MO - Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #4

[marge_rita]

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-parents-stop-cooperating-making-lists/story?id=14679914

Adds just a little more light on the case. Released an hour ago.

 

[Soulmagent]

Excuse me, but if you were innocent, how would you know LE was wasting its time?

Everyone has a choice but they also shouldn't be surprised if their choice leads to criminal charges.

JMO

Well if they didnt find finger prints the first 2 times and then wanted to look again ,I might think they hadnt done a good job searching if even they might have missed something I would feel they shouldnt have. If they searched my house 3 times and then told me I failed a polly which I had no reason to fail then I would call them shoddy.
If I was innocent. All searchers of my home would stop because I would feel they were not looking for my baby but trying to convict me.

I wouldnt be able to set aside my emotions and accept they must suspect me ,and my family just as much as anyone and the thought they might lie to me to "test" me wouldnt occur to me . I would have went in expecting to be believed and leaning on the sheriffs office to hold me up and investigate who did this ,and I would get mad when I realized it was me who they were wasting time investigating and the more time they wasted not looking at the real suspect or for one would upset me greatly.Then to be asked to hold back information that might be helpful in somebody finding my child..I dont know that I would cooperate with that.

Investigate them the old fashion way and leave out the modern use of the media agaisnt the parent which as we have seen can harm a resolution and actualy cause harm to other families when no one thinks a girl really got snatched by a stranger in her town because "the moms boyfriend did it " and it is safe to jog alone. It isnt.

The last few complex cases such as Trenton Duckett.. Haleigh Cummings,Haily Dunn (there are many examples) the media has been used as a way to envoke responces from the parents by LE presenting a poor image of the parent making them look like suspects. Either they say it or they dont it still reflects that way and the masses of media messes contort it over and over until Nancy grace is screaming every thing the parents do is a horrible crime and the biggest bombshell on the planet.

 

[tiredblondy]

@PeterAlexander NBC News
Peter Alexander
Irwin family says police told #LisaIrwin's mom she failed lie detector test, but says police offered no evidence.
44 minutes ago via Twitter

http://twitter.com/#!/PeterAlexander/status/122132904280211457

An unidentified man who later answered the door at the house only said "Thank you" when asked what the family had to say to the people helping to search for their missing child.

The family of Lisa Irwin's parents in Independence told FOX 4 News that the family has done all they can to help police in the search for their child, and that they don't blame them for not wanting to talk any more to police.

In a statement to the media earlier in the day, Jeremy Irwin's sister disputed the police claim that the couple had stopped cooperating with detectives.

"We want the public to know we have never stopped cooperating with police," she said in a prepared statement. She said that the parents plan on releasing a statement on Friday.

The news comes after police were able to find no new clues into her disappearance, despite word that the girl's parents told police that three cell phones were missing from the home.
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-lis...rch-for-missing-baby-20111006,0,2371703.story

Okey Dokey, I think that about covers it.

I cannot find the reference to the family telling one reporter that they couldn't talk to them because they had made a media deal. Maybe someone else can find that one??

 

[MyBelle]

I always hate it when the family either has a spokesperson or media consultant. I want to hear straight from the family.

MOO

So does the media. Especially so if the family stops cooperating with police.

JMO

 

[JeannieC]

Are you suggesting the LE spokesman was involved in Lisa's disappearance? Sorry, that's too far a leap for me to make. Until proven otherwise, I think the parents are still the focus, not the investigators.

JMO

That's a pretty big stretch from what I said don't you think? I in no way said anything to that affect.

I said maybe the problem between the family and LE wasn't only the family's fault!

Please go back and reread my post.

moo

 

[marge_rita]

From the reports in this case, it sounds as though one of LE's very first steps in this case was to search neighbor's homes. If that had taken place in the Lunsford case, she may have been found alive. I'd like to think LE has learned from previous cases what to do and what not to do.

