a bold accusation. Why do you say that?

 

[Marzipan]

Question about process on this board: How do we decide if someone should take action on a lead, and who? The idea of somebody talking with Marcy Wolf seemed like a good one. I have no inkling of any sort that Butch was anything other than a wonderful person, but I'd never heard this info before (never heard about him before, but I know some of you have long wondered if someone from the local music community was involved).

Perhaps the "local rumor" piece of it about Marcy suspecting Butch was involved in Jacob's case has been heard by LE and scratched off. But I don't know...does anybody else know?

If not, who would be the best person on here to either approach LE with the idea (or approach the Wetterlings if LE isn't so open to the info), or else go and talk with Marcy before she gets any older? I would imagine Patty W. has this info, but if she has never talked to Marcy maybe she would like to.

The thing that jumps out at me from the article about the woman who called in a tip and then didn't call back again with more is Patty's quote in that article. "Forget the composites." That makes me pretty sure that the woman's tip on a suspect did not match any composites.

Maybe this Marcy/Butch connection is all old info to the Wetterlings and LE, and maybe Marcy was just truly ill. But if it's new to this WS board, should one of us who has some good liaison skills or people skills take some action? Or maybe one of you already has. I'm just not sure how things work on here, especially because some things may happen via direct messaging among those who have been here devotedly trying to solve this case for years.

 

[Jbrown324320]

That's just it. We don't know what the Wetterlings and law enforcement know and what they don't know. Tracker has tried to reach out to LE and they declined his help. I know from Josh G's website that the Guimonds have called and emailed LE and Stearns County Atty and they do not respond. LE even told the family that maybe the turtles in the pond ate Josh or he sank in the mud. Neither are possible and both are absurd. St John's even got a protection order against Josh's dad from going on campus to search for his son which was approved by a court and enforced by police. This tells me where their loyalties lie. Not with the Guimond family. I think they were better with the Wetterlings, but I don't feel comfortable reaching out to anyone directly. Facebook or email maybe. I don't know what is appropriate and when and what is against Websleuth rules or not. I think someone should try to reach out to Marcy. We haven't really delved into this aspect of the case yet. Neither Butch nor the dad has a record in MN that I could find.

 

[ELOCsoul]

Question about process on this board: How do we decide if someone should take action on a lead, and who? The idea of somebody talking with Marcy Wolf seemed like a good one. I have no inkling of any sort that Butch was anything other than a wonderful person, but I'd never heard this info before (never heard about him before, but I know some of you have long wondered if someone from the local music community was involved).

Perhaps the "local rumor" piece of it about Marcy suspecting Butch was involved in Jacob's case has been heard by LE and scratched off. But I don't know...does anybody else know?

If not, who would be the best person on here to either approach LE with the idea (or approach the Wetterlings if LE isn't so open to the info), or else go and talk with Marcy before she gets any older? I would imagine Patty W. has this info, but if she has never talked to Marcy maybe she would like to.

The thing that jumps out at me from the article about the woman who called in a tip and then didn't call back again with more is Patty's quote in that article. "Forget the composites." That makes me pretty sure that the woman's tip on a suspect did not match any composites.

Maybe this Marcy/Butch connection is all old info to the Wetterlings and LE, and maybe Marcy was just truly ill. But if it's new to this WS board, should one of us who has some good liaison skills or people skills take some action? Or maybe one of you already has. I'm just not sure how things work on here, especially because some things may happen via direct messaging among those who have been here devotedly trying to solve this case for years.

Information regarding Jacob's case may be forwarded to the Stearns County Sheriff's office by emailing sheriff@co.stearns.mn.us OR call Crimestoppers at
(320) 255-1301.

When emailing information to the sheriff's office, the info will be forwarded to case investigators. I have sent several emails myself. Although your email will not typically be acknowledged by the sheriff's office, they will be reviewed by case investigators..

 

[shergal]

I may be mistaken because it is diffucult to find the information we need all in
one place. Its just a buch of tidbits to be found online in this case and that is a problem. Was the gun even a real gun or was it a toy gun from dans childhood? Where is the information from the interviews with dans parents?

I believe Daniel Rassier also abducted Joshua Guimond.

Typically someone who would be interested in 11 year old boys, would not also be interested in adult college aged men. Offenders usually have very well defined preferences. (I'm NOT saying DR is an "offender" at all.) I just don't think it's likely that whoever abducted Jacob and/or Jared would also have been interested in Josh who was much older. (JMO)

While Dan's parents may have been interviewed once they returned home, (not sure what date that was) it probably would have been a private interview with LE, since they were not home when the abduction occurred. I've never seen any interviews with DR's parents printed or posted anywhere. Dan has mentioned in his own TV interviews that his parents feel he reveals too much as it is, so maybe they aren't comfortable with public interviews.

