8/20 Ron takes plea, will testify in Haleighs trial

[suspicious1]

suspicious1, do get your thoughts together on this. It was your post wondering what would make Ron cover for anyone that prompted my thoughts on this. Also it was a post by lonetraveler a few days ago who opened my mind to the possibly Ron would mix guns and drugs.

It seems to me that I can make a good point only when I read posts by WS members who work so hard to make sense of this case. Each post here is valuable to this case and bringing justice for Haleigh.

Az, I learn so much on here from you guys. We're all trying to make sense of this tragedy.

I have to admit, that I can see Ron covering for someone who has inside knowledge of his illegal crimes. But would Teresa and Annette cover for this person too? In my heart, I feel that they knew what happened to Haleigh long ago. So for none of them to come forward with information, I just can't explain it.
But if it was a person who had knowledge of Ron's illegal crimes, why does Ron feel it is ok to tell on them now? Is he going to be granted immunity or something for those crimes that this person may be able to testify to? I don't know if I am explaining this right but it all just seems weird to me.

Whatever is going on down there in Putnam....IMO, the SA think Ron's testimony will help Haleigh's case, in some major way.

JMO of course

 

[Emma Peel]

"I'm so proud of you, Ronald."

 

[Maia]

I'm so glad you've posted and asked the questions you have, suspicious1. Can I add that I believe Ron would cover for anyone who harmed his daughter, if that person had information about something illegal Ron had done.

Let's suppose Ron didn't have anything to do with his daughter's disappearance but he knew who did and what happened. But this person, could testify to the fact Ron was involved in a gun for drugs deal. Especially if it were a gun that was stolen or was illegal to own if it were not registered with the FEDs, such as a machine gun. I believe Ron would keep quiet and protect that person in order to keep that person quiet about his crimes.

I truly believe Ron Cummings would be the kind of person who would turn the other cheek in his daughter's death if it meant his serious illegal activities were covered up by the person who harmed his child. His actions following the disappearance of his daughter makes me sure he would make that deal.

Yes, Ron would make that trade off to protect himself. The thought of that, makes me ill. But, it's jmo.

EXCELLENT POST AZ!! You have touched on what my theory in this has been from the very begining (as you know) and I posted a little of my feelings about this case in the General Theory thread when I first started posting here. I believe RC was dealing drugs and possibly illegal guns long before HaLeigh went missing. I also believe that during one of his deals, he double crossed the wrong person and HaLeigh's abduction was the result...a revenge. I also believe that TN, GGMA, MC and ToC (and maybe others) know about the double cross. They may not know exactly who the person is that actually took HaLeigh, but they know why. I have long believed that is the reason for the cover up.

I believe RC, TN and GGMS have kept quiet to protect RC from being caught in his illegal activities and doing serious time for Federal charges, and because the others know about it they had to be brought into the cover up as well. MC has not told everything she knows, we all know that. It was the voice analysis tape that showed deception when she was asked if RC could be responsible. I believe the deception was because in her mind he didn't actually hurt HaLeigh but she may have felt that he was responsible because of his actions. I believe TC kept quiet because he was afraid if he talked, his children could also be in danger.

In the beginning the Cummings all kept MC very close and scripted every word she said. That was most obvious in the interview they did in NY. When she was asked for an explanation for her discrepancies, her eyes went immediately to RC for an answer. When he didn't respond, she simply said "I don't know."

IMVHO, RC is indirectly responsible for what happened to HaLeigh, and they are all covering it up. I don't think it is any more complicated than that...it only became complicated when they all started lying.

All of this, of course, is just MY OPINION for what it's worth.

 

[PinkyPoo]

No way will he get anywhere near 90 years on three counts.
It is just not one like that. LOL

 

[kamky]

How do you know he threatened to not testify?

If Ron has a halfway decent lawyer, he would have stepped in and done what good lawyers are supposed to do! Example:

Ron to LE: So this is what I know...blah, blah, blah.
LE to Ron: Okay, good, thank you. Now, we'll need you to testify to that in court.
Ron to LE: Oka-
Ron's Lawyer stepping in quickly: He would be glad to testify for the prosecution IF you do something for him in the drug charges,
LE to Ron's lawyer: Well, maybe. We'll see. What do you have in mind?

