4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #93

[Cool Cats]

Can you please cite a source where LE indicated they were conducting surveillance on BK & lost track of him at some point on his cross-country drive?

I recall reading after the fact that his license plate was captured on a plate reader in Loma, Colorado on 12/13/22, but I don’t recall reading that he was under direct active surveillance until he was in PA. Indeed, I’ve seen the claim repeatedly denied by LE, so I’d be grateful to be pointed to something I’ve missed — TIA!

Was FBI tailing Bryan Kohberger cross-country? Why Indiana police stopping him twice
Published at 4:18 pm, June 8, 2023

Was FBI tailing Bryan Kohberger cross-country? Why Indiana police stopping him twice - East Idaho News

MOSCOW (Idaho Statesman) — Two December traffic stops by Indiana police of the man later charged with murdering four University of Idaho students were unrelated to any active surveillance or the search for a car similar to one the suspect drove, according to state and federal law enforcement...

www.eastidahonews.com

 

[Gemmie]

Can you please cite a source where LE indicated they were conducting surveillance on BK & lost track of him at some point on his cross-country drive?

I recall reading after the fact that his license plate was captured on a plate reader in Loma, Colorado on 12/13/22, but I don’t recall reading that he was under direct active surveillance until he was in PA. Indeed, I’ve seen the claim repeatedly denied by LE, so I’d be grateful to be pointed to something I’ve missed — TIA!

It is the DM so take its truthfulness with a grain of salt.

An FBI surveillance team tracking suspected quadruple murderer Bryan Kohberger as he drove across the country lost him for 'several alarming hours'.

Authorities had planned to keep a close eye on the criminology student, 28, as he and his dad traveled more than 2,500 miles back to Pennsylvania for the holidays.

Kohberger and his father, Michael, left Pullman, Washington

The pair had just pulled out of the parking lot of his graduate housing before he vanished from the sight of police – before being pulled over twice as he made his way back to the family home.

Kohberger was pulled over twice within nine minutes while driving along I-70 in December, looking more concerned on the second occasion.

Sources have since told AirMail's Howard Blum, who is penning a true-crime book on the horrific slayings, that the 'chief suspect in a quadruple homicide that had shocked the nation had seemingly vanished.'

He said that law enforcement let on to the potentially disastrous slip-up 'with a bristle of embarrassment.'

Blum added: 'It would be a disaster — not just professionally, but also for their own peace of mind.'

It also meant that the white Hyundai Elantra that officers painstakingly tracked down and linked him to the murders in the first place had also vanished.

This FBI surveillance quickly went from ‘panic to despair’ according to Blum, who added that they only picked him up again after an automatic license plate reader picked up his car in Colorado.

Kohberger and his vehicle were identified 900 miles after the cops initially lost them – around 15 hours from when they set off.

FBI lost Bryan Kohberger for 'about 15 hours' on his road trip

Authorities had planned to keep a close eye on the criminology student, 28, as he and his dad traveled more than 2,5000 miles back to Pennsylvania for the holidays.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[North_Idaho_Nony]

It is the DM so take its truthfulness with a grain of salt.

An FBI surveillance team tracking suspected quadruple murderer Bryan Kohberger as he drove across the country lost him for 'several alarming hours'.

Authorities had planned to keep a close eye on the criminology student, 28, as he and his dad traveled more than 2,500 miles back to Pennsylvania for the holidays.

Kohberger and his father, Michael, left Pullman, Washington

The pair had just pulled out of the parking lot of his graduate housing before he vanished from the sight of police – before being pulled over twice as he made his way back to the family home.

Kohberger was pulled over twice within nine minutes while driving along I-70 in December, looking more concerned on the second occasion.

Sources have since told AirMail's Howard Blum, who is penning a true-crime book on the horrific slayings, that the 'chief suspect in a quadruple homicide that had shocked the nation had seemingly vanished.'

He said that law enforcement let on to the potentially disastrous slip-up 'with a bristle of embarrassment.'

Blum added: 'It would be a disaster — not just professionally, but also for their own peace of mind.'

It also meant that thewhite Hyundai Elantra that officers painstakingly tracked down and linked him to the murders in the first place had also vanished.

This FBI surveillance quickly went from ‘panic to despair’ according to Blum, who added that they only picked him up again after an automatic license plate reader picked up his car in Colorado.

