CA/Canada - Elisa Lam - 21 years old - Los Angeles/Vancouver - 31-Jan-2013 - #2

[xlittlewingx]

Just to grind down on the video a bit more.

The second time she is in the elevator pushing all the central buttons, she is bent over more than the first time.

Lower and closer to the panel.

So that she can push the emergency button and speak into the speaker at the bottom of the panel.

And I think it's pretty clear that the other elevator is to the left of the camera.

Look at the foot movements at the end of the video.

If you were going to go left down the hall, you would lead with your left foot.

Instead she brings her right foot around to the left, which turns her body to face the other elevator.

To get in the other elevator which has finally arrived.

But, the police didn't say she was seen by security at the elevator, so I don't think security came up the other elevator. It just arrived because she pressed the hall elevator button.

And finally, whether it is the 14 or 15 floor, what was she doing there if she was staying in the 4 level "Stay"?

Without her glasses?

It's unbelievable that she went to the 14/15 floor in the other part of the hotel, without her glasses, to have a pee.

Or to go up to the roof to look at the view, without her glasses.

Assuming that, I think it could be possible that the perp was always to her left and never to her right (assuming there is only one). She was backed into the right side wall/opening of the elevator in defense. Elisa was in flight or fight mode and chose flight?

 

[californiared3]

Yep thanks kenmore, thats it. So I guess newspapers are covering her blog as well.

The article is here:
http://big5.xinhuanet.com/gate/big5/news.xinhuanet.com/overseas/2013-02/24/c_124380059.htm


It mentions that Amanda, Elisa's friend, received a postcard from LA...

and the contents frightened her. She wrote on the postcard that she was afraid of something.

Sounds like it could be referring to this Tumblr post: http://nouvelle-nouveau.tumblr.com/post/41581697593/im-going-out-tonight-i-really-hope-no-creeper

Link to the article?

I know her Tumblr is now being tracked by a Chinese-language forum based on a Google search. They heard it here first

 

[ceefry23]

Re: possibility of a broken neck, I think that would be included under visual signs of trauma, wouldn't it? If the quote is accurate, there were no signs of physical trauma.

I'm just trying to concept ideas of possible deaths that might seem natural. You fall head first in to a water tank it's a possibility you could break your neck no?

 

[Robert White]

I like the last two paragraphs. Perhaps this is a complete accident and she was on the roof with someone. I don't think it explains why the person would go through the length they did to hide the body Unless worried someone knew they were together or could be suspect. As for someone robbing her room I don't buy that. The man said he was almost knocked out of bed by the sounds he heard. In a simple hotel room I couldn't imagine there being too much stuff to search especially if she was ready to check out soon. But you could be right, my theory is her phone and ID were flushed so maybe the perp was just extra loud throwing stuff around I dunno

To me the ruckus in my eyes was caused by a struggle, a fight, not a robbery alone.

If it were a struggle, then wouldn't he have heard more than just banging? Elisa should have been screaming at the top of her lungs either in fear or for help. She likely would have inflicted wounds on him/her as well, but given the time she was in the tank, that evidence would have disappeared from her nails.

 

[cluciano63]

clucian, could you please edit your post to remove the name Pab** and the specific name of the group. The post you quoted was mod-snipped.

OK. I did.

 

[skyfitsheaven]

Her Tumblr makes multiple solicitations for "meet-ups" during her trip to California, and she is also proven to have met with a blogger she admired in Toronto. Elisa was certainly no stranger to meeting people from the Internet, so this is absolutely a better thread to follow than "why did the elevator stay open so long?" or "why did she press the buttons in that order?"

Going to a bar or club alone is not weird behavior for an independent person like Elisa was. If you travel alone, going to a bar alone wouldn't be out of the ordinary.

I do think that tracing her steps on her trip is way more useful than analyzing the video. Wish her Facebook was accessible...