Negotiations ensued. Obviously the prosecution feels that Ron's testimony will be helpful so they benefit. Ron gets to help find his daughter and to reduce his drug sentence.

BIBM

Using your hypothetical scenario here, RC is saying that he will only testify if they drop/reduce the charges against him.

WHY? Why would he even negotiate testifying in a potential trial when that trial would be to seek justice for his missing and presumed dead baby daughter?

So, if the SAO had not agreed to drop/reduce some of the charges, he is in effect saying that he could care less about seeing justice for HaLeigh and would not testify to those ends.

He made a deal on his daughter's dead body and in seeing justice for her demise.

In my scenario, above, I hypothezised that Ron's lawyer said he would testify if his charges would be reduced. That's what good lawyers do - speak for their clients and try to get the best deal for them.

I believe that he loves his daughter and does care a great deal about seeing justice for her. We have no idea if Ron passed his LDT or not since we haven't been given that information. However, the fact that he was offered a plea deal says that his testimony has some credibility, which implies that he was truthful. It also implies that he was not involved in the abduction of his daughter. In contrast, I think the reason neither Misty or Tommy were offered plea deals is that they have lied so much that their testimony would not have much credibility, and that LE may feel they have some degree of guilt.

It makes sense to assume that Ron would follow the lead of his lawyer. If his lawyer made a successful effort to reduce his drug sentence, why would Ron say "No, I'll testify, but I'd still like to face all my drug charges"?? I don't read anything into this about not caring for justice for his child. He's just being logical.

 

[cyberborg]

In my scenario, above, I hypothezised that Ron's lawyer said he would testify if his charges would be reduced. That's what good lawyers do - speak for their clients and try to get the best deal for them.

I believe that he loves his daughter and does care a great deal about seeing justice for her. We have no idea if Ron passed his LDT or not since we haven't been given that information. However, the fact that he was offered a plea deal says that his testimony has some credibility, which implies that he was truthful. It also implies that he was not involved in the abduction of his daughter. In contrast, I think the reason neither Misty or Tommy were offered plea deals is that they have lied so much that their testimony would not have much credibility, and that LE may feel they have some degree of guilt.

It makes sense to assume that Ron would follow the lead of his lawyer. If his lawyer made a successful effort to reduce his drug sentence, why would Ron say "No, I'll testify, but I'd still like to face all my drug charges"?? I don't read anything into this about not caring for justice for his child. He's just being logical.

I get it. I understand that LE does it all of the time and that's what you use an attorney for, to mitigate. An attorney is more objective and un-emotional. Deal is a deal.

It still feels wrong to leverage the death of your daughter in return for your locked-in cooperation and testimony regarding her demise. :sick:

It'd feel good to negotiate a deal on some other basis, any other basis and offer to testify on behalf of justice for HaLeigh anyway. It'd ease my conscience if I was Ron .... to do the right thing to honor and respect HaLeigh.

It further taints the image of Ron. IMO

 

[suspicious1]

EXCELLENT POST AZ!! You have touched on what my theory in this has been from the very begining (as you know) and I posted a little of my feelings about this case in the General Theory thread when I first started posting here. I believe RC was dealing drugs and possibly illegal guns long before HaLeigh went missing. I also believe that during one of his deals, he double crossed the wrong person and HaLeigh's abduction was the result...a revenge. I also believe that TN, GGMA, MC and ToC (and maybe others) know about the double cross. They may not know exactly who the person is that actually took HaLeigh, but they know why. I have long believed that is the reason for the cover up.

I believe RC, TN and GGMS have kept quiet to protect RC from being caught in his illegal activities and doing serious time for Federal charges, and because the others know about it they had to be brought into the cover up as well. MC has not told everything she knows, we all know that. It was the voice analysis tape that showed deception when she was asked if RC could be responsible. I believe the deception was because in her mind he didn't actually hurt HaLeigh but she may have felt that he was responsible because of his actions. I believe TC kept quiet because he was afraid if he talked, his children could also be in danger.

