Kyron's General Discussion Thread for 2012-13

[matou]

I remember hearing about someone having an affair. JMO

 

[La Louve]

Does anyone remember early on one of the investigators eluding to something like this? As in he had found info regarding their relationship(s) that he hinted was unseemly or displeasing in some manner? I will look to see if I can find the news clip. It was early on.

TMH was allegedly "sexting" with a former high school friend of Kaines's during the early days when Kyron went missing.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1007/14/ng.01.html

 

[Knox]

Would you really give up your baby? I wouldn't. And as a family law attorney I can tell you that the only ones I have known to give up fighting for their kids are those with serious mental health, drug or alcohol issues, and/or those who really don't give much of a damn.



No, the infant was not "taken" by the father. He went to court seeking sole custody and won based on the mother's refusal to participate in the litigation.

She may be able to get joint legal custody but as to significant parenting time, that is unlikely to occur for years, if ever, because she voluntarily gave up all contact for 4 years, leading to a situation where there is no mother-child relationship and thus the best interest of the child does not indicate such contact. The best interest standard looks at the child's need to maintain a relationship with the parent he or she knows and loves, and/or at what the other parent can offer to the child.

It is certainly the policy of the law to start with the premise that frequent and continuing contact with both parents is in the best interest of the child. But that's the starting point. A long voluntary separation from a child can do much to affect that premise. The age of the child at the time of separation is key as well.

TH has done much to permanently damage her rights to her child and her relationship with her. Her family law attorneys would have explained that to her way back when. She made her choice. If she plays ball, she is very likely to get some form of contact with her kid but she has a long row to hoe. Very long.

Btw, I am a family law attorney. That's my practice.

:seeya: gitana1

Just curious what your opinion is- Why is she finally pursuing visitation 3 1/2 years later?

 

[Knox]

As part of Young's lawsuit, one of Terri Horman's friends, DeDe Spicher, was called in for a deposition in 2012, and she refused to answer 142 questions regarding the case. She cited her Fifth Amendment right.

However, Young's attorney on Tuesday referenced a new development in a recent grand jury meeting.

"It's my understanding that (Spicher) finally agreed to testify in front of the grand jury a week or two ago," said Elden Rosenthal, Young's attorney.
Young said she was hopeful Spicher provided good information to the grand jury, but did not speculate on what information that could be. Spicher appeared before the grand jury at least one other time, in July 2010.
"We don't know. But I think everything's a possibility," she said. "The fact that she hadn't talked up to now. We just don't know."

Attorney and former MCSO captain Bruce McCain said people could be called to testify before a grand jury repeatedly, and refuse to answer questions based on their Fifth Amendment rights.

"The bigger question is, if it's true that she is supposedly cooperating, what's the motive, why would she be doing that now?" he said. "And the most likely reason, if it's true, would be some type of immunity or plea deal to get her to testify against someone else."

http://www.kptv.com/story/22967375/mom-of-kyron-horman-gives-up-on-civil-case

Thanks Scandi, could it have anything to do with DS? How about that evidence found in the search Desiree hinted about? Carp, I can't stand those news teasers!

 

[La Louve]

I'd forgotten that Desiree had hired Elden Rosenthal, another brilliant Portland attorney. There's some real heavy hitters on the legal teams on all sides of this mess. If anyone could match TMH's attorney Stephen Houze blow for blow, it's Elden Rosenthal. Too bad they decided to drop the civil suit.

http://www.rosenthal-greene.com/trial-lawyer-elden-rosenthal.php
http://www.splcenter.org/who-we-are/board-of-directors/elden-rosenthal

 

[gliving]

Colin Miner ‏@cominer 1h
Coming up at 11 #LiveonK2 - exclusive news from @AnnaCanzanoKATU about the plot to kill Kaine Horman #kyron

Colin Miner
@cominer
Currently at KATU News, have also reported for The Oregonian, The NY Sun, NYT, NY1 News, NY Post, Washigton Post.
Portland, Oregon · katu.com/news/field-not…

 

[Donjeta]

Has the landscaper been deposed yet?

