Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #183

[Emma Peel]

News outlets still trying to do their job; sorry guys, no can do.

05/03/2024

Order Issued Court has received "Request for Recording of Court Proceedings by News Media" for a hearing on May 7, 2024, from Jeff Wiehe WANE 15 and Cyndee Hebert WTHR-TV and denies same. Court has also received a "Camera in Court Request Form" request from Anthony Greeno, True Crime Investigates, and declines to consider same as this is not a news media outlet covered by I.C. 34-46-4-1. Judicial Officer: Gull, Frances -SJ Noticed: McLeland, Nicholas Charles Noticed: Baldwin, Andrew Joseph Noticed: Rozzi, Bradley Anthony Noticed: Luttrull, James David JR Noticed: Diener, Stacey Lynn Noticed: Auger, Jennifer Jones Order Signed: 05/02/2024

oh greeno.
ouch.
smh.


jmo

 

[EOA]

Then we're back to ignoring all of the too many coincidences of the case against RA:

He admitted he was there that day, at the time of the murders to DD (2017) and later to LE during his Oct 13th (2022) interview
RA himself described wearing clothing identical to the BG=RA=Killer on the video and claimed by witnesses
RA looks identical in stature and body frame as BG captured by Libby
Backed his car in an obscure way at the end of building when there were plenty of spaces
A car similar to RA's was seen on video from HHS at approx 1:40 pm
Female group of Witnesses pass RA on Freedom Bridge walking 'with a purpose' towards MHB at the same time
One witness actually saw him on MHB and saw Abby & Libby heading in that direction at the time
Another witness sees BG=RA=Killer walking West on Old County Road N300 as she drove East wearing matching clothing and looking 'bloody and muddy, like he'd been in a fight' at approx 4:54 pm
An unfired bullet matching the make and model of a box of ammo recovered from RA's home during SW was found between the murdered victims at the CS land which RA said he had NEVER been on, knew the property owner (RL) nor had he ever loaned his gun out or had it stolen and can't explain why it would be there
One unfired bullet matching the recovered bullet was found in a wooden keepsake box on a dresser in RA's BR
RA confessed to his wife and mother 5+ times to killing Abby & Libby on recorded jailhouse phone lines
RA confessed to others (up to 20?) during his incarceration to killing Abby & Libby

I'm seeing bricks and a 10 foot wall here and we don't know half of the State's case yet.

JMO

I appreciate your posts and understand your position on RA (& agree that a preponderance of evidence does point towards his guilt) - however while I acknowledge many of your points above, I’m not positive all of them are convincing proof (yet)…
— IMO no witness ever picked RA out of a lineup or specifically identified him. The PCA and other docs stated the 3 girls at Freedom and BB near the first platform saw “a man” or “a man matching the man in L’s video” which to me is a bit different than saying they all saw RA. In fact as we know, how they go on to describe that man is not a direct match to RA. MOO is that even LE won’t say with certainty these sightings were RA but it fits their timeline that it well could’ve been RA especially since no other man was seen.
— see my other reply to other poster below but I’m not positive he admits to being on the trails at the time of the murders - DD’s documentation may be ambiguous IMO.
— the vehicle sighting by HH camera is only described in the PCA as “resembling RA’s 2016 Ford Focus” traveling westbound. Since nothing is known whether this vehicle stops at CPS or keeps going, nobody is mentioned being seen in the car, nor whether this is the vehicle of his 2 vehicles RA admits to driving that day and westbound not being the expected direction of RA’s arrival, this all seems less solid than other points
— maybe I missed it but I don’t recall any post-wrapup of the SW obtained items to know if the item taken from the keepsake box or other ammo from the house matched that at the CS. But yes that would be good evidence if proven.

I know you, others, and somewhat me, feel like BG=RA but I haven’t quite got there yet to use them interchangeably.

 

[girlhasnoname]

You are for real and I really appreciate people like you and your perspective. You have an opinion and can change it based on future information. I am also biased toward him being guilty but not sure, honestly, I am as open minded as you. I wish I was. I will try to learn from you.

