Australia Samantha Murphy, 51, last seen leaving her property to go for a run in the Canadian State Forest, Ballarat 100km NW of Melbourne, 4 Feb 2024 #7

[StillDiggin]

desperate search continues for a mother-of-three who vanished without a trace after heading off on a 20km run during a heatwave.

Samantha Murphy, 51, was last seen leaving her home on Eureka Street in Ballarat East, about 100km northwest of Melbourne, at 7am on Sunday.

It's understood she was planning to run through the Canadian State Forest and was captured on CCTV wearing a brown singlet and black half-length leggings.

The mother-of-three has now been missing for almost 36 hours

Her 'upset and concerned' family hold grave concerns and described her disappearance as out of character.

Grave fears for mum missing for 36 hours

Samantha Murphy, 51, was last seen leaving her home on Eureka Street in Ballarat East, about 100km northwest of Melbourne, at 7am on Sunday. She's still missing 36 hours later.

www.dailymail.co.uk

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[Knitty]

IMPORTANT

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10. Sub judice contempt: restricting the publication of prejudicial information

 

[Knitty]

If you are new and haven't ever read our rules, or if you have been here awhile and you need a review, please take a look at the links below this post.

Please continue here.

 

[Waverider]

I was initially questioning the intention to kill because LE have stated this was a deliberate attack.

Could deliberate mean deliberately driving under the influence knowing you're at risk to others? Or deliberately concealing a body and not reporting it?

Perhaps they've worded it this way and charged the accused with straight up murder because he's illegally driving on drugs, killed SM in the process and then concealed her body instead of calling authorities... Sorry I'm just trying to make sense of this theory and the legal jargon as I know many want this theory to be disregarded because LE state it's not a hit and run as such. IMO.

No - by ‘deliberately’, police mean that the accused had the intention to kill SM or cause her serious harm, and therefore the charge is for murder.

Deliberately driving under the influence of alcohol / drugs and unintentionally killing someone in the process amounts to manslaughter, since there was no intention to kill, although there was an intention to take drugs/drink and then drive, with causing serious harm/death to a pedestrian being a reasonably foreseeable outcome from those actions.

If the charge is murder, then (assuming she was actually run over) either the claim is that she was killed by being intentionally run over, or she was run over and then further to this intentionally killed.

 

[drsleuth]

There are countless mineshafts in the area searched for signs of Samantha Murphy. This is what it's like inside them

Raymond Shaw says he has spent the past five-and-a-half weeks uncovering and exploring disused mine shafts in a determined effort to find anything that helps locate the Ballarat mum.

www.abc.net.au

Mr Shaw said he had located at least 100 mineshafts during his searches in Ballarat bushland during the past five weeks and he had been down about 60.

 

[Toowong(s)]

Question for Aristotle Picket from end of last thread:

Hi Aristotle, you said cars can’t access the area and that there is no suggestion the accused was in a car. Keen to understand more? Have you pinpointed the exact area? Sounds like you might be local, what is your theory? If the accused could not get his car near, how far has the accused carried a body to conceal the crime?

Presumably the car was involved at some stage, the police have seized the accused vehicle, and earlier appealed for info on damaged vehicles in the area. I do find it odd though that police have not released a detailed description of the car and asked for more sightings of that specific car.

Also I found just out of interest, another case where a “murder by vehicle” charge has been alleged. In Qld not Vic:

Millmerran crash: Car crash murder accused faces court

I’m not saying this is definitely what happened but for me (and I think some others?) it’s an open possibility, along with a deliberate attack NOT involving the vehicle. Keeping my options open, as I’m not sure I’m in a position to 100% know what police mean with the statements made in last weeks presser. Another presser would be good, journos might be able to reframe some of the questions this time around.

 

[Algorithm]

There are countless mineshafts in the area searched for signs of Samantha Murphy. This is what it's like inside them

Raymond Shaw says he has spent the past five-and-a-half weeks uncovering and exploring disused mine shafts in a determined effort to find anything that helps locate the Ballarat mum.

www.abc.net.au

Mr Shaw said he had located at least 100 mineshafts during his searches in Ballarat bushland during the past five weeks and he had been down about 60.

I’d be searching the mineshafts close to a road.
Putting my self in the accused’s shoes in getting rid of a body in a mineshaft, I would want to get it done very quickly so I wouldn’t be seen and I wouldn’t want to drag a body too far away from my vehicle.

