MO - Furious Friends Demand Answers After 3 Men Found Dead at Kansas City Home Days After Watching Football Game, January 2024 #2

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I feel pretty certain although their families say they don't use drugs, that there were substances on board that night. Why else would we be weeks out with no answers, waiting on the toxicology reports with no reports of any environmental issues at the house?
 
I admit I am confused at the attempts to normalize and explain away the behavior of a grown man, gainfully employed by all accounts, spending 2 work days in bed, not answering the pounding on his door or other attempts to get in touch with him.

I also work from home and have spent days not leaving the house. But working from home generally means you are attached to your phone/laptop and in fairly constant contact with others.

Not saying he is guilty of anything but his behavior was anything but normal.
 
Dear friends, be aware. These are 4 known facts of life about fentanyl:
1. DEA Warns of Increase in Mass-Overdose Events Involving Deadly Fentanyl
Sourced DEA dot gov
https://www.dea.gov/press-releases/...ass-overdose-events-involving-deadly-fentanyl
“the Drug Enforcement Administration sent a letter to federal, state, and local law enforcement partners warning of a nationwide spike in fentanyl-related mass-overdose events.”

This means, everything else equal, cases of multiple people killed simultaneously after taking fentanyl are getting more common.
Mass deaths similar to what happened to the 3 Kansas football fans are more common.
But we do not know yet if fentanyl was involved in this Kansas case.

2. Fentanyl may impair breathing minutes before its sedative effect kicks in
Sourced at medical news today dot com
Opioids: How fentanyl affects the brain and impairs breathing”

This means, everything else equal, most people who take fentanyl want to go outdoor to get fresh air and catch their breath BEFORE they fall asleep.

3. There are cases of Mass-Overdose Events when those who go outside died and those who stayed indoor survived
Sourced ABC news dot com
abcnews.go.com

At least 3 dead in Pittsburgh drug-overdose horror

At least three people died and four others were hospitalized in serious to critical condition after overdosing on drugs in Pittsburgh.
abcnews.go.com abcnews.go.com
“At least 3 dead in Pittsburgh drug-overdose horror [...]
One man was found passed out in the street outside the apartment building and later died, police said at a news conference. Another victim was found unresponsive in an elevator, according to authorities. When police officers went inside the apartment where the drugs were allegedly taken, they found five other people in need of medical assistance, authorities said.”

This means, everything else equal after taking fentanyl, 1) the most respiratory distressed went out and died but 2) those less distressed who did not need fresh air stayed indoor and survived.

4. Fentanyl is similar to morphine and heroin, but is 50 to 100 times more potent
Fentanyl Exposure Risks for Law Enforcement and Emergency Response Workers
Sourced at cdc dot gov
Fentanyl Exposure Risks for Law Enforcement and Emergency Response Workers | Blogs | CDC
“Fentanyl is a powerful synthetic drug that is similar to morphine and heroin, but is 50 to 100 times more potent. Fentanyl and its analogs, such as carfentanil, can pose a potential hazard to law enforcement, emergency medical personnel, and firefighters who could come into contact with these drugs through the course of their work day.”

This means, everything else equal: 1) for one “amount” of heroin that makes you fall asleep in 100 minutes, 2) the same “amount” of morphine will make you fall asleep in 50 minutes, and 3) the same “amount” of fentanyl will make you fall asleep in 1 minute!
This is how very dangerous fentanyl is.
You might fall asleep while driving within minutes of taking it!
(1st part -- shortened in 3 parts by me)
 
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Here is one thing I just keep coming back to...

Remember when this was a gathering to watch the football game?

Then it was an "after party" ...

To play video games? Watch jeopardy?

Idk?

I get that people just hang out to hang out, but they usually just say that's what they're doing if that is the case. Idk. Maybe it's just a reporter trying to quickly put a label on this gathering in only a few words.
 
neesaki said:
All excellent points, and thank you for bringing them up @December ….. especially when I‘m too tired to.
I also want to know about their phones, as well as what they showed re the communication.
And I 100% agree with you, that these family members are not exaggerating about the phone calls and texts that they sent to JW when they were frantically looking for their loved ones.
He can deny all he wants, but the records are records, even if he deleted them. It won’t matter they’ll still be there.

It was cold outside that night, so it is hard to believe they would go out there for any length of time without their coats.We can only speculate about what was going on, but…. what would all three of them go out there for, for a short time span, apparently expecting to come right back inside? I mean it was cold out.
Do you have any ideas?
Click to expand...
I assume that the room they were in was near the door to the outside because otherwise i have no explanation...

