Casey's Move-in-w/Amy Plans Explained

[BondJamesBond]

Can anyone advise if the cell call Casey made to Amy @ 7:20PM, on Monday, 6/19, was answered, and if so, the duration of that call?

 

[BondJamesBond]

I've taken a HARD look @ Amy's statement, and, just as important as the clarification of the error in the affidavit [my speculation that fixes Casey's move-in date w/ Tony as 6/9 http://websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2657027&postcount=1] is the clarification of what was going on with the move-in-with-Amy story.

Here goes...watch this closely...

DISCLAIMER: speculation based facts - for brevity not all shown here.

1) Casey pre-planned to move in w/ Tony 6/15.
2) Casey's plan was to get a "house" by 6/13-6/14 [call this house#1] where Amy could babysit Caylee while Casey slept @ Tony's as she had been doing. Evidenced by Casey’s 6/4 Facebook message to Amy setting move-in date.
3) Casey needed the 6/9-6/14 "mini-vacation" to search for house#1.
4) After Caylee died 6/15PM-6/16AM* house#1 was no longer needed.
5) After Caylee died , Casey changed her story to Amy and generated the G&C-divorcing-and-turning-the-Anthony-house [house#2] over-to-her story, etc. which she eventually wiggled out of and knew when she created it had no intention of doing.
6) After Caylee died and Casey no longer needed Amy to babysit @ house#1 Casey proceeded to steal from Amy while she was in Puerto Rico. This explains the abrupt change in Casey's treatment of Amy.

* I will show in a separate post how this date is fixed by a statement to LE.

The Casey’s 6/24 Facebook “DRAMMMMA” message about not being @ “the house” for the last 9 days and other references to Casey & Amy moving into “a house” together with Casey’s story changing from house#1 to house#2 along the way made the move-in-with-Amy plans confusing.

Here’s how I pick this important clarification out of Amy’s statement to LE. Note it is especially confusing because Amy talks about the move-into-G&C-house [house#2] first (geez):

From Amy interview transcript:

“A: Um, basically she..first there was when I was suppose to first move in. Um, there was like landscaping or yard stuff or there’s certain little things that her dad wanted to get fixed. ‘Cause apparently the tale was that her mom was gonna sign the house over to her and she was gonna takeover the mortgage payments. Um, so ‘cause she was gonna buy a house and we were gonna move into that house together [house#1]. And then this [George cheating on Cindy story] happened…and so I was just gonna move into that [G&C’s] house [house#2] .”​

There are further Facebook exchanges & LE statements w/ Amy about having a glimmer of hope to still have a home, and being homeless, etc.. These are a byproduct of Casey stringing her along as late as 7/4.

Sooo…my apologies for the long post, but, any Orlando area rental property agent could review their activities 6/10-6/14 for evidence of Casey (possibly w/ Caylee in-tow) acting as herself, or using an alias (e.g. one of the female “players”, OR, using the Angela W******s or C. Williams, etc. identity associated w/ fraudulent cc charges) viewing rental properties would be of interest. It would have been something far enough away from G&C, to be hidden, but, close enough to Fusian & a ‘new’ Tony apartment to work for Casey’s new plan. With the focus on post-6/15, I believe someone out there has 6/10-6/14 information they’ve considered unimportant until now.

OK. We’re able to develop this a little further now to establish the LATEST likely time that Caylee was alive IF her death was the result of a crime of passion or an accident. IF it was premeditated, the date & time could have been later than shown here.

Casey’s need for a legitimate house (a.k.a. house#1) disappeared immediately when Caylee died. Instead of waiting, she then immediately changed her story to Amy to the take-over-G&C’s house (a.k.a. house#2) and move in there. The house#2 was a ruse from its inception.

Now note Casey’s Facebook message to Amy on Tuesday, 6/17, @ 3:15PM. Casey’s message is no longer about becoming roommates, but has shifted to the next step (i.e. “can’t wait to finally get you moved in.”). This suggests that before 3:15PM on Tuesday 6/17 Casey had already changed her story to Amy from getting house#1 to taking over G&C’s house ( house#2). Until/unless additional phone records indicate, Casey called Amy @ 7:20PM on Monday, 6/16, which was likely when she first gave Amy the house#2 ruse.