 

[margarita25]

More from Chinese media outlets: http://big5.xinhuanet.com/gate/big5/news.xinhuanet.com/overseas/2013-02/24/c_124380059.htm

此外，OMNI記者也在臉書上找到藍可兒另一好友Amanda的網頁。Amanda在2月7日的網頁中，上載了據稱藍可兒從洛杉磯寄給她的明信片。該明信片上說有些東西令她感到害怕。

此外，有網友找到了疑似藍可兒本人的網志。該網志所貼出的諸多日志和一張自拍照，與藍可兒本人經歷和體態，均有極度相似之處。

此間星島日報引述疑似藍可兒的女孩在1月27日的日志裏寫道﹕“今晚準備出去，並希望一些意大利和墨西哥的跟蹤狂不要靠近自己。因為感到他們就像把我當作獵物一樣捕獲。”疑似藍可兒的人還提到，在當天遺失了手機。

在網際網路驚現疑似藍可兒微博的日志裏，當事人還提到一款流行的“喪屍求生遊戲”，而且也多次談及自己心情不好。

日志談到該遊戲中的一個情節就是，玩家從一個虛構城市的市區中一幢公寓頂樓經過下水道逃生。而藍可兒的屍體，就是本周較早時在洛杉磯一酒店樓頂水塔裏發現的

Google translate: (plus a little editing since Google picks up Elisa's name as "blue can children")

In addition, OMNI reporters another friend Amanda page can also be found on the Elisa's Facebook. Amanda February 7 pages, contained the allegedly Elisa send her postcards from Los Angeles. The postcard said some things that she was afraid.

In addition, users Elisa suspected can I blog. Many logs posted in the blog and a self-portrait, and Elisa I experienced and posture, have extreme similarities.

Here Sing Tao Daily quoted the suspected Elisa wrote: January 27 log "ready to go out tonight and hope that Italy and Mexico stalker Do not go near because they feel they like me as prey Like capture Elisa also mentioned, lost the phone that day.

Of suspected Elisa microblogging Internet Jingxian log, the parties also mentioned a popular zombie survival game ", but also repeatedly talked about his bad mood.

Log talked about episode of the game is that players from a fictional city urban an apartment on the top floor after the sewer escape. Elisa's corpse is in the water tower, the roof of a hotel in Los Angeles earlier this week found

Ok, IF this is credible, this is promising.
Is this a credible source?

 

[Robert White]

More from Chinese media outlets: http://big5.xinhuanet.com/gate/big5/news.xinhuanet.com/overseas/2013-02/24/c_124380059.htm

此外，OMNI記者也在臉書上找到藍可兒另一好友Amanda的網頁。Amanda在2月7日的網頁中，上載了據稱藍可兒從洛杉磯寄給她的明信片。該明信片上說有些東西令她感到害怕。

此外，有網友找到了疑似藍可兒本人的網志。該網志所貼出的諸多日志和一張自拍照，與藍可兒本人經歷和體態，均有極度相似之處。

此間星島日報引述疑似藍可兒的女孩在1月27日的日志裏寫道﹕“今晚準備出去，並希望一些意大利和墨西哥的跟蹤狂不要靠近自己。因為感到他們就像把我當作獵物一樣捕獲。”疑似藍可兒的人還提到，在當天遺失了手機。

在網際網路驚現疑似藍可兒微博的日志裏，當事人還提到一款流行的“喪屍求生遊戲”，而且也多次談及自己心情不好。

日志談到該遊戲中的一個情節就是，玩家從一個虛構城市的市區中一幢公寓頂樓經過下水道逃生。而藍可兒的屍體，就是本周較早時在洛杉磯一酒店樓頂水塔裏發現的

Google translate: (plus a little editing since Google picks up Elisa's name as "blue can children")

In addition, OMNI reporters another friend Amanda page can also be found on the Elisa's Facebook. Amanda February 7 pages, contained the allegedly Elisa send her postcards from Los Angeles. The postcard said some things that she was afraid.

In addition, users Elisa suspected can I blog. Many logs posted in the blog and a self-portrait, and Elisa I experienced and posture, have extreme similarities.

Here Sing Tao Daily quoted the suspected Elisa wrote: January 27 log "ready to go out tonight and hope that Italy and Mexico stalker Do not go near because they feel they like me as prey Like capture Elisa also mentioned, lost the phone that day.

Of suspected Elisa microblogging Internet Jingxian log, the parties also mentioned a popular zombie survival game ", but also repeatedly talked about his bad mood.

