GA - Suspicion over heat death of Cooper, 22 mo., Cobb County, June 2014, #7

[otto]

you'll get no argument from me -- I agree
apparently people who are way smarter insist that kids need to face backwards up to 4 yrs of age.... who knew huh? looks darn uncomfortable to me

A four year old in a carseat that faces the backrest would have his legs twisted all over the place like a pretzel. I couldn't imagine doing that to a child.

 

[liltexans]

bbm
According to Nancy G. the drive from CFA to dad's work place = 1 min. 20 seconds.

The drive from CFA to Cooper's daycare takes 1 min 20, per NG.

But he didn't drive to Cooper's daycare. He went right past it and drove to his office. That drive takes about 3 minutes, give or take.

 

[Lovejac]

I don't buy it only should take 1 min 20 sec. Not with traffic on a weekday morning, even if it was past 9.

The 1 minute and 20 seconds is how long it took from Chik-fil-a to Coopers' daycare.

 

[newone]

A four year old in a carseat that faces the backrest would have his legs twisted all over the place like a pretzel. I couldn't imagine doing that to a child.

thank you! I consider it child abuse -- my kids wouldn't have abided that for more than 10 minutes then they would have ''imploded'' for lack of a better word -

 

[Kimberlyd125]

I'm caught up and out of here for the day. I think I'll check back tomorrow during the court appearance.

[modsnip]

Have a good day.

So he wasn't hated for things that would make seasoned members of LE think he was guilty of killing his baby in a hot car?
Well, that's the difference here.

People are not "hating" him to just hate him. People are outraged by the facts we KNOW and the facts that we are sure LE knows by their statements.

We are not imagining things here. We are not just making justifications because we want to dislike him.

There are many people, myself included, who are using common sense and have come to the realization that this was not an "uh oh I forgot my baby in the car" case.

JMO

 

[popsicle]

reminded by what Bessie has said in the past on another case I have followed. She said even speculation should be based somewhere in fact.

I have to back read as I just woke up but where is the business about killing Cooper in a trunk or cargo area coming from? Has something come out that lead the thread to debate the trunk/cargo area?

Happy Birthday!!

:bdsong:

:bdscroll:

 

[keeponsearching]

Going back to searches. Was there a previous toddler in the news that died from being left in the car? I can say most of us have search some pretty odd things. I've never search how long will it take an animal to die in a hot car, but I am sure I've looked up statistics over how many. Just last month I looked up deaths in front loader washing machines, argh... I can't remember what made me look it up. I don't even have that type of machine or babies.

I just wonder if this gave rh an idea. He saw some other person not get charged and got an idea. Horrible thinking about about planning something like this.

I get guilty over the smallest things. One day I accidentally passed a stop bus, believe me there is a huge story to this and the driver parks off to the side to wait for the kids and then eventually turns the stop light on, so I was not the only one who did this. But I sure paid attention if that kid came out I waited. Anyways I felt so guilty I just wanted to go turn myself in. I can't even lie with out feeling guilty for life. I can't imagine how others can be ok with not telling the truth. Doesn't the guilt eat away at them?

 

[matou]

If he went out to lunch with others that day using their vehicle (speculation), I wonder if others asked for a ride in his vehicle and he dodged the request somehow. JMO

 

[newone]

:cupcake:

reminded by what Bessie has said in the past on another case I have followed. She said even speculation should be based somewhere in fact.

I have to back read as I just woke up but where is the business about killing Cooper in a trunk or cargo area coming from? Has something come out that lead the thread to debate the trunk/cargo area?

:cupcake:arty::gift::bdsong::up:


new member offered a premise - first post

 

[liltexans]

I can see it. I just don't know if it's a reflection or a photo that was taped onto the lamp. It looks more like a taped photo to me (because of its more perfectly square appearance), but I do see what appears to be her face. You can see a face, neck hair and possibly glasses, though that is hard to say for sure. What I can't see is her smiling or anything like that. It's too grainy to note the expression on her face.