In saying that, the accused may have had time to think and may have thought it would be too obvious using a mineshaft.

Wherever SM is, it would not be too far away from a road.

 

[Nifty]

The bush has been searched excessively in most parts, with the dog squad, helicopters with thermal imaging, fixed wing aircraft, drones, plus many hundreds of emergency search parties and volunteers etc...

But they still can't find her

Could she be in a mine shaft ? The accused would have had tools on his vehicle (electrician) plus some others to possibly
lift a grate off one of them, shovel etc

She could be buried at a property

or

She is not in the area

 

[bearbear]

reading yesterday that victoria police no longer have their own cadaver dogs, is it known if they borrowed some to search for sm?

 

[mondayschild]

Trying to find a mine in a haystack.

There has been a lot of focus on mines in media. The reality is that a lot of these mines will be quite narrow, variable depth (eg may have collapsed). The larger ones might have more substantial capping than a wire grate that would need extra equipment to remove.

However, given that there is a Ballarat precedent (earlier thread - Koby?) of disposing of body in a mine - perhaps that is why it remains a hot topic.

 

[Whatson]

You would think in this day and age, they would have some type of imaging machine that can screen the surrounds of a mine shaft to detect any recent ground disturbances at the entrance.

It would at least be somewhat helpful in narrowing down possible locations.

I'm sure they are onto it.

 

[SouthAussie]

I was just refreshing myself on how far it was into the bushland at Mt Macedon that Borce Ristevski dumped Karen. 'Not far' off a dirt track off Loch Road. Loch Road being a drivable dirt track itself. Karen was wedged between two logs and covered with dirt and leaves. This area had not been searched because it was 30km from Karen's home - the presumed place of her death. Link

Jill Meagher's killer dumped her in a shallow grave along the Black Hill Road roadside, obscured by two wattle trees. Again, unsearched, because it was a 45 min drive from where Jill disappeared. Link

I imagine that the police are checking how long the accused (in this case) was alone with no witnesses, how far he may have been able to drive in that time, and if any of the camping/exploring areas he is familiar with are within that range.

imo

 

[BreakingNews]

I’d be searching the mineshafts close to a road.
Putting my self in the accused’s shoes in getting rid of a body in a mineshaft, I would want to get it done very quickly so I wouldn’t be seen and I wouldn’t want to drag a body too far away from my vehicle.

In saying that, the accused may have had time to think and may have thought it would be too obvious using a mineshaft.

Wherever SM is, it would not be too far away from a road.

What bodies of water are close? I'm thinking sewerage treatment plants, dams, or rivers

 

[BreakingNews]

Re Jurors. I have been a juror on a high profile murder charge. I can assure everyone that this task was taken very seriously by each and every one of us. The judge was our best friend. I can understand occasionally a rouge juror digs up something on the internet. Probably because it is a huge decision to be making on only the information allowed in court. 12 people often unknown to each other are thrown together. They take this task with the utmost of professionalism. We were asked not to even watch the news. And none of us did. It is confronting enough in the jury room having to sort through the evidence and photos. Jurors just usually want to do the best job they can within the law.

 

[Ticktock84]

I was just refreshing myself on how far it was into the bushland at Mt Macedon that Borce Ristevski dumped Karen. 'Not far' off a dirt track off Loch Road. Loch Road being a drivable dirt track itself. Karen was wedged between two logs and covered with dirt and leaves. This area had not been searched because it was 30km from Karen's home - the presumed place of her death. Link

Jill Meagher's killer dumped her in a shallow grave along the Black Hill Road roadside, obscured by two wattle trees. Again, unsearched, because it was a 45 min drive from where Jill disappeared. Link

I imagine that the police are checking how long the accused (in this case) was alone with no witnesses, how far he may have been able to drive in that time, and if any of the camping/exploring areas he is familiar with are within that range.

imo

This is why I mentioned Lake Burrumbeet to see if it had been searched. It seems to be quite a popular spot to go for campers on busy warmer periods or long weekends, close enough to dispose of evidence but not an area where would be initially searched. I’m guessing this not being a long weekend not too many people if any would be camping there at that time.

 

[Toowong(s)]

reading yesterday that victoria police no longer have their own cadaver dogs, is it known if they borrowed some to search for sm?

