AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #19

[cluciano63]

I could see removing the boys from Sergio's physical presence if it was thought he was involved in something dangerous...but I cannot see why he is not to call or in any other way contact them. That is the part that does not fit any of the theories I've seen.

 

[Prof]

I thought the examiner and gather were not allowed here as MSM links, unless written by Isabelle Z. (?), one writer Tricia had approved. Yet these sites seem to have crept back in to many cases on a regular basis...JMO

I think that is what I have heard in the past.

If it is allowed, please note that this person paraphrases what other news sources are reporting, and only provides paraphrase of the tidbits that the other news sources with the actual reports provided last night. Nothing new, and simply reporting on the reporting. Without crediting any sources, may I add? lol sorry

 

[spoiledmom]

I could see removing the boys from Sergio's physical presence if it was thought he was involved in something dangerous...but I cannot see why he is not to call or in any other way contact them. That is the part that does not fit any of the theories I've seen.

I just hope he hasn't involved the boys in any type of illegal activity. It has been the new trend of the cartels to use pre-teens and teens to smuggle drugs. If that is the case I could definitely see LE notifying CPS.

 

[spoiledmom]

And she erroneously reports "two boys were turned over to their biological mother – Sergio Celis' ex-wife." We know Becky is bio mom and not Sergio's ex wife.

Yes, that is definitely WRONG. I heard a newscaster on CNN say the same thing the other day. Where do they get these people?

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Very good post and I agree. They obviously had some financial difficulties. This is all relevant background when a crime like this has occurred too. A tidbit released in the records is that Sergio has worked at the Dental office since 2008 (IIRC). Maybe they didn't have two incomes before that? But also they sure had a lot of trouble around the time Isa was born. Probably not of consequences, but Rebecca also had her DUI/child endangerment (or whatever it was) around the time the youngest son was born...

Respectfully <snipped> If Sergio has only been at his current job since 2008, what did he do before this? I doubt that the opera performances/singing engagements provided significant or steady income. Maybe they rented a room in their house to relatives or friends on a regular basis for additional income. Perhaps Becky or Sergio were beneficiaries of a family trust. I'm curious about this like others here, but I don't have to know about the Celis' financial circumstances unless this somehow figures into Isabel's disappearance. :moo:

 

[cluciano63]

Maybe a mod can weigh in on the status of using the examiner and gather, when they come to make a new thread...anyway, they are kind of the NG of articles, so big grain of salt, IMO.

 

[liz b.]

Well you will soon see in the documents. It just said that the police reported that a man told him that they "the Celis family" owed a lot of money to someone and that is why the girl was taken. I'm sure the documents will soon fill in the rest unless it is blacked out. Obviously if the people they owe money too took Isabel out of intimidation, CPS would come in and take the boys away from the person that is putting their children in this kind of danger. In past cases where the cartel is involved, many parents/people don't report it because they are turning themselves in for illegal activity. I just read an article about it. I will post it when I find it again. But, the cartel thinks that they can control you by intimidation. If they kill you, they don't get their money. I'm not saying this is who has Isa but I do believe that LE was considering this at one time. I don't know if they still are but it doesn't look like they have ruled it out.

But the two boys have been out and about in Tucson..not in a safe house. So, possibly they would be in danger of being kidnapped. Depending on the money owed,and the current value of kids...Sigh...I suuure wish they would put the docs online...JMO

 

[Prof]

Maybe Sergio worked in another office before 2008?

 

[spoiledmom]

:fence:I took Prof's advice and deleted it myself

 

[Prof]

I keep checking, LizB

 

[prima.facie]

Maybe a mod can weigh in on the status of using the examiner and gather, when they come to make a new thread...anyway, they are kind of the NG of articles, so big grain of salt, IMO.

Ive been on forums were the Examiner is not allowed as a source because it is user generated....so I could sign up an account and begin writing "articles" about whatever the hell I wanted and have zero accountability to the legitimacy of what I write.

So, doesnt surprise me if WS doesnt allow the source...


....FWIW lol

 

[spoiledmom]

But the two boys have been out and about in Tucson..not in a safe house. So, possibly they would be in danger of being kidnapped. Depending on the money owed,and the current value of kids...Sigh...I suuure wish they would put the docs online...JMO

I do too!:banghead: I hope that LE is actually close to the truth. I feel they are making an arrest soon. But I am no psychic.

 

[Prof]

LOL I swear I delete more than I post and I still make mistakes...like including a quote from an article with a name of minor that I did not catch...I will eventually learn lol

 

[time]

I take it you are referencing the financial difficulty that shows in public record as the "trouble" around Isa's birth? I am not sure what the DUI in 2002 is referencing, though. And how are we getting to Isa being the target of an unpaid loan? lol sorry I just want to ensure I understand.