I think we all process information differently that leads us to a certain feeling of guilt or innocence. I weigh the evidence known at the time, consider the pros and cons of what is most likely (Occam's razor) and go with my gut instinct after that is all said and done. LOL

I've said many times, this case has NEVER been being right or wrong about RA for me. I didn't know him before his arrest and don't know him now. It could have Moe, Curly or Larry for that matter.

It is about finally getting Justice and the Truth for 2 young bff's just out for a walk on a sunny Feb afternoon in 2017. The way they were terrified and ultimately killed is beyond my comprehension and I want the murderer to pay every day for the rest of his life.

JMO

 

[EOA]

What were the circumstances of RA changing the time frame he was there? Did it follow a question from LE?

I ask because.... only the murderer knows what time the murder happened. To say he left by 1:30, how did he know they weren't murdered at 1 pm or 10 am? Did his adjustment reflect foreknowledge? Granted this attempt to alibi himself out of the park during the critical time period may have occurred after LE laid out the timeline based on other evidence, it's a fair question to ask. In fact, he may have changed his story when presented with information from the tower dump if his phone number wasn't found, after claiming he had been looking at a stock ticker on that very phone.

As for the bullet, perhaps LE didn't indicate that it was an unspent cartridge which is why he could boast with full confidence that he had no explanation for it being there, had not ever been there before, had not loaned his gun to anyone, because he knew he hadn't fired a bullet that day.

it is my experience in following trials that, when there are evolving stories, they're often the result of the accused being presented with damning, contradicting evidence, compelling them to modify what they're said before. Presplaing, resplaining and just plain inventing.

JMO

I know it’s not popularly accepted but while acknowledging that a lot of evidence oints toward RA’s guilt, I personally am not convinced RA did change the timeframe of his being on the trails.

We’ve been told that officer DD recorded 1330-1530 in his very early interview though unfortunately there seems to be no recording and it’s hard to say 5 years later what the exact question was or what the exact answer was.

MOO since LE on 2/14/17 asked persons on the trail the prior day between 1:30 and 3:30 to voluntarily come forward, it makes sense to me that the opening interview question from DD would’ve been “So..you were in the trail in the 1:30-3:30 range?” If RA answers any of Yes, or About then, or Part of that time, then DD would note “1330-1530” in the affirmative. It’s a much different question and answer if DD did in fact ask RA to state his arrival and departure times and RA did in fact say he arrived at 1:30 and left at 3:30 - but we don’t know the phrasing and without a recording we won’t know for sure what the phrasing from 5 years earlier was. If RA all along felt like he left around 1:30 (thus not changing his times) DD could still have noted it in this manner due to the 1:30-ish overlap.

I compare the phrasing to DC in 2019 making a plea for any information on vehicles parked near the CPS building from noon to 5:00 on 2/13/17. We would all read that to mean if anyone saw a car there at any point between noon and 5:00 to report such - not asking for a car which arrived at noon and departed at 5:00.

 

[layer]

One unfired bullet matching the recovered bullet was found in a wooden keepsake box on a dresser in RA's BR

Can you help me out with this?
What are you referring to as far as matching the bullet in the wooden keepsake box to the bullet recovered at the scene? Matched how? Were they somehow traced to the same mfg lot number? Or both had some unusual primer sealant? Do you know what brand of ammo the recovered round was? I spent over an hour trying to get this stuff straight and it's still an enigma to me, any help is appreciated.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Can you help me out with this?
What are you referring to as far as matching the bullet in the wooden keepsake box to the bullet recovered at the scene? Matched how? Were they somehow traced to the same mfg lot number? Or both had some unusual primer sealant? Do you know what brand of ammo the recovered round was? I spent over an hour trying to get this stuff straight and it's still an enigma to me, any help is appreciated.

layer, it said 'bullet matching unspent round found in wooden keepsake box located on dresser in between closet of the MBR'. I don't have the time to locate it specifically for you but it is in this Document upload from the Courts once they allowed stuff to be unsealed. I'm sure it will be located near or in the SW section.

https://fox59.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/21/2023/06/DelphiDocumentsCombined.pdf

 

[layer]

I don't have the time to locate it specifically for you but it is in this Document upload from the Courts once they allowed stuff to be unsealed. I'm sure it will be located near or in the SW section.

