Found Deceased FL - Madeline Soto, 13, Missing Child Alert, 13500 blk Town Loop Blvd, Orlando, 26 Feb 2024 *arrest* #6

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

No matter what happens going forward Js will likely spend her lifetime looking backwards at what she did or didn’t do. What she knew or didn’t on any aspect of her relationship with SS. That’s not harsh. That’s not me blaming her. That’s me saying that’s her reality whether or not she is charged criminally or not. There is no recovering from this in my view. I don’t find that anything other than her new harsh reality. I can’t imagine being her.

That is 100% true, I completely agree.
I misread your context, I read it as you were saying both situations were one and the same.

 

[Pruddennce]

Respectfully copied for focus

Let's take a trip to a scenario...
You are going to pick your daughter up from school, and you arrive, and no one is there. You maybe call her phone (or maybe not, if she already had seen it at home), you look around where she might be, with panic rising every minute, you call the school, no answering, they have all left. You email the teacher...

My version, edits bolded:

Let's take a trip to a scenario...
You are going to pick your daughter up from school, and you arrive, and no one is there. You text and when she doesn't reply, call her phone (or maybe not, if she already had seen it at home), but after there's no response either way, you march into that school to find out if anyone's seen her lately, because with her ADHD she might have gotten absorbed in something and lost track of time. Or forgotten to charge her phone.

My point being: the first logical thing that most people do when you arrive someplace to pick someone up, child or adult, and they don't emerge, is to enter the building to look for them.

There's no indication that she ever did this.

for me, it appears she did not go inside and check with anyone inside of the school when she first arrived and saw Madeline was not waiting outside for her. if she did, IMO, someone in the school would have provided some assistance. it is my understanding from the school website, they have a security office....in addition, all of the teachers wouldnt have been gone.

yes, first instinct is to see, as you stated, if Madeline got hung up, etc. again, as you said, this would apply to anyone you are tasked with picking up, child or adult.

some reports say she arrived at 4 originally, others are stating 4:30pm now. if she arrived at 4:30 there still would be activity, but thinned out of course. if at 4, she would be seeing all the kids pouring out at 4:04 and be waiting for a period of time and would know she didnt come out. in either timeframe, checking the school while it was still open, in that moment should have been her first stop...she was right there.

 

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

My point being: the first logical thing that most people do when you arrive someplace to pick someone up, child or adult, and they don't emerge, is to enter the building to look for them.

There's no indication that she ever did this.

If you have ever been at the school as a parent after"the rush," you would know the school is locked up after your child comes out late because they couldn't find (insert very important item). I have had five children, at this has happened at least 2 per child. When the parking lot was empty, you knew the admin had gone.ASAP.
OR
It's the same scenario, except she gets out, goes to the main doors and presses the buzzer, but there is no answer. She gets back in the car and panics.
Maybe she did go to the doors; maybe she didn't.

We all have different opinions on whether that means something nefarious or not.

 

[MassGuy]

If you have ever been at the school as a parent after"the rush," you would know the school is locked up after your child comes out late because they couldn't find (insert very important item). I have had five children, at this has happened at least 2 per child. When the parking lot was empty, you knew the admin had gone.ASAP.
OR
It's the same scenario, except she gets out, goes to the main doors and presses the buzzer, but there is no answer. She gets back in the car and panics.
Maybe she did go to the doors; maybe she didn't.

We all have different opinions on whether that means something nefarious or not.

MUM - Yes. I went to pick her up after school and she wasn't there, so I started driving around, maybe thinking she took a walk; maybe she decided to walk to my mum's office which is pretty close to the school as well, drove around and I didn't see anything. I drove back to the school, the school was closed. I emailed one of her teachers, they confirmed that she was absent all day. At that point is when I called 911 because I realised something was truly wrong.

courtesy of @Allabouttrial

So she doesn't mention trying the door, and only realizes the school is closed when she returns. No mention of calling the school, but she sends an email. I see all of these things as an effort to delay, otherwise, they run contrary to what everyone else would do in this situation; start in, move out.

