Japan - Miyazawa family of 4 murdered, Setagaya, Tokyo, 30 Dec 2000 #2

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If my theory about there being a link to Yokota / USAF is true, then this is very exciting news.
DNA from trash links former U.S. soldier to 1978 murder in Germany, investigators say: "Match was 1 in 270 quadrillion"

Some similarities in the Setagaya case, too. My only concern would be that the German authorities got to this point with "forensic advances" which, as we all know, isn't going to be so simple in this case.
 
We know that due to laws in Japan preventing the use of the collected DNA being analysed in certain ways to find someone, the TMPD are (for now) still mostly relying on the fingerprints someday triggering a match, or getting a new lead, but do the laws prevent an ordinary citizen from collecting DNA and having it sent off themselves?
I honestly don’t have the faintest idea how someone would go about that or the cost and legalities involved… but, is there something stopping say, An Irie, going back to the house and collecting as much DNA as possible and having it looked at? Could she do that? Perhaps have it sent off to somewhere outside of Japan where it is legal?
 
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@Dr. Snoop the information of what has been released by the limited testing that can legally done in Japan just leaves us with an article full of it is “believed”, “estimated”, “indicated”, “possibly”, “considered”. There’s nothing definitive besides the blood type and sex.
They can’t even be sure he entered from the bathroom window which is the basis for “physicality required” to enter the house. Based on recent conversations on this thread it doesn’t even seem likely anymore and it was more likely it was Rei’s balcony instead.
The limitations of these laws in Japan are frustrating, albeit understandable I suppose.
 
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You really have to be careful with this wikipedia page. It's a mess of truths, misunderstandings, errors and mistranslations. For example, right there, in line two, the age range is wrong. The police updated it to 15-early 20s very recently. The whole thing about DNA, I've written about it so many times on this thread (and the previous Miyazawa thread #1 of which there are almost 60 pages), I can't bring myself to repeat it. But basically, the idea that he is "mixed race" is almost certainly a simplification and a misunderstanding. So on, so forth.
 
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@FacelessPodcast, was the “part-time restaurant worker” ever identified?
Tia
Hi Tia, good question: the answer is no. But, I'm not actually sure this was ever a real lead. If you look at the source printing this story, it's not exactly top-tier national news. And, as always seems to be the way in lurid true crime in this part of the world, full of convenient gaps and acronyms. Everyone is Mr. K or Mr. R, there are never any records, nothing firm. I think it's possible this was basically a lead the TMPD chased up but it led to nothing. Because if it were real, if the idea that someone had employed the killer who was working locally AND he was guilty of other crimes, it would tell us that this man was likely still in Japan. If that's true, then I would be confident in the TMPD catching him sooner or later.
 
Are there any CCTV images of the perpetrator or witness statements available? I was thinking about the ice-cream fest, considering that it would require a pretty large individual to consume an excessive amount of ice-cream at once. I wonder if this observation has garnered any feedback from readers—what if someone recognises a person known for their fervour for ice-cream?
Zero CCTV images (despite the rumours that there were). The ice cream was four small cups.
 
Are there any CCTV images of the perpetrator or witness statements available? I was thinking about the ice-cream fest, considering that it would require a pretty large individual to consume an excessive amount of ice-cream at once. I wonder if this observation has garnered any feedback from readers—what if someone recognises a person known for their fervour for ice-cream?
As for witnesses, there are a few possibles but nothing solid. One woman who sees a man stumble out in front of her car near the house. But zero blood on the floor and the timings wouldn't line up. A taxi driver who has three men in the back of his car who later found blood there (it turned out to be chocolate). And a man with a hand wound in Tobbu-Nikko station 3 hours north of Tokyo the next day (discounted by the Chief for reasons he wouldn't get into). That's it.
 
Yet these boards mention the killer's DNA in the household slippers casually. As well as the fact that red fluorescent dye on the perp's clothes matches the dye in Mikio's garage, that the perp was known not to enter on the day of murders. So the possibility of the perp having visited Miyazawa's house prior to the day of murders can not be excluded. It is my understanding that Yasuko's cram school was in the adjacent house, right?

The whole situation is not very clear. I wonder if the perp was marginally known to the family.