Therefore, unless there are other phone records of Casey calling Amy, or, Casey visiting Amy between 6/15 and 6/17 @ 3:15PM, it is likely that the LATEST time Caylee was alive was 7:19PM Monday, 6/19. And, practically speaking, it was likely before that time.

Alternatively, the date & time that Casey told Tony the new nanny story on either 6/15PM or 6/16 will more definitely establish the LATEST likely time Caylee was alive IF her death was the result of a crime of passion or an accident.

Unless Casey told Tony the new nanny story 6/15PM or before 9AM on Monday, 6/16, Caylee was likely still alive 6/16. Tony’s class schedule was established to be typically in classes @ Full Sail 9AM-1PM, on Monday 6/19. Casey’s cell call to Tony @ 4:19PM went unanswered. There is a break in Casey’s “flurry” of calls Monday afternoon between 4:24PM and 6:32PM giving Casey ample time to collect her clothes and drive to Tony’s apartment where he would first see her. At 6:32PM Casey places a call to the G&C home phone from her cell, indicating that Casey is no longer @ the G&C home, and supporting that she hasn’t spoken to Tony until sometime after 4:24PM.

IMHO, the date & time of the first telling of the (1) move-in-with-Amy, and (2) the new-nanny-to-Tony, storylines provide substantially more weight to the date & time of Caylee’s demise than the ‘flurry’ of cell calls on Monday, 6/19, alone IF it was a crime of passion or an accidental death.

IF the crime was premeditated, the date & time of Caylee’s death could have been later than shown here as Casey could have kept Caylee alive in a third location (e.g. car, etc.) while she issued her (1) move-in-with-Amy and (2) new-nanny-to-Tony storylines setting the groundwork to buy more time after the crime.

Stating the obvious…regarding the EARLIEST possible time of death….

Cindy & Clint’s accounts conflict on whether Casey stayed the night 6/15 @ C&G’s or @ Tony’s. IF Caylee was still alive on the morning of 6/16 - and I believe G&C accounts of 6/16 Caylee sightings should be treated as suspect – then G&C were both working on 6/16 and would have required Casey return there, if not already there, before George left for work ~2:30PM 6/16 in order to provide care for Caylee. Additional evidence, in the form of phone records and additional testimony is needed to establish Casey & Caylee’s movements 6/15PM to 6/16 to narrow the earliest possible date & time Caylee could have died, whether it was an accident or intentional or pre-meditated.

 

[halleyscomet]

I'm wondering why KC knew so much about Sawgrass Apts. She gave directions -- something about the apt being after the first speed bump and then there was a little shack or something. So, we know that she was in that apt complex at one time to know these details. I wonder if that little shack has been looked at.

 

[monoxide]

I'm wondering why KC knew so much about Sawgrass Apts. She gave directions -- something about the apt being after the first speed bump and then there was a little shack or something. So, we know that she was in that apt complex at one time to know these details. I wonder if that little shack has been looked at.

She went around looking for apartments for AL so maybe she went there at one point and time? Could've been really recent to the time she was questioned and remember somebody she knew lived nearby. Was it Amy that lived near Sawgrass? Somebody lived right next to it

 

[BondJamesBond]

She went around looking for apartments for AL so maybe she went there at one point and time? Could've been really recent to the time she was questioned and remember somebody she knew lived nearby. Was it Amy that lived near Sawgrass? Somebody lived right next to it

Actually, IMHO, she was looking for house#1 (could have also looked @ apartments) first, when Casey's plan was to have a place for she & Amy, then, after Caylee died, she spun a story to Amy creating the move-in-with G&C ruse (house#2) and her real intent was to move into a new apartment with Tony.

Sooo....Casey was looking @ rental property as early as 6/10.

 

[BondJamesBond]

I'm wondering why KC knew so much about Sawgrass Apts. She gave directions -- something about the apt being after the first speed bump and then there was a little shack or something. So, we know that she was in that apt complex at one time to know these details. I wonder if that little shack has been looked at.