I just wonder how 2 bullets could even be matched. Perhaps there was some foreign substance on both bullets, or DNA/fingerprints (wouldn't even have to match RA, just each other). I also wonder if the word "match" might have simply been used as a PCA bonus word there, meant to imply something that it doesn't necessarily mean.
Gah

 

[girlhasnoname]

It sounds like RA is ready to take a plea, if one is offered. He has definitely been his own worst enemy lately, at least 30 people have reported that he has confessed directly or indirectly to his involvement in the crime he has been accused of, maybe the stress was getting to him?

He should definitely have access to whatever medical or psychological issues he has, that should be a priority, so that nothing can seem to be a barrier to his conviction.

Richard Allen reportedly made ‘confessions’ to inmates, guards; attorneys say he was in ‘state of psychosis’

CARROLL COUNTY, Ind. — Richard Allen reportedly made “incriminating statements to both inmates and guards” during his time in prison awaiting his double-murder trial. His attorneys want…

fox59.com

RA's Defense Duo has known that information from at least June of last year, the confessions to his wife and mother happened on April 3rd. Part of the reasons moving him from CC is because RA needed access to physical and mental evaluations. His own lawyers should have, and I believe did, subpoenaed those records almost a year ago.

RA's gimmie money fund overseen by Hennessy allowed them to hire a new mental health expert who will be testifying in Court from what I've seen in their Motions.

JMO

 

[susiQ]

News outlets still trying to do their job; sorry guys, no can do.

05/03/2024

Order Issued Court has received "Request for Recording of Court Proceedings by News Media" for a hearing on May 7, 2024, from Jeff Wiehe WANE 15 and Cyndee Hebert WTHR-TV and denies same. Court has also received a "Camera in Court Request Form" request from Anthony Greeno, True Crime Investigates, and declines to consider same as this is not a news media outlet covered by I.C. 34-46-4-1. Judicial Officer: Gull, Frances -SJ Noticed: McLeland, Nicholas Charles Noticed: Baldwin, Andrew Joseph Noticed: Rozzi, Bradley Anthony Noticed: Luttrull, James David JR Noticed: Diener, Stacey Lynn Noticed: Auger, Jennifer Jones Order Signed: 05/02/2024

I can certainly agree with denying Greeno any requests, but I still feel audio of the hearings should be allowed by a reputable news agency for transparency so that the public does not have to rely on “reporting” which can in some cases be biased or just incomplete.

JG and I don’t see eye to eye on a few things. Well, maybe even more than a few things .

 

[girlhasnoname]

I just wonder how 2 bullets could even be matched. Perhaps there was some foreign substance on both bullets, or DNA/fingerprints (wouldn't even have to match RA, just each other). I also wonder if the word "match" might have simply been used as a PCA bonus word there, meant to imply something that it doesn't necessarily mean.
Gah

By lot #, or manufacturer brand or stamp, IDK. I'm sure all of that will come out at trial we've only got 10 days left? All the bonus words meant to imply something it doesn't necessarily mean were used up by the D during the FM (even if they (4) came after LOL).

JMO

EBM: to add word for clarity

 

[Jade]

Agree but I once had to go to the ER after three glasses of wine. Sulfites, mad sulfites. Oh, and it didn’t interact well with the Sri Lankan curry. No cops called but husband took me in. Could be some bad juice. Did she call police specifically or did she call 911?
Not a fan of RA — just don’t want to make something of one incident involving alcohol.

All this article says is < The Carroll County Sheriff’s Office confirmed that deputies were sent>

Did the reaction to the Sulfites cause you to lash out to the point that the SO could have been called out for a “domestic incident”?