In the beginning the Cummings all kept MC very close and scripted every word she said. That was most obvious in the interview they did in NY. When she was asked for an explanation for her discrepancies, her eyes went immediately to RC for an answer. When he didn't respond, she simply said "I don't know."

IMVHO, RC is indirectly responsible for what happened to HaLeigh, and they are all covering it up. I don't think it is any more complicated than that...it only became complicated when they all started lying.

All of this, of course, is just MY OPINION for what it's worth.

I loved this post, Maia. These recent developements have me thinking and what if maybe, just maybe, they were all threatened by someone, even Ron?

I just don't know what to make of this.

 

[cyberborg]

I loved this post, Maia. These recent developements have me thinking and what if maybe, just maybe, they were all threatened by someone, even Ron?

I just don't know what to make of this.

Does Ron intimidate the Cummings and Croslins the same way Casey Anthony does with the Anthony's? Cindy seems like a co-dependent slave to Casey and begs for returned love, a look, a sign, anything....

Does Ron have a hold over folks given his upbringing?

 

[bessie]

EXCELLENT POST AZ!! You have touched on what my theory in this has been from the very begining (as you know) and I posted a little of my feelings about this case in the General Theory thread when I first started posting here. I believe RC was dealing drugs and possibly illegal guns long before HaLeigh went missing. I also believe that during one of his deals, he double crossed the wrong person and HaLeigh's abduction was the result...a revenge. I also believe that TN, GGMA, MC and ToC (and maybe others) know about the double cross. They may not know exactly who the person is that actually took HaLeigh, but they know why. I have long believed that is the reason for the cover up.

I believe RC, TN and GGMS have kept quiet to protect RC from being caught in his illegal activities and doing serious time for Federal charges, and because the others know about it they had to be brought into the cover up as well. MC has not told everything she knows, we all know that. It was the voice analysis tape that showed deception when she was asked if RC could be responsible. I believe the deception was because in her mind he didn't actually hurt HaLeigh but she may have felt that he was responsible because of his actions. I believe TC kept quiet because he was afraid if he talked, his children could also be in danger.

In the beginning the Cummings all kept MC very close and scripted every word she said. That was most obvious in the interview they did in NY. When she was asked for an explanation for her discrepancies, her eyes went immediately to RC for an answer. When he didn't respond, she simply said "I don't know."

IMVHO, RC is indirectly responsible for what happened to HaLeigh, and they are all covering it up. I don't think it is any more complicated than that...it only became complicated when they all started lying.

All of this, of course, is just MY OPINION for what it's worth.

That was my original theory, Maia. Somewhere along the line, I came to see Misty as the likely perp. I still like this one, though.

 

[twall]

Here is a link to video footage of the court proceedings, the SA is shown reading the terms of the plea deal.
I am starting to wonder if the state knows Ron is involved in Haleigh's disappearance somehow and are trying to trip him up. If he does not testify truthfully or gives any sworn statements, depositions, etc. that contain lies they can disprove he can be charged with the 2 charges that were dropped and be sentenced to the max. sentence CONSECUTIVELY.

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/video...Details+of+Ronald+Cummings'+Plea/591024107001

 

[Maia]

That was my original theory, Maia. Somewhere along the line, I came to see Misty as the likely perp. I still like this one, though.

Thanks Bessie. This has been my feeling since the beginning but I have to admit, I have a couple other theories playing out in my head as well...just haven't made all the pieces fit yet LOL

 

[suspicious1]

Here is a link to video footage of the court proceedings, the SA is shown reading the contents of the plea deal.
I am starting to wonder if the state knows Ron is involved in Haleigh's disappearance somehow and are trying to trip him up. If he does not testify truthfully or gives any sworn statements, depositions, etc. that contain lies they can disprove he can be charged with the 2 charges that were dropped and be sentenced to the max. sentence.

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/video...Details+of+Ronald+Cummings'+Plea/591024107001

Twall, I don't know how it works, but wouldn't the SA know exactly what Ron is going to say, and testify to, before agreeing to any plea deals? and if that's the case, wouldn't they already know if his testimony is true or not?

