Malaysia airlines plane may have crashed 239 people on board #21

[MummaP]

I agree.

The way they had so much trouble at first just trying to figure out what the plane did after taking off has made me skeptical about any of the alleged flight paths. They changed their minds so many times I have doubts that any of them are right.

Im kind of leaning towards either a crash on land somewhere or a successful landing somewhere. Mainly think this because of no debri showing up anywhere in the ocean so far.

Totally agree with you & so glad i'm not the only person who very much doubts anything that we're being told.

I totally appreciate there are some things that we, the general public, don't need to be told, and although it's frustrating, we need to roll with it. But we've been provided with absolutely huuuuuge amounts of technical information, that normally we wouldn't understand, but all the bright minds here have explained so much in easy to understand language, i think we web sleuthers are extremely well informed.

So, in my head, i keep on wondering why the northern arc has been so categorically ruled out - my understanding of the information is "we (the clever people) say so, and thats that... Then Inmarsat did a huge number crunch (very proud of them being UK based) but even that information, although applauded at first, now seems to be getting picked apart.

Something has directed them to the Southern indian ocean, although i think it's extremely weird that it appears to be the most remote / deepest area on all of gods earth - as though its never to be found and we'll just have to possibly accept it? Surely there would be some sort of floating debris would have appeared by now?

I really do believe it has landed somewhere, although where - i couldn't tell you. Either that, or its been escorted out to sea & brought down intentionally, but i wouldn't think it would be in the area being searched. Just my thoughts...

 

[ilovepierre]

Not sure if this has been posted.

Is this possible? TIA.

Is that saying that the plane could have ended up in either Kazakhstan or off the Australian coast? I think something similar has been posted. It would have been after the satellite pings were determined and placed on the arc.

 

[Intermezzo]

BBM ~ What is that? Why do you think MH370 did not cut directly over Indonesia? Avoiding military radar detection?

Hi
I know your reply was to poster Archangel7

But I thought I would chime in :blushing:

Here are some things that have been reported in regards to Indonesia

That MH370 did not fly over, across, Indonesia after it made it westward turn and flew across Malaysia..

http://www.straitstimes.com/the-big...indonesia-and-around-its-airspace-senior-mala

The conclusion was reached by investigators after reviewing radar track data from neighbouring countries, CNN reported.

-------------------------
http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/...ts-mh370-did-not-fly-indonesian-airspace.html March 16, 2014

On Tuesday, the Indonesian government strongly opposed speculation that Malaysia Airlines flight MH370, with 239 people on board, spent hours flying through Indonesian airspace without any radar detection

The Indonesian Air Force has also repeatedly said that none of Indonesia’s military radars detected a flying object that could have been MH370.

 

[ilovepierre]

http://apps.washingtonpost.com/g/page/world/the-depth-of-the-problem/931/

Wow. Just WOW. For anyone who likes good graphics, check out that link. My mind is kind of blown at what the search teams are dealing with here. I knew it was deep, but this really helps put it into perspective. Very cool.

Wow is right!

 

[Isabelle]

Interesting that there is a IFR jet route near where the Ocean Shield is searching. Looks like M641 is part of the Abu Dhabi to Melbourne route.

Odd for 370 to circumvent Indonesia, the regular KL to Perth flight flies over it. Why not cut directly over Indonesia and fly South, same thing as what appears to have happened

Was it Indonesia that would not release radar info, early on? Thanks

 

[ilovepierre]

Was it Indonesia that would not release radar info, early on? Thanks

I think it was Thailand.
They never released it right away because "they were never asked to release it."

 

[ElleElle]

Is that saying that the plane could have ended up in either Kazakhstan or off the Australian coast? I think something similar has been posted. It would have been after the satellite pings were determined and placed on the arc.

Yes, but has Immarsat released all the ping data?

 

[Isabelle]

If the plane did not fly across Indonesia it could just as week have flown north.

 

[21merc7]

Yes, but has Immarsat released all the ping data?

