Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #181

[layer]

Okay, but on the flip side, the Defense will also be busy preparing to discredit the character of the State's witnesses. This is how a trial works unfortunately.

I look forward to seeing all evidence, all theories and all witnesses tested vigorously, regardless of who presents it. I have a preliminary feeling of confidence that JG will limit any shenanigans in front of the jury.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Correct. I never said it didn't.

RSBBM
My response was to your reply to me:

They are just getting prepared for the Defense team putting him on the stand. They will try to smear his character. IMO, MOO.

 

[O.Incandenza]

Yes I know this his the official PCA. This document only shows military time in the narrative between RA and DD. The rest is in non military ( standard) time. My issue is the other poster screenshot an altered unverified document that does not match this PCA. I have asked her to link the whole document she screenshot and she has been unable to do so.
I do not want to continue to go around with it. The PCA per MSM is the one you linked above and does only show military time during the RA/DD
Narrative which I was using as a basis of my argument. IMO
If RA reported his time to DD in military time which to me shows precise language and an indication that there was no confusion around the time. I also think it was used by RA to show “brotherhood” and “ one of the same team”. JMO

All my opinion and it’s been discussed at length.
If someone can’t verify their document I don’t think it should be posted per TOS. I am fine leaving the whole discussion here in this thread until after trial.
I appreciate your help!

Don't know why military time matters, but the screenshot you're asking about is from the PCA for the search warrant for RA's house. I linked you to the document here:

Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #181

No because this document does not match the one you screenshot earlier in post #924. The document you screenshot and stated was a copy from a page of the PCA included military time throughout. Perhaps you can link the document you first presented in the discussion and stated it was page 9 of the...

www.websleuths.com

 

[girlhasnoname]

Interesting. Is he still employed with Rushville? Not sure how this is relevant unless it ties into his investigation into Fields. Maybe he was pulled off the case we may come to find out. I know he referenced it was when his partner was killed in duty that his work stopped on the case.

I believe TC is retired now. IIRC

 

[vinayd]

I read it. It seems to me P dared the defense to share the confessions. It seems RA confessed to 30 different people at mininum at varying times and under multiple circumstances. The state asked the D to identified the specific statements of RA that were illegally coerced and identifying the state actor whose conduct supports the allegation of coercion and describe the conduct they believe to be physically or psychologically coercive before the State is required for further analysis by the Court.

So the D either make public the contents of each of 30 plus confessions, which probably, in my opinion, will destroy their claims of innocence, or don't, and tacitly admit that the shocking number of confessions weren't coerced and that they've been lying.

Yes I see why they would want a list. The D is creating a grand conspiracy of everyone working in tangent to convict their client. So they will need to produce proof of that so the State can speak to it.

 

[mrjitty]

What if, just WHAT IF, it turns out his phone was at the trails between 12 noon and 1:30 pm and then shows his phone at home? Would THAT be enough to convince those that presume him guilty to change their minds about who possibly committed this despicable crime OR would they just come up with another scenario to put him there during the time L & A where murdered?

Of course, I don’t know if this evidence exists, but neither do others know that it doesn’t exist. Yet, in reading these many threads, it seems to me that it doesn’t matter what is revealed in RA’s favour, he’s still unequivocally guilty in the minds of many.

I can hardly wait for this trial to begin and see just how fairly it proceeds. Thankfully, there are many attorneys with their eyes on this case and while we may not be able to see and hear testimony, there will be transcripts for those that can afford to purchase them. All JMHO.

BIB

I've made this exact argument several times on here myself.

My working theory is, if that phone data existed, it would have been in one of the various franks motions, and RA would be a free man already.

Therefore I speculate he didn't bring his phone with him OR the data is too inaccurate to say where exactly he was and when

 

[layer]

Here is a link from searching the terms military time in this thread. There are two pages of posts.

Yeah, I feel like we tapped that well for all it's worth, at least for now. It does highlight how much we still don't know, even after 7 years and an arrest in 2022.
When this is all said and done I'm going to need someone to help me understand why getting info on this one case is like pulling eye teeth, and always has been. I've never seen anything like it. Maybe that's something we will learn at trial.

 

[layer]

I've made this exact argument several times on here myself.
My working theory is, if that phone data existed, it would have been in one of the various franks motions, and RA would be a free man already.
Therefore I speculate he didn't bring his phone with him OR the data is too inaccurate to say where exactly he was and when

OK, I missed you making that argument before, but you just got my attention. Are you saying that if the defense provides that data at trial you see it as significant enough to free RA?

 

[StarryStarryNight]

I don’t think the prosecution would be interested in records on Click if they did not have some reason to think he did have credibility issues.
I will add, the fact that the defense did not object to the prosecution checking on Click’s records, to me, indicates that the Odinist theory will not see the light of day at trial.

 

[TTF14]

I don’t think the prosecution would be interested in records on Click if they did not have some reason to think he did have credibility issues.
I will add, the fact that the defense did not object to the prosecution checking on Click’s records, to me, indicates that the Odinist theory will not see the light of day at trial.

I interpret it the exact opposite way.