Unless you already know she's not there...

 

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

MUM - Yes. I went to pick her up after school and she wasn't there, so I started driving around, maybe thinking she took a walk; maybe she decided to walk to my mum's office which is pretty close to the school as well, drove around and I didn't see anything. I drove back to the school, the school was closed. I emailed one of her teachers, they confirmed that she was absent all day. At that point is when I called 911 because I realised something was truly wrong.

courtesy of @Allabouttrial

So she doesn't mention trying the door, and only realizes the school is closed when she returns. No mention of calling the school, but she sends an email. I see all of these things as an effort to delay, otherwise, they run contrary to what everyone else would do in this situation; start in, move out.

Unless you already know she's not there...

I agree with your logic, except I feel there are too many factors that could still be at play. Looking at it critically, with what we know, it is still ambiguous.

 

[Rolypolyoly]

That's been my biggest hang-up with the theory that the mother was also involved. I understand the delay in charging HIM. But I don't believe law enforcement would let the mother remain free so they can "build their case". That case is useless if the mother does something drastic (read: self-harm) while free. The risks of allowing her to remain free outweigh the risk of prematurely detaining her. IMO.

Using the Gannon Stauch case as an example, during the trial we saw that LE had LS in their sights pretty much from the first visit in response to the 911 call, yet they didn't arrest her for weeks. In fact they let her leave the State, as it turned out giving her the opportunity to collect and then transport her victim's body across the country to dispose of him under a bridge in Florida, right under their noses, all while she was their prime suspect and they were building an airtight case.

 

[Universecalling]

MUM - Yes. I went to pick her up after school and she wasn't there, so I started driving around, maybe thinking she took a walk; maybe she decided to walk to my mum's office which is pretty close to the school as well, drove around and I didn't see anything. I drove back to the school, the school was closed. I emailed one of her teachers, they confirmed that she was absent all day. At that point is when I called 911 because I realised something was truly wrong.

courtesy of @Allabouttrial

So she doesn't mention trying the door, and only realizes the school is closed when she returns. No mention of calling the school, but she sends an email. I see all of these things as an effort to delay, otherwise, they run contrary to what everyone else would do in this situation; start in, move out.

Unless you already know she's not there...

The only time you don’t try the door or call the school is if you know you won’t get an answer. Because you know from experience. Something tells me this isn’t the first time she’s been 30 min late and Maddie waited at grandma’s work after school.
She seems disorganized and checked out, overall.

 

[Universecalling]

Harsh.
More than lessening my view that JS has social anxiety, which I am totally guessing as an unqualified mental health armchair nobody. (To me, the anxiety is clear in the videos), the fact she doesn't actually call herself (or maybe she did, and that call has not been released), yet is there giving details while her support and family call makes my view even stronger for social anxiety, anxiety, ADHD, autism, and so on and so forth.
Let's take a trip to a scenario...
You are going to pick your daughter up from school, and you arrive, and no one is there. You maybe call her phone (or maybe not, if she already had seen it at home), you look around where she might be, with panic rising every minute, you call the school, no answering, they have all left. You email the teacher (this is a very normal way to speak with kids' teachers these days; my son's teacher uses a teacher-parent messaging app, and she replies within 10 minutes), and you anxiously wait for the teacher to respond while maybe checking the comic book store and your mum's place of work around the corner. The teacher responds, your child was never at school.
Now, if she has nothing to do with this, the panic would be immense. I would be in stress response mode, and I would be fighting to not hyper-ventilate. I would call my husband, friends, and family. I would call 911 myself, BUT I can see myself asking my husband, friend, or family member to call any consecutive times. Why? Because I know for sure that if the police had not turned up after 30 minutes, I would be in full panic mode and would need support.
But JS has been very consistent in taking backstage; if she is socially anxious, this makes sense.

But besides that, if she really did not know what a monster SS was, and he manipulated her from the start, I really do not think she deserves the callousness of "And if she didn’t know, well, she will have to live with that too."