Log talked about episode of the game is that players from a fictional city urban an apartment on the top floor after the sewer escape. Elisa's corpse is in the water tower, the roof of a hotel in Los Angeles earlier this week found

Important. I'm reading this as though she has had multiple encounters with these individuals. Or likely has frequented the same place multiple nights in her stay.

However, given that she took absolutely no action, perhaps it wasn't as much of a threat as she perceived it to be. Might have been paranoia - but it might have been real. Again, everything is so bloody speculative.

 

[xlittlewingx]

I like the last two paragraphs. Perhaps this is a complete accident and she was on the roof with someone. I don't think it explains why the person would go through the length they did to hide the body Unless worried someone knew they were together or could be suspect. As for someone robbing her room I don't buy that. The man said he was almost knocked out of bed by the sounds he heard. In a simple hotel room I couldn't imagine there being too much stuff to search especially if she was ready to check out soon. But you could be right, my theory is her phone and ID were flushed so maybe the perp was just extra loud throwing stuff around I dunno

To me the ruckus in my eyes was caused by a struggle, a fight, not a robbery alone.

This could possibly be due to the fact that the perp is a tourist/not a local and/or does not have access to a car. If the body can't be transported away, then you better hide it as best you can where you can and in a place that does not implicate you specifically.

 

[DrSlooth]

Agreed. At the end of the day, the video speculation isn't going to help Elisa, simply because there is not enough to go on. If Santa Monica was the end goal, and LA was an unscheduled stop (at least to her parents), we can logically assume that someone or something of interest made her stop for that period of time.

Given your statement of internet meets, its I would strongly suggest she went to meet someone. The problem there is, who is the POI? The person she met online, or a person she met while roaming around LA?

She planned to stop in LA.
http://nouvelle-nouveau.tumblr.com/post/40401259146/planning-planning-planning-for-the-west-coast

 

[margarita25]

I'm just trying to concept ideas of possible deaths that might seem natural. You fall head first in to a water tank it's a possibility you could break your neck no?

Of course, Not knocking by any means, we are all speculating here and shooting out different ideas, I was just wondering if this would be listed as physical trauma or not, as relating to the article that there were no signs of physical trauma.

 

[kenmore]

Agreed. At the end of the day, the video speculation isn't going to help Elisa, simply because there is not enough to go on. If Santa Monica was the end goal, and LA was an unscheduled stop (at least to her parents), we can logically assume that someone or something of interest made her stop for that period of time.

Given your statement of internet meets, its I would strongly suggest she went to meet someone. The problem there is, who is the POI? The person she met online, or a person she met while roaming around LA?

That would be the million-dollar question. And of course, there exists the possibility that she didn't meet anyone that fateful night, but ended up on the roof of the hotel by herself and became confused and...

I have spent way too much time trying to find further Internet trails left by Elisa using various combinations of the user names I have uncovered so far. Nothing. I did find an e-mail address left by Elisa under her "L.L." alias...

http://www.latterstyle.com/2011/11/giveaway-lula-13.html

So...marinierefields@gmail.com

Therein might lie the POI. Or at least their email address.

LE could very well already have it, since she calls herself "Elisa" when listing it and there aren't any other e-mail addresses to be found using her "real" name. If not, they do now, right? Get that search warrant, LAPD.

 

[Robert White]

Going to a bar or club alone is not weird behavior for an independent person like Elisa was. If you travel alone, going to a bar alone wouldn't be out of the ordinary.

I do think that tracing her steps on her trip is way more useful than analyzing the video. Wish her Facebook was accessible...

I'll be the devil advocate here. Why do you think that the video is more useful? Since I joined in on this, I've probably read at least 20 different variances in theories of what could possibly of happened. We have no audio, no video enhancers, no behavioural/body expertise that have come forward. Its nearly impossible to do anything but speculate.

On the other hand, analyzing her trip gives us an absolute sense of her path, her mind set. It allows us to see where she was going, what she was doing, and how she was going into it.

Edit: And I would strongly argue in the most emphatic sense, that regardless if you are independent or not, bar/clubbing in any major city is out of the norm.

 

[margarita25]

Wow, Robert W and I just posted the exact same thing about the chinese article at almost the same time. That was weird!