Smoke?
Vomit?
Felt weird and needed fresh air?

But, it's very hard to imagine everyone at once doing this and not coming back inside. I could see if one guy was feeling ill, maybe someone goes with him. But, the host would be the most likely person and he obviously came back inside. So.. idk.
 
These are 4 known facts and 4 unproven speculations about the 3 dead friends of JW:

1. We know that the deaths of Clayton McGeeney, 36, David Harrington, 37, and Ricky Johnson, 38, in the backyard of JW’s home are hurtful to their families. Condolences.
We do not know if fentanyl is involved or not, until toxicology report and postmortem results are released by Kansas City Police.

2. We knows that scientist JW allowed his dwelling to be used as a lounge for these 3 “friends.”
We speculate that the relentless accusations of crime against JW are resentments driven by the assumption that JW might have allowed his dwelling to be used as a den for doing “anything” dangerous these 3 dead “friends” would not do in their own home along with their children.

3. We know (from Daily Mail dot com interviews) that mystery fifth man AWL has a rap sheet that includes multiple drug offenses from multiple dates at multiple locations.
We do not know if Mr. AWL has provided “anything” dangerous to the 4 party goers, or not.

4. We know (from Daily Mail dot com interviews) that Police told family members they (authorities) had to wait for the bodies to thaw out before they could do an autopsy.
We do not know yet if the individuals were alive but asleep (within minutes) or already dead before their bodies were frozen from 27 F temperature over 44 hours.

(2nd part -- shortened in 3 parts by me)
 
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IMHO, these are the 4 steps of what might have happened:

1. The 4 friends, scientist JW and his dead 3 fellows, agreed to use as a lounge JW’s residence such that they could do there “anything” dangerous involving fentanyl consumption as they would not dare to do fentanyl in their own homes where their dear women and children are present.
2. Either Mr. Fifth man or any of the 3 dead men procured the fentanyl. Mr. Fifth man is lawyering up because he has a rap sheet that involves illegal drugs.
3. JW was stoned, had enough, ushered his 3 friends to the door, and … felt asleep within minutes ... impaired for many hours. He is lucky to be alive! The other 3 friends decided to get the fentanyl stuff one more time before leaving. Fentanyl may have impair the breathing of one or more of the 3 dead men minutes before its sedative effect kicks in. Hence, they decided to get the nice 27F fresh air in the backyard after taking it.
4. They took the same “amount” of fentanyl as their familiar amount of morphine that will make them fall asleep in 50 minutes, or as their familiar amount of heroin that will make them fall asleep in 100 minutes. The amount of fentanyl made them fall asleep within minutes before they could get back inside the warmth of the house. Yet alive but asleep (within minutes) their bodies were frozen from 27 F temperature over 44 hours, causing their death.

This is the most likely scenario based on known facts and speculated similar circumstance.
But there could be other weirder scenarios.
(The last 3rd shortened part, to ease reading)
 
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SMK777 said:
So his actual phone records reveal he never checked messages….
Click to expand...
I don't know about that being in concrete. I've check messages without returning a message to anyone, quite often at night.

Wasn't it said some of the messaging was set up the people knew sending messages knew JW had viewed them? Is that something an iPhone does, my Android doesn't?
 
About the only thing I really believe, except for things that have been proven (the guys who died), is that JW (at some point) fell very soundly asleep. The couch thing comes from someone saying he fell asleep on his couch. But, he could have relocated to his bedroom at any time.

Every half-way normal explanation works perfectly fine for one guy, but three guys? Two of whom worked in construction which involves climbing and (usually) being outside.

As for drinking, most drunks want to be in their cars. That's why the whole "take their keys away" PSAs started. I have actually known people try to start their car with their house keys. Then fall asleep in the (parked) car. I was in a fraternity. I don't know anyone who would do that now, but still. If JW was asleep and there was nothing to do but watch Jeopardy, the mystery is how none of them were in a car.

Is it possible to check stomach contents on a frozen person?
 
sunshineray said:
I don't know about that being in concrete. I've check messages without returning a message to anyone, quite often at night.

Wasn't it said some of the messaging was set up the people knew sending messages knew JW had viewed them? Is that something an iPhone does, my Android doesn't?
Click to expand...
I wonder if he is one of those people who automatically block calls from numbers they don't recognize. I'm not saying he is, but that would explain some things.
 
iamshadow21 said:
RSBM

Absolutely. They were able to discern the stomach contents of Ötzi with great precision, a man two days dead is no problem. They'd just have to let him thaw a little, first.

en.m.wikipedia.org

Ötzi - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org

MOO
Click to expand...
Oh, thank you for reminding me of that.