We will not know that for years. Until some resolution comes. We have some data, to keep the many families and all of us worried for the families aware, but much will not be public for a very long time.

Unlike public criminal matters we are used to on this board, this is different, not even criminal as far as we know, and, this is covering many countries and many huge agencies. This is a loss of life case. Different laws, many different countries, not much with any of the U.S. based (or European based) agencies until it all hits Courts. Then some more details will become known.

So many behind the scenes are working to find the plane, that is all we will know for quite a while.

If something is found, we still have to wait a while.

(I think you already figured that out though, looks like you too have been looking up commercial air crashes. )

 

[Intermezzo]

Was it Indonesia that would not release radar info, early on? Thanks

No, that was Thailand
Something about not being asked for it or something...


http://www.smh.com.au/world/missing...-to-release-pine-gap-data-20140319-hvkf2.html MARCH 19, 2014


Indonesia's Rear Marshall Hadi Tjahjanto said his country had nothing to add to the information gathered by radar facilities across the world, because Indonesia’s facilities had not caught sight of the ill-fated flight. “The radar we have which face Malaysia directly are in Sabang in Aceh and in Medan, but the radar data provided no information on MH370.”

Rear Marshall Hadi said the Indonesian navy had been searching in the Malacca Strait since the day after the plane went missing. Now that the search area had been expanded into the Indian Ocean, he said the airforce was willing to join the search, but it had not yet been given instructions about the specific area to look in.

 

[Suthrnqt]

Just checking in for anything new.


ETA. No MH370 or new debris sightings?

 

[Archangel7]

Yes, but has Immarsat released all the ping data?

Yes and no. I believe they released their "interpreted" version of the data but not the actual raw data for independent analysis.

If I was planning on ending up crashing in the area near where the search is now(Ocean Shield), I would simply cut across. They didn't and flew to waypoint IGARI and then turned off the transponder. That seems to indicate that "I don't wish anyone to see or know my location from this point on." Why is the big question.

 

[21merc7]

Yes and no. I believe they released their "interpreted" version of the data but not the actual raw data for independent analysis.

If I was planning on ending up crashing in the area near where the search is now(Ocean Shield), I would simply cut across. They didn't and flew to waypoint IGARI and then turned off the transponder. That seems to indicate that "I don't wish anyone to see or know my location from this point on." Why is the big question.

Not picking on your ideas personally, really, am not, BUT:

After spending a month or so learning, reading, and watching about commercial aircraft crashing, the routes do not seem suspect. An emergency, no ability to contact, loss of control, then the giant plane begins an odd spiral route. I could be totally wrong, and I know that. I am talking large commercial and heavy flights, not personal and smaller planes that - via physics - do something completely different and faster. But what do I know?

Again, not picking on you, or anyone. Just saying, we will not know until we know, and I would like to hear from a pilot of a fully loaded down 777 that actually landed before I can understand.

A crow, a sparrow, and a duck do not fly the same... Much like the Ford truck, the Chevy truck, and the Hyundai do not ride the same...

 

[ElleElle]

We will not know that for years. Until some resolution comes. We have some data, to keep the many families and all of us worried for the families aware, but much will not be public for a very long time.

Unlike public criminal matters we are used to on this board, this is different, not even criminal as far as we know, and, this is covering many countries and many huge agencies. This is a loss of life case. Different laws, many different countries, not much with any of the U.S. based (or European based) agencies until it all hits Courts. Then some more details will become known.

So many behind the scenes are working to find the plane, that is all we will know for quite a while.

If something is found, we still have to wait a while.

(I think you already figured that out though, looks like you too have been looking up commercial air crashes. )

It's amazing what can you find with Google. I have acquired more interest in aviation, even though I always liked it.

 

[ElleElle]

Yes and no. I believe they released their "interpreted" version of the data but not the actual raw data for independent analysis.