RA had CCSO response to his home which there was a need to “keep the peace”.

RA may have resisted his wife’s intent to take him to the hospital if she was possibly fearing alcohol poisoning from excessive drinking considering the 3 am time of the SO response thus the need to “keep the peace” imo. Alcohol Poisoning: Get Emergency Room Help Immediately

I’m familiar with wine and sulfites but the only possibility of “bad juice” in US I’ve ever heard of is from illegally produced moonshine.

[...]
Richard Allen’s home in 2015 for a “domestic” incident.
[…]
Sheriff Leazenby said no law enforcement action was involved other than responding to “keep the peace.”
[...]
Deputies responded to Delphi suspect’s home for domestic issue to ‘keep the peace’



all imo

 

[TTF14]

I just wonder how 2 bullets could even be matched. Perhaps there was some foreign substance on both bullets, or DNA/fingerprints (wouldn't even have to match RA, just each other). I also wonder if the word "match" might have simply been used as a PCA bonus word there, meant to imply something that it doesn't necessarily mean.
Gah

BBM. I think this is likely. Probably same type/caliber/brand....

 

[TTF14]

I can certainly agree with denying Greeno any requests, but I still feel audio of the hearings should be allowed by a reputable news agency for transparency so that the public does not have to rely on “reporting” which can in some cases be biased or just incomplete.

JG and I don’t see eye to eye on a few things. Well, maybe even more than a few things .

Agree, but I do wonder if this could perhaps be for the safety of some witnesses we don't even know about yet. In another ongoing trial, the RICO case with "Young T***" on trial (and others?), I recall one witnesses being very upset that his info was being put out there. I haven't watched much of that trial so perhaps more witnesses are also upset/scared.

MOO BBM

 

[layer]

...I still feel audio of the hearings should be allowed by a reputable news agency for transparency so, that the public does not have to rely on “reporting” which can in some cases be biased or just incomplete.

In a case with so many questions revolving around the conduct of the investigators, the corrections officers, the prosecution, the defense, and even JG herself, does anyone seriously think that hiding the proceedings from view will suddenly induce more confidence? No doubt for many it will only reinforce the idea that the cover-up is ongoing.

 

[nadia90]

I just wonder how 2 bullets could even be matched. Perhaps there was some foreign substance on both bullets, or DNA/fingerprints (wouldn't even have to match RA, just each other). I also wonder if the word "match" might have simply been used as a PCA bonus word there, meant to imply something that it doesn't necessarily mean.
Gah

Sometimes, even bullet casings have serial numbers on them, and this has been a useful tool for tracking down criminals

 

[justtrish]

I don’t believe it’s a convoluted plot.

RA spotted on platform 1 moments before the girls crossed.

The girls I believe saw him acting weird/off maybe he passed them coming off the bridge as they come on and maybe some words are even exchanged.

They start to cross and forget about him and the last known photo is taken which doesn’t show RA behind them.

RA starts to cross the bridge at a rate that scares the girls and alarm bells start to go off with Libby.

Libby shoots the famous video of Bridge Guy as he bears down on them.

As he reaches them and pulls a gun audio captures the moment and he is heard ordering them “down the hill”

RA knows the route he is taking and leads them to where they would be found the following day.

My only questions are and I hope we hear them at trial.

1) did he know they would be there that day and if he did how?

2) did the girls plan to meet somebody that day and that person turned out to be RA?

Mooooooooooooooooooo

Oh this makes me wonder if the girls crossed all the way over the bridge BECAUSE RA creeped them out. Was he lingering around there as Libby was getting a photo of Abby? Was it awkward so they just decided to cross all the way over thinking surely the older creepy guy wouldn't cross that bridge. Then he did. That would certainly raise my suspicion enough to record him.

 

[layer]

Sometimes, even bullet casings have serial numbers on them, and this has been a useful tool for tracking down criminals

That would be awesome!
RA's ammo of choice appears to be the cheapest aluminum-cased junk money can buy. I doubt any of that would have serial numbers on each casing. But many people purchase the small 20 round boxes of self-defense ammo for use in SHTF situations or daily carry.