JMO

MyBelle,
Totally agree with you about the Lunsford case.
Didn't LE later go to the home when JC had HL in the closet?

Sorry for OT question.


Any word on scent dogs or cadaver dogs being used in the neighborhood? tia

imo

 

[mikeysmommom]

You're thinking of Susan Smith? She didn't fail her poly but it was inconclusive and LE took it from there because she still spoke to them.

JMO

Le knew she was lying right away, she said her car was only one on the road when she stopped at the red light.That light only turns red when other cars drive thru intersection,otherwise it stays green.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Media relations people are the same as spokesperson in the media where I spent my career. Really is a moot point because the only spokesperson for this family apparently is a member of the family, not a "paid professional."

JMO

But they aren't the same thing.

A spokesperson would be the person who goes in front of the camera and reads a statement from the family.

A media relations person would be the one who coordinates the parents' TV appearance so the parents can read the statement.

The media relations person does not speak for the family. They just help the family out with all the media offers.

 

[MyBelle]

Well if they didnt find finger prints the first 2 times and then wanted to look again ,I might think they hadnt done a good job searching if even they might have missed something I would feel they shouldnt have. If they searched my house 3 times and then told me I failed a polly which I had no reason to fail then I would call them shoddy.
If I was innocent. All searchers of my home would stop because I would feel they were not looking for my baby but trying to convict me.

I wouldnt be able to set aside my emotions and accept they must suspect me ,and my family just as much as anyone and the thought they might lie to me to "test" me wouldnt occur to me . I would have went in expecting to be believed and leaning on the sheriffs office to hold me up and investigate who did this ,and I would get mad when I realized it was me who they were wasting time investigating and the more time they wasted not looking at the real suspect or for one would upset me greatly.Then to be asked to hold back information that might be helpful in somebody finding my child..I dont know that I would cooperate with that.

Investigate them the old fashion way and leave out the modern use of the media agaisnt the parent which as we have seen can harm a resolution and actualy cause harm to other families when no one thinks a girl really got snatched by a stranger in her town because "the moms boyfriend did it " and it is safe to jog alone. It isnt.

The last few complex cases such as Trenton Duckett.. Haleigh Cummings,Haily Dunn (there are many examples) the media has been used as a way to envoke responces from the parents by LE presenting a poor image of the parent making them look like suspects. Either they say it or they dont it still reflects that way and the masses of media messes contort it over and over until Nancy grace is screaming every thing the parents do is a horrible crime and the biggest bombshell on the planet.

With all due respect, we do not know if the mother in this case "had no reason to fail" a poly.

If I were in her shoes, I would insist it was a mistake and ask for another.

JMO

 

[mrsu]

I don't see how getting a "deal" whatever that means ($$) with a major network is going to help find this baby locally when the police are the ones who will need to investigate. Why not just say whatever they need to say TO police? :waitasec:

Also, could it be that Debbie was told she failed the lie detector test. LE wanted to ask her more questions, and she refused because she wanted to see the results of the first test. In turn, not cooperating.

Does LE ever offer proof of failing?

 

[tiredblondy]

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-baby-lisa-parents-stop-cooperating-making-lists/story?id=14679914

Adds just a little more light on the case. Released an hour ago.

In the video referenced above it states an FBI team descends on the home to investigate...

 

[MyBelle]

But they aren't the same thing.

A spokesperson would be the person who goes in front of the camera and reads a statement from the family.

A media relations person would be the one who coordinates the parents' TV appearance so the parents can read the statement.

The media relations person does not speak for the family. They just help the family out with all the media offers.

A media relations person is a paid professional. Every publicly traded company in America has media relations staffers.

A spokesperson who is a member of family speaking on their behalf isn't a professional. The media knows the difference. In this case, the parents have spoken directly to the media. If they've now lawyered up, they would be wise to only have their lawyer speak for them or say nothing at all.

JMO

 

[Lera213]

Okey Dokey, I think that about covers it.