 

[La Louve]

KATU's report tonight was regarding the landscaper's deposition. Frankly I was underwhelmed by the report. Supposedly he was first hired in 2008 to do work at the Hormans' home. About five months prior to Kyron going missing, he met with TMH at a restaurant, and the baby girl was there as well. He stated that she told him that she wanted Kaine gotten rid of because he would never let her have her daughter (implication that in a divorce she would not get custody). She told him that Kaine regularly carried around $10K in cash and a computer and it could be made to look like a mugging.

Kaine says he never carried around that kind of money.

There must be much more in that depo, why it's not being reported is odd to me.

 

[scandi]

KATU's report tonight was regarding the landscaper's deposition. Frankly I was underwhelmed by the report. Supposedly he was first hired in 2008 to do work at the Hormans' home. About five months prior to Kyron going missing, he met with TMH at a restaurant, and the baby girl was there as well. He stated that she told him that she wanted Kaine gotten rid of because he would never let her have her daughter (implication that in a divorce she would not get custody). She told him that Kaine regularly carried around $10K in cash and a computer and it could be made to look like a mugging.

Kaine says he never carried around that kind of money.

There must be much more in that depo, why it's not being reported is odd to me.

Thanks La Louve, I can't believe I missed that newscast, but my D in L called and needed to talk and I didn't have the heart to say I've got to watch the news! lol

I agree there must be much more in that depo of the landscaper. Or it might be simply HOW the TV station is reporting the news, to protect Kaine who is a victim in the case. I think the landscaper and TH knew each other pretty well. She might have told him things that have not come out in print yet. If that is the case I don't think we will hear those things until the trial. IMO

Somehow I think the reasons stated for her wanting to get rid of Kaine are not even worth killing somebody for - if that makes sense! Sounds like some poetic license by a reporter.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I don't understand how Terri can afford those lawyers. Can anyone take a guess as to how much she had to pay for her legal team so far? I don't get it, as I am pretty sure her family is middle-class. Are they working pro-bono? And if they are, do they secretly hope that the case will go to trial so they can get even more publicity?

 

[matou]

Here is a link for the story: http://www.katu.com/news/Details-in...31.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

 

[matou]

Terri had been contemplating divorcing Kaine for many months;

• Five months before Kyron disappeared, Terri asked Sanchez to a restaurant. She had Kiara, the daughter she and Kaine had, with her. She told Sanchez that Kaine was abusive and asked for his help finding someone to “get rid of” Kaine;

• When he asked why, Terri allegedly told him that unless she got rid of Kaine, he would take Kiara from her;

• Terri said that Kaine always carried $10,000 with him and a computer and the murder could be made to look like a mugging;

Sanchez said he told Terri that it was an offer that he could refuse.

http://www.katu.com/news/Details-in...31.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

 

[Knox]

Has the landscaper been deposed yet?

The landscaper, Rodolfo Sanchez claims in a deposition taken last month that:

• Terri hired him to perform landscaping work in 2008;

• Kaine was never told that Sanchez was doing the work;

• Terri had been contemplating divorcing Kaine for many months;

http://www.katu.com/news/Details-in...31.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

 

[Knox]

Now, if only KATU could find and report on the details of Spicer's depo!!! I am very interested in what she had to say.

 

[La Louve]

I don't understand how Terri can afford those lawyers. Can anyone take a guess as to how much she had to pay for her legal team so far? I don't get it, as I am pretty sure her family is middle-class. Are they working pro-bono? And if they are, do they secretly hope that the case will go to trial so they can get even more publicity?

TMH allegedly texted Kaine's high school friend (the guy she was allegedly sexting with) that attorney Houze's retainer was $350K.

http://www.katu.com/news/local/100794139.html

The reason this became an issue in the divorce is that Kaine's divorce attorneys are arguing they want to know where Terri got the retainer money from, and if it is from assets in the marriage that Kaine is entitled to half of that amount. Houze of course denied that Terri's retainer was that much.