Casey knew & partied w/ Dante who lived at Sawgrass. Dante was also associated @ Cast Iron tatt's where Casey hung out (weird, I know). The real ZFG's boyfriend Jonathan had gotten his new tattoo @ Cast Iron.

 

[BondJamesBond]

OK. We’re able to develop this a little further now to establish the LATEST likely time that Caylee was alive IF her death was the result of a crime of passion or an accident. IF it was premeditated, the date & time could have been later than shown here.

Casey’s need for a legitimate house (a.k.a. house#1) disappeared immediately when Caylee died. Instead of waiting, she then immediately changed her story to Amy to the take-over-G&C’s house (a.k.a. house#2) and move in there. The house#2 was a ruse from its inception.

Now note Casey’s Facebook message to Amy on Tuesday, 6/17, @ 3:15PM. Casey’s message is no longer about becoming roommates, but has shifted to the next step (i.e. “can’t wait to finally get you moved in.”). This suggests that before 3:15PM on Tuesday 6/17 Casey had already changed her story to Amy from getting house#1 to taking over G&C’s house ( house#2). Until/unless additional phone records indicate, Casey called Amy @ 7:20PM on Monday, 6/16, which was likely when she first gave Amy the house#2 ruse.

Therefore, unless there are other phone records of Casey calling Amy, or, Casey visiting Amy between 6/15 and 6/17 @ 3:15PM, it is likely that the LATEST time Caylee was alive was 7:19PM Monday, 6/19. And, practically speaking, it was likely before that time.

Alternatively, the date & time that Casey told Tony the new nanny story on either 6/15PM or 6/16 will more definitely establish the LATEST likely time Caylee was alive IF her death was the result of a crime of passion or an accident.

Unless Casey told Tony the new nanny story 6/15PM or before 9AM on Monday, 6/16, Caylee was likely still alive 6/16. Tony’s class schedule was established to be typically in classes @ Full Sail 9AM-1PM, on Monday 6/19. Casey’s cell call to Tony @ 4:19PM went unanswered. There is a break in Casey’s “flurry” of calls Monday afternoon between 4:24PM and 6:32PM giving Casey ample time to collect her clothes and drive to Tony’s apartment where he would first see her. At 6:32PM Casey places a call to the G&C home phone from her cell, indicating that Casey is no longer @ the G&C home, and supporting that she hasn’t spoken to Tony until sometime after 4:24PM. So, IMHO, based on the available informaion, Caylee died before 4:24PM, Monday, 6/16.

IMHO, the date & time of the first telling of the (1) move-in-with-Amy, and (2) the new-nanny-to-Tony, storylines provide substantially more weight to the date & time of Caylee’s demise than the ‘flurry’ of cell calls on Monday, 6/19, alone IF it was a crime of passion or an accidental death.

IF the crime was premeditated, the date & time of Caylee’s death could have been later than shown here as Casey could have kept Caylee alive in a third location (e.g. car, etc.) while she issued her (1) move-in-with-Amy and (2) new-nanny-to-Tony storylines setting the groundwork to buy more time after the crime.

Stating the obvious…regarding the EARLIEST possible time of death….

Cindy & Clint’s accounts conflict on whether Casey stayed the night 6/15 @ C&G’s or @ Tony’s. IF Caylee was still alive on the morning of 6/16 - and I believe G&C accounts of 6/16 Caylee sightings should be treated as suspect – then G&C were both working on 6/16 and would have required Casey return there, if not already there, before George left for work ~2:30PM 6/16 in order to provide care for Caylee. Additional evidence, in the form of phone records and additional testimony is needed to establish Casey & Caylee’s movements 6/15PM to 6/16 to narrow the earliest possible date & time Caylee could have died, whether it was an accident or intentional or pre-meditated.

...updated to include the important conclustion of Caylee's demise prior to 4:24PM 6/16.

 

[jmommy]

We can probably subtract ZG from that picture. Casey didn't look at the Sawgrass apartment in ZG's name. ZG made her statement to LE and it was in fact herself that looked at the apartment.

I think, even if Casey showed up at Sawgrass to inquire about an apartment during the same time ZG happened to be there, I'd think she would just swipe the visitor card instead of taking information from it.