Yes this article from yesterday’s media in Victoria, posted by another sleuther (thankyou!) in the previous thread is worth a read, it may be relevant for two reasons:
- seems to confirm there are indeed no cadaver dogs in Vic.
- alludes to criticism of police in that case (not SM) in the subsequent enquiry, for not responding as quickly as they might have in that search and rescue - refusing request for air search etc - consequently missed the person, who’s body was tragically located leaning against a tree by a farmer a month later.
May explain heightened response to SM, with air search launched within hours of MM reporting SM missing.

Coroner to recommend Victoria Police train cadaver dogs after search delays for SA woman Colleen South - ABC News

amp.abc.net.au

 

[Toowong(s)]

This is why I mentioned Lake Burrumbeet to see if it had been searched. It seems to be quite a popular spot to go for campers on busy warmer periods or long weekends, close enough to dispose of evidence but not an area where would be initially searched. I’m guessing this not being a long weekend not too many people if any would be camping there at that time.

I can’t recall seeing any pictures/footage in MSM of water bodies being searched by divers. Usually obligatory long lens / chopper footage media fodder in these cases. Another aspect of this case I find perplexing. Maybe it happened and maybe still happening but have not seen any coverage of diver searches in the MSM.

 

[Whatson]

I can’t recall seeing any pictures/footage in MSM of water bodies being searched by divers. Usually obligatory long lens / chopper footage media fodder in these cases. Another aspect of this case I find perplexing. Maybe it happened and maybe still happening but have not seen any coverage of diver searches in the MSM.

Yes the media typically will use a water body search just to get a new headline out and then rehash the info that's already been mentioned countless times.

 

[OptimusLime]

Yes this article from yesterday’s media in Victoria, posted by another sleuther (thankyou!) in the previous thread is worth a read, it may be relevant for two reasons:
- seems to confirm there are indeed no cadaver dogs in Vic.
- alludes to criticism of police in that case (not SM) in the subsequent enquiry, for not responding as quickly as they might have in that search and rescue - refusing request for air search etc - consequently missed the person, who’s body was tragically located leaning against a tree by a farmer a month later.
May explain heightened response to SM, with air search launched within hours of MM reporting SM missing.

Coroner to recommend Victoria Police train cadaver dogs after search delays for SA woman Colleen South - ABC News

amp.abc.net.au

My face when I read no cadaver dogs in Victoria
The coroner's reports are very well done in this country. I've read almost every one in Victoria/ NSW (medico- legal), but they do bring a lot of answers into the fold. (Especially Melissa Caddick).
My question is why don't they have cadaver dogs? Victoria has a population of almost 7 million.
Just read only two Australian states use them!

'A privilege being able to assist': Cadaver dogs are some of Australia's most specialised canines. How are they trained?

For those tasked with finding human bodies, the bond between specially trained cadaver dog and handler is vital — and the physical and mental exhaustion will likely be worth it, if it can bring closure to those grieving for a loved one.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Toowong(s)]

I was just refreshing myself on how far it was into the bushland at Mt Macedon that Borce Ristevski dumped Karen. 'Not far' off a dirt track off Loch Road. Loch Road being a drivable dirt track itself. Karen was wedged between two logs and covered with dirt and leaves. This area had not been searched because it was 30km from Karen's home - the presumed place of her death. Link

Jill Meagher's killer dumped her in a shallow grave along the Black Hill Road roadside, obscured by two wattle trees. Again, unsearched, because it was a 45 min drive from where Jill disappeared. Link

I imagine that the police are checking how long the accused (in this case) was alone with no witnesses, how far he may have been able to drive in that time, and if any of the camping/exploring areas he is familiar with are within that range.

imo

Southaussie, from what I can tell the accused had access to two, maybe even three houses and seemed to drift between them IMO:
- house sitting property (Scottsburn)
- parents house (Mt Clear)
- also recall mention in MSM that the accused maintained a “share house” but can’t find the link. This may be referencing the house sitting house, or another 3rd house with some mates?

So I’m thinking the accused could have been gone all day Sunday, and not be missed. Parents would think he’s at the Scottsburn house with GF, while GF would think he’s at Mt Clear with parents. Or crashed at the sharehouse, or a mates house. They’d have a fair idea a Saturday night bender was a possibility so neither household would have missed him all day, assuming he’s sleeping off the bender.

Throwing a third house in the mix, the possible share house, or a mates house even, would further cloud the accused whereabouts for the entire day on Sunday.

So IMO the accused could have travelled far and wide before being missed, maybe even into the evening on Sunday.

It would be fascinating to understand when he eventually resurfaced after the alleged bender. Did he make it to work on Monday, or still coming down from the bender.