Kohberger and his vehicle were identified 900 miles after the cops initially lost them – around 15 hours from when they set off.

FBI lost Bryan Kohberger for 'about 15 hours' on his road trip

Authorities had planned to keep a close eye on the criminology student, 28, as he and his dad traveled more than 2,5000 miles back to Pennsylvania for the holidays.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Yes, the DM, LOL.

Thanks, but that doesn’t address my question to the OP’s claim that LE admitted they were conducting surveillance on BK & lost track of him at any point on his cross-country drive.

That’s what I’m interested in & haven’t seen.

 

[jepop]

Can you please cite a source where LE indicated they were conducting surveillance on BK & lost track of him at some point on his cross-country drive?

I recall reading after the fact that his license plate was captured on a plate reader in Loma, Colorado on 12/13/22, but I don’t recall reading that he was under direct active surveillance until he was in PA. Indeed, I’ve seen the claim repeatedly denied by LE, so I’d be grateful to be pointed to something I’ve missed — TIA!

Yeah just what you say here NINony, that is my understanding too. I don't think he was under surveilance directed by fbi until 23rd Dec, that being the day investigating LE received return on phone warrants which included a trace on his phone number: wording in application for warrant included something like 'to ascertain the whereabouts of Kohberger' (AT& T Warrant is on Idaho COI page for anyone who wants to read it in the first batch released Idaho Judicial Cases of Interest). He was in PA from about 15th Dec from memory.moo

Just my own conjecture: prior to 23rd Dec BK was certainly a POI and I think local LE may have tried to surreptitiously but legally (eg trash can if there was one accessible) obtain his dna in Pullman without success. Possibly before 13th Dec when he left with his dad for PA, depending on where investigation was at by that time.Moo They knew about his single plate elantra by then, had DM's general description matching liscence and probably imo the video of white elantra in early am of Nov 13th in Pullman and moscow elantra video including one plater on Indian Hills drive. Moo

But I've read nothing from official police sources about fbi surveiling him in Pullman by 13th Dec and losing him cross country.

 

[Swansee]

I think local LE may have tried to surreptitiously but legally (eg trash can if there was one accessible) obtain his dna in Pullman without success.

Why not just swab his apartment doorknob or the door handle on his car? What could possibly have prevented them from obtaining it before he left?
It's a question I've racked my brain about a thousand times since the PA trash dna story came out. I don't understand why they waited, if they were onto him before he left, why wouldn't they get his DNA from the obvious places?

 

[jepop]

It is the DM so take its truthfulness with a grain of salt.

An FBI surveillance team tracking suspected quadruple murderer Bryan Kohberger as he drove across the country lost him for 'several alarming hours'.

Authorities had planned to keep a close eye on the criminology student, 28, as he and his dad traveled more than 2,500 miles back to Pennsylvania for the holidays.

Kohberger and his father, Michael, left Pullman, Washington

The pair had just pulled out of the parking lot of his graduate housing before he vanished from the sight of police – before being pulled over twice as he made his way back to the family home.

Kohberger was pulled over twice within nine minutes while driving along I-70 in December, looking more concerned on the second occasion.

Sources have since told AirMail's Howard Blum, who is penning a true-crime book on the horrific slayings, that the 'chief suspect in a quadruple homicide that had shocked the nation had seemingly vanished.'

He said that law enforcement let on to the potentially disastrous slip-up 'with a bristle of embarrassment.'

Blum added: 'It would be a disaster — not just professionally, but also for their own peace of mind.'

It also meant that thewhite Hyundai Elantra that officers painstakingly tracked down and linked him to the murders in the first place had also vanished.

This FBI surveillance quickly went from ‘panic to despair’ according to Blum, who added that they only picked him up again after an automatic license plate reader picked up his car in Colorado.

Kohberger and his vehicle were identified 900 miles after the cops initially lost them – around 15 hours from when they set off.

FBI lost Bryan Kohberger for 'about 15 hours' on his road trip

Authorities had planned to keep a close eye on the criminology student, 28, as he and his dad traveled more than 2,5000 miles back to Pennsylvania for the holidays.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I saw the word Blum in there and my self regulating bias o metre went onto the red zone. Almost choking on the massive lump of salt I'm trying to swallow!

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

Yes, the DM, LOL.

Thanks, but that doesn’t address my question to the OP’s claim that LE admitted they were conducting surveillance on BK & lost track of him at any point on his cross-country drive.