If I was planning on ending up crashing in the area near where the search is now(Ocean Shield), I would simply cut across. They didn't and flew to waypoint IGARI and then turned off the transponder. That seems to indicate that "I don't wish anyone to see or know my location from this point on." Why is the big question.

And who.

What is odd as well, is ACARS is turned off prior to last communication.

 

[PrairieWind]

And who.

What is odd as well, is ACARS is turned off prior to last communication.

Do we know that for sure now? They kept waffling on that and I never heard a definitive answer.

 

[ElleElle]

Not picking on your ideas personally, really, am not, BUT:

After spending a month or so learning, reading, and watching about commercial aircraft crashing, the routes do not seem suspect. An emergency, no ability to contact, loss of control, then the giant plane begins an odd spiral route. I could be totally wrong, and I know that. I am talking large commercial and heavy flights, not personal and smaller planes that - via physics - do something completely different and faster. But what do I know?

Again, not picking on you, or anyone. Just saying, we will not know until we know, and I would like to hear from a pilot of a fully loaded down 777 that actually landed before I can understand.

A crow, a sparrow, and a duck do not fly the same... Much like the Ford truck, the Chevy truck, and the Hyundai do not ride the same...

:twocents:

Re-creating it would be a great idea, but :razz:

If the last comm was at IGREX?, the last known satt ping was at 8:11am, so really, it could be anywhere inside that corridor?

I am trying to make logical sense of where it could be. I'm not 100% sold it is where they are searching.

 

[CARIIS]

I don't know about you all but the default font is hard to read! This one just seems easier IMO!

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/09/n...dens-son-in-law-charged-in-new-york.html?_r=0

As some of you know I remain steadfast, from day four, that Free scale employees and passport kids are related and involved in what has proven to be a complex, planned event. Successful too.

We have to ask ourselves, at the core, What happened here? The answer is an aircraft disappeared from radar contact and all communication was lost. That IS what has happened

That is the “what”. It is that concrete. That is what has occurred!

If the chips were for something else, or something vaguely or remotely connected I might not feel as strongly. However the technology is directly correlated to making aircraft impossible to track on radar, interfere with communication systems aboard aircraft, and related to satellite coverage.
Not sure I could find a technology that more mirrors exactly what has occurred here.

I think there is some confusion with cloning (sound nuts and far off to me!) and radar blocking – two different entities-entirely.

Again- what happened – radar! There is no debate that the Free scale folks had gotten the microchip technology to the point of applying for a patent.
It does not matter if the patent had yet been approved. What it indicates is the creators felt that they have done enough testing to have faith that the microprocessors were effective enough to need to protect the proprietary information.

The date the patent was filed –March 3,2014



It gets more significant now:

What is huge in this angle is that the following statements were made in 2012, in Osama Bin Laden’s son in laws testimony, for his trial; which, began in New York City on March 8, 2014. Yeh,March 8.

Think about that! That is the same date that America, started trying one of their own. We can’t forget the creepiness of doing 9-11 on 9-11
.
Two years ago he specifically correlated the Malaysians in an aviation related terrorism attack. It was not vague- he did not testify that someone was attempting to organize an aviation related terrorist attack. According to the New York Times he stated, BEFORE the 8th:

Mr. Bad at testified in 2012 that some months after Sept. 11, 2001, he met with members of a Malaysian terrorist group who were ready to perform “a similar hijacking to 9/11.”

“I provided them with one of my shoes because both had been, uh, both had explosives inserted into them,” Mr. Bad at said then.

Although Mr. Bad at backed out of his plot, he testified that he did nothing to persuade the Malaysian group to stop whatever it had planned. It is unclear whether such a plot in Malaysia was ever interrupted by the authorities; federal prosecutors in Manhattan and Brooklyn had no comment on Monday at Mr. Bidet’s 2012 testimony about the Malaysians.

…….“the storms shall not stop, especially the airplanes storm,” and advised Muslims, children and opponents of the United States “not to board any aircraft and not to live in high-rises.”