$350K may be high, but considering the high profile clients Houze has represented (Portland Trailblazer team member accused of rape, local car dealership magnate leaving the scene of a hit and run, etc.) IMO there is no way Houze is working for Terri pro bono.

 

[La Louve]

Thanks La Louve, I can't believe I missed that newscast, but my D in L called and needed to talk and I didn't have the heart to say I've got to watch the news! lol

I agree there must be much more in that depo of the landscaper. Or it might be simply HOW the TV station is reporting the news, to protect Kaine who is a victim in the case. I think the landscaper and TH knew each other pretty well. She might have told him things that have not come out in print yet. If that is the case I don't think we will hear those things until the trial. IMO

Somehow I think the reasons stated for her wanting to get rid of Kaine are not even worth killing somebody for - if that makes sense! Sounds like some poetic license by a reporter.

Dang those phone calls from family when we're trying to watch the news!

I agree that the news reports are probably holding back a lot of salacious details from the depositions that could be considered a distraction to the search for Kyron. The last thing Kaine and Desiree want is for the public to stop caring about finding Kyron.

 

[rosesfromangels]

TMH allegedly texted Kaine's high school friend (the guy she was allegedly sexting with) that attorney Houze's retainer was $350K.

http://www.katu.com/news/local/100794139.html

The reason this became an issue in the divorce is that Kaine's divorce attorneys are arguing they want to know where Terri got the retainer money from, and if it is from assets in the marriage that Kaine is entitled to half of that amount. Houze of course denied that Terri's retainer was that much.

$350K may be high, but considering the high profile clients Houze has represented (Portland Trailblazer team member accused of rape, local car dealership magnate leaving the scene of a hit and run, etc.) IMO there is no way Houze is working for Terri pro bono.

Perhaps her parents took out a home equity loan?

 

[rosesfromangels]

The landscaper, Rodolfo Sanchez claims in a deposition taken last month that:

• Terri hired him to perform landscaping work in 2008;

• Kaine was never told that Sanchez was doing the work;

• Terri had been contemplating divorcing Kaine for many months;

http://www.katu.com/news/Details-in...31.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Wow. Just wow.
Btw, odd use of words...."he COULD refuse the offer" vs would. Odd.

 

[La Louve]

Perhaps her parents took out a home equity loan?

I doubt the Hormans would've been able to get that large an amount in equity from their home. It's no estate or mansion. And in 2010 the housing market in Oregon was in the tank, so home values would've been lower.

I think more likely it was a combination of home equity loan and cashing out some retirement funds. And who knows what Terri might have been squirreling away while she was living with Kaine. I don't know much about the body building competitive circuit but maybe she had some prize money from that as well.

 

[gitana1]

:seeya: gitana1

Just curious what your opinion is- Why is she finally pursuing visitation 3 1/2 years later?

There was a second grand jury. DeDe Spicher testified and appears to be "cooperating" to some degree. Despite this, there was no indictment. Added to the fact that it has been four years without an arrest, TH is feeling more confident and feels she can play ball a little bit, in the family law litigation arena, at least enough to possibly get some access to her child.

Previously, the investigation was very hot and I think she (and her attorneys) expected or greatly feared imminent arrest. The above changes the picture somewhat.

I don't understand how Terri can afford those lawyers. Can anyone take a guess as to how much she had to pay for her legal team so far? I don't get it, as I am pretty sure her family is middle-class. Are they working pro-bono? And if they are, do they secretly hope that the case will go to trial so they can get even more publicity?

It appears they did get some money and probably have a family law property lien against TH's interest in any property owned by the couple.

But even well-known, experienced criminal defense (and other) attorneys will take high profile cases for free or low cost, because they (or their firms) can always do with the extra business it brings (think Mark Geragos and Gloria Allred).