Let me offer a very hypothecal situation. There are countries where you can invite a notary for a house visit to a sick elderly person. And if the guest is polite, he may change shoes and wash hands, too. On a hot day, he can be offered water/tea in a kitchen. In short, he can know the layout of the house.

What profession in Japan can easily make a house visit? Or, could a colleague be invited to discuss some job? The Wikipedia discussed that Mikio was making clothes for actors at home, is it a possible situation?
The red dye is found in common items such as pens. The idea that it somehow links Mikio and the killer is not proven. We also know that there was no traces of the killer in the garage at all. Yes, the possibility he visited before the attack cannot be discounted, of course. But we do know that the TMPD found zero connections between them. After 23 years and 280,000+ personnel investigating. Still over 30 detectives to this day. I find the idea that he was a casual friend but one that left zero trace very, very hard to believe. Even a marginal connection, I think they would have found.

From my time in Japan, visiting someone's house is not common. Homes are much smaller there, for starters. I don't think he had to know the layout of the house for him to carry out the murders as he did. You've seen the video, it's a small space. Why would he need prior knowledge of the layout?

You know I in no way put blind faith in the TMPD (or any police force for that matter) but I do think that if there was a connection through work or socialising, they would have caught him by now.
 
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The way i understand it, "supplication" in this case would mean kowtowing before the authority, be it the colonel or the deity. (But also, religious institutions and the military alike are ritualistic and predictable, and certain type of people who might struggle in regular community would thrive in both because of highly regimented atmosphere. - JMO).
Yes, that's what I was going for!
 
We know that due to laws in Japan preventing the use of the collected DNA being analysed in certain ways to find someone, the TMPD are (for now) still mostly relying on the fingerprints someday triggering a match, or getting a new lead, but do the laws prevent an ordinary citizen from collecting DNA and having it sent off themselves?
I honestly don’t have the faintest idea how someone would go about that or the cost and legalities involved… but, is there something stopping say, An Irie, going back to the house and collecting as much DNA as possible and having it looked at? Could she do that? Perhaps have it sent off to somewhere outside of Japan where it is legal?
As I understand it, if there is DNA from a killer on your own private property, there is nothing to stop you from taking -let's say a carpet with blood on it- and sending it for private analysis (particularly if you're sending it to a lab in Taiwan or the US etc). In the case of An Irie, I can only say that Universal had put aside a great deal of money for such a private analysis and part of our interview request was to make this clear. She declined several times.
 
Another quote from Wikipedia
String beans and sesame seeds are part of the diet in Japan, it just indicates he was residing in Japan.
Knife purchased in Kanagawa? Kanagawa borders Setagaya separated only by a river. They’re next to each other. Again just indicates he was in the vicinity.
What’s good about a sweater, no matter how little sold, if after 24 years they can’t find more than a handful of people who bought it.
None of that is really useful honestly…
 
As I understand it, if there is DNA from a killer on your own private property, there is nothing to stop you from taking -let's say a carpet with blood on it- and sending it for private analysis (particularly if you're sending it to a lab in Taiwan or the US etc). In the case of An Irie, I can only say that Universal had put aside a great deal of money for such a private analysis and part of our interview request was to make this clear. She declined several times.
Really? Very interesting. I’m honestly very surprised at that. Thank you for that information. It only makes me more frustrated however.
 
She doesn't like the media, basically. And it's definitely true she's had problems in the past. Including this, which I assume you've heard about:

Relative of murdered family says TV Asahi program misrepresented her
Yes, I had, but I didn’t think she would decline a fully funded private DNA analysis if offered. I understand her disdain for the media, but to decline that, however… and several times at that.
Then I wonder, how much does someone like An Irie know about the sheer amount of information that analysis could unlock in relation to finding her family’s killer. It’s such a shame.

It almost makes me want to go and swab that damn balcony myself. (I’m not serious for anyone wondering).
 
We know that due to laws in Japan preventing the use of the collected DNA being analysed in certain ways to find someone, the TMPD are (for now) still mostly relying on the fingerprints someday triggering a match, or getting a new lead, but do the laws prevent an ordinary citizen from collecting DNA and having it sent off themselves?
I honestly don’t have the faintest idea how someone would go about that or the cost and legalities involved… but, is there something stopping say, An Irie, going back to the house and collecting as much DNA as possible and having it looked at? Could she do that? Perhaps have it sent off to somewhere outside of Japan where it is legal?