Among other things, Abu Gait urged others to swear allegiance to Bin Laden, spoke on behalf of and in support of Al Qaeda’s mission, and warned that attacks similar to those of Sept. 11, 2001, would continue,” the indictment said.

Our passport kids have no feet. I think intelligence folks would know what kind of shoe wear is needed to plant a bomb in them. Again, just too much stuff. Specific stuff, shoes, aviation, radar blocking, Malaysia .

In addition, all the clutter the Malaysians gave the world in the first two weeks, in my opinion, was to distract , convolute , throw of track, muddle what happened. After 9-11 there cannot be any doubt that widely organized, planned and executed terror attacks directly related to aircraft can be executed.

The initial arcs going North OR South could not be more opposite! I mean, are we to believe that technology cant differ a between a left or right!
I could get something like 360 degrees versus 318 degrees. North vs. South is pretty incredible! Defies logic. Just does. The north , IMO was abandoned, because that is where it went, that is where it is, where does North go? Directly to the part of the world that pulled off 9-11. Again, too much stuff.

In this day and age folks can turn on their dishwashers from the office, insurance companies can put recorders in peoples car for accidents and we are supposed to believe that a jumbo jet vanished - it defies logic.

Then, in all of this, huge ocean, dozens of countries, by some AMAZING, just Amazing piece of luck China , on day 31, hears a ping. Its not all that far fetched, everyone has been running all over the place in the Indian Ocean to drop a fight recorder in the ocean.

And , it has worked huh? It has worldwide placed the notion that the plane IS there has it not? Forever part of the mystery. Its also breathtaking that the ping is coming from one of the deepest parts of an ocean. WOW - that is some pretty amazing flying to crash an airplane going fast , being able to anticpate how the recorders would sink - right in the deep part. I would think it might be easier to throw a flight recorder off a boat around there a couple of weeks ago and cloud the whole mystery up in one final effort to conceal.

After 9-11 I think most western cultures would shoot down a stray plane. But, imagine if that plane could not tracked on radar..........................



http://www.upi.com/Top_News/World-N...ce-related-to-NYC-terror-trial/4021395236041/

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/09/n...dens-son-in-law-charged-in-new-york.html?_r=0

 

[SouthAussie]

Totally agree with you & so glad i'm not the only person who very much doubts anything that we're being told.

I totally appreciate there are some things that we, the general public, don't need to be told, and although it's frustrating, we need to roll with it. But we've been provided with absolutely huuuuuge amounts of technical information, that normally we wouldn't understand, but all the bright minds here have explained so much in easy to understand language, i think we web sleuthers are extremely well informed.

So, in my head, i keep on wondering why the northern arc has been so categorically ruled out - my understanding of the information is "we (the clever people) say so, and thats that... Then Inmarsat did a huge number crunch (very proud of them being UK based) but even that information, although applauded at first, now seems to be getting picked apart.

Something has directed them to the Southern indian ocean, although i think it's extremely weird that it appears to be the most remote / deepest area on all of gods earth - as though its never to be found and we'll just have to possibly accept it? Surely there would be some sort of floating debris would have appeared by now?

I really do believe it has landed somewhere, although where - i couldn't tell you. Either that, or its been escorted out to sea & brought down intentionally, but i wouldn't think it would be in the area being searched. Just my thoughts...

I think there are some missing pieces of info that we do not know.

I have noticed that no-one has ever said whether or not Australia had sighted MH370 (or an unidentified plane that corresponded with Inmarsat's ping data) on our radar. It sounds to me like we are just not going to be told that particular missing piece of info.

 

[Intermezzo]

And who.

What is odd as well, is ACARS is turned off prior to last communication.

Do we know that for sure now? They kept waffling on that and I never heard a definitive answer.

I don't think so..

The Transponder was turned off at 1:21am, 2 mins after the final communication

But in regards to ACARS...I don't think we know WHEN it was turned off

What we know is that ACARS sent out a communication at 1:07am, it was due to send it's next communication 30 mins later at 1:37am...but that did not happen.