Although this is a very true 'fact,' her daughter was murdered/died, and she found out the man she maybe thought was her 'rock' was a lying, manipulating bag of garbage, and had hurt her daughter underneath her nose...
We may not have fallen for his stories, but maybe she did. Can you imagine the torture she will be going through for the rest of her life?
I completely understand that I have a view which is in the minority on ws, and I understand the majority have another view, and that view could be the truth. My view could be wrong, and if it is, I will say I was wrong, but as it stands, JS has not been named a suspect and has not been indicated to be involved in SS's depraved acts or her daughter's disappearance or murder.
We know SS is a disgusting monster. We do not KNOW that of JS. IF or YET.
Very much JMO
ETA:
I have HAD general anxiety and recognize some of the behaviours.

You seem like a person who is, while not a professional, well read in neurodivergence.
It is clear to me that you invest the time to understand the behaviors, strengths and challenges each mental health condition brings.

JS comes off, at times, as she’s weaponizing adhd and bipolar. I don’t know if it’s for validation, acceptance, or attention. Or just lack of knowledge because she’s going off of a google, one page job-aid listing top characteristics for adhd or other conditions.

 

[lightofmine99]

JS's possible mental state and emotional instability has been discussed at-length here.

I am not willing to just handwave or ignore someone's responsibility and parental failing because they happened to lack self-esteem to the point they let a man-child bum leech off them and be around their child for years. This is the harsh reality, but acknowledging it is not harsh.

Regardless of her level of culpability or lack thereof I don't think we have to "worry" she'll go to prison because she seems like a prime candidate for a sweet plea or immunity deal. Which there's a lot more I could say about that but I'm choosing not to. Personally I don't think she was directly involved in the "main event" but what we do know right know indicates, if anything, concealment after the fact.

 

[photographer4]

The only time you don’t try the door or call the school is if you know you won’t get an answer. Because you know from experience. Something tells me this isn’t the first time she’s been 30 min late and Maddie waited at grandma’s work after school.
She seems disorganized and checked out, overall.

Maddie - mom didn’t think she knew her own address. But mom DID think she may have gone to grans office. If she had done that before would JS not have mentioned it to LE or the media? She didn’t. Her being so vague as to what she did or didn’t do etc really makes me think she was lying through her teeth.

 

[ttjo]

Using the Gannon Stauch case as an example, during the trial we saw that LE had LS in their sights pretty much from the first visit in response to the 911 call, yet they didn't arrest her for weeks. In fact they let her leave the State, as it turned out giving her the opportunity to collect and then transport her victim's body across the country to dispose of him under a bridge in Florida, right under their noses, all while she was their prime suspect and they were building an airtight case.

When this happens ( a long time between incident and arrest) I always think it's because LE are making sure they have enough evidence for a conviction. How many people get arrested and released due to lack of evidence ( Colorado) or charged and not convicted. ( Casey Anthony)
I think police consider things like safety concerns , or flight risk and put things in place, ( surveillance, etc) maybe they want to watch behavior, or hope it will lead them somewhere ( to a body) Look at the (Cal City boys orrin and Orson West) That case, took forever to charge what everyone thought was so obvious, and even then everyone was on pins and needles until the verdict was in for a non-body homicide.
Anyway, my general point is many other professionals are consulted to ensure they don't just have probable cause to make an arrest but also have the best chance for a conviction.
I know that LE does their best to ensure that they maintain the public's faith in the justice system but I think that LE is more concerned with getting justice for the family as opposed to pleasing the public.
I think they do their best so that a family doesn't have to not only deal with a death but also an injustice. They know what is needed, They also know that the public is not very forgiving.

 

[Beekarina]

I've been wondering that since the 911 calls were released. She can't have been missing since 8am if JS saw her getting dressed at 8am.

But then I realized it didn't matter overmuch, since we know neither of these statements is actually true, and Madeline was already dead at 8am.

@floridafreshsqueez

Nope....was right there with you ....my first question when the calls. were posted here.