What a freaking coincident. I mean a Zenaida Gonzalez just so happens looks at an apartment in the same complex. I mean the name it's self is so uncommon and then to have a Zenaida Gonzalex look at that apartment around the same time all this happens. Just so freaky to me. I totally believe Casey is lieing and that she killed her child. HOwever, there's got to be some kind of connection here. Maybe she saw this lady look at that apartment that day some how. I don't know, but it's too much of a coincidence to me.

 

[BondJamesBond]

Shadow: No, we're going down different paths. Please read post#1 of this thread if you haven't already. I think that will fill in quite a few of the blanks regarding what you've posted.

 

[BondJamesBond]

BTW...we can now add a [rental#3] for clarification.

After Caylee died 6/16, Casey launched into finding an apartment for she and Tony...damn the torpedos, full speed ahead!

So...for clarity, let's call the new Tony & Casey apartment search [rental#3] to keep it clear that Casey transitioned through her search from house#1 to the house#2 story to rental#3.

If you don't look carefully at what she's doing and why she's doing it, you won't distinguish the differences from 6/10 through the later periods (e.g. by 6/19 she's included Tony in her search @ Crane's Landing).

 

[BondJamesBond]

Bond,
*snipped*
Was the renting of this other place more than just a place to stick Amy with Caylee. ... I just wonder about Amy not seeing or questinging where in the devil Caylee was.

Yes - house#1 was intended to be a place for Casey to dump Caylee on Amy.

Amy's statements did comment about her drastic change in contact w/ Casey and that it was limited to virtually only discussion about what was going to happen with the rental.

I understand a little better now what you're developing w/ 6/9 vs. 6/15. It would help to know if the witness of fight @ the Anthony's was 100% or 50% certain of the date of the fight. I dunno what that % is. I launched a thread to develop this further @ http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71042

 

[shadow of my mind]

Yes - house#1 was intended to be a place for Casey to dump Caylee on Amy.

Amy's statements did comment about her drastic change in contact w/ Casey and that it was limited to virtually only discussion about what was going to happen with the rental.

I understand a little better now what you're developing w/ 6/9 vs. 6/15. It would help to know if the witness of fight @ the Anthony's was 100% or 50% certain of the date of the fight. I dunno what that % is.

I removed the posts. Let yours ride without my two cents. I will PM you with what I deleted. I have done some digging into RCH and that has made me question a few things. I will add that to the PM.

 

[Broderick]

I don't know the exact dates that she was telling Amy she would get the house, but I am pretty sure it was after Caylee disappeared. I know Casey had a thing for police officers, and perhaps she was looking for a person, even in that type, to help her take care of her next project.

The parents were next.

Time ran out.

 

[BondJamesBond]

I removed the posts.

Whew...I thought I was imagining things there for a minute.

Look forward to the PM info.

 

[leandjl]

Except for the fact that ZG said that it was her boyfriend that told her to check out Sawgrass Apartments and she said that she did not know KC nor had she ever seen her before, she even signed the mugshot of KC saying that she did not know her. If they met, ever, then surely ZG would remember her face within 30 days, especially if they had talked about apartments.

IIRC ZG said it was her "then" bf who was with her at Sawgrass - anyone know who the 'then" bf was?

 

[Truthwillsetufree]

This is by far the best thread I have read in a long time. I feel like my brain is coming out of the fog. Thanks Ya'll!!!!

 

[Kadie]

WOW...great thread. I haven't posted on this one but have been lurking. Excellent detective work and excellent posts!

Thanks.

 

[eclipse827]

I removed the posts. Let yours ride without my two cents. I will PM you with what I deleted. I have done some digging into RCH and that has made me question a few things. I will add that to the PM.

Who or what is RCH?

 

[BondJamesBond]

Who or what is RCH?

Roy Clint...

 

[shadow of my mind]

Who or what is RCH?

Clint goes by his middle name. His full name showed up in the doc dump by the Sentinal by is no longer viewable. All of the pdf's that I have found that remain have blacked out the dang names and address. I was too stupid to download to my hard drive. Grrrrrr