I cropped the image:

Edit to add:

- with camera circled.

Can you see it now?

I'm one of those people who can never see things like this in photos. Even when people draw circles and arrows. Even if I squint. You should have seen me trying to make heads or tails of the photos in the Mickey Shunick case. It was a lost cause. I think I was the only one who couldn't "see" what everyone else could.

But even I can see Leanna holding what appears to be a cell phone camera horizontally. Thanks for circling it!

 

[DesertDreamer]

A four year old in a carseat that faces the backrest would have his legs twisted all over the place like a pretzel. I couldn't imagine doing that to a child.

thank you! I consider it child abuse -- my kids wouldn't have abided that for more than 10 minutes then they would have ''imploded'' for lack of a better word -

Calling it child abuse is a bit much, I think.

Parents are following the safety recommendations! Rear facing car seats are safer for kids.

It is safer for kids under a certain weight (I believe 20 pounds) to be in rear facing car seats. This is because they can have their neck snapped forward in such a way as it lead to of cause death in a forward facing car seat. So what's worse, a little leg cramping or a broken neck or paralysis?

Also:

In 2011 the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) revised its policy, citing a study that found children younger than 2 are 75 percent less likely to be killed or injured in a car crash if they're in a rear-facing car seat.

Now both the AAP and the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) recommend children face backward until they outgrow their seat. That means most children should remain in a rear-facing car seat until they're at least 2 or 3 years old.

Why rear-facing is better
Very young children are especially at risk for head and spinal cord injuries because their bones and ligaments are still developing. Their heads are also proportionately larger than their necks, so the structural support system is still a little wobbly. Rear-facing seats give the best support to your child's head, neck, and spine, and prevent your child's head from being thrown away from his body in the event of a car crash.

Although the rate of death from motor vehicle crashes in children younger than 12 has gone down significantly – dropping 45 percent between 2000 and 2010 – they're still the leading cause of death in children older than 1.

Is it safe to keep my child rear-facing if his legs seem too long?

When sitting in a rear-facing car seat, most toddlers have limited legroom. Their legs usually touch the car seat behind them and may even have to be bent or crossed to fit.

This can be troubling to some parents who worry that the child is uncomfortable. Or worse, that his legs could be hurt in the event of a crash. But experts say that's not the case.

Rear-facing car seats are not only far more effective at preventing fatal injuries (as well as those that could permanently disable a child), but they're also much better at protecting your child's arms and legs.

"In a forward-facing car seat during an accident, your child's arms and legs fly forward and are more likely to be injured," says Ben Hoffman, a nationally recognized injury prevention specialist and pediatrician at the Doernbecher Children's Hospital, Oregon Health & Science University. "In a rear-facing car seat, the chance of injuries to the arms and legs in a crash is less than 1 in 10,000."

So it's still the safest position, even for kids who look constricted in a rear-facing seat. As long as kids are within the height and weight limits of the seat, they're most likely quite comfortable, too.

http://www.babycenter.com/0_how-long-to-keep-your-child-in-a-rear-facing-car-seat_10348811.bc

 

[newone]

If he went out to lunch with others that day using their vehicle (speculation), I wonder if others asked for a ride in his vehicle and he dodged the request somehow. JMO

local suggested there was a food truck that day -- now that's seriously good lunch -

 

[tlcya]

as to the photo that was debated with cooper laying on Ross's chest: I believe mom took the photo and is clearly reflected in the brass lamp beyond the two subjects. as to that square to the left of her head in teh image, I think that is a wallmounted flat screen TV or large picture that is mounted on the wall somewhere behind and to the left of Leanna. I cannot see any camera in that reflection.

As to Ross's expression I cannot read too much into that as I have seen similar uncomfortable looks on the faces of many new fathers upon being trapped with a sleeping child on their chests. Especially when you have worked hard to get that child to sleep and now do not know how to extricate yourself from beneath sleeping baby without waking said baby. If anything, he looks slightly irritated with mom, not Cooper.