 

[Turk February]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TjVBpyTeZM"]Elisa Lam Video - YouTube[/ame]

Now just a reminder, who do you think is monitoring the CCTV cameras all around the hotel at night, especially the CCTV camera inside the elevator Elisa Lam was in?

The security guards. It was probably the same people who she was talking to in the CCTV video at 1:56 before she stepped out of the camera for the last time. They must of been concerned by watching Elisa's strange behavior through the CCTV camera on the elevator, while observing in the security monitor room -- as well as noticing how the elevator wasn't working and went to dispatch a security guard to check up on her.


Also, security staff at the Cecil Hotel would also have access to restricted areas, such as for example:

The locked door leading to the rooftops which is also armed with a alarm trigger that rings continuously when the door is opened -- unless you have a special key to insert in the alarm to disable it before opening the door. The rooftops don't have CCTV cameras up there by the way.



Any theories anybody here wants to repeat on how Elisa Lam could of gotten up the rooftops?

 

[californiared3]

The picture...haunting really, of the postcard sent to Amanda.

http://www.ettoday.net/news/20130224/167106.htm

Courtesy of Chinese media outlet: http://www.ettoday.net/news/20130224/167106.htm

 

[ceefry23]

If it were a struggle, then wouldn't he have heard more than just banging? Elisa should have been screaming at the top of her lungs either in fear or for help. She likely would have inflicted wounds on him/her as well, but given the time she was in the tank, that evidence would have disappeared from her nails.

That's just it, if there was a significant struggle in the room then she would be likely to have bruising at least if not worse. That's what makes me think broken neck. As stated earlier however apparently breaking a neck isn't as easy to do as it looks in movies so I don't know. Maybe she drank something poisoned and fell too who knows. I'm just assuming that the body wasnt in visible rough shape when she was autopsied

The sound of a body dropping to the floor after having their neck snapped would probably knock me out of bed.

Why go back to the fourth floor if you're on the 14th floor? Doesn't make much sense

 

[kenmore]

Ok, IF this is credible, this is promising.
Is this a credible source?

It's from the Tumblr that I first verified, so yeah, credible as all heck

In all seriousness, no, it is a literal reading by a foreign reporter of a North American girl's sarcasm about the behavior of men in clubs. Elisa was not referring to a specific incident or person in the post this was taken from, nor did she come across as afraid.

 

[Robert White]

That's just it, if there was a significant struggle in the room then she would be likely to have bruising at least if not worse. That's what makes me think broken neck. As stated earlier however apparently breaking a neck isn't as easy to do as it looks in movies so I don't know. Maybe she drank something poisoned and fell too who knows. I'm just assuming that the body wasnt in visible rough shape when she was autopsied

The sound of a body dropping to the floor after having their neck snapped would probably knock me out of bed.

Why go back to the fourth floor if you're on the 14th floor? Doesn't make much sense

However, no matter what the decomposition is of a body, a broken neck is going to be apparent during autopsy. Unless of course the body itself has lost its own mass, in that case they wouldn't have used a body bag in retrieving her. It would have been much worse.

 

[cath999]

I just looked at the meds her "doctors" had her on. I'm absolutely disgusted. It seems she got the classic cop-out diagnosis of bipolar (although I don't see where it says if she was I, II or NOS) along with depression and ADHD. This diagnosis drives me crazy (pun unintentional, but noted and left anyway.) Three out of the four medications she was on could trigger mania - effexor (an SNRI anti-depressant), wellbutrin (an atypical anti-depressant) and adderall (a straight up amphetamine.)

Bipolar disorder has become a catch all diagnosis as of late, particularly in women. So many of the DSM criteria are subjective, especially in a regimented society. What one doctor can call "impulsive" behavior, another could simply think was the result of a whimsical personality. Also, while ADHD can in theory be comorbid with bipolar disorder, ADHD and depression are on the differential for bipolar. Also, classic symptoms like "sexual indiscretion" are FAR more likely to be applied to women than to men. How many partners makes a woman sexually indiscrete as opposed to a man?


If this turns out to be a suicide or an accident, I hope her doctor(s) undergo serious scrutiny.

I agree in regards to her medication. In my practice I have never known people with Bipolar to be prescribed that much anti depressant and an amphetamine. Your just asking to flip them into mania.