 

[Megnut]

Isn't the clincher on the bullets the striations from having been chambered in the same weapon? Controversial science but certainly compelling. Proof? Maybe it does or doesn't reach that threshold but taken as a whole? That's a lot to overcome, multiple confessions notwithstanding.

JMO

 

[Jade]

I know it’s not popularly accepted but while acknowledging that a lot of evidence oints toward RA’s guilt, I personally am not convinced RA did change the timeframe of his being on the trails.

We’ve been told that officer DD recorded 1330-1530 in his very early interview though unfortunately there seems to be no recording and it’s hard to say 5 years later what the exact question was or what the exact answer was.

MOO since LE on 2/14/17 asked persons on the trail the prior day between 1:30 and 3:30 to voluntarily come forward, it makes sense to me that the opening interview question from DD would’ve been “So..you were in the trail in the 1:30-3:30 range?” If RA answers any of Yes, or About then, or Part of that time, then DD would note “1330-1530” in the affirmative. It’s a much different question and answer if DD did in fact ask RA to state his arrival and departure times and RA did in fact say he arrived at 1:30 and left at 3:30 - but we don’t know the phrasing and without a recording we won’t know for sure what the phrasing from 5 years earlier was. If RA all along felt like he left around 1:30 (thus not changing his times) DD could still have noted it in this manner due to the 1:30-ish overlap.

I compare the phrasing to DC in 2019 making a plea for any information on vehicles parked near the CPS building from noon to 5:00 on 2/13/17. We would all read that to mean if anyone saw a car there at any point between noon and 5:00 to report such - not asking for a car which arrived at noon and departed at 5:00.

No, it does not make sense that the CO would start out with a leading question when sent to take a “tip narrative”.

I believe the “tip narrative” would be relayed to the CO without interference by the CO.

That is the nature of a supplying a narrative as opposed to being interrogated, imo.

I appreciate your posts and understand your position on RA (& agree that a preponderance of evidence does point towards his guilt) - however while I acknowledge many of your points above, I’m not positive all of them are convincing proof (yet)…
— IMO no witness ever picked RA out of a lineup or specifically identified him. The PCA and other docs stated the 3 girls at Freedom and BB near the first platform saw “a man” or “a man matching the man in L’s video” which to me is a bit different than saying they all saw RA. In fact as we know, how they go on to describe that man is not a direct match to RA. MOO is that even LE won’t say with certainty these sightings were RA but it fits their timeline that it well could’ve been RA especially since no other man was seen.
— see my other reply to other poster below but I’m not positive he admits to being on the trails at the time of the murders - DD’s documentation may be ambiguous IMO.
— the vehicle sighting by HH camera is only described in the PCA as “resembling RA’s 2016 Ford Focus” traveling westbound. Since nothing is known whether this vehicle stops at CPS or keeps going, nobody is mentioned being seen in the car, nor whether this is the vehicle of his 2 vehicles RA admits to driving that day and westbound not being the expected direction of RA’s arrival, this all seems less solid than other points
— maybe I missed it but I don’t recall any post-wrapup of the SW obtained items to know if the item taken from the keepsake box or other ammo from the house matched that at the CS. But yes that would be good evidence if proven.

I know you, others, and somewhat me, feel like BG=RA but I haven’t quite got there yet to use them interchangeably.

Why would the witnesses that saw RA on the trails and bridge need to pick RA out of a lineup?

RA and his attorneys don’t dispute that RA was on the trails or the bridge.

You do understand that the only direct witnesses, they actually saw the crime take place, Abigail and Liberty, are dead.

Other witnesses are just telling LE what they saw and/or heard while on the trails that day.

Post wrap up is Court, imo.


all imo

 

[FrostedGlass]

JG has another transport order:

05/03/2024

Transport Order Entered Judicial Officer: Gull, Frances -SJ Order Signed: 05/03/2024