That’s what I’m interested in & haven’t seen.

Not trying to step on any toes, nor interject where not wanted…… and I am not certain of this source, but does this go to the apparent question?

From an Inside Edition online article by Chris Spargo dated January 30, 2023, entitled: ‘Idaho Murders Investigation: Bryan Kohberger 'Vanished' for 14 Hours While Under FBI Surveillance: Report’.

Idaho Murders Investigation: Bryan Kohberger 'Vanished' for 14 Hours While Under FBI Surveilance

"[S]ources in law enforcement would confide with a bristle of embarrassment, not long after the car had pulled out of its space in the graduate housing parking lot ... in Pullman, Washington, they lost it," reports Air Mail.

www.insideedition.com

And I am not speaking to the veracity of this nor any other reports. I think all should be grateful that investigative journalists and publications are making an attempting to cover such cases. MOO

 

[jepop]

Why not just swab his apartment doorknob or the door handle on his car? What could possibly have prevented them from obtaining it before he left?
It's a question I've racked my brain about a thousand times since the PA trash dna story came out. I don't understand why they waited, if they were onto him before he left, why wouldn't they get his DNA from the obvious places?

Not legal. They have to do it by the book imo

ETA door handle or any of his private property needs a warrant is my understanding

 

[Boxer]

l

A number of things on that list may not actually be true. But certainly most wouldn't be admissable in court as evidence of murder. An awkward vegan? Losing weight? Living at home while in college and graduate school? Learning to box (or wrestle or play other "rough" sports)?

I do hope BK is able to get a fair trial. Too often people may not when jurors' judgments are affected by a defendant's appearance or if they decide "he's not like us." It's not good for any of us when those things happen.
MOO

MOO his appearance is that he fits in, his behavior does not.

For instance, very few people would pick a fight with their Ph.D. program supervisor, in fact they would do anything they could to avoid it, even of they hated their supervisor or thought they were dumb, anticipating what the negative consequences would be for them.

His appearance in photos is pretty GQ. It's what animates him that is off.

 

[rogue ant]

I will comment again (since nobody liked my first one and my source was even unusual to me).

I have read lots of things about BKs demeanor, etc. It is my opinion, and separate from the facts on this case, that there are many interesting behaviors, patterns, and awkwardness of BK.

I know there are a lot of people who like to defend him (if he is the accused I'm not exactly sure why other than to be empathetic). I think that might be more related to them than him. From what we've learned about this suspect, he has drawn attention physically, behaviorally, and from employers and institutions he was attending. His gait is interesting, and the way that I read his body language is sort of lurchy.

I've read many things people report about him and he is off on many levels. Does that translate to guilty? Well, we will see. My personal reaction is like an 11 out of a 1 to 10 on the "get away" meter. Something is a miss. Or more accurately, lots of things are. JMOO.

FWIW I think he's guilty based on the evidence we have seen so far. I'm not "defending him" in the least.

 

[Cool Cats]

I will comment again (since nobody liked my first one and my source was even unusual to me).

I have read lots of things about BKs demeanor, etc. It is my opinion, and separate from the facts on this case, that there are many interesting behaviors, patterns, and awkwardness of BK.

I know there are a lot of people who like to defend him (if he is the accused I'm not exactly sure why other than to be empathetic). I think that might be more related to them than him. From what we've learned about this suspect, he has drawn attention physically, behaviorally, and from employers and institutions he was attending. His gait is interesting, and the way that I read his body language is sort of lurchy.

I've read many things people report about him and he is off on many levels. Does that translate to guilty? Well, we will see. My personal reaction is like an 11 out of a 1 to 10 on the "get away" meter. Something is a miss. Or more accurately, lots of things are. JMOO.

@Chloegirl
You are spot on according to LE.....

Authorities asking for information on Bryan Kohberger​

Authorities still want to hear from people who may be able to shed more light on Kohberger.

“This is not the end of this investigation, in fact, this is a new beginning,” Latah County Prosecutor Bill Thompson said Friday. “You all now know the name of the person who has been charged with these offenses, please get that information out there, please ask the public, anyone who knows about this individual, to come forward.”

“Report anything you know about him, to help the investigators, and eventually our office and the court system, understand fully everything there is to know about not only the individual, but what happened and why,” Thompson added.