IMO MOO

 

[Cyber sleuth]

I don't think so.

Per TC testimony during contempt case he is private investigator. It my memory is functioning today.

 

[vinayd]

Now it's really bugging me the statement made to Click. The reason why he says he stopped working the case. Why would you be pulled off this case if your partner died during the course of another case?
Maybe the state wants to impeach him as a witness.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Absolutely. I just wanted to jump in because I know I mentioned it showing military time and can't remember if I posted a link and was hoping I didn't muddy this up. I think we would all benefit from the official documents we can use. I will spend some time in the media threads today. I like going back from the beginning as more comes out.

I'll help you. This order (below) is for the PCA for the arrest. There are 2 versions as you can see where I highlighted. Both versions are available on the net; the unredacted one is in MSM.

When the PCA was redacted, it was also messed with a bit. Whoever did it changed the times from military to non-military. The tip narrative was changed a tiny bit, too; but it's enough to see that it has been changed. In the unredacted version they claim "he stated there were vehicle parked..."
but in the redacted one, they changed that to "he stated there were vehicles parked..."

So the issue here is the OP is using the redacted one, where the changes have been made. And that person is correct in that non-military times are used throughout. I think it's this one:
https://fox59.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/21/2022/11/Probable-Cause-Affidavit-Richard-Allen.pdf

Nick liked to use his whole case summary in some of the other documents he filed. Like this one:
State's Objection to Defendant's Motion to Supress He used the unredacted version of the PCA for the search warrant in it.

https://www.wishtv.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/Objection-Filed-6-27-2023-13.34.25-248103915-FFC47C07-5DAF-414E-9879-66EEBA100263.pdf

11/29/2022

Order Issued The Court, having had this matter under advisement following a hearing conducted on November 22, 2022, now denies the State's Verified Request to Prohibit Public Access to a Court Record, in part. The Court further finds that the Media Intervenors' Motion for Leave to Intervene is moot, and therefore, denied. Court orders that the redacted Charging Informations and Affidavit for Probable Cause, submitted by the State at the hearing on November 22, 2022, be filed with the Clerk of the Court with this Order, and further that the Clerk shall not release (without prior Court approval) the original, sealed unredacted Informations and Affidavit Judicial Officer: Gull, Frances -SJ Order Signed: 11/28/2022

 

[mrjitty]

OK, I missed you making that argument before, but you just got my attention. Are you saying that if the defense provides that data at trial you see it as significant enough to free RA?

Sure - in fact if that data existed, the case against RA would have collapsed long ago.

Obviously you can't get a conviction if the guys phone shows him leaving the area at least half an hour before the abduction.

Unless you have some convoluted evidence of someone else having his phone, i think it would prove his innocence.

 

[TTF14]

Now it's really bugging me the statement made to Click. The reason why he says he stopped working the case. Why would you be pulled off this case if your partner died during the course of another case?
Maybe the state wants to impeach him as a witness.

BBM.

That's exactly what they want to do.

 

[TTF14]

I read it. It seems to me P dared the defense to share the confessions. It seems RA confessed to 30 different people at mininum at varying times and under multiple circumstances. The state asked the D to identified the specific statements of RA that were illegally coerced and identifying the state actor whose conduct supports the allegation of coercion and describe the conduct they believe to be physically or psychologically coercive before the State is required for further analysis by the Court.

So the D either make public the contents of each of 30 plus confessions, which probably, in my opinion, will destroy their claims of innocence, or don't, and tacitly admit that the shocking number of confessions weren't coerced and that they've been lying.

Read the doc again. It didn't say this at all. He may have been watched by that many people though, who will be called to testify about it, maybe. Nowhere does it say he confessed to all of them.

 

[layer]

Now it's really bugging me the statement made to Click. The reason why he says he stopped working the case. Why would you be pulled off this case if your partner died during the course of another case?

I looked into that before. If memory serves me correctly, Click was sort of pulled into the case in the first place. Maybe he didn't have the authority to investigate on his own. I'll revisit it and verify that, but my impression was that it wasn't really hinky at all.

 

[vinayd]

Read the doc again. It didn't say this at all. He may have been watched by that many people though, who will be called to testify about it, maybe. Nowhere does it say he confessed to all of them.

The count in the doc is about 24 and says confessions and relevant statements. Maybe folks are just rounding to 30 when adding in wife/mom/warden/mental health professionals etc. Could a plea deal be coming? They still have 2 continuances to use I believe.

 

[TTF14]

The count is the doc is about 24 and says confessions and relevant statements. Maybe folks are just rounding to 30 when adding in wife/mom/warden/mental health professionals etc. Could a plea deal be coming? They still have 2 continuances to use I believe.

It also doesn't say he confessed to 24 people.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

Read the doc again. It didn't say this at all. He may have been watched by that many people though, who will be called to testify about it, maybe. Nowhere does it say he confessed to all of them.

The State did say they were planning to call all of them as witnesses. I don’t think they are calling them to testify that they walked down the hall with him.
Besides, whether he confessed 30 times or 4 times or 3,574 times, he has confessed multiple times.