IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #16

[mamamia54]

I am beginning to believe that LS is in the immediate area but for some strange reason has not been found. Locals, could this be? I remember a case over two decades ago on Long Island. Young newlywed, Robert Solomon, claimed his wife had gone for a walk and was now missing. When her body wasn't "discovered" quick enough; Robert, went into the woods himself and found his wife in a plastic trash bag. He was convicted of her murder and has not since been granted parole. My point is that even in the event of foul play, there may have been no intent to take the body far. But then, why haven't the searcher's come across anything? Wish I could have searched.

This is what has been bothering me lately. I've thought about places that weren't necessarily searched right away, or ever that we know of. I don't know if the underground sewer system was searched but that's one.

 

[mamamia54]

And I really don't care that LE did overhead searches with infrared to attempt to find a warm body on the ground, good both feet on the ground searches are still so very important. They say that's been done, and still no Lauren.

 

[Blythe]

This is what has been bothering me lately. I've thought about places that weren't necessarily searched right away, or ever that we know of. I don't know if the underground sewer system was searched but that's one.

I'm with you here to the point of having restless nights over it. At this point she must be found, whether justice will ever be served or not. Find Lauren!

 

[J1981]

Why then do you think police at a briefing said he was cooperating, when they won't say the same of others?

I believe he WAS cooperating. Is he still? Who knows. Seems like JW did at the beginning. The rest never did. Doesn't bode well for anyone IMO.

 

[elmomom]

I am beginning to believe that LS is in the immediate area but for some strange reason has not been found. Locals, could this be? I remember a case over two decades ago on Long Island. Young newlywed, Robert Solomon, claimed his wife had gone for a walk and was now missing. When her body wasn't "discovered" quick enough; Robert, went into the woods himself and found his wife in a plastic trash bag. He was convicted of her murder and has not since been granted parole. My point is that even in the event of foul play, there may have been no intent to take the body far. But then, why haven't the searcher's come across anything? Wish I could have searched.

I'm not beginning to believe this, I have believed it all along. I cannot imagine a scenario where she is far away - whether she was abducted, or had an accidental death and her body was dumped or she wandered off and fell into a rabbit hole. I pretty much think that even the rabbit hole would end up being nearby.

 

[Walker]

As we know from multiple sources, LS had a heart condition.

And, many people have suggested that she was abusing illicit drugs in the early morning hours of 6/3.

Usually death by OD comes only after many smaller but less deadly crises.

But there is no suggestion of a history of such episodes.

Possibly the accounts of LS taking drugs that morning were exaggerated.


These accounts all seem to have come after LS's disappearance. To the extent that I have seen, none came before.

For example, we did NOT see any FaceBook that sounded like: "LS was 'on a mission to party' AGAIN, just like last Thursday. We had to carry her home AGAIN ...."


Also, the word "party" also has a more innocent sense of just socializing.

We need to examine the sense of the word in the context of LS's social group. How did they use the word?

Quote from HT formerly quoted by TG (which seems to only exist in cache, and on forums now; has it been removed from the net?):

“She is just a fun and smart girl who loves hanging out and partying, but unfortunately it went too far this time. ..."

If the word "to party" exclusively means "to take hard drugs," why would another student just nonchalantly mention "... she loves [doing hard drugs] ..."

JMO: HT meant that LS liked to socialize.

And, socializing did not necessarily include hard drugs.

 

[Barry]

A stranger abduction could have her being anywhere. However, I am still leaning towards one or more of the POIs. That, I agree would make it likely that she is somewhere in the area.

 

[elmomom]

As we know from multiple sources, LS had a heart condition.

And, many people have suggested that she was abusing illicit drugs in the early morning hours of 6/3.

Usually death by OD comes only after many smaller but less deadly crises.

But there is no suggestion of a history of such episodes.

Possibly the accounts of LS taking drugs that morning were exaggerated.


These accounts all seem to have come after LS's disappearance. To the extent that I have seen, none came before.

For example, we did NOT see any FaceBook that sounded like: "LS was 'on a mission to party' AGAIN, just like last Thursday. We had to carry her home AGAIN ...."


Also, the word "party" also has a more innocent sense of just socializing.

We need to examine the sense of the word in the context of LS's social group. How did they use the word?

Quote from HT formerly quoted by TG (which seems to only exist in cache, and on forums now; has it been removed from the net?):

“She is just a fun and smart girl who loves hanging out and partying, but unfortunately it went too far this time. ..."

If the word "to party" exclusively means "to take hard drugs," why would another student just nonchalantly mention "... she loves [doing hard drugs] ..."

JMO: HT meant that LS liked to socialize.

And, socializing did not necessarily include hard drugs.

Walker,
just curious - did you happen to see the photo of Tamir with a pill in her mouth showing off at a party with shot glasses and liquor bottles and drinks covering the table in front of her? It's on TG's website. (you might have to go back a couple of pages or so)

eta: Never mind, I'll make it easy for you and add the link. A picture is worth a 1000 words..
http://tonygatto.wordpress.com/2011...e-to-stonewall-leave-hadar-and-i-out-of-this/

 

[Darcyline]

I appreciate Walker's thoughts, but also think it is really, really dangerous to perpetuate an idea that ODs normally happen after several other more minor, but still serious crises. ODs, by nature, can happen at literally any point of drug use including the very, very first time someone uses it. Plenty of people have died literally the first time ever using cocaine, heroin, meth, etc. Plenty of people have died after a few "perfect" uses where nothing bad happened at all and then for no rhyme or reason one night you OD instead of going home safely.

An Overdose does not discriminate between brand new users, experienced users, social users, etc. It can and will occur at random for anyone.