Authorities received roughly 400 calls in the hour after Kohberger’s arrest was announced, Moscow Police Chief James Fry said, adding he hopes tips will help investigators learn more about the suspect.

“We want information on that individual,” the chief told CNN. “We want that updated information so that we can start building that picture now. Every tip matters.”

Suspect in the Idaho college student killings returned home for the holidays weeks after the crime. Here's what we know about him | CNN

The man arrested in connection with the November killings of four University of Idaho students who were found stabbed to death attended a nearby university in Washington state and traveled across the country in December to spend the holidays with his parents.

www.cnn.com

 

[10ofRods]

Why not just swab his apartment doorknob or the door handle on his car? What could possibly have prevented them from obtaining it before he left?
It's a question I've racked my brain about a thousand times since the PA trash dna story came out. I don't understand why they waited, if they were onto him before he left, why wouldn't they get his DNA from the obvious places?

Part of the reason has to be that any doorknob in student housing would have so many different people's DNA. Car door handles not so much - but still possibly problematic.

In order to avoid the time and expense of touch DNA problems, it helps to get samples from items touched only by one person.

Or to collect familial DNA.

In the case of Joe DeAngelo, LE had good reasons to believe that he - and only he - had touched his car door handle. Most car door handles have a few more people touching them - in Kohberger's case, it might have worked but could be challenged due to touch DNA from, say, anyone he had ever met.

LE did the most cost effective and scientifically viable thing, IMO.

 

[maskedwoman]

<snip>

I don't agree with allowing the stalling. If she is stalling because she doesn't want to go to trial on a losing case then she shouldn't have taken this case. If she thinks he mudered 4 people she should want justice.

She has to say he is innocent because Bryan TELLS HER HE IS INNOCENT. She can't say anything else. She has no choice but to proceed as if he is the wrong person sitting in jail.

Well, she is the public defender, so she doesn't get to pick her cases, but I take your meaning. If she really didn't want to try the case, I suppose she could get another job.

You're completely right that, if BK is saying he's innocent, then she has to proceed in that manner. Except that, legally, he hasn't said anything at all. She can say they all believe he is innocent all she wants. She's not under oath. She's not a witness. She can swear on a stack of bibles that he's innocent, and keep on doing so until the proverbial cows come home and it still means nothing. It's just posturing and trying to implant that thought into potential jurors minds. I don't think it's going to work. MOOooo

 

[Cool Cats]

Well, she is the public defender, so she doesn't get to pick her cases, but I take your meaning. If she really didn't want to try the case, I suppose she could get another job.

You're completely right that, if BK is saying he's innocent, then she has to proceed in that manner. Except that, legally, he hasn't said anything at all. She can say they all believe he is innocent all she wants. She's not under oath. She's not a witness. She can swear on a stack of bibles that he's innocent, and keep on doing so until the proverbial cows come home and it still means nothing. It's just posturing and trying to implant that thought into potential jurors minds. I don't think it's going to work. MOOooo

No, it will not work, I agree.

I think it is utter nonsense that jurors won't be able to sit and discuss the evidence fairly because Anne Taylor said this or that, or a survey called them, or the media reported this about BK....Etc.

It is called Voir dire and it circumvents all this through questionnaires and answering questions from attorneys of both sides and letting the judge know that you can still be fair despite what you have heard.

2 Cents

 

[Justice101]

Yeah just what you say here NINony, that is my understanding too. I don't think he was under surveilance directed by fbi until 23rd Dec, that being the day investigating LE received return on phone warrants which included a trace on his phone number: wording in application for warrant included something like 'to ascertain the whereabouts of Kohberger' (AT& T Warrant is on Idaho COI page for anyone who wants to read it in the first batch released Idaho Judicial Cases of Interest). He was in PA from about 15th Dec from memory.moo

Just my own conjecture: prior to 23rd Dec BK was certainly a POI and I think local LE may have tried to surreptitiously but legally (eg trash can if there was one accessible) obtain his dna in Pullman without success. Possibly before 13th Dec when he left with his dad for PA, depending on where investigation was at by that time.Moo They knew about his single plate elantra by then, had DM's general description matching liscence and probably imo the video of white elantra in early am of Nov 13th in Pullman and moscow elantra video including one plater on Indian Hills drive. Moo

But I've read nothing from official police sources about fbi surveiling him in Pullman by 13th Dec and losing him cross country.