My thought is maybe the Aunt (?) asked JS when she last saw MS and was told 8am. That is what makes the most sense to me trying to make sense out of everything we have here.

 

[Beekarina]

She told the media that she last saw her daughter the night before. She told law enforcement she saw Maddie getting ready for school. The first statement makes her liar. The second would make her a liar and a criminal. I fully expect her to charge her for that, at a bare minimum. Committing a crime by lying is typically to cover up a more serious crime. I mean, why lie otherwise?

100%

If JS had broken down sobbing, saying she couldn't remember, something along those lines? Then maybe I could better understand some of this. She outright lied. If she really did not know when she last saw her daughter, then that is what she should have said. No one forced JS to give media interviews. No one forced her to stand consoling SS and all of that. It would be understandable to be a mess with her young daughter missing, gone overnight, you think someone took her. Don't lie.

 

[Beekarina]

E-mailing the teacher strikes me as the oddest part. I can appreciate we all live i different communities and have had very different experiences with the ways schools handle dismissals and the hour or two after classes end. However e-mailing a teacher about something of this nature? What if the teacher had gone to the gym? Out to an early dinner with friends? E-mailing your child's teacher is a way to check in about a project or concerns you have about something you found out happened socially that day. Not to get confirmation about if your child was AT school all day.

 

[Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc]

E-mailing the teacher strikes me as the oddest part. I can appreciate we all live i different communities and have had very different experiences with the ways schools handle dismissals and the hour or two after classes end. However e-mailing a teacher about something of this nature? What if the teacher had gone to the gym? Out to an early dinner with friends? E-mailing your child's teacher is a way to check in about a project or concerns you have about something you found out happened socially that day. Not to get confirmation about if your child was AT school all day.

Sometimes, at a certain point in the day, it is the only communication you can get. Once the admin has gone home, my experience has always been that you will get the answering machine.
(Experience over a 25-year period in the UK AND Canada)

 

[Ontario Mom]

100%

If JS had broken down sobbing, saying she couldn't remember, something along those lines? Then maybe I could better understand some of this. She outright lied. If she really did not know when she last saw her daughter, then that is what she should have said. No one forced JS to give media interviews. No one forced her to stand consoling SS and all of that. It would be understandable to be a mess with her young daughter missing, gone overnight, you think someone took her. Don't lie.

The thing is, literally all we do know is what an officer wrote in a report.

We don't know what else she said.
We don't know how she said it.
We don't know if she was sobbing.
We don't know if she was a complete mess.
We don't know what impression she gave the officer taking her report.
We don't know if she later changed her statement to say no, she wasn't sure if it was that day or not.

And for that matter, we also don't know if she was aware of the SA and/or MS's death and/or the disposal of her body.

There's SO many facts that we simply don't know to be forming an opinion based on literally nothing but speculation.

jmo

 

[floridafreshsqueez]

I’m not trying to be harsh here, but JS comes across as a bit immature. She’s got her family handling the birthday party, allegedly asked SS to bring MS to school and now Grandma and the sister are making the 911 calls??

I’m a single mom too and I don’t know how complicated her responsibilities were in her day to day life, but the lack of initiative on JS’s part either signals to me a significant detachment between her and her daughter, or a streak of immaturity in which the people around her are a bit of a crutch. I’m wondering if it even occurred to JS to call 911 until she let her sister and mother know MS was not at school.

MS was 13, not a younger child…so I don’t understand this outsourcing of tasks to others in this situation. I’m curious to know if there was a deterioration of dynamics between MS, JS, and SS in the weeks leading up to MS’s disappearance that may be a factor in how JS has handled things.

The disappearance sure seemed to motivate SS to surgically attach himself to JS, and she seemed comfortable enough having him stay there during the search despite the fact that he was supposed to not be living there?

I think I’m most bothered by the appearance of a unified family front that included SS when in reality, it seems as tho JS was dependent on her parents for housing and dependent upon SS to take on a defacto parental position, and in the end she let the family throw a milestone birthday party she for whatever reason couldn’t take off to attend.