IMHO, the SA didn't cut a deal with Ron for nothing.JMO of course

 

[Whisperer]

The only thing I can think of is the State had to give an excuse for cutting ron a deal. The public would want to know why he is getting one, that's all. He would have had to testify, if called, anyway...so that is irrelevant.

Shoemaker might have made sure that he gets immunity for his testimony, if called. I think the whole "deal' thing is just a sham. They were always going to give him that, regardless.

I will follow up with WBG and see what they are doing and what they drop. They dropped big charges for Jerome's case also.

 

[Whisperer]

I still see no reason for the State to drop the charges except they chose to. If he wanted to get out early from prison and tell the truth in a court of law, they could have said "No deal" g today and reduced his sentence AFTER he testified.

I've seen things in Courts that makes the State look real tough when in actuality, it is not so. They usually work out a deal that makes both sides look good but in reality, the one who is really making out is the defendent. Everyone is happy, the public, the judge, the defendent....till you peel off the layers.

 

[twall]

Twall, I don't know how it works, but wouldn't the SA know exactly what Ron is going to say, and testify to, before agreeing to any plea deals? and if that's the case, wouldn't they already know if his testimony is true or not?

IMHO, the SA didn't cut a deal with Ron for nothing.JMO of course

Yes, you are probably right. Most likely they have worked it out and all other areas that may arise in the future are off limits to Ron that are not in the deal.
His testimony would be limited to what is in the deal. I wish we could see the details of the deal, I am curious. Is that now considered public record? Let me guess, no, because there have been no arrests in the Haleigh case. :banghead:

This was a good point made by Jeff Brown on the JVM show:

CALLER: The second one is that if he was told while they were married that -- that his at that time wife knew about what happened, couldn`t he be held responsible for withholding evidence?

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. Excellent question, Jeff Brown. I mean, let`s say he`s not involved, but he`s going to testify now. They`re going to give him a break for testifying in whoever they arrest for little Haleigh`s abduction and/or murder. But shouldn`t he also face a charge of withholding evidence if he`s known something important all this time?

JEFF BROWN, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yes. There`s charges such as aiding and abetting. There`s a federal charge called misprison (ph) of a felony in which you don`t report a crime that you know to have occurred.

But to say that he`s not a suspect, I have to disagree with Art. State attorneys and prosecutors are always cutting deals with people that are involved maybe to a lesser degree, but that`s the nature of the game. They cut deals with people, because they need certain gaps of evidence filled.

So just because he signed -- he did a plea agreement, and he`s willing to testify against others doesn`t mean that there isn`t some responsibility on his part criminally. They may have already cut a deal with him for that.

http://archives.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1008/20/ijvm.01.html

 

[bessie]

The only thing I can think of is the State had to give an excuse for cutting ron a deal. The public would want to know why he is getting one, that's all. He would have had to testify, if called, anyway...so that is irrelevant.

Shoemaker might have made sure that he gets immunity for his testimony, if called. I think the whole "deal' thing is just a sham. They were always going to give him that, regardless.

I will follow up with WBG and see what they are doing and what they drop. They dropped big charges for Jerome's case also.

He could've been called to testify, but there was no way to guarantee what his testimony would include. Other than initial interviews with LE after Haleigh disappeared, I don't recall that Ron made any subsequent statements under oath. He could've stuck with, "I don't know nuthin'. I was at werk", or claimed a faulty memory. The drug charges give the SA leverage to secure the desired testimony.

Or...it is a sham. Ron really does have connections, and the SA was going to cut him a deal, regardless. The promised testimony is just a way to avoid backlash from the public. The problem with that notion is the drug sting. Let's say LE didn't know Ron would get in on the act -- which is a pretty far fetched notion -- why did the UC continue to pursue them once he did? Why not just bust them the first time Ron participated? They only sold the UC like seven, maybe nine pills. The charge could've easily been dropped, and teflon Ron would've walked away unscathed once again. Nah, I believe LE wanted a chokehold on Ron because they knew that was the only way they'd get him to open up with information about Haleigh. JMO

 

[Homegrown]

The only thing I can think of is the State had to give an excuse for cutting ron a deal. The public would want to know why he is getting one, that's all. He would have had to testify, if called, anyway...so that is irrelevant.