It might be worth considering, that it is also in witness statements that the Celis family moved to the neighborhood when Isa's grandmother had a stroke, so they could help take care of her. Grandmother's stroke, Isa's birth and the purchase of the home happenend in the same year, I believe.

Oh, maybe I am more rambling than anything searching for any kind of theory.

The DUI in 2002 would be about the time the youngest son was born. I was just mainly noting that they had a lot going on, but I think DUI are more serious when there's either a pregnancy or a newborn around - I guess because it indicates drinking is a bigger problem. It's probably just me, but that would have been the least likely time in my life for over drinking.

Thanks for the added info on the Gma. I've had financial hard times so I don't look down on anyone for that, BUT I never bought a house for nearly half a million. I k now houses have gone way up and we live where homes are expensive, but that is still a lot of money for a house. I am being judgmental when I say I think they made poor judgment and bit off more than they could chew (unless it would come out they had some inheritance or something). I don't think you get that far in trouble in just a couple of years unless you had some huge catastrophe, you were living beyond your means, or some income source unexpectedly dried up?

***
The second half of my post was an entirely different topic, sorry. The docs released said someone claimed the Celis had someone previously living in their house, I thought they said the guy owed someone money - but I can't find the quote now. Some posters were asking how that could possibly be connected to Isabel's disapearance so I gave a wild theory.

 

[Prof]

In regards to the foreclosures, is it possible they bought the new house with the intent of selling the old one? Maybe the old one didn't sell and they were saddled with two mortgages. That could really screw up someones finances in a hurry. The surely wouldn't have been the first and won't be the last.

Yes, I thought this when I first saw public records, too, combined with the fact that they HAD to move to be close to and take care of SC's mother who had a stroke.

 

[liz b.]

I do too!:banghead: I hope that LE is actually close to the truth. I feel they are making an arrest soon. But I am no psychic.

SM, you mean you're NOT psychic ? And here I was thinkin...oh never mind ....

Seriously, something that sounded weird : when RC said something to the effect of " It will all be explained when Isabel returns home...*paraphrasing* but close to the actual quote. What on earth did she mean ? Makes it sound like the whole thing is just a big month long misunderstanding...JMO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Well you will soon see in the documents. It just said that the police reported that a man told him that they "the Celis family" owed a lot of money to someone and that is why the girl was taken. I'm sure the documents will soon fill in the rest unless it is blacked out. Obviously if the people they owe money too took Isabel out of intimidation, CPS would come in and take the boys away from the person that is putting their children in this kind of danger. In past cases where the cartel is involved, many parents/people don't report it because they are turning themselves in for illegal activity. I just read an article about it. I will post it when I find it again. But, the cartel thinks that they can control you by intimidation. If they kill you, they don't get their money. I'm not saying this is who has Isa but I do believe that LE was considering this at one time. I don't know if they still are but it doesn't look like they have ruled it out.

I saw that and then last night I read it was a family member who had lived with the Celis family.

Good grief........even the media cant get it straight and they have the darn docs in front of them.

I am sure glad they are releasing them so we can see what they say for ourselves. I dont trust any of them for accuracy.

IMO

 

[Prof]

Does Uncle/Cousin JM drive a truck?

Just thinking but didn't someone (I think JQP) find a document (warrant?) for JM that gave the Celises address?

I can buy the talk about someone living with the family (JM) who owes money to someone (cartel) and SC is somehow involved also.

Also if Sergio borrowed money to keep from having his current house foreclosed on - maybe he told people he borrowed it from work (but it has now come out from his employer they did not lend him money).

JM has a jeep.

The truck mentioned by news media found in one of the police reports was an "uncle's" truck, not the cousin's car.

No addresses are included in Arizona public records, so I am not sure how this could have been stated.

I do know that I have searched records of all kinds for many different people not just in this case, but in the Gabriel case, and have never seen any addresses. I wish.

 

[luvmydogs]

docs out at www.kold.com

 

[spoiledmom]

SM, you mean you're NOT psychic ? And here I was thinkin...oh never mind ....

Seriously, something that sounded weird : when RC said something to the effect of " It will all be explained when Isabel returns home...*paraphrasing* but close to the actual quote. What on earth did she mean ? Makes it sound like the whole thing is just a big month long misunderstanding...JMO

I thought the same thing when I heard her say that. It's sounded like she knew exactly what was going on and we will all find out when this is over. I am pretty sure she said "when Isabel is home". Didn't she also say that?