 

[Sasquatch321]

Typically someone who would be interested in 11 year old boys, would not also be interested in adult college aged men. Offenders usually have very well defined preferences. (I'm NOT saying DR is an "offender" at all.) I just don't think it's likely that whoever abducted Jacob and/or Jared would also have been interested in Josh who was much older. (JMO)

While Dan's parents may have been interviewed once they returned home, (not sure what date that was) it probably would have been a private interview with LE, since they were not home when the abduction occurred. I've never seen any interviews with DR's parents printed or posted anywhere. Dan has mentioned in his own TV interviews that his parents feel he reveals too much as it is, so maybe they aren't comfortable with public interviews.

First I would just look at the facts

1. Daniel Rassier is employed by Saint Johns University.
2. Josh was involved with music/band at Saint Johns University.
3. Someone called in a tip saying they had seen a person out running the night Josh was abducted. They said he was wearing bright colored clothing and that it was dark outside.
4. Both Jacob and Josh vanish without a trace.
5. Daniels known running route supposedly goes right through the area they think josh went missing.

 

[Sasquatch321]

Hey guys lets go back to Jacobs abduction and why Dan is 95 percent likely involved. The police ruled out a vehicle in 2004, based on this, where is the only way the abductor and Jacob could have gone? There is only one way, back towards the farm.

If you think about it the boys were told to run forward to the woods and not look back. That eliminates forward. To the left there is a dead end and the victims own home. That eliminates left. To the right is the road leading to tom thumb, the abductor does not carry Jacob down the road to oncoming cops. that eliminates right. The only remaining way to flee and somehow cover up this crime is to go backwards, backwards into a 153 acre farm.

 

[human]

Question about process on this board: How do we decide if someone should take action on a lead, and who? The idea of somebody talking with Marcy Wolf seemed like a good one. I have no inkling of any sort that Butch was anything other than a wonderful person, but I'd never heard this info before (never heard about him before, but I know some of you have long wondered if someone from the local music community was involved).

Perhaps the "local rumor" piece of it about Marcy suspecting Butch was involved in Jacob's case has been heard by LE and scratched off. But I don't know...does anybody else know?

If not, who would be the best person on here to either approach LE with the idea (or approach the Wetterlings if LE isn't so open to the info), or else go and talk with Marcy before she gets any older? I would imagine Patty W. has this info, but if she has never talked to Marcy maybe she would like to.

The thing that jumps out at me from the article about the woman who called in a tip and then didn't call back again with more is Patty's quote in that article. "Forget the composites." That makes me pretty sure that the woman's tip on a suspect did not match any composites.

Maybe this Marcy/Butch connection is all old info to the Wetterlings and LE, and maybe Marcy was just truly ill. But if it's new to this WS board, should one of us who has some good liaison skills or people skills take some action? Or maybe one of you already has. I'm just not sure how things work on here, especially because some things may happen via direct messaging among those who have been here devotedly trying to solve this case for years.

I have sent info to LE from here. It may be placed in the watch out for that crazy box, but so what.

So send it in, It is anonymous to anyone but LE.

Just because you want to interivew someone does not mean you would ever be alowed to do that

 

[human]

Typically someone who would be interested in 11 year old boys, would not also be interested in adult college aged men. Offenders usually have very well defined preferences. (I'm NOT saying DR is an "offender" at all.) I just don't think it's likely that whoever abducted Jacob and/or Jared would also have been interested in Josh who was much older. (JMO)

While Dan's parents may have been interviewed once they returned home, (not sure what date that was) it probably would have been a private interview with LE, since they were not home when the abduction occurred. I've never seen any interviews with DR's parents printed or posted anywhere. Dan has mentioned in his own TV interviews that his parents feel he reveals too much as it is, so maybe they aren't comfortable with public interviews.

That makes me positively ill.

Jacob is missing and the parents of DR are upset because he reveals too much.

I cannot imagine any person who would not do what s/he could to help .

 

[Sasquatch321]

:loveyou:

That makes me positively ill.

Jacob is missing and the parents of DR are upset because he reveals too much.

I cannot imagine any person who would not do what s/he could to help .

A classic cases of the "good son" fool proofing his parents that he could never do it. His parents are so fooled that hes 54 yrs old and still hasnt left the farm.

