Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #182

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TTF14 said:
Have you seen the interview with Lebrato? He's not even on the case, and only was for a short time. He was so shaken up and believes Allen is innocent.
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I saw Lebrato in a couple of interviews a long time ago; he reminded me of John Malkovich. Someone said he has walked that back somewhat, but I never saw where they got that from. I have 2 takeaways.
First, he was expressing a lot of concern with the way RA was being handled/treated at that time. That's not good.
Second, I was wondering if those interviews were done before the news of the confessions came out. Perhaps that's what led to the walking back.
TTF14 said:
(I don't think he's totally innocent, but will be more than happy to be proven wrong since he's been treated terribly and the State is so dang shady and incompetent and reckless and negligent....)
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I started out convinced RA did it. At this point my head's spinning, I honestly don't know what to think. That's probably the proper state of mind to enter a trial. Well, not the head spinning part...
 
Ravenmoon said:
You don't think he's totally innocent?
Would you care to elaborate?
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I've always thought he is probably involved in some way, but didn't actually kill them. <modsnip> That doesn't mean I'm OK with how things have gone down, which I think is a failed attempt to get him to either plea or die before trial (IMO) so this could all be wrapped up in a neat little bow. They didn't count on good defense attorneys who actually care.

I think others are responsible and I hope everyone who is guilty will eventually be brought to justice, hopefully by some things that come out in Richard Allen's trial, if there ever is one. I don't see how the defense could be properly prepared by May 13th since they have now found themselves in the position of practically having to solve this case (IMO).

If you're only getting your information from MSM, which often spits things out in a hurry and never takes a deep dive, there's no reason you'd think anything other than "RA is guilty! Fry him!" (IMO)

<modsnip>

Also, on an completely different topic, who's the dead guy in the bed???? Who was the suspect in Florida they tracked down and may or may not have taken bloody clothing from?

IMO MOO
 
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FrostedGlass said:
Depends on the jury. I think many people will agree that no one in their right mind would do that.
Then the D can throw in opinions on how damaging solitary confinement is and how they could have transferred him to a facility that agreed to take him. Add in his Constitutional rights...
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Or RA could plead guilty but mentally ill, which is probably closer to the truth.
Just my thoughts. Don’t hurt me.
 
FrostedGlass said:
Depends on the jury.
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Such an obvious observation but so often overlooked. It's a variable that is unpredictable.
FrostedGlass said:
Then the D can throw in opinions on how damaging solitary confinement is and how they could have transferred him to a facility that agreed to take him.
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I'm getting a Mayberry jail cell (next to Otis) versus a Turkish prison cell (next to about 8 wonderful companions) visual here. What's no joke is solitary confinement. The literature is extensive on how psychologically damaging it can be.
FrostedGlass said:
Add in his Constitutional rights...
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oh, those
 
layer said:
I saw Lebrato in a couple of interviews a long time ago; he reminded me of John Malkovich. Someone said he has walked that back somewhat, but I never saw where they got that from. I have 2 takeaways.
First, he was expressing a lot of concern with the way RA was being handled/treated at that time. That's not good.
Second, I was wondering if those interviews were done before the news of the confessions came out. Perhaps that's what led to the walking back.

I started out convinced RA did it. At this point my head's spinning, I honestly don't know what to think. That's probably the proper state of mind to enter a trial. Well, not the head spinning part...
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Lebrato never walked it back. He said what he said to BM and it was obvious he meant it. Later, he also stated he is innocent until proven guilty. Or that’s how it should be. Just because he added that does not mean he does not think RA is innocent. He does. He saw the discovery, or at least what the P has allowed them to see. JMHO
 
layer said:
Such an obvious observation but so often overlooked. It's a variable that is unpredictable.

I'm getting a Mayberry jail cell (next to Otis) versus a Turkish prison cell (next to about 8 wonderful companions) visual here. What's no joke is solitary confinement. The literature is extensive on how psychologically damaging it can be.

oh, those
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I follow the Innocence Project and Solitary Watch. The articles that come out of there on the harm that comes from solitary confinement are beyond words. It's just so hard for me to justify what they have done to Richard Allen in the name of keeping him safe.
 