I cannot find the reference to the family telling one reporter that they couldn't talk to them because they had made a media deal. Maybe someone else can find that one??

http://www.fox4kc.com/videobeta/127...-Family-of-Missing-Baby-No-Longer-Cooperating

 

[tiredblondy]

http://www.fox4kc.com/videobeta/127...-Family-of-Missing-Baby-No-Longer-Cooperating

Thanks Lera !

 

[MyBelle]

I don't see how getting a "deal" whatever that means ($$) with a major network is going to help find this baby locally when the police are the ones who will need to investigate. Why not just say whatever they need to say TO police? :waitasec:

Also, could it be that Debbie was told she failed the lie detector test. LE wanted to ask her more questions, and she refused because she wanted to see the results of the first test. In turn, not cooperating.

Does LE ever offer proof of failing?

Why would LE offer proof? Don't forget, LE can also lie about it and maybe they have done so in this case in order to drive a wedge between the parents?

JMO

 

[CHICANA]

innocent people can not always be cleared by le no matter how hard they try.

this evening, a police spokesman wagered anyone to try to think of something that they haven't tried yet and if they have decided to try to squeeze mom -not because they have evidence against her - but because she was the last known adult to see lisa - i'm sure the parents would think they should be spending their resources on finding lisa and I don't blame them.

for the record - I don't think mom failed a lie detector and i don't doubt she was told she did.

For the record, if I was told that I had failed a poly & I knew I was innocent, I would probably hire an attorney also.
Honestly, I can't get a good 'feel' for this case regarding the parent's involvement if any.

 

[mrsu]

Something just does not add up for me.

I wonder if LE has known something regarding the parents from the beginning. They have been very in your face about saying the parents had cooperated and that their stories had no holes. It was mentioned at nearly every press conference. I'm thinking they were hoping the parents would feel a false sense of security and spill something. Obviously, if it's true that the mother failed the LD test, her story did have holes.

The original Amber Alert with no car or suspect description
Calling off the AA so soon
No call for public to come help search
Several days focused on the family's house
Several bags/boxes of stuff removed from the home
Searching of the same area 3x
No random road blocks/car searches (especially within the neighborhood)
Sudden closure of command center
Putting family on blast publicly

Something's not right here.

 

[jadejazzkayla]

That's the contradiction I was pointing out. Look at this post from Day 1.
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - MO MO - AMBER ALERT: Lisa Irwin, 10 months, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011 - #1

here is the post....
http://www.kmbc.com/video/29383532/detail.html

update video

~gives parents first names

~aunt reports that they LE has taken parents' cell phones

===========================

the poster was giving snippets of the video. after listening to the reporter's video what was said was....the aunt said that the police told her that they (the police) did take the parents cell phones.

======================

it could have been that police asked the parents permission to search their cell phones and the parents said yes.

now we know that the cell phones are physically unavailable to be searched but the freely given permission would still be there for police to quickly get their records from the cell phone provider - no search warrant needed.

 

[tiredblondy]

I agree Mrsu, Something's not right here.

I've got an idea but not sure I want to state it just yet. Matter of fact, I'm going to bed. Night all

 

[MaciBean]

Something just does not add up for me.

I wonder if LE has known something regarding the parents from the beginning. They have been very in your face about saying the parents had cooperated and that their stories had no holes. It was mentioned at nearly every press conference. I'm thinking they were hoping the parents would feel a false sense of security and spill something. Obviously, if it's true that the mother failed the LD test, her story did have holes.

The original Amber Alert with no car or suspect description
Calling off the AA so soon
No call for public to come help search
Several days focused on the family's house
Several bags/boxes of stuff removed from the home
Searching of the same area 3x
No random road blocks/car searches (especially within the neighborhood)
Sudden closure of command center
Putting family on blast publicly

Something's not right here.

In this area of the country, it seems as if our LE always assume guilt before innocence. They're so used to dealing with meth heads that they forget how a REAL investigation is supposed to go. IMO