Good point. They were probably like you said already trying to get an (accidental) DNA sample.

They had to wait till they got home in the Poconos.

 

[Boxer]

This next hearing is with 2 DNA experts for the defense and they are also going to have a hearing requesting that the defense investigator be allowed to view the IGG information. IMO, the 2 DNA experts for the defense have discovered one or more discrepancies.

On the other hand, IMO...it is extremely bizarre that the prosecution does not seem to have in their possession ALL of the evidence that was used to support PCA Exhibit A. How can this be? I've never seen a situation like this in court. This SHOULD be the EASIEST evidence for the prosecution to proffer AND defense SHOULD have had this evidence back in 2023. BUT they don't and BT is indicating he doesn't have it and insinuating the FBI does. So I'm very puzzled. The FBI does not normally get involved in murder cases unless there is RICO evidence. RICO DOES NOT APPEAR to be the situation in this case. Yet BT keeps saying the FBI has the evidence and now he claims he's filling out Toughy requests. But why didn't BT KNOW to fill out Toughy Requests when he originally requested the evidence which is normal for any evidence request to the FBI? For Heaven's sake, he has been an attorney for decades. 100% of information from the FBI requires a Toughy Request 100% of the time and it's been like that for decades. What is the explanation for this? I'm very perplexed.

RICO

This primer provides a general overview of the statutes, sentencing guidelines, and case law regarding the Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act, commonly referred to as the “RICO Act” or simply “RICO.”

www.ussc.gov

So back to JJJ's comment - prosecutors are usually loathe to release a defendant even in the face of exonerating evidence. However a judge may choose to dismiss a case for lack of evidence. Could that happen here? I must admit, with the very mixed-up PCA, the missing evidence and BT not being able to give the defense the documentation to support the PCA, I'm starting to wonder and I think the judge may also be starting to wonder.


When and where would he have said so? BK has been under indictment since 2022 and the prosecutor canceled the preliminary hearing by going with a Grand Jury leaving BK NO OPTION to proffer his alibi.

BKs DNA is a match for the knife sheath. MOO all the rest is typical and precictable challenge to process.

 

[Boxer]

Well, she is the public defender, so she doesn't get to pick her cases, but I take your meaning. If she really didn't want to try the case, I suppose she could get another job.

You're completely right that, if BK is saying he's innocent, then she has to proceed in that manner. Except that, legally, he hasn't said anything at all. She can say they all believe he is innocent all she wants. She's not under oath. She's not a witness. She can swear on a stack of bibles that he's innocent, and keep on doing so until the proverbial cows come home and it still means nothing. It's just posturing and trying to implant that thought into potential jurors minds. I don't think it's going to work. MOOooo

He is innocent in the eyes of the law. That is true. It can be repeated as often as they like, with all the earnestness they want to try and counter the evidence that is public.

 

[Boxer]

Wawawai Park is where the body of a WSU Coed was found who was murdered in 1971. She was stabbed to death on WSU Campus, Stevens Hall which is still standing.
It l's a famous unsolved case.

 

[jepop]

Most car door handles have a few more people touching them - in Kohberger's case, it might have worked but could be challenged due to touch DNA from, say, anyone he had ever met.

RSBM for focus. Yea and I think it's safe to say a car door handle lift would 100% have been challenged by this defense. Seems to me, in the main, investigators in this case were very mindful of things like that. Chief Fry in one of numerous press conferences prior to an arrest asking for public patience: 'We want a conviction not just an arrest' (not a direct quote but IIRC). All Imoo.

 

[Angelcat13]

Well, she is the public defender, so she doesn't get to pick her cases, but I take your meaning. If she really didn't want to try the case, I suppose she could get another job.

You're completely right that, if BK is saying he's innocent, then she has to proceed in that manner. Except that, legally, he hasn't said anything at all. She can say they all believe he is innocent all she wants. She's not under oath. She's not a witness. She can swear on a stack of bibles that he's innocent, and keep on doing so until the proverbial cows come home and it still means nothing. It's just posturing and trying to implant that thought into potential jurors minds. I don't think it's going to work. MOOooo

Jumping in after not following for a bit, but is this Public Defender the same attorney that previously represented the parent(s) of victims? If so, and if she really doesn’t want to try this case, couldn’t she just try to recuse herself based on a “conflict of interest” and/or concerns about grounds for appeal?