Whisper, If he wasn't offered a deal, could he plea the Fifth? This way he can not plea the fifth. That's my thinking. but I really don't know.

 

[Concerned Papa]

The only thing I can think of is the State had to give an excuse for cutting ron a deal. The public would want to know why he is getting one, that's all. He would have had to testify, if called, anyway...so that is irrelevant.

Whisper, If he wasn't offered a deal, could he plea the Fifth? This way he can not plea the fifth. That's my thinking. but I really don't know.

Since he wasn't granted immunity, he could still plead the Fifth. However, his contract with the State requires him to TRUTHFULLY answer all questions. If he refuses to answer for ANY reason it's BYE BYE deal.

The Details of Ronald Cummings' Plea

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/video...Details+of+Ronald+Cummings'+Plea/591024107001

 

[Snowbunny]

Since he wasn't granted immunity, he could still plead the Fifth. However, his contract with the State requires him to TRUTHFULLY answer all questions. If he refuses to answer for ANY reason it's BYE BYE deal.

Papa, is it possible that the SA just setup Mr Cummings with this plea deal? In otherwards, the SA could use this plea deal to choke Mr Cummings knowing that he cannot fulfill his obligation with his plea and therefore in the end the plea deal will be taken off the table and Mr Cummings will have to face these charges after all. I cannot see the SA allowing Mr Cummings to have the upper hand over them. I personally think Mr Cummings just got himself setup by the SA without his knowledge and the SA will use this plea deal as a leverage to squeeze Mr Cummings hard and in the end Mr Cummings will not have a smirk on his face and will be sitting behind bars for an extremely long time. At least one can hope. I think the key word here is "Truthful" and I don't think Mr Cummings can tell the truth even if his life depended upon it and the SA knows this and will use it. Another thought would be that the SA is using this plea deal to put the squeeze on the other players in this case as well to get them to rat the others out to tell the truth finally.

 

[azwriter]

EXCELLENT POST AZ!! You have touched on what my theory in this has been from the very begining (as you know) and I posted a little of my feelings about this case in the General Theory thread when I first started posting here. I believe RC was dealing drugs and possibly illegal guns long before HaLeigh went missing. I also believe that during one of his deals, he double crossed the wrong person and HaLeigh's abduction was the result...a revenge. I also believe that TN, GGMA, MC and ToC (and maybe others) know about the double cross. They may not know exactly who the person is that actually took HaLeigh, but they know why. I have long believed that is the reason for the cover up.

I believe RC, TN and GGMS have kept quiet to protect RC from being caught in his illegal activities and doing serious time for Federal charges, and because the others know about it they had to be brought into the cover up as well. MC has not told everything she knows, we all know that. It was the voice analysis tape that showed deception when she was asked if RC could be responsible. I believe the deception was because in her mind he didn't actually hurt HaLeigh but she may have felt that he was responsible because of his actions. I believe TC kept quiet because he was afraid if he talked, his children could also be in danger.

In the beginning the Cummings all kept MC very close and scripted every word she said. That was most obvious in the interview they did in NY. When she was asked for an explanation for her discrepancies, her eyes went immediately to RC for an answer. When he didn't respond, she simply said "I don't know."

IMVHO, RC is indirectly responsible for what happened to HaLeigh, and they are all covering it up. I don't think it is any more complicated than that...it only became complicated when they all started lying.

All of this, of course, is just MY OPINION for what it's worth.

Thanks for praising my post. I can see you have put a lot of common sense and thought into your post. It's an excellent point when you state lying is what has made this case so complicated. You are so right. But, we all need to concentrate on the whys. Why all the lying? Why did Ron's family do a turn about from praising Misty to now have TN on a video saying Misty should be hung in a public hanging.

The frustration we all share gives all of us a motivation to dig deep and find answers. Your post here gives us all a jumping off point.

This can not be over fast enough in order to find justice for Haleigh.