I just have the weird feeling that will shed some light on things. Well, to authorities. I feel so bad for the families.
 
I believe the first step in doing an autopsy of a frozen body is to let the bodies thaw at fridge like temperatures. I expect the results to be more reliable as the freezing prevents tissue degradation.

I believe most LE officers are skilled at detecting deception so unless JW is a world-class actor pulling off his charade with his boxers and empty glass of wine is very difficult to fake the surprise of seeing a dead friend in your back porch.
 
CrimeDawg123 said:
I admit I am confused at the attempts to normalize and explain away the behavior of a grown man, gainfully employed by all accounts, spending 2 work days in bed, not answering the pounding on his door or other attempts to get in touch with him.

I also work from home and have spent days not leaving the house. But working from home generally means you are attached to your phone/laptop and in fairly constant contact with others.

Not saying he is guilty of anything but his behavior was anything but normal.
Click to expand...
I think "the attempts to normalize and explain away the behavior of a grown man..." simply illustrate that "normal" means vastly different things to different people. Work and lifestyles in general are much more varied than they were, say, 50 years ago.

These days, every work-from-home job doesn't necessarily involve being in "fairly constant contact with others" by phone or laptop. It depends on the nature of the work. (And sometimes on the paranoia of managers who fear people working from home aren't really working!) I'd expect a scientific research job like JW's would not involve constant contact as much of that kind of work is likely solitary. And IMO for some people it's probably possible to be more productive without all that forced "constant contact" with others!

JW's kind of job is also not necessarily a M-F job. So "missing two workdays" (assuming he did) may not have been an issue. Most likely JW's work performance is judged on his output, not whether he "clocked in" on time each day. If his work was going well, he may have been free to work on weekends (& not for any overtime pay) and then been able to take time off the next week. I admit we don't know how his particular job was structured but I'd be shocked if he was expect to yak on the phone constantly or have frequent Zoom meetings with colleagues.

People also vary in how much contact with others they feel they need and want. Some people seem to be saying not seeing anyone for two whole days is unheard of for a normal adult, that something had to be wrong for that to ever happen. And, for them, two days of solitude is not normal. But it IS normal for other people. For example, true introverts don't constantly seek out the company of others. They enjoy meaningful friendships and interactions with friends and relatives but also need "alone time," time that may include not checking email, texts, Fb and so on. Not seeing anyone or communicating electronically for two days can be entirely normal for them especially following a social gathering that lasted for many hours. A person who needs that degree of periodic solitude may well be drawn to the sort of job JW appears to have. OTOH, people who crave frequent interactions with others might consider that sort of job quite unpleasant and "not normal." They may also find it inconceivable someone wouldn't constantly check their phone for messages.
MOO
 
Seni said:
Just wondering, what does it cost? To do a big hit? Would cocaine be the most expensive? Fentanyl the cheaper?
Click to expand...
RSBM

This says cocaine runs around $120/gm as of 2019 in the US, so today it's probably anywhere between that and $200/gm. dp-drug-prices | dataUNODC

Cocaine and fentanyl are very different drugs with vastly different effects -- IMO, a person using a substance desires a very specific effect and wouldn't substitute a "downer" for an "upper". Fentanyl comes into the picture because drug dealers use it to cut their product, which increases the quantity they have to sell and in turn increases their profits.

abcnews.go.com

If fentanyl is so deadly, why do drug dealers use it to lace illicit drugs?

Fentanyl is now being laced in traditional opioids like oxycodone and heroin, and increasingly, in non-opioids like cocaine and various counterfeit pills.
abcnews.go.com abcnews.go.com
 
I haven't read the whole thread, but wouldn't a tox screen tell us if they were drunk or on drugs that killed them? This whole story is weird, it just doesn't make sense to me. I will be curious to see how this ends up. i looked at the picture of the porch area, and they could have just kicked in the window to get in if they were in distress. I don't think that is where they died, outside... JMO I don't know what happened but none of this makes sense to me.
 
Skully said:
I haven't read the whole thread, but wouldn't a tox screen tell us if they were drunk or on drugs that killed them? This whole story is weird, it just doesn't make sense to me. I will be curious to see how this ends up. i looked at the picture of the porch area, and they could have just kicked in the window to get in if they were in distress. I don't think that is where they died, outside... JMO I don't know what happened but none of this makes sense to me.
Click to expand...
If it was fentanyl poisoning, there would be no distress. Just sudden passing out. Probably all about about the same time.
 
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