<modsnip - sleuthing family members>

 

[Pruddennce]

Maddie - mom didn’t think she knew her own address. But mom DID think she may have gone to grans office. If she had done that before would JS not have mentioned it to LE or the media? She didn’t. Her being so vague as to what she did or didn’t do etc really makes me think she was lying through her teeth.

yes, she inferred Maddie was compromised so much as a 12-13 year old that she wouldnt know her 'full home address'. me: I dont believe that. JS: she 'left her phone at home, not unusual, she's forgetful (ADHD)'.... that happens on the day she is supposedly missing?

Im still maintaining, the key to understanding the full pic here, is knowing the movements of JS, SS and Madeline AFTER the party, that nite and into the morning--> where was SS, JS and Madeline during that time period. only an abbreviated version of SS and his movements have been released about the morning and afternoon.

so many gaps. and now the 911 calls..dont know if she called before the unnamed caller. when asked by the 911 operator the nature of the call, the caller says 'POSSIBLY the police'. when asked if Madeline had a cell phone, did I hear the caller telling the 911 operator that Madeline 'conveniently' left her phone at home?

why did JS tell the public her last interaction was at nite? why didnt she tell the public straight out, the last person with Madeline was SS dropping her off almost an hour before school at another location? which by the way was misleading, her constant use of the term we saw, we did, we we we storyline was not her personal account.

 

[BeeGirl]

100%

If JS had broken down sobbing, saying she couldn't remember, something along those lines? Then maybe I could better understand some of this. She outright lied. If she really did not know when she last saw her daughter, then that is what she should have said. No one forced JS to give media interviews. No one forced her to stand consoling SS and all of that. It would be understandable to be a mess with her young daughter missing, gone overnight, you think someone took her. Don't lie.

I think it’s important that it says verbal and sworn written testimony, too. That suggests that police have both a body cam video and sworn written statement saying she saw her at 8 am. This was not a one-time tongue slip.

 

[Ontario Mom]

I’m not trying to be harsh here, but JS comes across as a bit immature. She’s got her family handling the birthday party, allegedly asked SS to bring MS to school and now Grandma and the sister are making the 911 calls??

I’m a single mom too and I don’t know how complicated her responsibilities were in her day to day life, but the lack of initiative on JS’s part either signals to me a significant detachment between her and her daughter, or a streak of immaturity in which the people around her are a bit of a crutch. I’m wondering if it even occurred to JS to call 911 until she let her sister and mother know MS was not at school.

MS was 13, not a younger child…so I don’t understand this outsourcing of tasks to others in this situation. I’m curious to know if there was a deterioration of dynamics between MS, JS, and SS in the weeks leading up to MS’s disappearance that may be a factor in how JS has handled things.

The disappearance sure seemed to motivate SS to surgically attach himself to JS, and she seemed comfortable enough having him stay there during the search despite the fact that he was supposed to not be living there?

I think I’m most bothered by the appearance of a unified family front that included SS when in reality, it seems as tho JS was dependent on her parents for housing and dependent upon SS to take on a defacto parental position, and in the end she let the family throw a milestone birthday party she for whatever reason couldn’t take off to attend.

<modsnip - sleuthing family members>

The fact is, we don't even know JS.
We don't know if she's immature or had a detached relationship with MS.
All we do know is what we've seen in interviews with her, when her child was missing.
Literally the worst possible time to make a first impression on anyone, is in a moment of trauma.

We don't know why the party was held at grandma's instead of at home.
We don't know who suggested it, or if someone preferred it.
We don't know why JS wasn't there.
We don't know if JS and MS had their own thing on her actual birthday the prior Thursday.
We don't know why JS allegedly asked SS drive MS to school.
We don't know the dynamics between JS, her mom and her sister.
We don't know if JS also called 911.
We don't know how JS has handled anything beyond what she's stated in her interviews.

I'm fully aware this is a rather unpopular take but there are loads of facts we just don't have.

jmo