Mailing has to be done outside of Japan, if Japan is not on the list of the countries that are serviced by a chosen criminology lab. And, the relative has to have an address in the country. Or c/o. I was thinking about the same yesterday. I noticed that there is possibly one DNA source in the house. Relatives own the house. DNA ownership is private, but sometimes, no one even knows whose DNA is there in a mixed sample. But because they don't want to end up with a mixed sample, they have to know well where he went when he bled, and where their relatives never had the chance to get to.

So, it is more about in what countries are the services provided to by a certain company, and whether the customer has an address in such a country. They can even find a private criminology company/lab in that country. JMO.
 
Yes, I had, but I didn’t think she would decline a fully funded private DNA analysis if offered. I understand her disdain for the media, but to decline that, however… and several times at that.
Then I wonder, how much does someone like An Irie know about the sheer amount of information that analysis could unlock in relation to finding her family’s killer. It’s such a shame.

It almost makes me want to go and swab that damn balcony myself. (I’m not serious for anyone wondering).
We didn't get into much detail, she was so firm in her rejection. But yeah, there was a lot of money on the table from Universal for testing etc.
 
I read that the sisters were very close. Hard to imagine what she goes through, though.
Apparently, from the books she has written, there are conflicting sentiments on this. Of course, they were sisters and close. But I can also tell you first-hand, there was conflict between the two sides. Not that this has anything to do with the case itself.
 
Hi Tia, good question: the answer is no. But, I'm not actually sure this was ever a real lead. If you look at the source printing this story, it's not exactly top-tier national news. And, as always seems to be the way in lurid true crime in this part of the world, full of convenient gaps and acronyms. Everyone is Mr. K or Mr. R, there are never any records, nothing firm. I think it's possible this was basically a lead the TMPD chased up but it led to nothing. Because if it were real, if the idea that someone had employed the killer who was working locally AND he was guilty of other crimes, it would tell us that this man was likely still in Japan. If that's true, then I would be confident in the TMPD catching him sooner or later.
@FacelessPodcast, thank you for your response (btw, Tia stands for: “thanks in advance”, my wife would be quite upset if she thought I’d changed my name to Tia..!)

The following is all just speculation, just one possible theory:

I have no idea how deep the TMPD went on the restaurant worker (I’ll call him “R” as some others have) but if they didn’t go deep on “R”, I think they perhaps should. There are few references to him, but from what I’ve read, fellow employees said “R” was very off - unstable, and threatening. Possibly mentally ill. After the crime, several co-workers immediately pegged him as a possible suspect, especially based on age and appearance.

My questions would be (to TMPD):

-do you know “R”’s name? If you don’t, imo you need to find out. I understand the restaurant is long since closed, but maybe there were/are employment records. Are sole proprietors required to keep records like they do in the US for things like WC, SS, taxes, etc?

-what nationality was “R”?

-was “R” at work the next day - or any of the next few days (I’m sure odd schedule though due to holidays)? If he was, was his right hand bandaged?

-if “R” did not work in the next few days, did he simply disappear following the discovery of the Miyazawa family murders? What’s the story? Did he ever return to work? Whether he worked or not, co-workers apparently thought he should be looked at

-I understand that TMPD does not know the name of the man at the station 3 hrs north of Tokyo the next day with the grievously wounded right hand (I believe I read it was the right hand - with a cut so severe that you could see bone). It’s amazing to me that this man could have been treated for such a severe wound w/o having to provide any information. Even if insurance was not involved (I’m not sure how the healthcare system works in Japan - is it universal, no payment required?), it seems there should be a record of his treatment that would include a name.

I cannot find a link at the moment, but I also read that this mystery man at the station who sought treatment for his hand seemed unfazed by the severe injury. As if the pain didn’t affect him. Kind of an Anton Chigur thing. Very odd.

-were witnesses at the station - and witnesses who treated this man - shown a composite / e-fit of “R”? Did any of them think the man could have been “R”?

If TMPD don’t know who the man at the station was, how can they have ruled him out?

Maybe TMPD knows who “R” is and have ruled him out, but if they don’t know who he is - and if they don’t know his nationality, and if he resembled their composite suspect, and if (IF) the injured man at the station resembled “R”, I don’t see how.