AugustWest said:
Wouldn't you agree, or at least not argue with the notion, that psychosis comes and goes? That false confessions in fact do occur?

I've said this before, but why would the defense include any more information in a motion (which is written for a judge, not the public) than he or she would need to make a ruling on an evidentiary issue?
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Psychosis does come and go for many who suffer from it.

But ...I mean...he admitted to,30 ish people!!!!

How many times to each of them???

RA is guilty by his own admission.
He even told the warden.

It is making more and more sense to me as to why the P is holding back on information.


AJMO
 
AugustWest said:
Wouldn't you agree, or at least not argue with the notion, that psychosis comes and goes? That false confessions in fact do occur?

I've said this before, but why would the defense include any more information in a motion (which is written for a judge, not the public) than he or she would need to make a ruling on an evidentiary issue?
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Well.. from what I've read she usually tells them essentially prove it. Even in the few hearings we see her ushering them to the point and when they don't make it they do offer to prove which still falls flat. So yes the motions aren't for our eyes technically but I think even she is asking for something to work with.
 
TTF14 said:
Also, on an completely different topic, who's the dead guy in the bed???? Who was the suspect in Florida they tracked down and may or may not have taken bloody clothing from?
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I saw that and def wondered. But if that was something found during the course of investigation and also irrelevant to the case. This brings me back to why do they need any and everything to prove the innocence of their client? Now they are sitting and shuffling hundreds of pages since no one organized the files for them. Sigh. Just a mess.
 
The D is asking for the following sanctions:

Adobe Acrobat

c. That the State of Indiana be sanctioned for its discovery violations in the following way:

i. This Court will instruct the jury that the prosecution received certain evidence that tended to exonerate the defendant on May 1, 2023 but failed to turn over that evidence for over 4 months and that said failure to timely produce that evidence to the defense was a violation of the rules.

ii. Permit the defense to play any video that was belatedly produced without objection from the State of Indiana.

iii. Prevent the prosecution from rebutting the evidence that Todd Click provided to the prosecution on May 1, 2023.

iv. Prevent the prosecution from using any data or information extracted from Liberty German’s phone in its evidentiary presentation.

d. That the prosecutor be ordered to explain in written form his reasons for delaying turning over the Todd Click evidence as detailed in paragraph 38 above; the reasons why he sent an email that is filled with false statements and that misled the defense; and the reasons he failed to turn over a massive amount of evidence, but then chose to turn that evidence to the defense between September 8, 2023 and October 6, 2023 just 4 days before requesting the Court to dismiss defense counsel from the case. This request is made for several reasons, but especially to preserve the record.
 
TTF14 said:
I don't think there is any chance at all of that happening, especially at this late stage. That requires a huge amount of work and experts and we all know they don't have money for that. They'd never be able to prove that. IMO MOO
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His lawyers and RA himself would have been better served if early on, they would have used their time and money looking hard into RA’s mental state.
Why they ignored that is one more head-scratcher in this case.
 
teeby said:
What's this in reference to, please?
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Pg 3:
Adobe Acrobat

3. Most of the items found on the hard drives detailed above are not labelled in any descriptive fashion and many, if not most, of the items (consisting of documents, photographs, and video) have zero context as to what the significance of the documents/video/photographs are. Many of the items are not accompanied by a report or even notes that explain the reason such items are included in discovery. For example, one video shows a man that appears to be dead on a bed being turned over by what appear to be police. There is no context provided as to why that video is included in the massive amount of discovery or what this video has to do with the murders of LG and AW. That is just one example of thousands of examples the defense could cite of evidence with no context of why it is related to this case that the State of Indiana has provided to the defense.
 
StarryStarryNight said:
Or RA could plead guilty but mentally ill, which is probably closer to the truth.
Just my thoughts. Don’t hurt me.
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I don't think he was mentally ill in Feb of 2017. He knew what he was going to that trail to do, he did it, and he lived his life free and clear perfectly normally until Oct 2022. If he were to plead guilty, but mentally ill, he would have to be mentally ill at the time of the murders, not while incarcerated waiting for trial.
 
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