 

[Marzipan]

Russ B is on my radar too, but Jared has supposedly never heard of him, according to an exchange I had with the blogger Joy. Briefly, I felt very strongly that several signs pointed to him. But this was all highly circumstantial and intuition, and I am not psychic. Still, he remains of interest to me.

 

[Jbrown324320]

I could not find a criminal record for RB in mn. This would be a bold crime for someone without a background. Unless he goes by a different name.

 

[Sasquatch321]

I could not find a criminal record for RB in mn. This would be a bold crime for someone without a background. Unless he goes by a different name.

For 14 years investigators concentrated on over 8,000 suspects, until in 2004 when the bombshell that no vehicle was ever involved. There just isn't anybody or anything much to look for anymore beyond the farm.

 

[ELOCsoul]

For 14 years investigators concentrated on over 8,000 suspects, until in 2004 when the bombshell that no vehicle was ever involved. There just isn't anybody or anything much to look for anymore beyond the farm.

To clarify. The use of a car has never been ruled out in Jacobs abduction. LE did say that possibility was diminished after Kevin came forward, but that is far from saying it's been ruled out.

That being said I concur that DR being involved either as the perp or an accessory is the most likely solution. However I base that on other bits of information more so than on Kevin's statement. Note that Kevin came forward In October 2003, it was four months later that LE went public with that information and their shift in the theory of the case.

The primary mistake made in Jacobs investigation, IMO, was the early assumptions that Jacobs and Jareds cases were related. I think that may have negatively impacted both cases.

 

[Sasquatch321]

Well there was two ways to go, down the road or back into the farm. I just think if there was the vehicle this case would be solved years ago.

 

[Sasquatch321]

There is so many things that play against a vehicle used-

1. Gravel driveway, perpetrator would know he would leave tracks.
2. Someone elses driveway, too risky to leave the vehicle and wait and take jacob and come back without thinking the farmer might be there or watching by now.
3. One way escape-dead end road
4. Sunday night in 1989 would virtually have no traffic and anyone driving that night around there would stick out like a sore thumb.
5. There was never a vehicle seen or heard in the first place.

 

[Trackergd]

I am starting to think that the auto tracks and possibly the foot prints are a dead end as I have recently seen a picture where the police are standing directly on the evidence. It is beyond my ability to fathom why they would do something like that.

Adding to that the fact even if I had good print photo's to work from, the shoes that go with them are long gone.

 

[thenotebook]

Has everyone read Joy's latest blog entry? What's your take on the Paynesville cases? Do you think they are related to Jacob??

 

[cGorg]

There is so many things that play against a vehicle used-

1. Gravel driveway, perpetrator would know he would leave tracks.
2. Someone elses driveway, too risky to leave the vehicle and wait and take jacob and come back without thinking the farmer might be there or watching by now.
3. One way escape-dead end road
4. Sunday night in 1989 would virtually have no traffic and anyone driving that night around there would stick out like a sore thumb.
5. There was never a vehicle seen or heard in the first place.

Just playing devil's advocate here...IDK if a vehicle was used or not....

1. Gravel driveway: yes risky by leaving tracks but it was a working farm with only 1 entrance...there would be multiple tracks as a matter of course. LE never did identify Kevin's tracks as far as I can tell at least not until 2003 when Kevin came forward. And as far as I understand it, he said the tires were new at the time- so that's all they had to go on after 14 years as it's doubtful Kevin had the same tires.
2. Farmer's driveway: again, risky but maybe the perp couldn't see the farmhouse? Even so, if the farmer came home then the perp would be caught with a vehicle on the driveway. Again, risky but not implausible. The big risk IMO would be getting caught by a passing car during the abduction itself but this could have happened while on foot as well.
3. 1 way dead end: not if the perp positioned the car so he could exit from whence he came.
4. Sunday night limited or no traffic: goes in his favor in that nobody to see him.
5. Never a vehicle seen or heard: the boys stated they didn't see one. IMHO, a car could have been positioned 40 yards to the east and they wouldn't have seen it as it was so dark. However, it's been shown that there were cars that passed the boys on the way to Tom Thumb. It seems to me the occasional car passing on 16th would not be an anomaly-there could easily be neighbors from the Wetterling's neighborhood going to/fro.

 

[cGorg]

I am starting to think that the auto tracks and possibly the foot prints are a dead end as I have recently seen a picture where the police are standing directly on the evidence. It is beyond my ability to fathom why they would do something like that.

Adding to that the fact even if I had good print photo's to work from, the shoes that go with them are long gone.

I agree and think we'll never know anything for sure until the case is solved or LE is more forthcoming with info.