 

[docwho3]

. . .but just the notion that this girl left voluntarily and is alive and
well somewhere is just LUDICROUS! It is silly and a waste of time to even discuss it. . . .

Actually the idea that she might be alive & well is not ludicrous but
is truly a possibility until evidence surfaces to rule out that possibility.
In cases of missing adults there are almost always those who feel it is an
insult to the missing person to even consider an adult runaway scenario
and yet in many cases that has turned out to be the solution to the case
even in cases where there were circumstances that seemed to indicate
foul play, such as a a drop of blood on an abandoned vehicle
and/or the fact that leaving meant the missing person left children behind
etc.

People do runaway more often than they turn out to be victims of foul
play. Various LE have made that statement on more than one occasion.
(links are available.)

I am not saying this particular missing person is a runaway but I am saying
it is not a ludicrous possibility. I read the same sorts of remarks made
when that preacher's wife disappeared and when that mailman
disappeared and other cases as well & those were cases of runaway
& they even left children behind. The missing mailman case even involved
a drop of blood left behind on the abandoned vehicle and had
previously told his wife that he thought someone had followed his
mail vehicle on his route a time or two and his wallet was left behind.

To sum it up, stuff often happens that can look very much like foul play
and still turn out to be a runaway or accident so it is best to carefully
consider all theories until evidence surfaces to rule out those theories.

In this case we do not even have evidence that a crime actually
occurred. We have no blood, no body, no witness to an abduction
and nothing other than alleged lack of cooperation of her 'friends'
to indicate a crime occurred.

Perhaps LE has more evidence not made public but we do not have
any such evidence for our discussion.

I intend to consider all possibilies until evidence rules them out.

 

[ylime11]

Walker,
just curious - did you happen to see the photo of Tamir with a pill in her mouth showing off at a party with shot glasses and liquor bottles and drinks covering the table in front of her? It's on TG's website. (you might have to go back a couple of pages or so)

eta: Never mind, I'll make it easy for you and add the link. A picture is worth a 1000 words..
http://tonygatto.wordpress.com/2011...e-to-stonewall-leave-hadar-and-i-out-of-this/

Where do you see a pill in her mouth? I clicked on the link but I don't see a pill. Do you have an additional source?

 

[Jupiter812]

To hang out means to socialize; to party means to drink and do drugs. In this circle you can pretty much count on pot, Rx drugs, especially Xanax, and probably coke.

Hell, her head banging alone could truly have been enough to put her out. We know that from very recent research about head injuries.

 

[elmomom]

I agree that she could be alive, the one scenario that does come to mind is an abduction. I think the likelihood that she would have left intentionally is so infinitesimal that it hardly seems worth discussing. Other cases I don't have a problem considering that scenario.
What disturbs me more is that there are facts, like it or not, that give credence to the idea that LS was vulnerable that night. Whether it be vulnerable to an accidental death from substances she ingested, or whether she was abducted because she was out alone at 4:30 and likely intoxicated. Her parents pleas are directly to the friends, and the quote "shame on you" is directed at the person who harmed LS. There are no facts, rumors or any outside speculation that LS is gone by choice, yet since it is a preferable outcome, it seems some would rather talk about it than that of the much more likely outcomes. I wish we lived in the kind of world that let us choose only the preferable scenarios. We don't.

 

[Jupiter812]

Case in point re: head injuries

Natasha Richardson RIP

http://articles.cnn.com/2009-03-19/...erre-actress-natasha-richardson?_s=PM:SHOWBIZ

 

[elmomom]

Where do you see a pill in her mouth? I clicked on the link but I don't see a pill. Do you have an additional source?

No, but maybe my monitor is clearer than yours. I have no problem seeing a white pill on her tongue.

 

[Walker]

With the moderator's permission, I would just like to clarify one of my theories, the runaway theory.

It has been brought to my attention that some people may have misunderstood my suggestion.

Because there are other theories out there, maybe they sort of run together in people's minds.

In any case, please note that I most certainly did not intend to imply that LS had any involvement with a criminal gang based in Israel, nor was I considering that she had been a victim of such a gang.

Reviewing my posts will confirm that what I meant to suggest is this scenario: Let's imagine a young, sensitive, perhaps idealistic person who decides to start a new life in a different place. She has just returned recently from another country. She may decide of her own accord to return there or to some other place which she feels favorably toward.

Remember the adult run-away deserves compassion. Judging them as necessarily hating their family or being irresponsible is not fair. The phenomenon is not well-understood. Because an adult running away involves private and often family issues, the public is almost never given a complete explanation in such cases.

A few years ago, we had one such case in my region. Luckily the young missing woman was found, partly as a result of the publicity surrounding the case. After she was found, the family asked people not to continue to make inquiries, since they needed their privacy. Of course, their request was well-justified.

We can see that by the very nature of this behavior, we cannot easily understand the motives. And, we should therefore withhold judgement.


Thank you for allowing me to clear up this misunderstanding.

 

[Darcyline]

It definitely looks like something white on her tongue to me too, but we could be imagining it. I say that seriously-remember the white truck where people on facebook were posting that they saw Lauren's face clearly and her being pinned down by a Mexican man. Turned out to be paint supplies. Sight is a funny thing sometimes.

 

[elmomom]

There's no point in having this discussion, I will agree to disagree. I lived this life way back in college, as many of us did, and managed to grow up and out of it quite well. If you all would prefer to ignore anything to do with drugs (of which alcohol is perhaps the most debilitating), do not fear, I won't try and burst that bubble any longer, as I don't see the point.

 

[bessie]

New thread coming in a few minutes.

 

[Jupiter812]

I don't understand the constant questioning of substance use? Does it offend sensibilities? There are just way too many signs, accounts, peer comments, parallels, you name it, to think otherwise. This group likes to drink and drug just like countless others in their age group.