If you Google “migrant workers in Japan”, you will find numerous search results that discuss Japan’s decades-long dire need for foreign workers. Due to the shrinking population over the past several decades (and maybe even going back to the early post-war years) Japan has desperately needed foreign workers at all skill levels. From what I’ve read, the situation today is virtually at crisis level.

This presents a conundrum though, as (imo) the Japanese government and Japanese people would prefer to keep their country and workforce homogeneous. Japanese. In short (again, jmo), the Japanese need migrant workers, but they only want the best. They also however need migrant workers who will perform the lowest level of labor - jobs that the Japanese themselves don’t want to do. This is not new. Many nations with declining populations find themselves in a similar predicament being similarly nationalistic.

In these instances, in a homogeneous nationalistic nation, it would not be surprising for a kind of caste system to develop, where foreign migrant workers (especially those doing menial labor) would be looked down upon. I can see how this could result in racism and discrimination - an underclass of migrant workers who are grossly underpaid, overworked, and looked down upon by the rest of society. I could also see it leading to resentment on the part of the migrant workers.

Could “R” (or any potential perp) have been just such a migrant worker or migrant student? Perhaps working a menial job - with a growing resentment (maybe even a hatred) of the Japanese people? Could he have been in Japan on a student visa?

Filipinos are the fourth biggest group in Japan’s foreign population. From the early 1980’s through 2000, the vast majority of OFW (Overseas Filipino Workers) in Japan had been admitted on “entertainer” visas. Many worked “hostess” jobs, dancing and working (and “other” entertainment) in restaurants and bars and nightclubs -for extremely low wages. Many were housekeepers and caregivers. Visas were also granted to students. Most were 3-5 yr. In more recent years I think Japan has sought to bring in foreign workers with higher skill sets.

I think it’s possible that the perp in the Miyakawa murders might have been an OFW (possibly working a menial job, like part-time in a restaurant) or a young man on a student visa from the Philippines. Possibly somebody who had been living west of Tokyo for 6 mos or more. Are migrant workers and foreign students required to provide DNA samples in order to obtain a visa?

This is all just a theory, and I’m sure there are many things I have not considered.

From what I’ve read online though, I think the number of Filipinos working or studying in the Tokyo area in the late 90’s was around 50-60k. Direct flights from the Philippines to Japan are 5-7 hours. Many Filipinos saw Japan as an escape from poverty and crime. Destination airports included Osaka and Tokyo. Velkova trees grow in Osaka, Tokyo, and the northern Philippine. Hip packs are made in Osaka..

Apparently the knife handle wrapping technique (using a handkerchief) that the TMPD suspects was used by the perp in the Miyakawa murders is indigenous to Eastern China, but also to the northern Philippines (fish cleaning, other).

There is also a segment of the Philippine population that could have genetics from Spain and East Asia. A study in ‘09 suggests that approx. 53% of Filipino genes are from Southeast Asia and Oceania, 36% are from East Asia, and 5% are from Europe. There are descendants in the Philippines from the Spanish / European colonial period as well as from Persian Gulf and Arab sultanates formed from14th-15th century conquests.

I think the Edwards Air Base sand is a red herring. Jmo. There was an American air base in Luzon (Clark) but it was closed in the early 90’s. Again, I think the hip pack came from Osaka.

Were the Slazenger’s available in Angeles or Manila? How hard is the water used to wash clothes in the Philippines? Certainly a student could have had a fluorescent marker at one time in their hip pack. Also some skateboard tape.

I do not think the perp was the son of an American serviceman unless that serviceman was an Asian American (obvious due to DNA). But unless an Asian American serviceman’s offspring was never really “Americanized”, I don’t see such a person grabbing 4 barley teas over the other drinks. I also don’t think many young Asian American men - again, even those who have lived in Japan for several years - choosing to eat string beans with sesame seed. Idk, maybe somebody born in Japan or Korea or China to an Asian American service member who was also not very “Americanized”. But just how many of those are/were there?

Again, all just speculation, thinking out loud. I wonder whether enough could be learned (or was learned) from analysis of the DNA to rule out a Filipino? Was “R” a Filipino?

All jmo
 
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