As in: You think this is funny that I am trapped here beneath our sleeping baby and now cannot move for fear of waking him. I find it less than funny, I wasn't kidding when I said I have to pee. Stop photographing and help me figure out to transition him off my chest now.


NOTE: still back reading, still haven't reached where the debate for trunk vs cargo area or figured out what it's significance is.

 

[matou]

local suggested there was a food truck that day -- now that's seriously good lunch -

If so, it's not really worth mentioning IMO. He could have gone to the office cafeteria (if there is one) or to the food trucks and it doesn't show he avoided using his vehicle to drive somewhere for lunch. JMO

 

[Lyra500]

A four year old in a carseat that faces the backrest would have his legs twisted all over the place like a pretzel. I couldn't imagine doing that to a child.

I have to say, these changes to the recommendations were news to me since it is many years since car seats were a part of my life.

I think this backwards facing until the age of 4 (or whatever the weight limit is) and in the back seat only is a US thing - fairly certain the rules are not that strict in the UK. I can understand not wanting small children facing forwards in the front seat due to the airbags, but it does look very cramped and uncomfortable for children towards the upper end of the age range to be trussed up in the back seat like that. I wonder if it increased the chances of motion sickness as well.....(although I fully except that a bit of puking is by far the lesser evil compared to RTA injury)

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

thank you! I consider it child abuse -- my kids wouldn't have abided that for more than 10 minutes then they would have ''imploded'' for lack of a better word -

Kids often don't like things that are good for them but teaching them good car safety is easier if you do it right from the beginning.
Rearfacing until at least 2 is safer. It protects their neck and can prevent internal injuries.

Their heads are still so much bigger than their little bodies and when forward facing in a front or side crash they are whipped forward and can cause internal decapitation.

It is not child abuse. [modsnip].
IMO

 

[liltexans]

Going back to searches. Was there a previous toddler in the news that died from being left in the car? I can say most of us have search some pretty odd things. I've never search how long will it take an animal to die in a hot car, but I am sure I've looked up statistics over how many. Just last month I looked up deaths in front loader washing machines, argh... I can't remember what made me look it up. I don't even have that type of machine or babies.

I just wonder if this gave rh an idea. He saw some other person not get charged and got an idea. Horrible thinking about about planning something like this.

I get guilty over the smallest things. One day I accidentally passed a stop bus, believe me there is a huge story to this and the driver parks off to the side to wait for the kids and then eventually turns the stop light on, so I was not the only one who did this. But I sure paid attention if that kid came out I waited. Anyways I felt so guilty I just wanted to go turn myself in. I can't even lie with out feeling guilty for life. I can't imagine how others can be ok with not telling the truth. Doesn't the guilt eat away at them?

Some people do not feel guilt. Those people are usually called sociopaths or psychopaths. They are devoid of empathy and have little to no conscience.

I'm like you. I can't even lie without feeling guilty that I lied. But not everyone is like us.

Fortunately not all sociopaths are sadistic. But the sadistic sociopaths are the scariest type of all.

 

[AgentFrankLundy]

Creepy, almost, I thought it was a selfie at first, but you're right the wife took it . [modsnip] not showing much emotion . Just damn.

 

[matou]

IMO that is not a reflection. It looks like a photo and the camera, if it is one, is positioned to the side of her face. Who takes a photo with a phone or camera holding it to the side of their face instead of looking into the screen to see if the shot is in focus or not KWIM? JMO. Also, unless the reflective surface is a flat/plane mirror, the image would not look so perfect and flat. JMO

 

[tlcya]

Okay I have given up on backreading - I went back to page 16 or so. Bored reading stuff you all have already hashed out. Would rather be participating in now's conversation

Good morning everyone and :wagon: to all our new members. Glad to have you join us.